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Never thought I would be posting here

107K views 290 replies 58 participants last post by  Taxman 
#1 · (Edited)
Hello all. Here is my story. As you may or may not know I stumbled on this site about 4 months ago when I googled "My wife doesnt love me anymore"..I have been posting on the sex in marriage, and mens rooms, but liteally had not looked at this forum, because that was not the problem. I have been going thru 2.5 years of hell at home, no real affection, lots of resentment from both my W and me, some pretty rough times. I have contemplated divorce,but was reluctant to give up on my 30 year marriage, felt like this was the "worse" in "B or W" and I really take that vow seriously. My kids are all but grown one is going to be a Junior in college, the other two are 24 and married, and 27 bipolar and a constant source of frustation, exasperation (putting it mildly, but to tell that story would take a novel, and I am afraid this one is going to be too long as it is). In December 2009, my troubled one moved back home (from UTAH where she had lived for 3 years, and had refussed to talk to us, wrote us off,) and that was a disaster! Her time here was STRESSFUL finally she got her own place in Florida, but before she was gone my wife was prescribed anti depressent, and I believe the meds, along with that smothering stress brought on her subsequent lack of libido. and a slide into the abyss. (more here as well) Couple of months ago: my W who does not work outside the home, started doing odd jobs working with a family friend of 22 years (if there is a power tool in our home it is hers not mine) and at first I was happy, I was actually glad that she was doing something that seemed to make her happy ( a VERY rare occurance) and the little extra money would come in handy as well, especially since she seem to really like haveing her own money (I am not wealthy but we live a nice suburban americana lifestile, but the little she made helped pump her ego) I became suspicious of her relationship with this friend as they did a lot of things together...went to auction sales together (buying tools, I get bored easily at auctions, she loves them, the OM was happy to go with her, as he likes auctions as well) etc. Saturday nite I waited for her to fall asleep, then checked her cell phone, and on there were these texts from the OM, professing his love for her. Looking at the "sent" messages, I saw where she expressed her love for him..."thank u for loving me" "I needed you so much" so at 3:00 am I loaded my shotgun and headed for his house, not to shoot him but to put loads of double ought buckshot into his car and truck. As i patroled the area to make sure no cops were about my head cleared a bit and I realized to do jail time would just be stupid, so I proceeded to drive around thinking a million thoughts, my head spinning. after an hour or so I drove back past his house (he lives 5 minutes from me) and parked in front was my wife. She had found the empty gun box figured out where I was (there is some info missing here how she figured it out etc..but god you people dont need to be reading this until next year). As I drove up, she jumped out of her car and ran over to me saying, "Your problem is with me, not with him!" I rolled down my window and said "You are right you s**t! "You go right now and pack your bags and get the hell out of my house!" She then said "I love him, he treats me better than you ever have!" "You have never treated me good" She proceeded to drive home, load her suitcases and leave, going to his house. Now this is Sunday 4am. On monday I received a tearful phone call,on my voice mail informing me that she wasnt going to "take me to the cleaners". I texted her"What do you want?" "My attorneys name isXXX and his phone is YYYY." was her reply. I called the att. and all she basically wanted was her personal things and $50k. Now her half of our assets would be worth much more than that the vast majority tied up in our business not liquid at all and if forced to sell in this market easily $300k would be lost. I had been concerned that I would be forced to sell to pay her off, so that made me breathe a little easier. I know the attrny, picked up on my surprise and he state"all she wants is to get this over with and get on with life." A friend had explained to me that in Indiana, a H and W if they can agree on the split of assets, can use one attrny draw up an agreement, sign it, give it to a judge to sign and 60 days later Boom! u are D. I asked if that were true and it was. So I texted my wife back that I was basically in agreement, thought we could go this route. "Fine As long as it is not contested" says she. Today I met with my attrny, he agreeded to review the doc. for me. I then called her guy back, discussed a couple of items he had brought up, mentioned that she missed her 20+ oil lamps and she would want them on the list, and in 20 minutes hammered out the basics of the entire agreement.
Tonight as I looked the texts over, I believe strongly that this was the very first encounter, and triggered by my being an ass, and going to the office to get away from her (I have done a LOT of that the last two years) not giving her any breaks but just acknowledging my fault in this as well
This knowledge has caused me to loose 90% of my anger!, still have 100% of the hurt of betrayal, but thinking for the first time this might be saveable (cant believe I am saying this) as I still do very much love my wife. I havent been able to stand living with her the last two years, bt I can remember back just before that, my youngest started college, we were empty nesters, and loving it and each other. best 4 months of our marriage! So my inclination is to hurry thru the D to conserve our business, then thinking about looking into Recon. I have read the forums everyday for these last 4 months, and kinda know were we REALLY went wrong, know enough to realize at least we have something we can work on with the right help. Am I delusional? I realize she would have to be willing to try, and all that but am I just in denial? Will I wake up 3 wks from now and hate her all over again, a product of this WAVE of emotion I have been on? is this just me wishing?
 
