9 months ago, my wife started playing online spades every night with a particular man. She had played lots on the computer and even on that sight. However, it wasn't long before it was obvious they were becoming more than card partners. She would search for him as soon as she got on the site. He would search for her as soon as he got on the site. They would play together for hours every night.
We had several arguments over the first 7 months. I would get angry about the time spent with him. She would give me the script that I know now to be quite common. "It's just a game." "You wouldn't care if I was spending this time with a woman." "You're just jealous." "You're just insecure." "He's just a good spades partner." "We win all the time because we have the same playing style." etc. etc.
About 2 months ago, I came across some google searches. "Falling in love over the internet." "Ending an emotional affair" and a few others. I confronted her. "You've been lying about "affair partner name". "Yes, I have. As a matter of fact, he's the one I wish I was with right now." She agreed that she wouldn't contact him any further.
A day or two later, she wanted to play with him to see if it could just be friends as it should have been. Somehow, being the doormat that I now know I have been, I reluctantly agreed. This went on for a few days. She had promised it wouldn't go back to every night. After a few every nights in a row, I said he had to go.
Then came the controlling accusations. "I need time to make my decision." "You can't force me to decide." etc. That's about the time I found this site.
I have finally starting becoming stronger, mainly due to all of the help and information I have gleaned from the many friends I have found on here. I have now a great support group. This site, my family, her family, friends, etc.
She has refused to stop the affair until a few nights ago. I sat her down and told her that she needs to either dump him, go to marriage counselling, and start working on our marriage or we need to start liquidating our assets in preparation for divorce. I told her I think we need to go for an uncontested divorce since it will be cheaper and easier on the kids.
She said she doesn't want a divorce and will end it with him that night. She called to end it with him, supposedly. However, I still don't understand and she won't explain why a "goodbye" phone call lasted about 3 hours. Also, she will not give up the affair phone or the online passwords. The OM has her passwords. He is the one that set them up. I told her that as long as he has that info and I don't, the affair is still ongoing.
She swears it is over, but won't give me what I ask. She is very angry that I don't just trust her. The kids are gone for a few days with my sister-in-law. Our anniversary is tomorrow. I cooked a nice meal last night - steak, baked potatoes, etc. We did eat dinner together. The trust thing came up last night and I explained that she has continually shown that she can not be trusted. Hiding the phone and not giving the passwords only reinforces that instead of working on rebuilding trust.
Pit of my Stomach made a great point. Even if she is done and does actively start working on the marriage, am I too far gone to forgiver her and start over? I don't know. I really feel nothing for her at this point. She feels less for me. One day at a time. Tomorrow is our 13th wedding anniversary. That should be a great day.
Re: Synopsis & Update on ongoing? emotional affair
You stay strong and no matter what any body tells you... you stay strong in the belief that NOT trusting your wife is a good thing.
Don't believe for one minute that you are the bad guy for not trusting your wife. She has broken that bond and it is her choice to stay with you and rebuild it by being transperent on *your* term, not hers.
I have no problem telling my cheating wife that I don't trust her, I have never hidden from that fact and I don't care how many people tell me its unhealth I will continue to make my self clear that this emotion, behavior or what ever is gone and the person that took it is Mrs. the guy.
Granted Mrs. the guy can leave and I could find some one else and I would have to tell them I have trust issues b/c .........
The point is this women has scared me and it is her job to heal me if she so chooses. The good thing she has made that choice to to just that and it has been hard for her but she is making progress in healing me.
Again stay strong and don't be fooled with the BS your wife and others tell you about trust. You have suffered an injury for say and you have every right to have these issues and it is her choice to help you heal. The good news is it is an injury and it can be healed..if not by Mrs. hurt....but when the right person comes along.
Re: Synopsis & Update on ongoing? emotional affair
I just had that conversation with my cheating husband this evening. I told him I only believe what he can prove right now, and he said he doesn't blame me. He has until tonight to make his decision, but at least he's not trying to hide it anymore, or expecting me to trust him.
