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Any way back from 2nd EA?

66K views 243 replies 49 participants last post by  Lostinthought61 
#1 ·
While my now wife were dating 15 years ago she took a job at a company and struck up a friendship with one of the executives who was many years older, she told me how much of a nice man he was. I didn't think much of it at the time. Around the time of our wedding 4 years later he helped her get a part time job and I knew she had met him for lunch. At this stage I still didn't think anything of it. It wasn't until our 2nd child was born some 7 years later and my parents were visiting from my home country and we gave them my wifes old mobile phone to use while they were with staying with us. I was showing my Father how to use the phone when I started to delete some of the text messages to free up some space it was then I started reading some of the texts from this man who she had struck up the friendship with.
It was clear from the text's that this man was madly in love with my wife saying things like 'You're the love of my life and I love you so much' she never told him she loved him but would sign off with things like "lots of love and hugs xxx" but never made an effort to repal these outbursts of undying love.
I confronted her about this and she broke down begged me not to leave her and promised me on our childrens life that she would never have any contact with this man again and it was only ever a friendship and that it wasn't a PA. I took her word for that.
Fast forward 6 years and we now have 3 children and have moved back to the country of my birth. I was on our family laptop doing some work and I accidently click on her work gmail account instead of my gmail account to find an unread email sitting right there from the same man. I can't describe how I felt, I nearly vomitted into my mouth it was like deja-vu.
I read through every email and the theme was the same as before, her confiding how she was feeling (nothing about our relationship) about things etc, him persistently declaring his undying love for her and how he had been sad since the day we moved countries. It also showed that the 2 of them had chatted at least once on the phone but she had tried to call him at least 3 or 4 times. She initially said she turned to him when she was home sick and feeling down but I was suspicious as to how he knew that we'd moved countries if this was the first communication since she promised to cut all ties.
I confronted her about it and told her I was leaving her. She again broke down and told me he meant nothing more than a good friend and she was flattered that he felt so strongly about her and how he just listened to her and understood her problems. I asked how he knew we had moved countries and she come up with some lame reasosn. She denied this several times over the course of the next month but finally admitted that she had been in email contact before we left and had met him for lunch one time before we left.
I'm trying really hard to believe her that it was never a PA and she loves me and our kids more than anything. But something in my gut just can't trust her, there has to more.
She has never volunteered anything about the EA and only told me the truth once I'd already found out more about the extend of the deception. We are now receiving marriage counselling but I just don't know if I can ever trust her again. I was able to forgive the first EA but the second I'm not so sure. How can I trust her that she is telling the truth and not holding anything else back? I'm 99% sure it's never progressed to a PA but that 1% is eating me from the inside and I'm sure there is more I haven't been able to find out and she's not telling me for fear of my walking away.
Is there anyway back from this even though we love each other and have 3 children. I feel so hurt and betrayed.
 
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#3 ·
Have ways to monitor her communications in place (VAR, key logger, etc.) See the link below.

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/209754-standard-evidence-post.html

Then do what I call “kicking the ant nest.” Voice your suspicions and see who she contacts. It may not be the other man (OM). It could be a friend she’s telling how much she loves you or how crazy you’re acting, Or she could tell them about a PA.

One way to “kick the ant nest” now is to tell her that you’re going to DNA the kids. That should get her talking to someone. It’s quite simple. You just buy a kit at about any drug store or even Amazon. You swab the inside of your cheeks and the kids and send it to a lab.
 
#4 ·
Have you told his wife yet? Why not. How many men do you know that would keep a 15 year EA, without the possibility of sex? You would be stupid to trust her again, because she is not trust worthy. You should never trust her again, this is only logical. Only you can decided if you can live with that. Looks like she loves you for your financial stability but gets off on his emotional neediness. There is no way back to your old marriage, the truth is she has basically been in two relationships since before you were married. There has never been a point in your 15 years where she was completely committed to you, or at least treated you with the respect a wife is supposed to treat a husband. Even when she knew the consequences.

You must accept the fact that there is something wrong with her, she probably doesn't have it in her to be faithful and honest. This is harsh and it pains me to say it but I would DNA test my kids. I would also make sure she knows you are doing it. She needs to see some real consequences from her actions at the very least. You have no idea what is true here, no one would. Your wife's behavior is irrational and disconcerting.

