twotimeloser

Maybe you just need to remove the problem.. Maybe you just need to cut down the tree, even if you have become comfortable with it there.

Believe it or not, people often become comfortable with problems. Just like that big tree, they become close friends in our daily life. We become so used to them there, that we fully integrate some problems into our lives, thinking we really dont need to get rid of them because we have learned to live with them for so long.

No amount of raking, will solve the problem, and if you move, the dirt patch will still be there. Worse yet... if you remember how much you loved that tree, you may end up planting another one in your new home (relationship) and the problems will move with you.

One of these days, when i get some time... i will write a huge post about how to gain your power back, and become the person you always wanted to be. How to find happiness and peace. But that wont be until May 15th or so.. lol


Until then, I have some very direct questions for you Hurt:

1. What is that you want to do, that you are not doing? this can be anything from bowling with a buddy, to getting a new job or going back to school.


2. What is the one thing that your wife can say to you or do with you, that will make you feel passionate.

3. What kind of relationship do you want, if you had a magic wand?


That's it. just 3 little questions. Thanks.

__________________
***Expectation is premeditated resentment***

HurtinginTN

I'm not much of a bowler. I took the kids last weekend. My score was around 100. I enjoy country dancing. I used to do that alot. I used to go with my wife, but she no longer will do that. There is a new country bar in town that I have been planning on checking out.

I used to go fishing and hunting a lot. This weekend, I am going turkey hunting. I saw a nice old tom this past weekend at my parents' farm, but I didn't have a shotgun with me at the time. I'll go back after him this weekend.

I am very blessed with my job. I make decent money, but my bosses have to be the best ones in the world. They have put up with my head being up my rear for months. Instead of firing me, as I believe they have every right to do, I just received a slight raise.

I have no desire to go back to school. I have considered it at times, but another piece of paper on the wall doesn't excite me.


PG answer? Using the bedroom for more than playing on the computer and sleeping.


One with plenty of passion. One with plenty of trust. One where both parties work together toward common goals. One where both parties share their thoughts with each other instead of others. One that would be a great model for our children to follow. A long-lasting fulfilling blissful marriage.

Does that exist except for beginning with "Once upon a time. . . "? I suppose that is where the magic wand comes in.

joe kidd

Hurt it is amazing how understanding employers and employees can be. I'm a region manager for my job. Not only was my boss understanding but the guys under me were too. In short they covered my a$$ for about 3 mos. I knew there were things I had to do but just didn't care. I found though that once I started to take pride in my work again that spilled over to everything else in my life.

twotimeloser

Hurt,

So essentially you feel sexually deprived. I dont think your wife is going to be that person for you at the moment...

I want to focus more on something you have said.

"One with plenty of passion. One with plenty of trust. One where both parties work together toward common goals. One where both parties share their thoughts with each other instead of others. One that would be a great model for our children to follow. A long-lasting fulfilling blissful marriage."

What you described is rational and reasonable in expectation. You can not rely on a spouse to provide you a source of happiness or to make you feel complete. and she is doing that with the OM. Ideally, you will grow into a complete person without her and then contribute those mature emotions and a fully developed self, to the relationship.

Let's assume that she was not having an affair for a second... On her own, she is not contributing to the relationship much. In fact, she is relying heavily on this other person to complete her, because currently you do not.

What you find attractive right now, what you have said you want from a marriage is a partner. In business organizations, a partner is defined as someone who contributes to equally to the management of the business, suffers the losses and reaps the benefits.

What you have now is a limited partner. A person who invested in the business but does not help manage it, reaps the rewards, but loses nothing more than the initial investment.

Make no mistake, a marriage is a business. It cannot survive when you have one person who is not committed to it fully, independently self sufficient and willing to put in the extra hours.

If your wife was not having an affair, you still have to deal with the fact that she is a leech on your soul. That she is not a good partner to make a lifetime commitment to. If you do decide to work ont he marriage, remember that the trust and affair are are not the only things you need fixed.

you could save your marriage today, and wake up 5 years from now to realize that you have made a really bad investment.

