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Old 05-02-2012, 12:43 PM   #61 (permalink)
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Default Re: I don't feel guilty, I just feel sad

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No, but I think typically narcissists don't know that they are narcissists, right?

Regardless, no...I tend to be overly empathetic if anything. I understand his feelings in this matter entirely. I know he is hurting and I feel for him and I am doing my utmost to mitigate it now that the damage is done.

But this is a place for me to express myself too. It is just as important for me to understand my own feelings, and discover what's under there, and that's what I am doing.

Someone who is empathetic toward another person would not take the road that you have chosen. Someone who is empathetic doesn't just "understand" their spouses feelings, they actually feel them.

I dunno, all I ask you is to move out and divorce your husband. He deserves better than this and you deserve the life that you want to live. Do not be a cake eater here. You don't want to be with him, so do not be and let him live out his days with someone else.
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Old 05-02-2012, 12:45 PM   #62 (permalink)
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Default Re: I don't feel guilty, I just feel sad

Sometimes with posts (such as mine on this thread) that come off as judgmental is that you just see the post, not necessarily the emotion behind that you would see when talking face to face. That is a fact of life on anon boards. Its the reality of the internet age. I think you are well aware of that tho.

You came across on your posts as cold and callous.

People reacted to that. You have to understand that sometimes the hard truth is the best truth. I think we dance around things far to much these days. Cheating on your husband was a heartless choice. And no one here is going to give you and validation or sympathy for making that choice.

For me when I read your posts my first thoughts, besides the coldness, was that you were in denial. That you understood the basic concepts of what you had done, what you were or weren't feeling, but you had no emotional attachment to it. LIke it didnt matter at the end of the day. If that makes any sense.

I am in no position to offer any guidance to that, because I have no concept of how that would feel. Not to say that makes me better then you, it doesnt. Just different.

I do have a question for you tho, if I may.

In past relationships, were you the ender of the relationship, or did it end on you?
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Old 05-02-2012, 12:49 PM   #63 (permalink)
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Default Re: I don't feel guilty, I just feel sad

Missing,

Where did I say that you were "looking for another marriage. I am not trying to "trade up" (horrible phrase). I think it's an interesting assumption that people have made out of my posts"

My last post simply revolved around your lack of guilt for having hurt someone. I was talking about a general lack of guilt and not speciacally related to your affair. I feel guilt when I hurt someone even UNINTENTIONALLY and you've done it with full awareness. I think this may be a serious isse for you and advise you to seek individually counseling for it!
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Old 05-02-2012, 12:50 PM   #64 (permalink)
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Default Re: I don't feel guilty, I just feel sad

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Has you husband gotten any help for himself in dealing with the emotional scar and pain your affair caused him?

Your posts all involved you, which makes me doubt that therapy can help a lot at the moment because you are look for it to return to you the freedom and passion you had before the commitment and responsibility you now want to dump. Counseling can give you the tools to build a great marriage , but you have to chose to use them. I predict you are going to go to a session or two and discover it isn't all about you and that it actually requires you to work and reflect on with empathy the feelings and needs of others. You will right it off as useless and walk away.

Here is a life lesson I have learned. You can chose to be self centered and selfish, but by doing so you are ultimately choosing to be left behind and out of life. Sure, you'll find men who will tell you all you want to hear about you, and they will pretend to listen about you, but those men won't care about you or help you live life. It's a lonely path to choose, since you may have men around you, but you won't have kindness or love.

That's what you have begun to choose, perhaps you've seen a bit if thus truth when your affair didn't do it for you.
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My posts are all about me at the moment because this is a forum I chose to help me understand myself and my own motivations.

My husband and I have discussed this. I was the one who encouraged him to talk to his sister, to tell her all, despite what it would do to my relationship with her. I haven't asked him to cover it up or to keep quiet with anyone. I don't feel the right to damage control and I know he needs his places to talk. And we've discussed individual counseling too, but we are going to start with the couples one first and move from there.

I know full well it isn't all about me, the whole situation. This particular post, however, was about me and indeed should be. What more can I offer him right now but the willingness to dig deep down into the ugly stuff and find out what happened?

