not sure where i stand - Talk About Marriage
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post #1 of 43 (permalink) Old 02-05-2009, 10:56 PM Thread Starter
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not sure where i stand

I had a lot of problems with my wife and a friend of hers named Jay. While she was in college {we were married) she spent many nights staying out until 1 a.m. or later studying or partying with Jay and his friends. At one point she ended up supposedly on his couch drunk and spent the night with neither one of them calling me to tell me where she was. As time has gone on (14+ years) I've found out other things that went on with more partying that I never knew about.
Currently she has taken a job with a company that Jay and another guy Dave work for in other states but my troubles have returned. I've come acrosss e-mails from Dave to my wife telling her how gorgeous she is and how much fun he has listening to her talk about sex all the time. When I confronted her about this she insisted that Dave didn't mean anything by this and everything was fine. She then went on a company triop showcasing their products for customers that lasted 4 days at which both Jay and Dave were at. My wife lied about staying out late (2-3 in the morning ) partying with them and often times didn't even talk to the kids at night. More recently I came across a voicemail from Dave and Jay asking my wife if she was "getting it on" with another co-worker and how lucky he was if she was and also how much they'd like to have anal sex with her. After leaving them a less than nice message and telling her that it's them or me I've decided I'm very tired and feel I can't trust her at all and I really don't know what to do. We dairy farm so when she's gone {5-6 nights/month) I have a lot to do with 70 cows and heifers and 3 kids. I feel betrayed and I feel that my wife only thinks of herself. Unfortunately I also love her very much and know I can't do better. I also know I can't do this again like in college and now with some of this new stuff I'm wondering how much more happened in college than I have yet to know. I need to do something but don't know what since I feek the pattern is back again. Any helpful ideas would be great.

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post #2 of 43 (permalink) Old 02-05-2009, 11:09 PM
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Re: not sure where i stand

So are you saying that you know your wife has been unfaithful to you? And when you confronted her she just said they were joking? i dont think anyone would leave a message like that would be joking. That is serious!!!!What was her response to that? Can you still love her if she continues to cheat on you? She is not only hurting you but the children too. What has she said about all this?
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post #3 of 43 (permalink) Old 02-06-2009, 04:41 AM Thread Starter
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Re: not sure where i stand

I don't know that she has cheated on me and when confronted she is completely crushed and crying. She is prepared to quit her job but we need the money. As far as I know she has quit all communication with Jay but because of the job she sometimes has to consult with Dave. E-mails from Dave have all but stopped except for job related issues. I know I sound crazy but I believe my wife doesn''t take actions /consequences serioulsy. She says that she says little and they always talk this way to everyone. To an extent I believe her except I have a gut feeling that something happened (even if it was a kiss or he tried and she stopped him) with Jay probably in college though she consistently and strongly denies anything has happened with either. My biggest concern is she has herself in a position that people think she is available because of her flirting and she doesn't realize it and / or the situation she has created. To answer your question I unfortunately do still love her and am willing to try but she needs to be honest and it needs to end. The time span between the last 2 years of college and when she started this job were great with no problems except when we visited the state Jay is in and she would see him and friends I would take second place. It's like she can't say no to them and though she shorts me she knows she can make it up latee. Not that it matters but both Jay and Dave are married with kids.
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post #4 of 43 (permalink) Old 02-08-2009, 12:12 AM
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Re: not sure where i stand

Quote:
Originally Posted by bremik View Post
At one point she ended up supposedly on his couch drunk and spent the night with neither one of them calling me to tell me where she was. As time has gone on (14+ years) I've found out other things that went on with more partying that I never knew about.
I dont know of any woman or man who does this unless they are having sex. you said you found out that more went on behind your back. if it was innocent, she wouldnt have hide it.

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I've come acrosss e-mails from Dave to my wife telling her how gorgeous she is and how much fun he has listening to her talk about sex all the time.
you have hard core evidence that it is her talking about sex very often, not just a little like she is trying to twist it.