All of this is to say - you already know the answer. If she's whining about "trust" and refusing to give you the keys to do that, she's still neck-deep in the affair. I'm sorry.
Cheating spouses have to wear their scarlett letters for a while, and they *will,* if they're really out of the affair and fully re-committed to the marriage.
Re: Synopsis & Update on ongoing? emotional affair
OK, Hurt...
Congrats on getting her to commit to the relationship. What that does not do for you is guarantee that it will work out, but what it DOES do is allow you a new set of reasonable expectations.
EMBRACE that. Expand your expectations and take what has been given to you through the commitment.
You do not need to ask her for passwords to phone accounts, simply call the company and reset them. You should write down list of what you want and give it to her, with a time frame to provide them. She has committed tot he relationship, and these are what you require. Make it clear that it is not to snoop, but to verify that she is keeping her word.
You should change her number. Do all the leg work if you have to, make sure you get the new number to the people who need it. If she is committed, this is a reasonable expectation.
Delete the game, and buy her a new one without on-line access. You will be offering an equally entertaining option for her, but the source of the pain must go. This too is a reasonable expectation for a the commit you have gotten.
I am going to say something that is going to hurt your feelings but i want you to take it, swallow it, digest it and let it fester inside you until it grows.
You have been a coward of a man. You have been weak and not the kind of leader that a family deserves.
This is your chance, Hurt, to become that man. To be the moral, spiritual and overall leader that your family has been without. You seem like a wonderful person with a good soul, Now you need to teach that lesson to your wife.
I have seen the abuse that you have endured, the weakness and fear in your posts. I am here to tell you that right now you are EMPOWERED. The BS stops today! Today you become a man, the man that a family needs to hold it together.
For too long YOU have been your biggest obstacle by allowing her control over a sinful situation. Give her love, but demand respect. This is not about you, this is not about her. This about the "WE" the "OUR" the "US" of marriage. She has been an infection to the unity of marriage and it is time for you to be the cure.
She has committed to saving the relationship. You must act on that as though it is a 100% commitment. You must act on the new set of expectations that she has allowed you to its fullest extent. Knowingly or unknowingly, it is irrelevant. She must accept her new reality.
I applaude you for having endured such torture, but now is the time to make your stand. Now is the time for you to take your place as head of your household. Lead her to forgiveness and yourself to redemption.
Begin with a letter outlining your new set of expectations. I have said this 100 times and i will say it again: It must be a letter... hand written preferred. Letters are a personal one way conversation that is not open for debate, excuses or rebuttal. They are clear, to the point and unmistakable in their intention. The reader can review for clarity. WRITE A LETTER.
Ask for difficult subject matter that you want revealed, in a letter as well (if you still need that information). For the very same reason.. and additionally because it easier for a person to be honest in a letter due tot he fact that they must think about what they are saying and they do not have to look you in the eye.
A transformation is about to take place. Everyone had that crossroad life. where what they say, what they do and how they do it will decide the path of their future. This is that time for you Hurt.
I hope this gives you motivation and inspiration to act and become the man that she needs you to be. The days of Desperation must be put behind you.
Let me know your thoughts on the matter.
Just a bit of advice: Be assertive. your wife is an aggressive personality type and you are a passive based person. She will seek accommodation from you because that is your highest level of conflict resolution that you are truly comfortable with.
Re: Synopsis & Update on ongoing? emotional affair
If you don't mind I'm going to go along twotime's post and share for you from a disloyal's point of view...and a female's. I suspect you may be surprised...
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OK, Hurt...
Congrats on getting her to commit to the relationship. What that does not do for you is guarantee that it will work out, but what it DOES do is allow you a new set of reasonable expectations.
EMBRACE that. Expand your expectations and take what has been given to you through the commitment.
