Halien

I think it would be crazy to just pack up and leave. You say that you would like to save the marriage, but you are acting like you want to give it away and run away from the kids, in my opinion.

I think she is using her hate to force you into a specific action, knowing that you will bow down. There is a completely different tact that will actually make you out to be the one who is trying to save the marriage, provide for the kids, and appear to be the ONLY sane one here.

First, see a lawyer. Don't even suggest that you are considering abandoning your children just to placate your wife.

Second - do you realize how it makes her sound when you say that the woman you married actually HATES you? My opinion is that her tantrums and hate can become your biggest ally in shaking her into a sense of reality. If necessary, let her know that you are speaking to a lawyer about the safety of YOUR children under the care of a woman who has lost control over her harmful emotions. Pursue her AFFAIR. Speak of it as an AFFAIR, and her challenged emotional state. She is the one who is unfit to be around your children in her state. Your constant motto should be that you are the only level headed one. If she wants to leave, she must do so alone. Cut off her access to any of your funds. When you talk about how hard it will be on you if you give in to her affair fog, remember that it will be just as hard on her, or more so, especially since she is the unbalanced one now. It might even force her to take an action on her affair, further abandoning her children (I'm spelling it out this way to suggest that you should start seeing and talking to her in the terms of her affair and her abandonment of the family, in her current 'emotional state).

My real point here is that if you appear unflappable by her extreme state, you'll actually begin putting her on the defensive instead of the offensive. She'll see that you aren't the easy mark she always made you out to be. Hunger and a life of poverty have a radical effect on a person's illusions that they maintain once they start dreaming of escaping into a new life with a new lover.

Be the sane one here. The mature one who is fighting for your family. And, be the one who is protecting your children from her unbalanced state. I think that this alpha confidence might be your only chance of salvaging anything out of the situation, if you handle it very carefully, and with the consultation of a lawyer.

Unless the lawyer advises against it, I would recommend pulling out a VAR, a recorder, when you inform her that you will not leave since you are afraid that she'll go ballistic. I think she needs to see that you are taking this extreme unbalanced state very seriously. Even tell her that such reactions make her unfit to be the sole guardian of your children.

dubbizle

First off every state has different laws,so we don't know what he can do or cannot do so go talk to your lawyer.


He is not abandoning his kids he is just going to live some place else and they will know where he is at,so its not abandoning if he decides to do it .

I think of marriage as two people that want to BE TOGETHER,not one that wants to be and the other who hates them so if she wants to go let her go and get your life together then find somebody that really wants to be with you.

Halien

In my state, if one parent leaves the children, it is construed as intent to yield custody. That's why I stressed seeing a lawyer. But that does not have anything to do with the way the OP addresses his wife. He is currently addressing her as a person who is making logical decisions, or at least he is afraid to address her because he is afraid. She will respond differently if he sees it for what it is, and addresses her as a woman who is under the fog of an affair, and that this has impaired her judgement. She will address the situation one way if her husband bends to every whim, but another way if he maintains a clear, unphazed attitude. In almost every state, a judge will respond differently if words like "hate" are used in the absence of physical threat, or if a parent responds in a tantrum, losing control when the children are in the same residence.

Really, though, I am trying to suggest that the dynamics within the way you treat the other person can impact their response in many cases. If a guy is basically a nice guy type in the way he behaves when around his wife, then when she begins to consider an exit affair, being more of a nice guy just plain won't work. The affair partner isn't being a nice guy, and so this is the attraction signal that she respects at the time. Letting her know through the tone that she is being childish, immature and not a good role model to the children will really make it hard for her to look downward at him, as if he is someone to be placated until she can arrange things so that she can be with a real man (in her slanted way of viewing it).

Toffer

Agree with all others....You do NOT leave! She's the one who has admitted to an "inappropriate" relationship (BTW, I'm willing to bet they've slept together already) She wants to be away from you so SHE should leave the martial home!

Not sure when the last time was you had relations with your wife but you may want to get tested for STDs

As others have told you, EXPOSE the affair to everyone, especially if the OM is married or has a GF. Expose to his family and her family pointing out that this man (married or not) has taken up with a married woman. Do not tyell her you're going to do it.