Look man she showed you who she was years ago a you chose to go with your heart. How did that work out for you?

By the way the question you should be asking is not "is there a way?", but "is it in your best interest?"
 
#5 ·
She didn't have a second emotional affair,she had one that lasted fifteen years.You would be very foolish to believe that nothing physical happened in fifteen years,can you account for every minute of that time,of course not.She has shown you that your ultimatums or opinions do not matter to her so she needs to face some consequences.Dna the kids as previous posters have said,tell his wife immediately and contact a lawyer. Make sure she knows you have done all this AFTER you have done it otherwise she will warn the om and he will feed his wife some story,but make sure she knows exactly what you have done.Also try and save as many of their messages as you can,on the cloud for security.I would also ask her to move out for a while but under no circumstances are you to leave the marital home,she could cite abandonment.
 
#15 ·
You would be very foolish to believe that nothing physical happened in fifteen years,
I don't know Andy, I've known men to stay married for fifteen years where next to nothing has physically happened. :)

Regrading her getting pissed off when CJ said he was going to tell the other cats wife does not, in and of itself, indicate anything physical happened. (but bear in mind what I've said about when a man and a woman are friends, one or both are thinking about sex) If most guy's wives would falsely accuse them of banging the neighbor's wife and threatening to tell the husband, they'd go ballistic to. When accused, an innocent person will typically give you a unequivocal, no frills, flat out, and often angry denial. Beating around the bush, swearing on their mother's grave, weak and mumbling denials, avoiding outright denials, denial via reasons why they couldn't have done it, are signs that something may be rotten in Denmark. I'm more impressed that a person is innocent when they fly in your face like a bantam rooster when they are accused.
 
#6 ·
Firstly thanks for all your replies.
Our first 2 kids are IVF so they are mine. I broke down with her one night and ask if the 3rd was mine. She nearly vomited at the suggestion and the look on her face told me all I needed to know (not that I seriously believe that she isn't but the thought crossed my mind).
I told her tonight that I'm going to reveal the EA to the OM's W and she hit the roof, water works etc. Then told me to that either I trust what she is telling or we should separate.

I'm thinking of asking her to do a Poly any advice on how to approach this. Could that be the answer to my not fully trusting her?

I am being quite irrational atm, one minute all over her showering her with love trying to move on the next minute I'm sad and reclusive. This behavior leaves her not knowing where I'm at (to be honest I don't know either). I feel it's jeopardizing any chance of a reconciliation. We have 3 kids and W is from the other side of the world, part of me fears a separation will mean her returning to her home with the children.
 
#26 · (Edited)
Her reaction could be getting caught. Frankly, you have proven that you have no ability to read her, which is understandable a person who could live a second life for 15 years are usually really good at lying. Besides that, it will give her some consequences and you some agency. Do it.

I want to know what you think you are reconciling to? She has had a relationship with another man your entire marriage. You don't think you're worth more than that, you don't think you can do better than that?

Why would you not tell his wife what have you got to lose exactly except that you are just passive. Sounds like you are just afraid. Passive men get bullied and abused as you have been for 15 years. Your wife is an emotional school yard bully and you are her target. The way you get bullies to stop picking on you is to punch back.

Telling his wife puts a stop to this once and for all or at least give you another person to keep an eye on him. It also brakes the fantasy that these two idiots have had about their affair. It places it squarely in the reality of just at of two emotionally immature people behaving like fools. Do you want to be done with this or not? Stand up and start fighting for yourself.

Take the kids passports and go talk to a lawyer so you can find out your rights. DON'T TELL HER.

All I have to say is you have let her emotionally manipulate you for 15 years, you have never given her consequences and if you don't change your ways now you will be her again in 5 years. Truthfully, even if you do I doubt she is even capable of being honest. She is a con. Her whole life is a con. You married a charlatan. If you continue it will just be more of the same.

Thing is, I think people like you who refuse to do anything to fight for themselves really deep down want to be where they are. It's a parasitic relationship, you like being the host to her parasites, there must be something you get out of it. That is the only explanation for your lack of action. Maybe some of the issue here is you? Why are you allowing this to continue? Why are you allowing yourself to be abused?
 