This is dead on, 100% correct. You have stood firmly in a HECK of a marital storm and for that I am very proud of you. However, getting her to commit to the relationship does not mean SQUAT unless her actions match her words. Right now, her commitment is about as valuable as the helium that fills a balloon, so if she really is committed she is going to have to demonstrate that through ACTIONS and she's going to have to do those actions voluntarily. If you force her, you're just controlling her; and if she refuses then she is not committed. It's just that simple. It is MORE THAN REASONABLE for you to indicate to her what you would require in order to continue the marriage, but I would caution you to just remember that your boundaries will be fences around YOU and what you will and will not allow in your life, not rules that she "has to live by."
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You do not need to ask her for passwords to phone accounts, simply call the company and reset them. You should write down list of what you want and give it to her, with a time frame to provide them. She has committed tot he relationship, and these are what you require. Make it clear that it is not to snoop, but to verify that she is keeping her word.
Speaking as a former disloyal and a female, again this is right on the money but will probably be a bitter pill for her to swallow. Here's the way this works. If YOU are going to pay for a phone for her to use, then you will have the passwords and access to her records. Period. If she is going to pay for her own phone that's cool, but as the spouse whom she has already lied to, your boundary would be that you will not be with a person who does not willingly and openly share their phone and access to their phone at all times. That means if she wants to buy her own phone and pay for it, that's cool with you...but your boundary for yourself is that anyone who's going to be a partner with you will be open and transparent about their phone, email, FB, etc.
Now speaking as a disloyal, this "feels" like your spouse is treating you like a child and snooping on you, but the fact is that part of the cost of her hiding calls from you with COloverbooy and being devious and deceptive is that she now has to be an open book to earn your trust back. Or let me rephrase that. You trust her to be dishonest--100%!! You do not trust her HONESTY! So if she wants you to trust her honesty, she has to BEHAVE honestly and have her words and actions match. She will have to endure the "feeling" of being checked on and behave WELL...and after some time when she says she'll be XYZ and she actually is XYZ then you'll start to trust her honest again, right?
And speaking as a disloyal, it will help somewhat if you set a good example and also give her access to your email, phone, FB etc. that it shows her that not only do you hold HER to that standard, but you yourself will be transparent with her and allow her to see the True You. Now, there is no dishonesty for which she should distrust you except that if you have been feeling less than satisfied with the marriage, etc. this is the time to let her in on your personal thoughts the same as you expect her to open up herself to you. I guarantee you she'll say "But I don't want to see your email, phone, FB, etc." but that's too bad. This is a non-negotiable. She's transparent or she's hiding something. Period.
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You should change her number. Do all the leg work if you have to, make sure you get the new number to the people who need it. If she is committed, this is a reasonable expectation.
Again, I agree except on a very small matter. I believe she should change her number and this is a more-than-reasonable step to take. Ideally it would be best if you two worked as a team and she agreed to change for the sake of the marriage. If she is committed, she'll bite the bullet. If she does not want to change the number (and chances are about 90% she won't) her arguments will likely be "It will be inconvenient to tell my business contacts of the new number" or something silly like that), well that is the cost of her infidelity! If she is really willing to commit, she will do what has to be done to cut the OM out of her life 100%. That's why, on the occasion I will even suggest that if the affair is at work, that people quit their jobs! Because marriages survive periods of unemployment but they DO NOT SURVIVE ongoing adultery!
If she is not willing and you are paying for the phones, then I would suggest being firm and saying that if YOU pay for phones you will not pay for her to continue with her lover. The choices are a) you continue to pay, she changes her number and tells "family" that she had a hassling solicitor or something.... or b) she has to pay her own phone and you'll know then that her "commitment" is about as trustworthy as her promise.
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Delete the game, and buy her a new one without on-line access. You will be offering an equally entertaining option for her, but the source of the pain must go. This too is a reasonable expectation for a the commit you have gotten.
Agree on this 100%. In fact, after deleting the game, blocking it, etc. I suggest making the effort to find something recreational that both she and you enjoy doing. If she likes playing cards, then show her some games you like and do the fun activity together.
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I am going to say something that is going to hurt your feelings but i want you to take it, swallow it, digest it and let it fester inside you until it grows.
You have been a coward of a man. You have been weak and not the kind of leader that a family deserves.