Quote:
My wife lied about staying out late (2-3 in the morning ) partying with them and often times didn't even talk to the kids at night.
There is no way this was innocent either. why lie about that, plus forgetting to call your kids is a big one, it means she was doing something that she shouldnt have been and it was more important then her own babies. Speaking from a woman's point of view. If i am out just drinking, i dont forget my babies or calling. i want to hear their voices because i miss them and they mean more to me than just drinking. i have been out partying and having sex, and yes, those where the times i didnt call to say goodnight to the children.

Quote:
More recently I came across a voicemail from Dave and Jay asking my wife if she was "getting it on" with another co-worker and how lucky he was if she was
OMG!! Why in the world would they even ask that unless someone was saying something or saw something. This is more then just talking sex in the office!!
Quote:
and also how much they'd like to have anal sex with her.
You have the proof that she cheated on you. I guaratee it. Nobody leaves a text like this unless it was true!!! So she is CHEATING on you!! Apparently these guys already know they can talk to her that way because she is the one who talks to them that way. if you think it is all talk then you are lieing to yourself.
You CANT Trust her, You cant DEPEND on her, She is NOT LOYAL. She is NOT HONEST. You HAVE BEEN BETRAYED, and she DOES ONLY THINK of herself. This is more then just love, sometimes love is not enough.

I really feel sorry for you because you sound like a wonderful, hard working, dependable, loyal husband. I only wish my husband was like that. But i believe you really need to sit down with your self and decide if you want to go on like this for the rest of your life. BECAUSE SHE IS NOT GOING TO CHANGE. She is continuing to excuse her friends actions as being not that big of a deal, because they are not a big deal to her since she is the one that "started" it in the first place. She tries to minimize it because it is bother you and you are yelling about it and basically because she got caught and she doesnt want you digging deeper and finding out the truth. You gut feeling is usually right, it is your head that is trying to convince yourself otherwise. look everyone flirts, i flirt, but guys know that i am just flirting and they have no chance in h*ll getting with me. And there is no way i would ever allow that kind of texting to go on or that level of sex talk either. For whatever reason, she encourages it. And as a woman, there is only one reason you encourage that kind of thing and that being you are open for suggestions and hoping for some action. so i honestly feel it is more then someone trying to kiss her and i seriously doubt she stopped them. No woman who loves her husband would risk going to visit a guy that they KNOW makes their husband upset. it just isnt worth it.

That needed to be said, because you have your blinders on. The thing now is what are you going to do about it. You can ignore it, and act like nothing happened. and things might be okay for a while, but she will do it again and again and again. You can sit her down, without the babies, and have an allnighter talk with her about your marriage and what you expect from it and find out what she wants from a marriage and a husband. and force her to understand that her doing these kinds of things are not acceptable. and how they hurt you and might break up the marriage. but i still think she is too selfish for this to work. or you can cut your losses and leave her. Love is strong but it sounds like you are the only one in love here. Her actions are speaking stronger then words.

good luck. i hope what i said has made you look at things a little differently. I know it is hard to discribe what is going on and how the other person really is. So i might be wrong about how your wife really is, but i do think you need to look long and hard at her and not make excuses. I think marriage counselling might help too, you might want to check into in your area and demand she goes with you.

Last edited by MrsVain; 02-08-2009 at 12:20 AM.
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post #5 of 43 (permalink) Old 02-08-2009, 04:52 PM
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Re: not sure where i stand

AT best she is having an emotional affair. At worst she has been playing you for years. You think you can't do better than someone that treats you like a dorrmat? She needs to serious up, and lead a life that is open and honest. It really sounds like she is hiding sometime and a councilor would be a good help.