#7 · (Edited)
It does sound as if its been going on continually for 15 years. Only they know if it went further, but her saying 'love and hugs' may show that there was some physical contact at least.
Interesting that your first 2 children were ivf but not the third? Trouble is if she isnt yours what will you do? It may well cause the child to be hurt.
The fact that your wife looked devastated when you asked her about the child means nothing. She would look devastated if she suspected the child isn't yours.

Its hard to know what to advise. Could you trust her again after so many years of lying and deception? Will she ever stop this EA or will it just go underground?
I do think its advisable to tell the OM's wife, and if he spins her some story then you have the proof in the emails. Poor woman, being with a man who for many years has declared undying live for another. At least it should stop the EA, although his wife may throw him out.

I dont think you should be showering her with love, I would stay consistently cool, polite and distant for now. Her getting angry and emotional when you say you were going to tell the OM's wife is appalling. This has been going on for 15 years, with her claiming it had stopped 7 years ago. Of course you cant trust her.What does she expect?Only a fool would trust someone who has lied and deceived for over 15 years. She isnt showing any repentance or understanding of what she has done to you, or of the fact that the trust is shattered.
 
#8 ·
This lie has been going on for 15 years? Is there any way back? Only if you shut off all feelings and emotions. I mean, if you can live with someone who has disrespected you and your marriage for 15 years and didn't stop when caught and never really seemed to care to...well, I guess good for you.
 
#9 ·
This has never stopped - that much is clear. Also, as others are saying, there is a very, very high percentage that this went physical. She has had over 15 years of opportunity.

Her reaction to telling his wife should tell you volumes of what you need to know. She is defending her lover and protecting him. Absolutely you should tell the OMW. For many reasons - shed light on the affair, it is the moral and right thing to do (for the OMW), to draw him out and expose hims to your wife so that she can see what kind of man he really is (based on how he handles the exposure).

Are you and your wife from the same country ? Is the OM from the same country too ? Would you mind saying what country that is ?

If she gave you the ultimatum "trust me or we separate", your reply should have been "neither - there is a third and most probable option - we divorce, not separate!" She should be in no position to be giving ultimatums.

Destroy the other b@st@rd through exposure to his wife and also the company that they met at (if he is still there). Do not accept any more lies from your "wife". Have your 3rd child DNA tested even if it is just for effect to show your wife what you think of her. Be prepared for plenty of trickle truth so plant some VARs, go into snoop mode on her phone and computer etc. and never reveal your source of any info.

You have to be ready to really let her go in order to come out the other side in tact. At the moment she is not showing any remorse (she is just sorry that she is caught). And it appears that she will never come clean on her own (she will just admit to whatever you have discovered).

This is not a 2nd EA but one long PA. One that has lasted longer than your marriage has (think about that - I wonder who she thinks of as the OM in this relationship).

For your own well being, don't rug-sweep, hide your head in the sand etc as you have been doing since the start. And besides going into surveillance mode (snooping), you should also secure your assets and finances as well as your custodial rights (get an attorney asap). And start the 180.
 
#11 · (Edited)
As the old saying goes, "Fool me once, shame on you! Fool me twice, shame on me!"

You have effectively let 15 years of the deception and "trickle-truthing" water flow, almost totally unchecked beneath the bridge!

Think about it! There is not a snowball's chance in hell, that over the span of those 15 years, that the pair of them weren't exactly smart enough to find themselves some cloistered, out-of-the-way place to keep their little covert PA perpetuated! And if you happen to somehow disagree, then the good, profitable business folks out in Las Vegas would absolutely love to quote you some rather interesting odds!

In essence, it's well past time to do "the 180," schedule an appointment with a good "piranha" family attorney to advise you of both your property and custodial rights! And since they both work for the same firm, what is wrong with reporting these findings to their HR Department? Companies nowadays take an extremely dim view of worker sexual fraternization, both on and off of the premises, more especially with the company being used as largely a staging ground for it!

There's an infidelity iceberg that is sticking up out of the water where you can only see some 10-15% of it!

What you don't see is the other 85-90%!
Be wary!
 
#12 · (Edited)
Is there anyway back from this even though we love each other and have 3 children.
Back to what? This guy was basically in your relationship the whole time since she met him while you where dating and then throughout your marriage. You want back to that?