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#3 ·
I think you're dreaming, but all she can do is say "no", so it certainly wouldn't hurt to try. However, it would seem your regrets are momentary and based upon memories. Don't forget to also give weight to the bad memories. There were reasons you went to the office to get away from her which seemed VERY reasonable at the time.
 
#4 ·
I dont understand "momentary" but actually before our 4 month empty nest, i would rate our marriage as better than average, just those 4 months were awesome, our business was doing well, money issue still existed (own your own business..huh!) but I felt were were going from pretty good to Great! then she arrived.
 
#6 ·
My point was that you seem to be having regrets because the divorce is imminent. I think that's natural. You are remembering the good times. I was suggesting that you don't forget the bad times because they were as real as the good times. Assuming your wife had a change of heart what makes you think after a few months you both wouldn't just fall back into the same routine?
 
#5 ·
As luck would have it, we were scheduled to fly to Florida together today to see about my troubled ones new baby that, because of her mother, is temporarily in the welfare system I backed out of going, my W is going tommorow as there is a hearing on Thursday concerning her care. My W has to stay there for 4 weeks to care for the baby along with my daughter, while she completes some evaluations otherwise my gandbaby goes into the system. At least she will be away from the OM for a while.
 
#7 ·
Hey Hoosier----do you think her lust for this guy----is a result of being with you for 30 yrs., and things just got boring, tired, same old, same old---I know you had an exciting 4 mths with her recently,---but it was still the same old you, and the same old ways----do you think just maybe, that this new spice (her lover) came from her being seduced, as I am sure she probably was, and because she was just in hot passionate lust---the way the 2 of you were in the beginning yrs., of your mge., and maybe in that recent 4 month period

Obviously she was demonizing you, in order to justify her lust---

It is very possible that once she really sees reality with her lover, the everyday things that happen when you are with someone full time, having to deal with all of life's problems---that he won't measure up---question then becomes, will you still want her---knowing that for a period of time, she did not want you

You don't seem to have much choice at this point----if you really do want her----just bide your time---and see how it all goes down

Hook-ups from A's have a 97% failure rate---so just wait her out---She will eventually see the grass is not greener, but it is really a dirty shade of brown.
 
#8 · (Edited)
Frankly her total lack of remorse and desire to divorce you, says that your 30 year old marriage is over and you need to move on with life. Unlike other men in your situation, your divorce won't wipe you out financially. Take it before she changes her mind.

Read the links below my signature, especially the one titled "Just Let Them Go" which I believe can help you with moving on with your life.

As JNJ said, she needs to experience reality with the OM.
 
#9 ·
JNJ: I dont think it is a lust thing for her so much as my treating her like s**t, (which I did her, she did me) for the last 2 years, this guy comes along, he is a real likeable fellow, he starts paying attention to her, does things with her......

monty, at the intial confrontation it was no remorse, but I kinda think the $ offer, was a direct reflection of her feeling guilty....again I might be wrong...but as I write this at 5am, having been up all night again, I am thinking that I never even talked with her, had a good ol yelling match, and realize that for the last 2 years I havent either and I think that is a mistake, I am a nonconfirmational keep to yourself kinda guy (this is ONE area of weakness) when it comes to relationships, instead of getting any problem out in the open I hold it in and the resentment grows and it has grown HUGH....and in another posting AEFH pointed out that her actions at that time were "passively agressive".... I read alot about what that is and realized I am just as guilty of doing that to her! (this is where our counseling should start) Im thinking two things 1. How dare I not be there for my grandbaby tomorrow, just because of my W and my problems. That is not what I am about, my family has always meant the most to me. If I am guilty of anything there, it is that over the years I have locked into my work to make things good for them, when I should have been working more on being a better person for them (I have my own issues) and 2. Doesnt 30 years deserve more from me than a "get the hell out of my house, dont EVEN talk to me"?
I am booking a flight to Florida, I will be at that hearing tomorrow where I SHOULD BE. I will get to see my grandaughter (1st) for only the second time in her 5 months of being on this earth. I am going to ask my W to talk to me, I am going to ask her if she would be willing to try. I dont think she will, but I really should ask. Hell I was 16 when we started dating and I am 51 almost 52 now. I am not totally scared to go on without her if she does not want to try, but I really should ask her, not beg, not plead, ask her if she wants to...