This is your chance, Hurt, to become that man. To be the moral, spiritual and overall leader that your family has been without. You seem like a wonderful person with a good soul, Now you need to teach that lesson to your wife.
Okay I'm not going to call you a coward, but I am going to say that what is called for here is not going to be compromising and giving in. In order to save this, you are going to have to act like a warrior leader and do some things that will feel harsh and she will probably say hurt her. (Don't be fooled: it is her choice to act poorly that is actually hurting her...not what you are doing.) She will likely blame you and try to guilt you for her choices, but the fact is that in order to save HER and save the MARRIAGE you have to be the hero now. That means you have to be courageous enough to treat her like a full adult and if she makes disasterous choices, don't prevent her from experiencing the consequences. If she makes choices that are going to cost HER and sink HER don't let her pull you down and drown you and the kids too! And if you're going to make this marriage healthy and loving, YOU are going to have to set the tone...and the tone is this:
"When we married we volunteered to forsake all others and give 100% of our affection and loyalty ONLY TO EACH OTHER. I will not accept anything less than 100%. If you want to give any part of your affection to someone else, or give some of your loyalty to another man, I will not accept that. I will not participate in your choice to give yourself to someone else either. So it's either 100% to me, honoring the vow and what is my due...or you're on your own" And part of what is due to you as her husband, is her affection, her loyalty and the TRUE HER. That means knowing where she is, what she's doing, who she's doing it with, and knowing her real, innermost thoughts and feelings.
You HAVE TO DO THIS or you will not save your marriage. It is that urgent. So don't be afraid. It may feel counterproductive, because it seems like it just makes her "more mad" but in real life, it is what your marriage needs. Be Brave. Do it.
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I have seen the abuse that you have endured, the weakness and fear in your posts. I am here to tell you that right now you are EMPOWERED. The BS stops today! Today you become a man, the man that a family needs to hold it together.
I agree with this as well. The buck stops here and stops now. The line is in the sand, and it is a reasonable one. You understand that people make mistakes and you're willing to grow with her and do better as a couple...but the COST is that she has to let go of the lover and then prove to you with her actions that she is continuing to do so. There is no compromise here.
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For too long YOU have been your biggest obstacle by allowing her control over a sinful situation. Give her love, but demand respect. This is not about you, this is not about her. This about the "WE" the "OUR" the "US" of marriage. She has been an infection to the unity of marriage and it is time for you to be the cure.
Actually I was going to write to you about this too. Just so you know, I am a believing Christian and wanted to explain a few things that seemed to be confusing you. I'll suffice it to say here that God does indeed say that He hates divorce, yet in that same verse (right after that) it says "...so be on your guard so you don't become unfaithful!" [look it up: Malachi 2:16]. What God hates there is someone who BREAKS THEIR COVENANT. Next, unconditional love does not mean "I'll let her get away with anything." Read the book of Hosea (in the Old Testament) and you'll see it's by a prophet who was specifically told by God to marry a hooker and then stay faithful to her. Why? He wanted an example of what it's been like to be God and love us, and yet we were unfaithful and turning to other gods all the time! But the "unconditional" part does not mean that He prevents us from experiencing the consequences of our infidelity (in turning to other gods). Hey one huge consequence is that sin is in the world!! Nope we still have to experience the consequences and they hurt us a LOT...but the "unconditional" part means that IF WE REPENT and turn to Him, He does not turn us away. Same for unfaithful spouses: if they REPENT (which means 180 degrees turning away from their infidelity and changing how they act and think and feel) they still have to experience the consequences of their bad choices (such as, losing their phone, being snooped on, maybe having an STD...) but if they absolutely change, then the loyal one is asked to not turn them away. They have the RIGHT but the very high road would be to not exercise a right you have the ability to exercise! Does that make sense?
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She has committed to saving the relationship. You must act on that as though it is a 100% commitment. You must act on the new set of expectations that she has allowed you to its fullest extent. Knowingly or unknowingly, it is irrelevant. She must accept her new reality.