There never was relationship of just you and your W. You would have to make something new from scratch. Regardless if there was something physical (and it's unlikely that there never has been any sexual contact) she used him for support, to vent etc. All this was never part of the relationship between the two of you, just between her and him. I highly doubt that she will be able to change herself and these dynamics after all this time. The marriage you thought you had was just a facade for a threeway relationship with you out of the loop. Basically your relationship only "worked" as it was with him in the picture.

P.S.
Swearing on your children's life, getting sick at the thought of your kid being his etc...that's all BS you can't take seriously, especially under these circumstances. Millions of kids would be dead by now for everyone that lied and swore on their kids' life. The same goes for getting sick. Could be the truth, could be guilt, could be that she does not know, could be the realization that it could be possible...who knows. Because you can't trust her, her every reaction and statement on this matter is questionable without evidence.

Why did you have to resort to IVF? Was the problem on your end or hers?

P.P.S
Her "trust me or leave me" is just blackmail, and shows no sign of you being the love of her life. Regarding the kids and your W taking them abroad you should consult an attorney what you could do about that. First thing I would do is store their passports at a safe place (bank safe, parents etc.) just in case.
 
#13 ·
In the uk a parent cant legally take the children away to live in another country without the other parents permission. As the above poster said, put their passports in a safe place where she will never find them to make sure she doesn't run off with them. Get some good legal advise.
 
#14 · (Edited)
I'm going to go in a slightly different direction as the others here have gone. Not saying I'm right, just a different POV.

I think your wife has a certain loyalty to this man, for starters. He got her a job, and likely helped her in her previous career (where they met). She obviously liked him then (though not necessarily liked him) and he's clearly shown her a certain level of admiration.

And that's something that's difficult to reject, especially after so long. That doesn't mean AT ALL that she shouldn't, for your sake, of course, but it's clearly not something she wants to consider.

I don't think she's IN love with him. I do think she loves him, but not romantically. For starters, 15 years is a long time, and it's highly likely that she's never seen anything but the 'good' side of him.

It's also highly likely she doesn't see the forest for the trees. They guy is in love with her, clearly, and while she probably knows this, she also doesn't quite see what he's doing - and that's playing the long game. I'd be surprised if she hasn't, at some point over the years, assumed she's made it clear he's not an option. She's married, he knows this. She has kids, he knows this. She doesn't even live in the same country any more.

From her POV, she feels that this is safe, IMO, and that she can continue to talk with him, confide in him, etc. just like friends do, because, in her mind, nothing will ever happen between them.

That doesn't make any of it okay, but I don't get the impression she feels she's carrying on an affair, let alone an EA, despite her trying to keep it somewhat underground.

If I were in OP's shoes, I wouldn't be making accusations or even getting visibly upset. I'd be sitting down and talking to her about the optics of this, and how it impacts our marriage. How it's not okay to accept other people showing romantic love, regardless of whether you feel the same or not.

And that's what I think this is - he's in love with her, she loves him as a trusted (and old) friend, who she feels some sort of loyalty towards. They're each getting totally different things out of this, and the distance between them allows her to feel safe about her choice to continue with him in this manner.

But the underlying issue, to me, is that she doesn't see this for what it really is, or how the OP sees it. It's an EA, to be sure, but not necessarily a romantic one for her. As OP said, the messages he's come across seem to be rather one-sided on OM's part, with nothing more than non-romantic affection returned by his wife. No mention of anything sexual, either. And no mention of whether she tells this guy how unhappy she is, or otherwise negative comments about her marriage or OP in general. From the sounds of it, she speaks to him like she'd speak to any other friend.

That said - it's not okay, of course, and it should stop.

*ETA - this reminded me of a girl I knew back in high school. I had been dating another girl for well over a year at that point, and this girl had a thing for me. It was clear and obvious, and my girlfriend was not comfortable with it. From my POV, which I remember clearly, I saw no problem with it all - because I had zero interest in this other girl. She wasn't a side-chick or a back up plan to me, she was just a girl that happened to like me, which was not MY problem. Because she hung around in the same circles as I did, it wasn't as simple as never speaking to her, let alone seeing her. Besides, I liked her, but as nothing more than a friend. Basically, I didn't think twice about it, especially in regards to my girlfriend. She was no threat TO ME, but she definitely was to her. I didn't get that at the time.