s**t do you know how much tickets cost when you buy them the day you want to travel? crapola, but its booked I am going to be there tonight, for tomorrow mornings hearing and I'm going to ask....definitely nuts I know, I realize that it is probably 80/20 against me, I dont really think desperate, but if I dont ask I will NEVER be able to forgive myself...she says no, I am prepared to continue on without her, and I realize that even if she says yes, a real crapshoot for success at best. But 30 years deserves more than a "you sl*t" on the street ending. Lets see, I now have 3.5 hours to get my haircut, get some new shoes, (important to look good for the Judge) pack my overnight bag, make out my payroll, and get on the road. Guess I will sleep on the plane.
 
#10 ·
I would take the deal as fast as possible.
Your chance of reconciliation is not high. If you start trying to reconcile, she will come to her senses. Your ultimate divorce after trying to reconcile will involve selling your business and you giving her spousal support. I would take the deal in a heartbeat. You can always reconcile after that.
 
#12 ·
I can understand you feeling bad over your poor choice of words on that night you went over the OM house. And I also understand your need to give reconciliation one more shot before moving on. But what you should understand is that any attempt on your part may be viewed by her as a manipulative, disingenuous, ego tripping tactic designed not because you truly love her but because you don't want to let the OM have her.

People, like animals, tend to want to get as far away as possible from someone who is aggressively pursuing them and your wife is no exception. So instead of pursuing her, behave in such a manner that will make her want to pursue you. Showing her that you want her to be happy even if it means divorcing her in order for her to make a life with the OM, is one of the ways of you abandoning pursuit of her. Your wife has not had to deal with the OM 24/7 so her view of him is more fantasy based than reality based. She may discover that the OM is not actually who he appears to be. Even a 62 year old man can be a player.

Hicks is right. Divorcing her now is simply a formality and there is always the possibility of reconciliation and remarriage later on after her affair with the OM tanks. This is also an opportunity for you to work on bettering yourself emotionally and physically so if there is a reconciliation after the divorce, she'll be attracted to the new you.

Again I strongly suggest that you read the initial post of my thread titled Just Let Them Go.
 
#13 ·
Whatever your faults were, there is NEVER any excuse to cheat. She made her choice to go f*ck another man instead of communicating with you, going to counseling, or divorcing you. Instead she chose the easy route - to cheat. Like most betrayed spouses, you are grasping at straws and taking the blame for her adultery. You are in survival mode and willing to do anything to save the marriage. This is only temporary.

Now you are chasing after her. This never works. She is deep in the affair fog with her OM. She is only concerned with her feelings and her OM at this point. Any attempt by you to chase her only results in her looking down on you and feeling this is too little, too late. You are basically wasting your time and money here. If you want to be there for your grand child, fine, but begging your WW to give it a chance is fruitless. Do you think you are going to be able to woo her back into your arms?

You cannot compete with a fantasy, and what she has with him is a fantasy. He can be the perfect prince charming right now, be everything in her eyes that you cannot ever be. Thats how these affair fantasies work.

You have to work on letting her go.
 
#15 ·
I have not posted in a while but after reading this I feel compelled to respond to your post.
Hoosier
I think you need to think carefully about a number of things before you give up on your marriage.

Money. If you get out quick you walk away with a lions share of the assets. If that the most important thong for you then you need go no further in your deliberations. However, you will have to balance having the money against not giving a 30 yr good marriage any effort. Factor in also that your finances wil figure heavily on future relationships. A new woman will evaluate your ability to provide for her. If it's s younger woman she will have kids or want them. I think the money issue is a wash. You have it but not for long.

