turnera

She doesn't have to be home for you to Plan A her. You just have to work a little harder to find opportunities. If she's feeling down, mail her a CD of her favorite music. If she's struggling at work, send her a fruit bouquet to her work. If she doesn't believe you listened at home, fix something at home she asked you to fix years ago and let her know that it's done.

If I had a dime for every husband who has said that in forums, I'd be a millionaire.

Women lose trust. IMO, they are like cats. Always on the lookout to see if they'll get attacked (wronged), so as to protect themselves, since they are the weaker species. Once you show, continually, that you will harm them, they remember. And they will start to approach you with the assumption that you will continue to do so. That's why it often takes months, if not years, for a woman to believe that a man has 'changed' to what she needs.

WARNING: GRAND generalization coming, so don't blast me or tell me why you're different:
Seriously, why can't they make teenagers take a class on what it takes to keep a marriage before they graduate? I see it over and over and over...the woman has dreams of housekeeping like she grew up playing; the man (typically) has dreams of being housekept for because he never paid attention to that stuff...cos Mom always did it for him. He grew up looking for fun; once married, he doesn't stop to think that the dynamics have changed and he now owes half his allegiance to protecting the marriage. So, when wife complains that she's not getting the dream she had, he thinks so what? She's married. What more does she want? Well, she wanted a partner to enjoy the marriage with her.

land2634

Your generalization is at least partially true. The main problem in that sense was that we tended to have different priorities on things. If laundry needed to be done and the dishes done, I might do the laundry because I need some pants for work the next day. Well, if she felt the dishes were more pressing, obviously it ended up being an argument. Furthermore, we had varying degrees of what we each considered "messy". For her, if the dog's toys are spread across the floor, the house is messy. For me, there might be dog toys, a few pairs of shoes, and maybe some papers scattered across the coffee table and I still might not think it's messy enough to merit cleaning. It's obviously something I'll have to be mindful of in the future.

Tanelornpete

This is something that is rather near and dear to Affaircare and I - we are working on a program that offers a seminar for churches, etc., in which people who are planning to be married have the opportunity to learn a lot before they make that commitment. It seems to us that a lot of the tools you learn after an affair would be very useful in avoiding that in the first place...

land2634

That is very true. I know many young couples are hesitant to jump into any sort of counseling before marriage (as we were), but I truly wish we had.

I wanted to throw a question out there. As far as sending her something to work or things of that nature, is it possible I could come across as too overbearing?

I want to remind her that she is loved by me, but don't want her to feel smothered with so much affection that she feels I'm trying too hard. Does that make sense?

turnera

Do it as if you would a friend. Not romancing.

land2634

Just had a thought... I know for a fact her rheumatoid arthritis is flaring up on her (I'm sure stress-induced). How well-received would a gift certificate to a spa or massage be? Just something so she can take some time to relax.

Affaircare

I have RA and I can honestly say that would most likely be a well-received gift. However, I do not recommend sending things to her office unless it's like a discreet card she could open at her desk.

Flowers or singing telegram = NO!
Card or spa certificate = Yes, delivered with little hoopla.

That shows you are thinking of her.

__________________
Helping couples recover and reconcile after an affair or keep their marriages affair-free at Affaircare.

The 180 * Coping With Infidelity Newbies--Please read this!

land2634

Actually, I was considering leaving it at her mom's house, which is where she is staying. Her mom is having problems with her Internet, so she called me asking for help.

If it isn't too personal, living with RA, did you go through a phase of depression after diagnosis? She says it felt like a death sentence to her. I know that somehow, the depression stemming from that has helped play a role in all of this as well, no matter how small or large it may be.

Affaircare

Well yes and no. I was diagnosed at 16yo and living in a physically abusive household, so my stress was sky-high at survival level. It didn't go away once I moved out--just was a lot better after I got out of that environment. I tend to believe a lot in holistic and natural treatments as much as possible and over the course of having it for decades now, I've learned to pretty much manage it so that it doesn't slow me down much at all! Ask Dear Hubby!