Then one night, she tried to kiss me. I (obviously) never once said anything or did anything with this girl that she may have construed as interest in her - or so I thought. In hindsight, not saying "no, not interested" CAN be construed as her maybe, possibly having a chance, especially if I were to find myself single. She didn't wait until I was single. Lesson learned.

This is kind of how I feel about this situation. Again, I may be wrong, but this is what I'm seeing from what OP has so far posted. Apart from his wife simply speaking to this man, it doesn't appear that she's actually said anything romantic or sexual or otherwise indicating those kinds of feelings towards him.

What I don't think she's seeing is that the relationship she has with him is FAR different than the one he has with her.
 
#16 ·
Your situation sounds almost identical to mine. My husband has been communicating via text, email, and whatsapp with the same woman (I think) for years and years. I, like you, swept it under the rug until my most recent discovery. I also like you, have no idea if it was physical or not. However, reading your story I can look objectively and say this of course was physical! Don't be stupid like I have been! Get out! It hurts too much to live like this!

Your wife sounds exactly like my husband. Maybe we should hook them up! Hahah. Bad joke. Anyway, get out. Get out. It won't ever go away.
 
#17 · (Edited)
But for 15 years? And with those documented text messages?

Sorry, but that alone, IMHO, of its very own accord, definitely meets the "stench test," that something indeed is, and has been rotting away in Denmark, and for an inordinate amount of time!
 
#18 ·
So you are falling into a familiar trap. You discuss your decisions with your wife. You don't tell her what you are going to do.

Heck, you should actively lie to her and tell her that you are not gonna intrude into OM"s life AND THEN CONTACT HIS WIFE.

OM has probably gotten a heads up already so he's gonna destroy evidence that you might want. Contact his wife immediately and do not announce it to your wife.

His wife may help you with discovery and good for you. She may confront him and he tells your wife and good for you cause you know they are in contact. She may confront him and your wife ignores his reaching out and good for you cause you know she's NC.

Cheating is dirty work. So investigating it is dirty work. Stop being so respectful and decide of you want the truth and want an honest life. Of you do, then get your hands dirty and do stuff behind the scenes. Blow up secrets.
 
#19 · (Edited)
Probably the most pragmatic thing he can do, for his own peace of mind is get her to take a poly. If she refuses, he's going to have to go with what he's got and make his decisions based on that. If it were me, I'd do the poly before contacting the other wife. (albeit one can argue that the other wife needs to know her husbands crush on another woman)
 
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#20 ·
How is marriage counseling going to fix a character defect in your wife?

I wouldn't let it go this time, I'd separate and think about if staying married is a wise idea. But, she sounds like she is into this guy, too. Yea yea...I know, he's so much older and she feels obligated. She likes the attention he gives her, and doesn't care that he is married also? She is telling him things that are causing him to stay interested...if she was like, look I'm married, can't talk anymore, he wouldn't keep professing his love for her. Marriage counseling won't fix your wife's character problems...but, separation will clear your head and help you make a better decision as to if staying with her is wise. Sorry you're hurting.
 
#21 ·
Be very very clear with her....at this point she does not make the rules...they may or may not be empty threats from her...either way what it does demonstrate is that telling his wife forced your wife to say that she wanted to separate tells you how much she cares for him and not for your marriage.....i woudl have told her right there and then, pack your suitcase, and leave...your separating your divorcing and tell her that you are going to reach out to his wife and you are getting your last child DNA, and you are going to tell her parents and your family and you will do everything and anything you want.
 
#22 ·
@cjadek, I am so sorry that your wife has hurt you like this. There are many here who understand your feelings all too well.

As to whether you can find a way back to a place where you could consider staying married, I'm afraid that only you can answer that question. Many have and many haven't. People who heal from the awful pain caused by their spouse's infidelity can do that from inside their marriage, or by simply letting their marriage go. Some of us have made the journey with our unfaithful partner's support. Some of us haven't had that, or haven't even wanted it. But you don't have to decide any of this now, and you should take as long as you need to decide.