Something to consider.

__________________
***Expectation is premeditated resentment***

HurtinginTN

I do believe the affair is over. I went drinking with my brother-in-law last night. She has talked to her sister several times lately. She told her sister it was over and she can't understand why I'm not happy with that. She aslo told our daughter that it was over. She has lied to me consistently, but I don't believe she would lie to our daughter and her sister that it is over.

Of course, I am still not completely convinced. About 75%, I would say. You are right about the problems running much deeper than the affair. We had our biggest fight to date last night. It was not related to the affair. I slept in a hotel room last night. There was no physical violence, but the words were biting in both directions. I got the "I don't need a father" speech again because of her playing games and chatting online. She was talking to another man who asked where she lives. She told him and he was asking more details as to the location.

I pulled the modem and told her she don't need to be chatting with any men period. She said she was just having polite conversation. I told her polite conversation doesn't require telling a man where you live, especially considering our past nine months.

I agree about the partnership, or lack thereof. Even with the affair over, there are still many issues that may or may not be resolvable.

Eli-Zor

Stay unconvinced, if it were over she would give you the phone and the pass code and do everything to evidence it is over, do not believe her they have more than likely worked out another way to go deeper underground.

Keep control and focus on making yourself a better person, you will then have the choice of what you want to do next.

pidge70

I know how desperately you want to believe her but, did she not just call him from your home phone? Until she relinquishes her passwords and becomes completely transparent, I would not believe a thing she says.
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Mrs Chai

Why not cut internet off completely as she seems to have an addiction to getting attention from men online. I remember in my younger days I had some sort of sick thrill from having male internet users hitting on me. I grew out of it, but it looks like your wife is still getting her jollies off on it.

As she can not responsibly use the internet, I'd say it's time to get rid of it. If you must have it for work purposes, password it and don't let her use it.

Does she work? If she pitches a fit over it, tell her you refuse to fund her addiction and if she takes steps to continue to get at her drug of choice instead of fixing the issues that stem from it... well we'll have to cross that hurdle when we get there.

Mrs Chai

You're smart in not believing her and her going to her sister and daughter doesn't prove a thing. I have a term I use with some of my family, probably the most familiar way to put it is "Delusional." I have several of them who like to rewrite history or time paradox things as I jokingly reference them to my husband.

They rewrite history in their heads, even if it becomes an outright lie, because they simply cannot handle the truth. And the lengths they go is amazing. Especially if they no longer want to be the one at fault. There can be witnesses as to what actually happened and they will insist you and those other people are wrong.

Why is she going to the two people who will actually get back to you with their conversation? Because she knows you'll hear about it from them and maybe, in her mind, that will get you to believe what she wants you to believe (and maybe what she herself is trying to believe). Everyone is right, until there is total transparency and she takes responsibility for her actions, there is no trust here and the affair still isn't over. Coveting another man - even in your mind - is still an act of an affair.

And why is she telling your daughter this? That didn't sit well with me when I read that...

As for the fight, I'm sure some of it stemmed from the affair. I mean, this is a life altering choice she made. You still have no trust with her and clearly she's still having a chip on the shoulder that doesn't seem to be getting worked on at all. Are you guys going to do marriage counseling? Or even individual counseling?

paramore

amen is all i have to say.

Pit-of-my-stomach

Brother,

Outside of trying to reason with my fogged wife, you are probably the most frustrating person I've ever interacted with. You seem to be a nice guy, and you actually seem to be intelligent, thoughtfull and reasonably receptive at times...

but you just can't get the f*uck outta your own way, and your head is so far up your as$ at times it's maddening.

lol.

Nothing has changed. (and seriously dude, why the F would it?)
She is managing you. Affair is NOT over, paused perhaps, managing you has become her priority. Your in the way... your fu*cking up her grand laid plans and putting glitches in her fantasy scenario... She has to get you "back in line".