However, I will say I'm not a spring chick anymore and as age advanced, the RA was just...different. THAT was depressing. I didn't feel like I wanted to be old yet. So yep I can see how that would have played into this. It's weird but things like that can kind of make ya lose your mind for a minute and think you have to "be young" again.

__________________
Helping couples recover and reconcile after an affair or keep their marriages affair-free at Affaircare.

The 180 * Coping With Infidelity Newbies--Please read this!

turnera

OMG. I've had chronic back pain for 10 years. But I carry on and don't complain. I've given my DH and DD19 gift certificates for massages in the last year; but they NEVER think of doing that for me (although my DD19 did give me a GC for a pedicure last month for my birthday).

I would be over the moon if I could go to a massage. In fact, I think about it all the time - but never go because I can't afford it.

land2634

Definitely had a major letdown tonight.

She hasn't come home yet, and has been more distant in our conversations the last few days. I actually made the comment to a friend that it seems she has someone in her ear telling her that she needs to make me wait. I found out why I felt that way tonight due to the fact that this friend happens to work in the same place as her.

They had an after-work function tonight. The employees stayed after the store closed to watch movies, play video games, etc. My wife normally NEVER goes to these things. She can't stand being at work when she isn't working. Well, turns out Jim was there tonight as well...

I went for a run down at the park by the river when I got a text message from my friend saying that they left at the same time. I had a bad feeling that was confirmed when, a few minutes later, I saw both of their cars parked on the other side of the river. About 30 minutes later, I saw them sitting on a bench, again, on the other side of the river. At this point, I was obviously upset and didn't know what to do. They hadn't seen me, and I kept it that way. I called my friend and he said he was coming to pick me up. Before he got there, they jumped up in a hurry and ran to their cars. I'm pretty sure they saw my vehicle parked in the lot I had parked in and panicked. He passed them on the way to pick me up. At this point, I got in my car and started to drive home. He asked me to meet him up at the college, hop in his car, and we would go grab a beer or something and talk.

While I was on the phone with him, he said, "Never mind, don't go to the college... both of their cars are here now."

So, not only had they panicked, but they made it a point to go somewhere else to spend more time together.

I'm angry, upset, and hurt. I know this is all part of the process, but I still feel the need to vent. I keep replaying it all in my head. Should I have approached them and asked them what was going on? She hasn't exactly said for sure that they were no longer talking, but she definitely tried to imply as much in our conversations. What should I have done?

I'm considering calling the HR department of her place of employment. Is this advised?

Affaircare

Land~

I'm so sorry to hear of this turn of events. Now you know why she was "not ready to come home" and it has nothing to do with needing space to think or anything. What it comes down to, in summary, is that things got uncomfy for her and Jim there for a little while, she covered by talking to you as if she was thinking of coming home, some pressure was let up, and now she's right back to her affair.

I would recommend contacting your pastor friend immediately and tell him he is needed TOMORROW--please drop everything and come talk to her. I would contact her family and your family and let them know what you saw with your own eyes and that contact with the Other Man is continuing and it appears the affair is still on. Finally I would contact the HR department at her place of employment for three reasons:

1) It is highly likely that either their resources (email, laptops, expense accounts, etc.) are being used to further unwanted sexual advances--and it would behoove them to audit those resources and/or take them away. If they hesitate, please remind them that the Supreme Court recently ruled in City of Ontario V. Quon that an employer does not violate an employee's right to privacy when they review the texts, emails or pages of the employer's property (i.e., employer's laptop, work email, work cell phone or work pager), as long as the review is "reasonable."

2) It is highly likely that productivity is greatly reduced because the two lovers are so busy lying and covering their affair and flirting during work hours--so again it behooves the employer to get between those two so that WORK is getting done!

3) It is highly likely that due to the unwanted sexual advances (as the spouse of the employee, YOU don't want them), that their business is vulnerable to a sexual harassment lawsuit. To summarize: 'The employer is liable if it knew, or should have known, about the harassment. However, the employer is not liable if immediate and appropriate corrective actions were taken to remedy the problem.' They now know.