Your emotional state
I went from being neutrally OK(ish), to feeling love for my husband and wanting my mariageto survive, to wanting to divorce my husband, several times a day when I was working things through in my head. Feeling like you are being irrational and oscillating between feelings of desperate love and then great sadness (and probably enormous anger and bitterness - if not now, then with time) is completely normal. You are trying to internally reconcile the person that you thought your wife was, with what she has done. You are trying to find a way forward. You are trying to understand all of the consequences of whatever decisions are available to you. You keep "forgetting" and normal life takes over for a little while and then you remember again. And then it starts all over again. Don't expect it to make sense, no part of this "makes sense". If you can afford it, I would recommend that you go for individual counselling (IC) as well. Remember that your MC's patient (if they are good) is your marriage, not you. You need someone who is completely on YOUR side, and is focused on helping you understand what you need and want. If you can't see a therapist by yourself, then do you have a good and wise friend or religious confidant that you can talk this through with?

PA or EA?
I'm going to get shouted down by many on TAM saying this, but I do believe that it is possible that your wife did not have a sexual PA (I'm not going to comment on hugging, kissing etc.). (Although, I don't personally see an EA as a far lesser betrayal.) My husband's morality was not the same as mine. In his mind, as long as he didn't have sex then what he was doing "wasn't so bad". It was wrong, but not an incredibly damaging betrayal (in his mind, NOT mine). When I found out about my husband's second betrayal, I asked him to have a polygraph but backed down once we started working through things. When I found evidence of things that he had "under-represented", he offered to take the polygraph himself. And he did. And it was humiliating for him and very painful. And I'm glad that it was both those things. Because by doing it, he proved some things to me. Firstly that he was (in all likelihood - polygraphs are not 100% guaranteed) telling the truth; and secondly that he was willing to do this to prove how committed he was to helping me recover my faith in our marriage and his commitment to it. He was ashamed. This was a good thing. (If you want some more info about my polygraph situation, please just ask.)

Disclosing to the OM's wife
Absolutely. (If you had done this when you first found out about what had happened, then it is very likely that the relationship would not have continued. Your wife may very well have just found another place to get her emotional high, but she may not have. (A lot of if's and but's here.) Don't use disclosure as a threat against your wife. The OM's wife deserves to know. Just like you do. You are disclosing because this is the best way to make sure that the affair stops in its tracks. Shine a light on their behaviour - let the full weight of consequences come to play. Their choices were neither morally acceptable nor constructive, and meeting their behaviour head-on is the best way for them to face up to what they did. Just forward what you know to the OM's wife. In my case, the OW's H told me enough to get things out in the open. Do I think he did it in anger - absolutely? But I am also very grateful that he did do it.

Consequences and honesty
Your wife is still hiding behind thinking that there could be a good reason why she did this to you and your family. The lame excuses - that is her trying to come up with a reason that makes what she did acceptable to both her and you. She is trying to avoid telling you the truth because it shames her to confront it. She enjoyed having him declare his love, tell her how much she meant to him; and she welcomed this, even knowing that it was wrong. Knowing that it would and had hurt you. She did it because it made her feel good. Because she thought that she would get away with it. She didn't just cheat on her wedding vows, but she stole from you (because all that emotional energy and connection belonged to you). She has a very long journey to make on her own to understand herself and her actions and choices.

When I first asked my husband to take the polygraph, he got frustrated and angry. I remember him sitting on the edge of our bed saying "Why do you want this? I've told you the truth. Don't you trust me?" I answered, "No. I don't. I may never trust you again." I think that was the moment that he finally began to understand what he had done. Your wife does not currently deserve your trust. To tell you that either you trust her or you should separate? After what you have found out? It's not just unfair, it's ridiculous.

Your wife wants you to let this go (like you did last time). I did this the first time with my husband, as well. You were neither gullible nor naive because you did just that. Your wife said that she loved you and was very sorry for what she'd done, that she would never do something like this to you again. You loved her and you trusted her. You took her promise at face value. Unfortunately, you can no longer do that. If she threatens separation to prevent the truth from coming out, then she is more concerned with her reputation (and the OM's) than she is with the future of your marriage. She is still living in the place where if you close your eyes tightly then the bad stuff goes away. You don't live there.

My thoughts are with you - your situation speaks very closely to me. Be strong.
 
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#25 ·
Her threatening separation if he tells OMW shows that she holds OM in higher regard than her husband. She would rather leave her husband than cause OM distress.

CJ - what does telling OMW have to do with trusting your wife. Your wife says trust her or separate. That is a threat you cannot back down from. Tell her you cannot trust her because she stayed in communication with OM even after you told her how you felt about him years ago and she promised to stop.