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post #6 of 43 (permalink) Old 02-09-2009, 10:03 AM Thread Starter
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Re: not sure where i stand

Thank you all for your posts! I think a common thread with a lot of people on this is that for the most part we're in our relationships for better or worse and it's not so much that we have blinders on but we hold out for hope that our partner will fully come back to being the person we originally fell in love with. In my case it's the realization that when I give up we're done and our dream of owning our farm is done as well as we have now screwed up the lives of 3 innocent children. To me as well as others ( I'm guessing) one of the hardest parts of dealing with spouse problems is that we protect our families and to some extent our friends and acquaintences by not telling them what's going on. So the person that is getting hurt looks angry or disconnected when actually they're hurt and dealing with a tremendous stress all alone. You don't want to give up a portion of your life (in my case 20 yrs) that will only make the hole you feel now bigger. A lot of us come to sites like this to be told things we already know just so we can have someone to listen and possibly come up with a way to save what we are worried can't be saved. Sorry about the blabbing.
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post #7 of 43 (permalink) Old 02-09-2009, 01:58 PM
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Re: not sure where i stand

I agree to a point. I am also very much against divorce and would love to find a solution to solve my problem with my marriage. I agree in not telling our friends and acquaintences everything that is going on because they never forget while you move past it sometimes. And i agree that is why the majority are on this site, to get support, to vent without having to worry about fallback, the Anonymousity, and maybe someone might have something new to say or try.

And i also agree that 2 people can work and should continue to work out issues within a marriage. and most issues can be compromised and a happy medium can be found. But there are few things i consider unexcuseable. 1. Cheating!! never cheat on each other. I am not dumb enough to say i would never be tempted or will never think about it. But the answer is so easy. Dont put yourself in situations where you can cheat. I know for a fact, there are 2 people that i would love to have sex with and given the right sitution, probably would cheat or could make an excuse to cheat on my husband. I CHOOSE NOT to by keeping myself well away from those 2. the 2 temptations, for example, one is my bf brother, what a god!! me and my husband have been having a hard go at it for a few years, and some months are worse then others, so one night she asked me to met her at the bar, to have a drink, and i was considering it, after fighting with my husband and a hard day at work, a drink would have been nice, until she said, oh and my brother is here. The brakes came on, and i said no, i think i better just go home. I could easily see me drinking too much (on accident or accidently on purpose) and ending up in bed with him. and so i regonzized my weakness and just did not put my self in the situation that would happen. its that easy. honestly.

The other one i cant live with is Hitting. Raise one hand to me, and i will leave at the drop of the hat. no excuses, i dont care how bad you feel afterwards, and could care less what your reasons were. bad day, i pushed you too far {i admit i can do this}, i physically pushed you {have done this also} or you were just so mad whatever. Dont matter, i am the female you are the male. and males NEVER hit a female. no matter what!!!

but those are my limits, maybe yours are different. All i say, is you need to look at your marriage and your wife. Long and hard, and thoroughly. and after 20 years, you cant expect to find the lady you fell in love with, she doesnt exist anymore. we all change with life experiences and we cant go back to who were once were. Some with your wife, she is somebody totally different. The most you can hope for is to fall in love with the person she has became, and she with you.

again, good luck
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post #8 of 43 (permalink) Old 02-09-2009, 08:15 PM Thread Starter
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Re: not sure where i stand

I agree with you. Really it comes down to trust. Trust that when you're unhappy or just need reassurance you'll talk to each other. Trust that when you're out in the public w/o your spouse you'll still behave like you're happily married even if you're marriage is struggling (kudos to you for how you act Mrs.Vain), Once the trust is challenged or gone it is really hard to continue because there is always that doubt in the back of your mind. Right or wrong I think when the trust is gone whoever broke it has to do double the effort to re-build that trust and leave no question in your mind as to where their loyalty is. I also agree with no hitting and I hope you aren't talking from experience.
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post #9 of 43 (permalink) Old 02-09-2009, 08:51 PM
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Re: not sure where i stand

Thank you for your compliments, it is hard to do. but worth the effort for me anyhow. i dont like everyone knowing what is going on and i dont want the kids to suffer by seeing their parents always fighting. some days is harder then others, but that is when i cry in bed after the children are sleeping. ugh!!! i completely agree with you on all counts on this one but i am going to add one more, trust that the other person will put forth the same effort you are and show you how much you mean and they care. it is so hard when that trust is broken, mine is on a very thin string, but at least we still have that. hitting is from past experiences when i was in high school and not as bad as i have seen others go thru.

i hope you succeed in your marriage because i would hate for a marriage that has that many years in it to fail. sometimes, i think my marriage is harding on me then anything else i have to do.
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post #10 of 43 (permalink) Old 03-03-2009, 11:09 PM
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Re: not sure where i stand

how are you doing lately?