If Jim has a wife, a girlfriend, or a family--contact them as well. They deserve to know that their husband or boyfriend is trying to cheat and that their world is about to be turned upside down. They deserve to know so they can defend themselves (same as you are defending yourself) whether that is legally, financially, etc.

And literally, FINALLY, I would talk to your wife tomorrow night and say "This is a ONE TIME OFFER TONIGHT. I do love you and intend to honor my vow to you, but you have disrespected our marriage in public. If you agree tonight to end all contact with Jim by resigning from your job, write him a No Contact Letter which I send to him, give me access and passwords to all of your emails and cell phone accounts and chats so I can VERIFY your honesty, and commit to working on the marriage together with me...I will help you move home tonight. I will not accept 'needing space' or 'thinking about it' because I now know that is a stall tactic to continue your affair. So you are completely free to choose but bear in mind that whatever you choose tonight you will experience either the benefits of your choice...or the consequences. You made a committed covenant to me, not to Jim, to forsake all others, and tonight I'm asking you directly to honor YOUR vow. Will you?"

The end. Let her decide. She will likely be furious and spout "How dare you tell everyone" etc. but bear in mind, Land, that it is not you telling people that is harming her. It is HER BEHAVIOR and what she's choosing to do!! You are just telling people the truth! And the truth could just as easily have been: "I am thrilled to say that she's chosen to work on our marriage and move home!" See? Both are just you telling the truth--the only difference is her choice.

Our prayers will be with you and again I am so sorry.

__________________
Helping couples recover and reconcile after an affair or keep their marriages affair-free at Affaircare.

The 180 * Coping With Infidelity Newbies--Please read this!

turnera

It's time for exposure on a massive scale. START with HR. Bring a lawyer friend if you got one, to scare the crap out of them and make them DO something.

Sit down and call EVERYONE who matters, in ONE sitting.

land2634

Hi all, it's been awhile. I've been somewhat secluding myself to the gym whenever I'm not working. That and writing my weekly sports column has kept me occupied enough to think about the situation less.

I've worked on exposing this all, but it seems as if I may have waited too long. Her best friend changed her phone number for unrelated reasons to our situation, her mom has been too drunk to talk to the last few times I've seen her, and her manager (my former manager from the time I worked there) has been in meetings in Dallas until tomorrow.

I plan to call him tomorrow and tell him what I know and, if necessary, show him proof so that they can't tell him they are "just friends" anymore. My gut feeling is that, at the very least, he will purposely schedule them on opposite shifts, and at the extreme, they will both lose their jobs. Either way, several of her co-workers, friends of mine, are already aware of the extremity of the situation and haven't been very friendly to Jim.

Today has been rough. I took the suggestion to remind her that coming home is always an option. She was talking about how she misses our dog (he was like a son to her she says) and hopes I'm taking care of him. I responded that I am, and proceeded to tell her that he's been hogging the covers recently. She got upset and said that she didn't want to talk about it anymore and that she can't believe how I have "taken her dog away from her."

At this point, I responded, "Well, we could always go back to being a family. It would involve you dropping what you're doing and coming home to work on our marriage. It won't be easy, I know, but the option is there and I would be here with open arms."

She responded by saying, "I don't think I would be happy. My feelings are not there anymore and I hate your family now."

I responded by saying that every person has a different definition of happiness, and that I am choosing to measure my life based on fulfillment rather than happiness because I know everything won't always be peachy.

She said, "You really don't understand. I'm done and there is nothing left for you."

Is this common?

I'm sure it is, and I know why she doesn't have feelings for me (because she's giving them to someone else), but I almost feel like I'm getting to the end of my rope. Although I'm trying to stay busy and work on myself, I feel like I'm still being stomped all over at all times.

turnera

Nothing left for you to do but make the affair hard to continue, IMO.