Ok, so husband is home now. He is willing to do personal counseling to help him figure out what he wants, which is a HUGE step, since a few days ago he was dead set against it. Now, I am sure I know most of the answers but am curious of some of your perspective.
What can I do to convince him that staying married is the best choice? I know, fixing me is paramount, I need to do that for my sanity anyways, I don't know who I have become. My kids don't want us to split, do I tell them to tell him that point blank? My middle child is terrified. Take steps toward the "simple life" that he wants? I know becoming the better choice is the answer, just not sure exactly how to go about it.
I know in the end it all falls on him, and darn it I am rambling again, as usual. lol
We all ramble. In fact I am sure that is the reason some of my posts take forever to get responds. I am horrible at grammar, and writing, so it leaks threw and people don't like to bother reading.
But that is a hard question. I wouldn't have the kids do it, it might push him away right now. Maybe after some therapy, down the road when he feels like he is doing the right thing have the kids reassure him of it. But for now, I would keep the kids away from the topic myself. I know if my two little girls could talk, it would make me feel good if they could let me know I am doing the right thing, though I can tell it just the way they act with both of us home. When I moved out even for the week, my daughter would wake up looking for mother, I hated it.
__________________
"Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?"
Yeah this is true. I know I have told him what they tell me, he needs to know what's going on in their heads, cuz they won't really say much to him. I figure if he comes right out and ask him, that's the best course. They never really acted different when he was gone, because he kind of withdrawed into his computer, which I was guilty of for a long time, but I am still talking to them, watching tv with them etc. I have cut my time down on my game and internet alot. The last few months, I have been actually spending more time with them. I know I can't "make" him choose our marriage, but I wish I knew of a few magic tricks to kind of sway his way of thinking without actually swaying him, if that makes any kind of sense whatsoever. Like get him thinking more pro marriage without manipulating his mind.
I guess I got lucky with that. Almost too lucky. Ever since she broke down, and hit rock bottom (about a week ago) I know she wants to make it work. The only issue is I have heard it all once before from her. So... its kind of a to good to be true thing going on. If things are going well you will know when he hits the "rock bottom" stage. It sounds like you did already. My wife broke down and admitted it was not me (before she was telling me I "led" her to it in a way) that she was selfish *****, that she has issues, etc, etc, etc... the whole nine yards. I just hope she follows thru and gets help, otherwise I am sure next time we hit a small bump in our relationship she will jump ship again.
__________________
"Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?"
Yeah, I am not sure if he's hit that. When he came home on Saturday night, he was sad because he hurt HER and led HER on, this whole time he's said he's sorry he's hurting me while still talking to her, but he never acted like that hurting me. Well, she had a choice, she knew he was married. Anyways, I wonder if he'll break down like that, he should have that level of pain for hurting me too. Lord knows I have gone through that, the overwhelming guilt and pain knowing how much I have hurt him. I haven't completely forgiven myself, and I feel alot of self loathing. I don't think he's hit that yet, if he has, he hides it really really well. I am not sure if he'd actually come to me when he does, or if he'd suffer in silence. I am hoping his individual counseling will help him with that.
Sounds like you are already doing what you should.. taking care of your mental state and forging ahead.
As for the kids... i wouldn't tell them what happened. I mean you can let them know it is serious but do not be specific. I told my 12 year old " mom did something that I do not agree with and there's a chance that it could cause us to move into different places) that was the most i ever said about it, and i noticed the kids were trying to put a lot less pressure on us.
But dont say what happened... neither one of you wants to have to defend that, or worse yet, have them bring it up in the future, when YOU guys are past it.
Whatever you do, dont let him know that he has control of your emotional state. People who are courageous and without compassion tend to bully those who have compassion but lack courage. Your goal is to reach a collaborative state.. where you two are working together to come to a NEW solution together. you dont want to compromise... Noone should ever compromise in a marriage.
OMG!!! NO COMPROMISE??? WHY TWOTIME?? WHY!!!???
Simple... in a compromise, someone always has to give something up.. Why compromise, when you can collaborate? You dont give concessions, you both work to create a win/win situation, where both people are completely happy. It is 100% possible, you just cant be lazy.
If she wants spaghetti and he wants tacos.. dont compromise and say " tonight we go to olive garden, next time we go to Chevy's Mexican place" no no no!! Go to Golden Corral or a buffet where they have both!!
Collaboration takes two willing people who can state each others perspectives and should be the ultimate goal of any conflict.