And some of that ugly stuff involves him and his attitudes toward me and my kids. And I also know I will hear ugly stuff form his side, and am prepared to do so. We're going to take it right down to the ground and then see if we can rebuild it.
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Old 05-02-2012, 12:54 PM   #65 (permalink)
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Default Re: I don't feel guilty, I just feel sad

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Missing,

Where did I say that you were "looking for another marriage. I am not trying to "trade up" (horrible phrase). I think it's an interesting assumption that people have made out of my posts"

My last post simply revolved around your lack of guilt for having hurt someone. I was talking about a general lack of guilt and not speciacally related to your affair. I feel guilt when I hurt someone even UNINTENTIONALLY and you've done it with full awareness. I think this may be a serious isse for you and advise you to seek individually counseling for it!
Sorry, wasn't really meaning you about that trading up remark. Others have suggested it and you did say something about finding a "better marriage". I do just find it an interesting assumption. I've seen posts about "trading up" or what have you and I dislike the phrase.
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Old 05-02-2012, 12:56 PM   #66 (permalink)
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Default Re: I don't feel guilty, I just feel sad

I know where you're coming from.

3 children, overburdened. Don't have any me time, can't do what I want to do anymore. Always make plans to go out and do something but the kids come up and have to be taken care of 1st.

Losing your identity, stuck in a rut being a mom and you want to be able to be free and go where you want to go, do what you want to do.

Love the family but it's all weighing you down like a big rock and you're sinking to the bottom of the deepest ocean.

Been there and still there. But I've had to buck up and do what's right for my kids. Seeing my little girls happy and smiling at me (although they are the most rotten 3 little girls in the entire world, my 3 little monsters from hell is what I call them since they're spoiled rotten from my parents) is what keeps my sanity.

When I hear them smile and run up to me yelling, daddy, daddy, daddy and giving me a big hug that makes my day. Yes, they drive me nuts and I want to stick my head in the ground and drop a 2 ton car on it but those little things keep me going.

Since our kids, we have our yearly Vegas trip and I get 2 months free of the kids since the wife takes them home to her parents back east. But no matter how bad they are or how much they want me to throw myself off the highest building on this planet, all it takes is a big hug and kiss to make all those things go away.

Then, they'll get married and won't be my problem anymore and the wife and I can finally go back to vacationing alone and enjoying ourselves. Unless the kids have children early then I know my wife.........Oh well, just another thing to look forward to...

I'll take the daddy I love you any day of the week over me missing out on life. Because my kids are my life right now, and I guess the wife too
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Old 05-02-2012, 01:03 PM   #67 (permalink)
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Default Re: I don't feel guilty, I just feel sad

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I know where you're coming from.

3 children, overburdened. Don't have any me time, can't do what I want to do anymore. Always make plans to go out and do something but the kids come up and have to be taken care of 1st.

Losing your identity, stuck in a rut being a mom and you want to be able to be free and go where you want to go, do what you want to do.

Love the family but it's all weighing you down like a big rock and you're sinking to the bottom of the deepest ocean.

Been there and still there. But I've had to buck up and do what's right for my kids. Seeing my little girls happy and smiling at me (although they are the most rotten 3 little girls in the entire world, my 3 little monsters from hell is what I call them since they're spoiled rotten from my parents) is what keeps my sanity.

When I hear them smile and run up to me yelling, daddy, daddy, daddy and giving me a big hug that makes my day. Yes, they drive me nuts and I want to stick my head in the ground and drop a 2 ton car on it but those little things keep me going.

Since our kids, we have our yearly Vegas trip and I get 2 months free of the kids since the wife takes them home to her parents back east. But no matter how bad they are or how much they want me to throw myself off the highest building on this planet, all it takes is a big hug and kiss to make all those things go away.

Then, they'll get married and won't be my problem anymore and the wife and I can finally go back to vacationing alone and enjoying ourselves. Unless the kids have children early then I know my wife.........Oh well, just another thing to look forward to...

I'll take the daddy I love you any day of the week over me missing out on life. Because my kids are my life right now, and I guess the wife too
This is real love. This is real marriage.
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Old 05-02-2012, 01:03 PM   #68 (permalink)
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Default Re: I don't feel guilty, I just feel sad

Again, you've side stepped the entire issue I've raised about you getting individual counseling for yourself to try and dig into your lack of guilt.

You are obviously a well spoken and intelligent person. I wonder if someone else had posted what you have in the last 24 hours and you read it, would you not have answered it as others have done?