I applaude you for having endured such torture, but now is the time to make your stand. Now is the time for you to take your place as head of your household. Lead her to forgiveness and yourself to redemption.
What can I say?
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Begin with a letter outlining your new set of expectations. I have said this 100 times and i will say it again: It must be a letter... hand written preferred. Letters are a personal one way conversation that is not open for debate, excuses or rebuttal. They are clear, to the point and unmistakable in their intention. The reader can review for clarity. WRITE A LETTER.
Ask for difficult subject matter that you want revealed, in a letter as well (if you still need that information). For the very same reason.. and additionally because it easier for a person to be honest in a letter due tot he fact that they must think about what they are saying and they do not have to look you in the eye.
I agree with this as well, with the reminder that you do not control her but you absolutely DO control you and what you will and will not live with and allow in your life. I find that when I talk to someone about difficult topics I can do "okay" but when I write, I can be more precise, fix the wording to be more accurate, go back and edit so it's not filled with emotionally explosive words, etc. Doing that while talking can be hard. So I agree that if you aren't a natural "orator" that writing is better...if you're a good writer. If you're not a talker or writer, give us a clue in what way you best identify and communicate your thoughts and feelings and we can adapt that to fit your situation. Okay?
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A transformation is about to take place. Everyone had that crossroad life. where what they say, what they do and how they do it will decide the path of their future. This is that time for you Hurt.
I hope this gives you motivation and inspiration to act and become the man that she needs you to be. The days of Desperation must be put behind you.
Let me know your thoughts on the matter.
Just a bit of advice: Be assertive. your wife is an aggressive personality type and you are a passive based person. She will seek accommodation from you because that is your highest level of conflict resolution that you are truly comfortable with.
NEVER compromise, always collaborate.
You can do this hurt!!!
I have one final thought. From this point forward, you and your wife have to move from a confrontational/adversarial way of working to a cooperative/mutual way of working. In other words, move from being competitors to being on the same team. In order to do this you will have to be transparent (meaning "see through") to each other, and you are going to need to practice standing up for yourself in an assertive way. This means being honest and healthy--true to yourself--not being passive and not being abusive to her. Practice stating your truth and standing for it...and then evaluate where you could do better and practice THAT.
I agree with twotime also on this: You CAN do this, Hurting. You have people behind you, now LEAD ON!
Re: Synopsis & Update on ongoing? emotional affair
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Originally Posted by just_peachy
All of this is to say - you already know the answer. If she's whining about "trust" and refusing to give you the keys to do that, she's still neck-deep in the affair. I'm sorry.
Absolutely. I told her that keeping the affair phone and passwords hidden screams so loudly that the affair is still on that I can't hear her words saying it's over. There would be no problem getting rid of the phone. OM and me are the only two with the number. It was specifically bought and only used for contact with him. I saw the chat where they first discussed it. It was on that horrible night that I witnessed levels of the iceberg that I previously would have never imagined. He said Verizon. That is what she chose so she has unlimited cell - to cell minutes with him. (I have AT&T wireless.)
Also, I went to my parents' yesterday for my brother's birthday. The kids have gone to my sister-in-law's house for a few days. She was home alone. When I got home, I looked at the internet history. There was a new game that she had been playing, golf. She has never before showed any interest whatsoever in golf. I have the transcripts (Possibly the same night as the cell phone conversation) where he mentions finding a new game, maybe golf. Also, her user name that she was playing golf with was HIS FAVORITE screenname that she had used on Spadester. I also have the transcripts showing that conversation. I told her I was going to ask her a question and I would appreciate it if she would give me an honest answer. "Have you had any contact with OM since you said you wouldn't?" She said no. I said, "Well something interesting is on the history. You played 45 holes of golf today online. OM mentioned changing games to golf. You also played with his favorite screen name. Is that just coincidence?" "Yes, it is. I haven't talked to him." I asked how in the world she could possibly expect me to believe that.
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Originally Posted by twotimeloser
You do not need to ask her for passwords to phone accounts, simply call the company and reset them. !!!