Just saying... It is never a question of ability, only a question of motivation.
I kind of like your stance two time, makes perfect sense now. I guess right now we are kind of collaborating, now that he came to the conclusion to go to individual/marital counseling. All I can do to prove I mean what I say is by action at this point, it does hurt to not see it back, but I think it will come with time. We seem to be following the exact same path. I have found I am catching more flies with honey than vinegar. Just a week ago he was saying he doesn't need counseling, he has gotta figure it out on his own...so in baby steps we have made a little progress. He says it's to help come to a decision on where we go, work on our issues on each other after the trainwreck. Isn't working on our issues kind of working on the marriage? lol. I'll let him keep his wording so it makes him feel better. I told him the only way he'll know if he hasn't made a mistake is to actually try to work on the marriage. Ball is still in his court.
yessir, he's thinking about taking the weekend off, i am gonna try and do something then, if he's game. Can't force him to go. Definitely NOT going to a movie lol.
*sigh* The mental exhaustion just hit me badly today....hard to get myself to get up and do stuff lol. Literally have to force myself to get up and do what needs to get done. I need a vacation haha.
talked tonight, he seems to fail to see the working on our relationship so we don't hate each other doesn't go hand in hand with the marriage. Seems we are at a stalemate. I asked do we live as a married couple or roommates?? He answered I don't know what we do. He said that's where the counseling comes in, and I agree, to fix ourselves. He said he needs to get to a point where he was a couple of years ago to make sound decisions, I understand that. GOD do I have a long emotional/mentally draining road ahead of me. He mentioned how does he know if what I am doing isn't some manipulative scheme to get him back and he gets duped into old habits, understandable. All I can do is prove by action, it's gonna be hard to give so much without getting anything back, but he's worth it, he is a wonderful man, and I love him. God, I pray I have the strength for this.
Give me some ways to cope with this, it's gonna be hard to work on myself, prove myself trustworthy, and forge ahead. Giving her up and coming home, and willing to go to counseling are positive. Unfortunately I am not a patient woman, please pray to give me patience.
He has things to prove too as well, but I pray he gets on the same page, he said he has no doubt that if we both want it, it'll be a go. I just don't know what to do other than what I am doing to get him on the same page. I swear I am gonna head to the funny farm sometime lol.
Are you over talking, over crowding, harping harping harping on this subject?
It seems to me that everyday you post something that resulted from a conversation you had with him about this...
I lovingly tell you this... Each time you talk to him about this... he does not hear what you think he does. He hears " I am disappointed in you sir" and "You can't make up your mind?" and "You are not trying enough"
NOw, if those were your actual words, that would classify as abuse.. but they are not your actual words, at least i hope not... lol
no, no.. you just arent aware of a simple yet little known fact about communication...
55% of all messages we send to someone are through Body Language, 25% is through Tone of voice and 12% is through facial expressions... ONLY 8% of the message we express come across in our words.
Now consider this... just as you are evaluating the relationship and making choices.. he is also.
And as he is making those choices, he is faced with your tone, body lanaguage and facial expressions.
Do you think those are helping or hurting your cause? Are those messages of mixed desperation and frustration an over-abundence for him? my guess, probably so.
Our feelings are so hurt, so devistated that we often fail to realize.. that there is actually someone else whose opinion determines the outcome.
Just be aware. and try to think back about posture and body language, tone of voice and such during your last talk.
Actually HE initiated the conversation last night. My body language for the most part is always the same. I am relaxed, most of the time, my voice polite calm...I honestly don't know if they are helping or hurting, it's so early on yet. I don't let myself get frustrated or sound desperate. For instance, I was getting frustrated, while I didn't allow it to show, I stepped away for about a half an hour. The words you posted above? Nah, those aren't my words at all. I could very well be over harping on the subject, it's just that I feel he needs to know my feelings as well. I will back off for awhile. It just seems to creep into the conversation, for instance, we were talking about stuff we wanted to do on the farm, and talking about me getting a job, all of a sudden he brings up, well you may wanna get a job where you can get health insurance just in case. I was thinking WTF??? We were having a nice conversation and he brings this up, so the conversation took off from there. So this last one wasn't on me lol. I go to the counseler on Thursday, he goes on the 17th. We will see what happens from there. I have also suggested to him to come on this site and do some real reading. He knows I come here, tell him X is my username, read other peoples responses, read other stories.
trying to decide next course of action 