Good luck but I'm afraid this is a done deal

Toffer

Also, get a voice activated recorder or two (VARs). Keep one on you (concealed in a pocket?) at all times when you're with your wife. If the freaks out and starts breaking stuff and screaming, record it! It may not be admissable but it can't hurt especially if she tries to pull some BS with the cops claiming you hit her in order to have you removed from the house

hisfac

This sort of stuff happens all the time. I speak from personal experience on this one. If she wants you out bad enough, and she spends enough time at the family courts around battered, abused, manhating jilted women, they're going to get in her ear and start giving her ideas to get rid of you by using a legal tool originally designed to protect women from abusive guys but now used to gain an upper hand early in a divorce.

Like I said, I would consider moving out only after a separation agreement is drafted, signed and sealed that spells out everything nice and clearly in a way that is favorable to the Op.

Unfortunately in situations like these, the husband usually has to relocate, especially when he's as much as said the kids are better off with the mom, so don't sit around and wait for it to happen, be proactive and get all the ducks lined up, but at the same time I agree don't just turn tail and walk out the door.

Besides, he needs more time to come to grips with the situation, these legal separation agreements take time and at least things are moving in the direction the wife wants them to go and he'll save himself a ton of money by avoiding a highly litigated divorce.

If you do nothing the hostilities are going to rapidly escalate and your home is going to become a war zone.

You cannot sit on this one.

Lenny123

I'm going to find out for sure if she's still lying and seeing the other man. I have a VAR to put in her car. I'm going to get a GPS tracker too. Does anyone have any suggestions on a particular one to get?

Ultimately, I want to get into her phone records, but I don't know if I can. Since she started cheating, she put a password on her phone (that was my first clue that she was cheating-turned out to be correct!) She also changed the password on her cell phone online account, where you can see call and text history (that's how I saw the calls/texts in the first place, since I confronted her, she changed that password)

She only uses her own laptop, never the home pc. I have a key logger on hers, but she changed her password on the laptop to one that I can't crack. I have a program that can crack simple windows passwords, but she must have changed it to one with special characters, because my program can no longer crack it. My keylogger doesn't send me the info, I have to get in her computer to view it. It used to work great, until she beefed up the password. Anyone have any advice on this issue?

The phone records will give me proof for sure. I just don't know if I'll be able to ever se them again. All I have right night now is VAR and soon GPS on the car. Anything else I could do that I haven't thought of.

I'm starting to feel like I don't have any reason to want her at this point. She lied and had an affair, probably still having one. I just want to know for sure if she's still lying. If so, I'm 99.9% sure that I will leave and move on. The kids will be fine with her. Despite what I said about her anger, she's good with the kids, just not with me when I catch her lying!

If I don't leave and tell her to feel free to do so, I'm 99.9% sure she would stay. It would be almost impossible for her, financially, to leave. Also, I don't think she woulld leave without the kids. Someone here said she can't take the kids from our home without my consent. Are you sure about this? I couldn't find info online.

Right now, niether one of us can afford a lawyer. If she is not still lying to me, I will have to decide if I should leave or not. Like I said, she probably won't leave. However, if we both stayu put, things might just continue to crappy and full of mistrust. She would have to have some interest in fixing the marriage. I don't even know if I do at this point. She has made it clear that she does not.

Thank you everyone for all the help! I really appreciate it.

EleGirl

"Someone here said she can't take the kids from our home without my consent. Are you sure about this? I couldn't find info online."

Yes this is true.. but you would have to be willing to hire an attorney to inforce it and the court to order her to return the kids to your home.

Use the VAR for a few days. Do check the laws in your state for recording conversations.

So it sonds like neither of you will be able to live very well without the financial help of the other. You might want to have a serious talk with her about the financial aspects of what she is doing.

If you are hell bent on leaving the children with her then I agree you should be the one who moves out of the family home because your children should not be uprooted. They are the first concern in all of this.

__________________
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Lon

Well what does she expect separation/divorce is all about? A free ride for her? Whether you choose to leave or stay, her financial obligations are the same, she will still need to support herself, provide food clothing and shelter fo herself and her children... if she can't afford her own place how does she expect to afford the house? Are you planning on just keeping providing for her forever?

Halien

In most of the larger states, you can buy a book online about divorce written by a divorce attorney in your state. These will have more specific details than you can usually find online, along with state-specific avenues that may exist for protecting your children and your income. My wife and I briefly discussed divorce, and I found the book very helpful. It even had a CD with sample copies of some of the forms for viewing.