"I have felt very trapped in my relationship for a long time. And although I pride myself on being very open and straightforward, I found it very hard to say to the man who's been my partner for 15+ years that I felt that way, that I was struggling and drowning in it and that he and the kids and everything around me was part of the problem. So yes, I chose a path that was spectacularly unfair to him and hurt him deeply. I know that. And I do feel remorse for hurting him, but that's not necessarily the same as guilt over what I've done. Splitting hairs, maybe, but it's how I feel"

Don't you see the complete contradictions in this part of one of your posts? How can others take you seriously without wondering if there is some undiscoverd flaw in your psyche?

Again, my 2 cents from the outside looking in but I've always found that third parties removed oft see things that we can't BECAUSE we are involved in the thick of it.

Again, while I know you can't put every detail in the communications you post, you need to realize we can only advise on what we see and draw inferences from it, hoping that maybe one or more of our inferences will point you in a direction to possibly consider other things and recognize issues in yourself that you may not have realized existed. Sometimes I find postings here can serve as a guide to self-discovery
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Old 05-02-2012, 01:32 PM   #69 (permalink)
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Default Re: I don't feel guilty, I just feel sad

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Again, you've side stepped the entire issue I've raised about you getting individual counseling for yourself to try and dig into your lack of guilt.

You are obviously a well spoken and intelligent person. I wonder if someone else had posted what you have in the last 24 hours and you read it, would you not have answered it as others have done?

"I have felt very trapped in my relationship for a long time. And although I pride myself on being very open and straightforward, I found it very hard to say to the man who's been my partner for 15+ years that I felt that way, that I was struggling and drowning in it and that he and the kids and everything around me was part of the problem. So yes, I chose a path that was spectacularly unfair to him and hurt him deeply. I know that. And I do feel remorse for hurting him, but that's not necessarily the same as guilt over what I've done. Splitting hairs, maybe, but it's how I feel"

Don't you see the complete contradictions in this part of one of your posts? How can others take you seriously without wondering if there is some undiscoverd flaw in your psyche?

Again, my 2 cents from the outside looking in but I've always found that third parties removed oft see things that we can't BECAUSE we are involved in the thick of it.

Again, while I know you can't put every detail in the communications you post, you need to realize we can only advise on what we see and draw inferences from it, hoping that maybe one or more of our inferences will point you in a direction to possibly consider other things and recognize issues in yourself that you may not have realized existed. Sometimes I find postings here can serve as a guide to self-discovery
I haven't responded to you specifically on the matter of IC and my lack of guilt and digging at what it means, but I have in fact answered this. Yes and yes to both.

Again, that IS why I am here...to try to gain an understanding of all of this.
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Old 05-02-2012, 01:36 PM   #70 (permalink)
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Default Re: I don't feel guilty, I just feel sad

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Sometimes with posts (such as mine on this thread) that come off as judgmental is that you just see the post, not necessarily the emotion behind that you would see when talking face to face. That is a fact of life on anon boards. Its the reality of the internet age. I think you are well aware of that tho.

You came across on your posts as cold and callous.

People reacted to that. You have to understand that sometimes the hard truth is the best truth. I think we dance around things far to much these days. Cheating on your husband was a heartless choice. And no one here is going to give you and validation or sympathy for making that choice.

For me when I read your posts my first thoughts, besides the coldness, was that you were in denial. That you understood the basic concepts of what you had done, what you were or weren't feeling, but you had no emotional attachment to it. LIke it didnt matter at the end of the day. If that makes any sense.

I am in no position to offer any guidance to that, because I have no concept of how that would feel. Not to say that makes me better then you, it doesnt. Just different.

I do have a question for you tho, if I may.

In past relationships, were you the ender of the relationship, or did it end on you?
I do have a strong emotional attachment to the situation. We've both been crying daily, trying to understand how we both feel, what it all means, where we (both of us) went wrong. And what we want to do from here.

Lordy, I can hardly remember the bazillion years ago when I had prior relationships. Both, though. I've broken up with people and been broken up with.
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Old 05-02-2012, 01:39 PM   #71 (permalink)
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Default Re: I don't feel guilty, I just feel sad

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I know where you're coming from.

3 children, overburdened. Don't have any me time, can't do what I want to do anymore. Always make plans to go out and do something but the kids come up and have to be taken care of 1st.

Losing your identity, stuck in a rut being a mom and you want to be able to be free and go where you want to go, do what you want to do.

Love the family but it's all weighing you down like a big rock and you're sinking to the bottom of the deepest ocean.

Been there and still there. But I've had to buck up and do what's right for my kids. Seeing my little girls happy and smiling at me (although they are the most rotten 3 little girls in the entire world, my 3 little monsters from hell is what I call them since they're spoiled rotten from my parents) is what keeps my sanity.