It is a prepaid phone. I have tried. She has the security question, pin #, etc. hidden. It is in her name. There is no way for me to gain access without the phone, which she still keeps hidden.
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Originally Posted by twotimeloser
You should write down list of what you want and give it to her, with a time frame to provide them. She has committed tot he relationship, and these are what you require. Make it clear that it is not to snoop, but to verify that she is keeping her word.
!!!
I agree. I will do that today and give it to her tonight. This is our 13 year anniversary. Woo Hoo!! I am considering picking up some roses on the way home. Then at least she can't come back and say I didn't give her anything. I gave her roses for Valentine's Day. Her present to me? Hours playing games with Romeo.
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Originally Posted by twotimeloser
You have been a coward of a man. You have been weak and not the kind of leader that a family deserves.
Yes, that hurts. However, it is true.
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Originally Posted by twotimeloser
Ask for difficult subject matter that you want revealed, in a letter as well (if you still need that information). For the very same reason.. and additionally because it easier for a person to be honest in a letter due tot he fact that they must think about what they are saying and they do not have to look you in the eye.
Another good idea. There are many questions I have. I will ask for them in a letter. Thank you for taking the time to give such a detailed response and great advice.
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Originally Posted by Affaircare
This is dead on, 100% correct. You have stood firmly in a HECK of a marital storm and for that I am very proud of you. However, getting her to commit to the relationship does not mean SQUAT unless her actions match her words. Right now, her commitment is about as valuable as the helium that fills a balloon, so if she really is committed she is going to have to demonstrate that through ACTIONS and she's going to have to do those actions voluntarily. If you force her, you're just controlling her; and if she refuses then she is not committed. It's just that simple. It is MORE THAN REASONABLE for you to indicate to her what you would require in order to continue the marriage, but I would caution you to just remember that your boundaries will be fences around YOU and what you will and will not allow in your life, not rules that she "has to live by." !
Great point. I believe that is how I've come across in her mind. Here are the rules you must live by.
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Originally Posted by Affaircare
If YOU are going to pay for a phone for her to use, then you will have the passwords and access to her records. Period. If she is going to pay for her own phone that's cool, but as the spouse whom she has already lied to, your boundary would be that you will not be with a person who does not willingly and openly share their phone and access to their phone at all times. That means if she wants to buy her own phone and pay for it, that's cool with you...but your boundary for yourself is that anyone who's going to be a partner with you will be open and transparent about their phone, email, FB, etc.
I refused to re-fill the prepaid phone when it ran out a few days ago. She actually asked me to stop at Wal-Mart and buy a re-fill card. I adamantly refused. Guess what? Mr. OM finally put some skin in the game and re-filled it. I told her the phone has to go. He has the pass words, etc. It was bought specifically for him. It has been only used for him. Now, he has actually put some cash in it.
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Originally Posted by Affaircare
Now speaking as a disloyal, this "feels" like your spouse is treating you like a child and snooping on you, but the fact is that part of the cost of her hiding calls from you with COloverbooy and being devious and deceptive is that she now has to be an open book to earn your trust back. Or let me rephrase that. You trust her to be dishonest--100%!! You do not trust her HONESTY! So if she wants you to trust her honesty, she has to BEHAVE honestly and have her words and actions match. She will have to endure the "feeling" of being checked on and behave WELL...and after some time when she says she'll be XYZ and she actually is XYZ then you'll start to trust her honest again, right?
Absolutely. I told her that I can't believe a word that comes out of her mouth. As long as she continues to hide the affair phone and let him keep the passwords, etc. she continues to erode my trust in her. By giving full transparency, she would begin to build some trust back. Right now, she is still eroding it.
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Originally Posted by Affaircare
And speaking as a disloyal, it will help somewhat if you set a good example and also give her access to your email, phone, FB etc. that it shows her that not only do you hold HER to that standard, but you yourself will be transparent with her and allow her to see the True You. Now, there is no dishonesty for which she should distrust you except that if you have been feeling less than satisfied with the marriage, etc. this is the time to let her in on your personal thoughts the same as you expect her to open up herself to you. I guarantee you she'll say "But I don't want to see your email, phone, FB, etc." but that's too bad. This is a non-negotiable. She's transparent or she's hiding something. Period.