Salvageability of the relationship. A few things to consider - you had a more than good relationship for 30 yrs, the short empty nest period was intense. Very fortunate for you both. Then your daughter went through yourlives like a bad disease. Not so good.

The stress pulled you apart from your wife. You both made mistakes in handling the stress. You mentioned you escaped into work and maybe not giving your wife the emotional support and physical presence that she expected of man who she had been good to for so long. . Your wife may have felt shocked that you abandoned her and left her to handle the stress.

Her mistake was the daddy of them all she betrayed you. She is not remorseful, yet.

Your effort to salvage your 30 yr marriage. I think you efforts have been negligible. Somewhat suppressing given the preceding 30 yrs. The bad times were not you or your wife's, it was something niether of you could have predicted. If your wife caused the problems then you would have reason to cut and run.

Try to step into her shoes for a moment. You her husband of 30 cut out on her when she needed you the most duting a time of great stress. Then you confirms her lack of value to you by getting out quick for 50k because thinking things through and trying to keep her in your life might cost you too much. Wow Don't you think that 30 yrs and 3 children, working together to build a bisiness is worth some careful consideration? If she gets her fair share of the things that she helped make.

You both have much to think about, if don't slow this process down, , you will both deeply regret it I think. I am not blaming you but asking you to put every thing on the table to consider not just money. Think then act. No matter what you do look at your sense of fairness, ability to give as much as you take, ability to appreciate the people in your life. These issues will come in any future relationship so you may as well work on them or you are destined to fail.
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#18 ·
Well after the trip from HELL (cracked windshield in plane made me miss connection causeing me to get to Florida 12 hours after original start time (my iteneriy was suppose to be 5) then second air port had major storms backing up flights for hours I have NEVER had atravel experience like that. All the way down here I made notes of things I wanted to address, I mean pages. I get here, go online, read the comments fromn Hicks, AFEH, Sinister. lord Mayhem and especially Moritari's just let them go. and it is like a fog has cleared. So much great imput! Thank you all. I am going about my grandaughter tommorrow so glad I came for her cant wait to see her. After reading all these I really like the "hope he makes you happy approach" because you are right. no matter what I say she is in LOVE with him I wont change that. I know the OM (remember 22 years) he is a neat nick...she is boarder line horder with the line getting thinner and thinner every year. He is going to die! she cant help herself. Thats going to be revenge enough against him. I KNOW IT Is coming! LOL I gain nothing to even really try tomorrow and I am not going to I am going to be civil, polite, but firm. I am going to shine tomorow (I am excellent in these type situations) I had to laugh, she flew down, and had to take the bus from the airport to downtown, where my daughter picked her up, just to save one day on the car rental! She is definitely not use to that, I am sure she is fine with it, as the young lovers are taking it on together, but that kind of deal will get old to her eventually. I also did remember how miserable I was (it wasoverwhelming at times). because I knew she didnt love me.then the unbelieveable happened... I kinda got hit on in the air port! (I always travel with the W before) that was a differnt experience. I have received SO many calls from concerned friends that I cant help but feel loved. Tomorrow right before I leave to go to the courthouse I am going to read thru the Just let them go thread again to get primed. I am going to be fine. I am not saying I would never consider R, butthat would require a lot of counseling I will wait for her to start and she never does that is her choice as well, A lot of good times in the meantime in fact did you know that Vegas is on the way home from florida? LOL the advice to improve myself is excellent as well. It is just so unbelieveable how my emotions have kicked my a** got to be careful of that, actually ate a sandwhich today, first food in three days, really. I will make it! looking forward to a few months of chilling adn finding new things to do. Not looking for any woman anytime soon, gonna get me shaped up, and chill with my buds, thanks again all of you. I will be vigilant against the despair I have felt 2-3 times a day, wont let it take me. I can be nice to her, cause I know her betrayal is going to eat at her. especially if I give her no reason to hate me. Where is that agreement? where do I sign? oh there is no spousal support in Indiana. going to bed to sleep havent been able to do that lately,,,feeling sleepy now... Betrayal........it can kill ya with emotions it causes.
 