__________________
Never say Never- The Fog
4 No0bs

Jellybeans

She is still playing you.

HurtinginTN

Yes, that is most likely what is going on.

I recently found the call on the home phone. It was from April 5th, before this last "promise" of no contact.

My daughter has hounded her to quit from the time she found out. It is possible she told her to get our daughter off her back. As far as my sister-in-law, I don't think she thought that conversation would get back to me. I sat down with my sister-in-law today for a while and talked. She is convinced the affair is over, but also pointed out that is not the real issue. The real issue is the deeper problems that caused the affair. I believe the affair is just a symptom of deeper problems, a very painful symptom.

I have offered marriage counselling several times, but she refuses. It has to come from her. I am going to individual counselling. She has been going to individual counselling as well.

Yes, I believe paused is a very possible scenario. IF there has been no contact, it has been for 1 of 2 reasons, in my mind. 1 is as you say, it is on pause to get me under control. 2 is that she didn't like the way he looked. The night I told her either the affair is over or we are over, she admitted to recently seeing his picture. Since looks have been such an important thing for her, she may have wanted to leave him after seeing his picture. My insistence on ending one of her relationships gave her the out she was looking for.

Either way, even IF it was over, it doesn't matter. The total disrespect and selfishness is still there.

By the way, I did start reading your thread. I haven't read all of it, but the first few pages were dead on with my situation as well. You mentioned that your wife "cringed" when you touched her. I don't think I ever posted that in my thread, but that was the exact word she has used several times over the years.

HurtinginTN

I am obsessed with that darn phone. I bring it up daily. I tell her it would be so easy to just give it up and give me the passwords. That would be a great start to re-building trust. However, she insists that she "needs" something that is her own. Yes, I know, that is most likely an excuse.

For my sanity, I have to stop obsessing. I have to drop it. Fighting constantly over the darn phone is no good. How do I stop obsessing?

I suspect it will come to the surface in a few weeks. We will be getting another vehicle. I signed up for a motorcycle class at the end of the month. I am searching for a motorcycle with the intent to buy one in the next couple of weeks. She said she would like to go to the class also. We are both going to spend the weekend together at the class.

That has 2 possibilities. It could a new, exciting thing we can do together. Right now, we will just be buying one motorcycle, but my father-in-law has one we could use to go on bike rides together.

Of course, the other possibility is that she'll take off on it to Colorado.

Jellybeans

TN. I am not sure there is much else that can be said, unfortunately.

You already know what the score is--she refuses to be transparent with you, which isn't conducive to restoring your marriage.

As for obsessing--I am afraid you are always going to obsess as long as she isn't being open and honest with you. And as far as your posts tell--she hasn't chosen to give up the OM, the phone, and most importantly, her affair.

It is a choice. And she continually chooses the affair along w/ having your marriage because she has that option. You have tolerated it so she goes with it. And why not? Honestly? She gets to have a loving, caring, stable husband and father of her children at home, and gets to have her ego fed by this Phantom Anonymous Poker Man online.

Motorcycle purchases, taking classes together, visiting your FIL and other family members, Colorado-bound or not--the facts don't change--she is still having an affair.

You have an open marriage.

Remove yourself as an option. She will never know what life is like w/o you as long as you hold her hand while she speaks to her lover on the phone, which is, in essence, what you are doing.

Women cannot and will not love a man they don't respect. Remember that always.

You need to start respecting yourself and putting the kabosh on this BS, which is, quite frankly, what it is. Stop letting her pull the strings on your puppet heart. This isn't about FEELINGS anymore--this is about you finding your dignity, being a man, and stop being a doormat.

My friend has a good saying: Don't let someone walk all over you just because you have FEELINGS for them.

The choice is yours: continue doing "more of the same" and spoon feed her whatever flavor of cake she most enjoys or standing up for yourself and saying "I'm mad as hell and I'm not going to take it anymore" and doing something about it.