Again, right on track. I have offered all my information. She responded just as you said. Yes, her lack of transparency shouts very loudly that the affair is still on.
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Originally Posted by Affaircare
Again, I agree except on a very small matter. I believe she should change her number and this is a more-than-reasonable step to take. Ideally it would be best if you two worked as a team and she agreed to change for the sake of the marriage. If she is committed, she'll bite the bullet. If she does not want to change the number (and chances are about 90% she won't) her arguments will likely be "It will be inconvenient to tell my business contacts of the new number" or something silly like that), well that is the cost of her infidelity! If she is really willing to commit, she will do what has to be done to cut the OM out of her life 100%. That's why, on the occasion I will even suggest that if the affair is at work, that people quit their jobs! Because marriages survive periods of unemployment but they DO NOT SURVIVE ongoing adultery!
Changing for other contacts is not a valid argument for her. OM and I are the only two that have that number.
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Originally Posted by Affaircare
"When we married we volunteered to forsake all others and give 100% of our affection and loyalty ONLY TO EACH OTHER. I will not accept anything less than 100%. If you want to give any part of your affection to someone else, or give some of your loyalty to another man, I will not accept that. I will not participate in your choice to give yourself to someone else either. So it's either 100% to me, honoring the vow and what is my due...or you're on your own" And part of what is due to you as her husband, is her affection, her loyalty and the TRUE HER. That means knowing where she is, what she's doing, who she's doing it with, and knowing her real, innermost thoughts and feelings.
Thank you. I will incorporate this into my letter to her today. You won't charge me with plagiarism, will you? lol
Quote:
Originally Posted by Affaircare
Actually I was going to write to you about this too. Just so you know, I am a believing Christian and wanted to explain a few things that seemed to be confusing you. I'll suffice it to say here that God does indeed say that He hates divorce, yet in that same verse (right after that) it says "...so be on your guard so you don't become unfaithful!" [look it up: Malachi 2:16]. What God hates there is someone who BREAKS THEIR COVENANT. Next, unconditional love does not mean "I'll let her get away with anything." Read the book of Hosea (in the Old Testament) and you'll see it's by a prophet who was specifically told by God to marry a hooker and then stay faithful to her. Why? He wanted an example of what it's been like to be God and love us, and yet we were unfaithful and turning to other gods all the time! But the "unconditional" part does not mean that He prevents us from experiencing the consequences of our infidelity (in turning to other gods). Hey one huge consequence is that sin is in the world!! Nope we still have to experience the consequences and they hurt us a LOT...but the "unconditional" part means that IF WE REPENT and turn to Him, He does not turn us away. Same for unfaithful spouses: if they REPENT (which means 180 degrees turning away from their infidelity and changing how they act and think and feel) they still have to experience the consequences of their bad choices (such as, losing their phone, being snooped on, maybe having an STD...) but if they absolutely change, then the loyal one is asked to not turn them away. They have the RIGHT but the very high road would be to not exercise a right you have the ability to exercise! Does that make sense?
Absolutely! I have read Hosea a few times lately. I suppose it is the repent piece I haven't been looking at. She certainly hasn't repented.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Affaircare
I have one final thought. From this point forward, you and your wife have to move from a confrontational/adversarial way of working to a cooperative/mutual way of working. In other words, move from being competitors to being on the same team. In order to do this you will have to be transparent (meaning "see through") to each other, and you are going to need to practice standing up for yourself in an assertive way. This means being honest and healthy--true to yourself--not being passive and not being abusive to her. Practice stating your truth and standing for it...and then evaluate where you could do better and practice THAT.
I agree. Currently, we are both acting like enemies on the battlefield. We are attached for life, regardless of how the marriage works out. She will always be the mother of my children. I will always be the father of her children. We certainly need to end the adversarial relationship.