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post #11 of 43 (permalink) Old 03-08-2009, 09:03 AM Thread Starter
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Re: not sure where i stand

still here. Kind of numb and was thinking of even posting another question on here. The question would ask what is the best way to convince your spouse that they need to take action soon before it's too late and how to follow through.
As far as my wife I saw that she deleted an e-mail from Jay that only stated he couldn't make an unplanned event for the company that my wife plans on going to. She left other responses from others still on. Not sure what it means. As my luck seems to have it she is going on a training trip for 4 days and will meet up with another (Mike) one of "the group" who just started working for the company. His dad was telling everyone that my wife was planning on leaving me and hooking up with Mike. Luckily some good friends of ours called me to ask if everything was ok and why they were asking. He also at one point at a bar was "humping" my wife's leg while we were all sitting up at the bar. I really wanted to hit him but didn't want to embarrass my wife and we rode up with all of them and I wasn't sure how we would get back if I started a fight-How stupid is that? This Mike stuff all happened while she was in school. By the way she still hugs him when she sees him. In theory I have asked her to stop. So I am seriously considering showing her my posts and everyone's responses on this site to see if that does anything for her. I really feel she thinks she has improved -which she has- but I wanted her to completely break all ties and she is unable to do that. Sorry about the long answer but thanks for asking. By the way I didn't mention Mike originally because I thought he won't ever be a problem again-Wrongo!
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post #12 of 43 (permalink) Old 04-10-2009, 04:01 PM Thread Starter
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Re: not sure where i stand

Wanted to update everyone on this post that we have been seeing a counselor. Though I'm happy that we are going I feel that my questions of why these things have happened have not been answered. I guess that we have concluded that my wife avoids conflict at all costs which isn't a new thing to me. This avoidance does somewhat explain why she can't be blunt with her male "friends" but she does risk making me mad since she knows I will still accept her. But the other problem in this is that though we have talked more using tools from the counselor we still go in circles about these issues. She feels these people are no threat to us and therefore there are no problems and basically I need to let this all go. I still strongly disagree and though we don't argue per se we do get frustrated since we aren't budging from our positions. The other thing that bothers me in all this is that she feels she has done more than enough to change things. She has stopped all non-essential calls but she also hasn't seen them- particularly Jay - to see how she really stands up to him. What do you think?
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post #13 of 43 (permalink) Old 04-02-2017, 04:54 PM
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not sure where i stand

You posted over 8 years ago about your wife cheating and you are still with her? WTF.
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post #14 of 43 (permalink) Old 04-02-2017, 05:47 PM
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Re: not sure where i stand

He didn't post anything about her cheating.

She was perhaps a bit inappropriate with some of her coworkers in terms of what she talked about but that's it.

Well short of cheating.
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post #15 of 43 (permalink) Old 04-02-2017, 05:55 PM
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Re: not sure where i stand

Some men just do not want to accept what their senses tell them and will grasp as straws rather than face the truth and a divorce. The evidence is there and she will lie about everything. How stupid would she be to admit it when you did not catch her in the act? She already knows that she can play you and will continue to do so. Reminds me of the marriage of my best friend. His wife was younger and she still went out with her old friends, both men and woman. She did cheat and had sex with two of the male friends when drunk. They divorced and when she matured, they got back together to raise their child but my friend told me that he does not even want to run a DNA test because he is afraid of the results. He rather pretend that he is sure that his son is his. Does not look like him at all though.

If it smells like cheating, sounds like cheating and looks like cheating, it is cheating and don't look for your wife to confirm anything. She is no fool. Don't be a fool either. A person's past behavior is a very good indicator of their future behavior. I have dated a few married women and most of them were forgiven once or twice by their husbands. They never stopped cheating despite their promises. Instead they just got better at not getting caught. They knew all tricks and learned from their mistakes. Many husbands chose to believe the lie because the alternative is not acceptable to them.

Many prefer to drown in a pool of their own morality rather than seek the safety of a different morality.
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