When I hear them smile and run up to me yelling, daddy, daddy, daddy and giving me a big hug that makes my day. Yes, they drive me nuts and I want to stick my head in the ground and drop a 2 ton car on it but those little things keep me going.

Since our kids, we have our yearly Vegas trip and I get 2 months free of the kids since the wife takes them home to her parents back east. But no matter how bad they are or how much they want me to throw myself off the highest building on this planet, all it takes is a big hug and kiss to make all those things go away.

Then, they'll get married and won't be my problem anymore and the wife and I can finally go back to vacationing alone and enjoying ourselves. Unless the kids have children early then I know my wife.........Oh well, just another thing to look forward to...

I'll take the daddy I love you any day of the week over me missing out on life. Because my kids are my life right now, and I guess the wife too
Yes, this is nice. And yes, I want to run away from my kids sometimes. But I won't.

I come from a family where divorce WAS actually the answer. And it wasn't an abusive relationship, it was just a better choice for both parties involved. And in the end, for the kids too. So I guess that's a bit of my perspective. I will still be there for my kids every single day. That's who I am most accountable to at the moment.
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Old 05-02-2012, 01:45 PM   #72 (permalink)
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Default Re: I don't feel guilty, I just feel sad

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I know where you're coming from.

3 children, overburdened. Don't have any me time, can't do what I want to do anymore. Always make plans to go out and do something but the kids come up and have to be taken care of 1st.

Losing your identity, stuck in a rut being a mom and you want to be able to be free and go where you want to go, do what you want to do.

Love the family but it's all weighing you down like a big rock and you're sinking to the bottom of the deepest ocean.

Been there and still there. But I've had to buck up and do what's right for my kids. Seeing my little girls happy and smiling at me (although they are the most rotten 3 little girls in the entire world, my 3 little monsters from hell is what I call them since they're spoiled rotten from my parents) is what keeps my sanity.

When I hear them smile and run up to me yelling, daddy, daddy, daddy and giving me a big hug that makes my day. Yes, they drive me nuts and I want to stick my head in the ground and drop a 2 ton car on it but those little things keep me going.

Since our kids, we have our yearly Vegas trip and I get 2 months free of the kids since the wife takes them home to her parents back east. But no matter how bad they are or how much they want me to throw myself off the highest building on this planet, all it takes is a big hug and kiss to make all those things go away.

Then, they'll get married and won't be my problem anymore and the wife and I can finally go back to vacationing alone and enjoying ourselves. Unless the kids have children early then I know my wife.........Oh well, just another thing to look forward to...

I'll take the daddy I love you any day of the week over me missing out on life. Because my kids are my life right now, and I guess the wife too
Two months without your kids?? and you call them "monsters" lol

I only wish I could have time away from my kids sometimes, and hour would be good. lol
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Old 05-02-2012, 01:47 PM   #73 (permalink)
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Default Re: I don't feel guilty, I just feel sad

Missing,

Good luck with your life. While finally answering one of my questions, you've avoided any input on other issues raised in my posts.

Again, knowing you're too busy I shall not burden you further.
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Old 05-02-2012, 01:51 PM   #74 (permalink)
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Default Re: I don't feel guilty, I just feel sad

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Yes, this is nice. And yes, I want to run away from my kids sometimes. But I won't.

I come from a family where divorce WAS actually the answer. And it wasn't an abusive relationship, it was just a better choice for both parties involved. And in the end, for the kids too. So I guess that's a bit of my perspective. I will still be there for my kids every single day. That's who I am most accountable to at the moment.
I don't know, but I get the feeling that a lot of what you are doing is based on the "right thing to do".

Look, I was where you are, I had the guilt, but lacked a lot in the remorse department, probably due to a lot of resentment. You need to go to I/C first, you need to understand why you did what you did, and you are far from understanding what went wrong with yourself (this is about you, not hubby), you're on the path to having another affair. Your passion for life is not there, there is something missing...

On the other hand, maybe I'm way off..
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Old 05-02-2012, 01:52 PM   #75 (permalink)
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Default Re: I don't feel guilty, I just feel sad

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Missing,

Good luck with your life. While finally answering one of my questions, you've avoided any input on other issues raised in my posts.

Again, knowing you're too busy I shall not burden you further.
She has no answers to the questions because she herself does not know....
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