Re: Synopsis & Update on ongoing? emotional affair
I have to go against the grain in one aspect here... I don't see where she has committed to the marriage. She is still actively involved with OM and still calls him, still wants to see him, still disrespects TN by not ending it.
Re: Synopsis & Update on ongoing? emotional affair
I want to make this clear. and I want to explain this in a way that you will really get the entire picture of.
Now some are going to disagree with but I Will explain why it would be a good idea in YOUR situation, and not in most.
You need to locate that phone. Before you locate it, you should set up a cutting boards and a hammer.
When you locate that phone, you should smash it with a hammer in front of her. and say the following " As part of our commitment to each other, i am committed to helping you where you are weak. This act that I have just done is to support you in YOUR goal of staying committed. If you get another phone, I will find it and continue to smash each phone you buy, in order to help you achieve your goals. That is the best way i can help you"
Now some of you are on the floor right now... but this why it should be done this way...
She will get away with anything you let her get away with... Which has been everything up to this point.
Being that she is aggressive and you are passive, she does not understand your message. If you deal with her in an assertive manner ( a cousin of aggressive) Then she will fully understand you.
Aggressive people communicate through force. Not physical but through verbal force and symbolic force. They like to hold things over peoples heads and exert authority. This is where you need to be, in order to communicate with her effectively. Passive people avoid and accomidate.. your lack of action on this prepaid phone has been accomidation and that is enabling.
Find the phone and smash it... That is not some redneck advice, it is real advice.
Re: Synopsis & Update on ongoing? emotional affair
I agree. I had my hands on it the night she called him last (that I know of). She wanted it back. It is a flip phone and I had a hand on both ends of it. I asked her how many pieces she wants it back in. I should have gone ahead and snapped it right then. Actually, the night she brought it home, I should not have let her in the house with it. I knew it was in her purse. I should have snatched the purse, found the phone, and smashed it. Yes, I have been systematically searching for it again. It will re-surface. Then it will be gone forever.
Re: Synopsis & Update on ongoing? emotional affair
^ And did she call him last night?
Quote:
Originally Posted by twotimeloser
You need to locate that phone. Before you locate it, you should set up a cutting boards and a hammer.
When you locate that phone, you should smash it with a hammer in front of her. and say the following " As part of our commitment to each other, i am committed to helping you where you are weak. This act that I have just done is to support you in YOUR goal of staying committed. If you get another phone, I will find it and continue to smash each phone you buy, in order to help you achieve your goals. That is the best way i can help you"
Re: Synopsis & Update on ongoing? emotional affair
Quote:
Originally Posted by twotimeloser
I want to make this clear. and I want to explain this in a way that you will really get the entire picture of.
Now some are going to disagree with but I Will explain why it would be a good idea in YOUR situation, and not in most.
You need to locate that phone. Before you locate it, you should set up a cutting boards and a hammer.
When you locate that phone, you should smash it with a hammer in front of her. and say the following " As part of our commitment to each other, i am committed to helping you where you are weak. This act that I have just done is to support you in YOUR goal of staying committed. If you get another phone, I will find it and continue to smash each phone you buy, in order to help you achieve your goals. That is the best way i can help you"
Now some of you are on the floor right now... but this why it should be done this way...
She will get away with anything you let her get away with... Which has been everything up to this point.
Being that she is aggressive and you are passive, she does not understand your message. If you deal with her in an assertive manner ( a cousin of aggressive) Then she will fully understand you.
Aggressive people communicate through force. Not physical but through verbal force and symbolic force. They like to hold things over peoples heads and exert authority. This is where you need to be, in order to communicate with her effectively. Passive people avoid and accomidate.. your lack of action on this prepaid phone has been accomidation and that is enabling.
Find the phone and smash it... That is not some redneck advice, it is real advice.
I think this sounds like a great idea, but putting it in a glass of water seems less threatening/violent. Smashing things could bite him in the ass if this ends in divorce.
Synopsis & Update on ongoing? emotional affair 
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