Lenny123

Lon,
We looked at a state specific, online child support calculator. It's run by the state, so I assume it's fairly accurate. After inputting all the bills and both incomes, it said that I would have to give her more than either of us expected. I told her at the time that I would pay what it says, to avoid a battle in court, also because I want the kids to be ok.

When we were talking divorce a year ago, I mentioned maybe she should be the one to leave, since she wants out and I don't. Her response was "No way, then I would be paying you child support!"

The amount I would be paying her would allow her to stay in the house with the kids and get by. I, on the other hand would have to find a place to rent for about $700 including utilities. This would not be easy in the area where I live. I would;d definitely be in a studio/efficiency at best. More likely, I might have to just rent a room from someone. For various reasons that I won't go into, she and I are both on the verge of making more money soon - maybe 6-9 months. So, I guess the child support would change at some point in the near future. But for now, yes, I would be supporting her basically. I seriously doubt that she would rent a room and give me half of her income for child support. Of course, she has no problem with telling me to do that.

I don't even know what to think at this point. I really need to find out for sure if she's still cheating on me. If so, I think I'm just gonna walk away and move on with my life. If she's not lying anymore, I just don't know...Still might be beyond repair.

hisfac

I don't think it matters what you find out about her cheating on you or not.

She did cheat, she's not remorseful, she's beefed up her passwords and locked you out of her phone and her computer, and she wants a divorce and you out of the house ASAP.

There's nothing left here for you but damage control and figuring out the best way to handle the demise of your marriage.

Like I said ultimately if you go the litigation route the courts are most likely going to give her occupancy of the marital residence and sole custody so you're better off negotiating something more favorable now, start looking into possible places to live, and stop chasing your tail trying to find out if she's still having an affair because that's irrelevant at this point.

Lenny123

You are probably correct. I guess it's still hard for me to accept it and move on. I am getting there, little more every day. It doesn't help any that she's being nice and almost acting as if none of this ever happened. I guess that just because she thinks I'm getting ready to move out and let it go.

hisfac

You'll find out soon enough.

It's sort of like looking out over the calm ocean waiting for that rogue wave knowing its going to happen just not knowing when.

Batten down the hatches, you're in for some rough weather ahead.

Like I said, always better to be proactive, I still say your next move is to sit down with her and draft up a favorable separation agreement in exchange for you finding somewhere to go, that clearly spells out the conditions of the separation and ultimate divorce in a way that is very favorable to you in terms of custody, visitation, spousal and child support, and asset/ personal property distribution. I suppose it could be worded in such a way that she is the plaintiff and there's something in there about "in consideration of the wife's wishes to divorce".. or "due to infidelity and abandonment on the part of the wife".. that way you've got it in writing and some day you can show the kids that it was all mom's fault that things crashed and burned..

You'll need to sit with an attorney to get it "court legal" but a couple of hours of attorney time is a fraction of the cost of a litigated divorce and like I said you've got the negotiating edge because she wants this more than you do.

Or, do nothing and wait.. I don't suggest going this route for all the reasons I've previously stated.

Lon

Lenny, it sounds to me that you just don't want to be a custodial parent, that you think your kids are better off under her care, with your support and standard visitation. And you know what, that is ok, parenting is hard work, even if its only 50% because that is 50% of the time that you are a single dad, and it is very gruelling - I know first hand. I don't think anyone has the right to judge you if you don't want to be the hands on parent so long as your children are getting the care and love they need. Just don't complain about being in the passenger seat of your children's lives when their mother makes decisions you disapprove of, because you are conceeding that power by not fighting for custodial privileges.

With that decision obviously comes financial obligation too and you seem ok with that, so then maybe you really don't have a problem - just leave, pay her what the state says and like hisfac, I don't think its even worth it for you to find out more about the affair she is in because she is telling you she is done and checked out anyway. Just remember, her decision to end the marriage and her decision to cheat is all on her, there is nothing you did or didn't do to cause those to happen, the fact that she chose to quit instead of work through all the imperfections means she took away the chance for you to fix those together so have no shame or guilt, just go about living life for you donig the things you know to be right, and cherish your kids giving them as much attention as you can under whatever circumstances you know to be best for them.