Lastly. If IVF was required for the first two pregnancies then you have to DNA the last kid. It is not impossible that the child is yours, but there is a question simply because of the situation with the first two.
 
#30 ·
Thanks all for your thoughtful and thought provoking replies, I've learnt allot about my situation and myself and how I plan to proceed.

I'm getting my W to write a timeline of the EA and encourage her to leave nothing out, obviously dates will be sketchy given the timeline but the interactions won't be whatever they were (PA).

Then I'm going to hit her with a poly to prove that timeline isn't more lies and half truths anything but full, frank and total honesty will be terminal for our marriage.

Anyway thanks to you all I am now much more comfortable with whatever and however this turns out. I read the 180 and have implement my version of it, I call it the 135. I woke up this morning full of purpose because no matter what happens I am awesome and I'll be just fine with or without her.

The more she's talked about it the more I'm being swaying by fact my W's father died in her mid teens which totally rocked her world as he was her world, and she viewed OM as a sympathetic father figure (he is 12-15 years older) who listened intently and told her the nice things she wanted to hear, things a Dad might say. Please comment on this as my bull**** filter is clearly not functioning 100%. The email trail from both of my discoveries align with this.

She has been at painful lengths to say there has been and never ever was any PA. Too me there is a possibility there was before we were married. She is convincing, but pathological liers are aren't they!!

The bottom line is I gave my W a 2nd chance when many wouldn't have and she slammed that goodwill/trust (some say naivety) back into my face then lied to my face to cover up detail.
 
#34 · (Edited)
The more she's talked about it the more I'm being swaying by fact my W's father died in her mid teens which totally rocked her world as he was her world, and she viewed OM as a sympathetic father figure (he is 12-15 years older) who listened intently and told her the nice things she wanted to hear, things a Dad might say. Please comment on this as my bull**** filter is clearly not functioning 100%. The email trail from both of my discoveries align with this.
My mother's father died when she was 5, it caused her to marry bad men but she never and would never cheat. I get my black and white thinking about this from her. So what you say may be true but that is really not an excuse. I see this all the time the desire to know why. The real question is does it matter, it doesn't fix her even if you know the reason. It just shows that she is defective and probably not a good choice to continue. The only person who can fix her is her and she has wasted 15 years at this point. Times running out for you to have a good marriage, assuming that was one of your dreams when you were young. You ain't getting any younger waiting for her to fix her 5hit.

I think you should get the timeline and then spring the poly. Thing is if she refuses to take it then that has to be it. You can't back down, unless you want more of the same. I hope she understands she is hanging on by a thread. If she really is, maybe she thinks you are all talk, she was able to con you before. Looks like she just said everything you wanted to hear and then continued acting exactly the same way. She probably knows she can do the same now. You must remember if she can't be honest she is not worth much in a relationship, at least if you want a healthy one. If you look at it that way the ball isn't even in your court.

One more time why are you not telling the man's wife. You are participating in the cover up. What are you afraid of? Where is your compassion for this lady. You of all people should understand the betrayal yet you have no empathy for this woman. This would be probably the most effective way to take some control and power in this situation and you refuse to use it. Again there is that passiveness I keep talking about. I think there is a very good chance you will find out this was a PA, are you prepared for that? Then the question becomes your third child.

If you are smart and move on when you learn to be assertive you will be a good catch for some other woman, you had a 15 year faithful relationship from your end. That makes you valuable. However you should never love anyone enough to let them abuse you. You are responsible for protecting yourself at all times, just like they say it the ring. This passiveness you have shown will make you attractive to the wrong type of woman. And it will turn of the right kind. Woman don't like passive men, the ones that do like them because they can dominate them.

No person in your life is worth your self respect. No matter what you do try to remember that. It's really better to be alone.
 
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#35 ·
She responds with something like "I told him I wasn't interested in anything but being his friend I told him I waited along time for you to come into my life and I would never do anything to harm that (sounds contradictory in the current context eh!). He said he can accept that but just wants to keep in contact just to know how I'm doing"
 
#32 ·
I'm so very sorry that you're going through this pain. People who haven't experienced EA's really don't understand that it can be an even bigger betrayal than a PA in many ways. Knowing that your 'partner' has spent a life sharing intimacies with another person is excruciating. I've lived this. It's terrible. Again, I'm very sorry.
 
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