#20 ·
Update: I am back in Indiana, she is still In Florida seeing about our grandchild. Things are going good in that field, the authorities have approved my daughters home for the baby and now seem to be actively engaged in returning her to my daughter and W. (The deal is my W is actually the caretaker for the baby, it is hoped that in the next couple of weeks or so, daughter will have complete care and custody of the baby, at which time my W is going to return to Indiana) The night before I left to come back we were working on the apartment until rather late, we set down to relax, I looked at her and she said "what are you looking at" thanks for giving me an opening. We had a 2 hr conversation, and a lot of good information was exchanged. I expressed my love for her, learned that she has really been suffering for the last 4 years. I explained to her that I felt that thru lots and lots of counseling we could be together and things would be as they should have been not the way they were. As it was after 1 am in the morning she said she just felt numb and would not answer me as to yea or nay on the reconcil. The next morning (monday of this week) as I was preparing to go to the airport I told her, "I will trade you even up...your last 4 years of troubles from me for the last 2 weeks of what you did to me" with that I left. Since then I attended the first counseling session I have ever had. And was please to find out that the discussion we had and what was said was almost exactly what the counselor suggested. We find out today if the baby goes to my W and daughter (social worker believes that to be the case) at my counselors suggestion I am going to wait until Sunday (letting things settle a bit down there) before I call and ask her decision. That phone call scares me to death! I have practiced the paragraph from "Just let them go" for when they cant make a decision, telling them that you will make it for them. My heart sinks, my stomach rolls my blood pressure rises when I think of making that call. But I WILL make the call! I will require an answer, I will live with her choice.....I have a sheet prepared for the call. One side is NO/Unsure....it contains the paragarph from just let them go. the other side is Yes (work on marriage) on it, it contains 1. Divorce will continue. 2. you will call the OM immediately and tell him that you have decided to work on your marriage. You will tell him to do not contact you, and if he does in any way you will notify me immediately. You will tell him to box up what belongings he has at his home put them on his porch, call my office ( I am his insurance agent) and I will arrange for someone other than myself to pick them up. (To refresh your memory, upon discovering the PA/EA I told her to leave which she did in the middle of the night...going to his house, two days later she went to Florida) 3. I will set up a time for you to start counseling by phone so when you get back we will be up and running. Does anyone have any additions, corrections, comments on my list? I have some friends who tell me I am in denial about my situation, and they are probably right. But I needed to do what I could in order to live with myself in the future. I pray each day to have the strength to carry out this plan. I already belonged to a gym, I am a swimmer, but have started working out on the machines for the first time, and I really really like it. I have lost 18 pounds from this in 12 days, a good start, not the best way to go about it, but still a good start. I have been spending lots of time with my college student child who is home for the summer. sworn off any alcohol (therapist asked me about liqour, which I was drinking a bottle of wine a night, when I told her I havent had a drop she raised an eyebrow, and I explained the alcohol is a depressent and I figure I dont need anymore depressing, I need to keep my head clear) and sworn off tv. (which I use to veg in front of everynight after drinking wine) chosing instead to work in my yard or do an activity with my kid. I have had dinner each nite at the dinning room table with her (we were notorious eat in front of the tv people, which I never liked) and I am making plans to go out Saturday nite on a "friend" date with a woman I know with the intent on getting dating hints from her for when I start dating again....thats going to be a while. ( I started dating my wife 35 years ago today...today! and I am 51 so I never even really dated anyone else. that is real scary. Dread the phone call, but also look forward to knowing which way I am going in the future. comments?
 
#21 ·
Can't tell you if the decision to give her the opportunity to pursue reconciliation is the right one or not, but I damn sure understand the need to try everything you can. You sound really well prepared and like you're actually dealing with it all well. One observation - and I may get blasted for this - but if I have the timeline right you're having your moment of truth phone call with your wife on Sunday. You're have a "date" with a woman "friend" on Saturday. Sorry but these seem a little contradictory and maybe not the best idea. I'm all about plan for the best but prepare for the worst - I might put that date off until I had that phone call...
 
#23 ·
Today has been the toughest day in a week. I am sick about Sunday nites phone call, because I think I know what the answer will NOT be....Yes work on our marriage.....with that in mind I have spent the day reading Just Let them go...I use to think I was a pretty tough guy, well this tough guy is being brought to his knees.....this really hurts.
 
#27 ·
Whenever I read threads like this is takes me back to my D-Day and weeks and months after. It's such a lousy situation. I'm sorry you are in it. I nearly broke me.

Can I suggest that these "big decision" ulimatums work against your best interest. Right now she is essential hooked on a chemical stew of endorphines that are akin to being on drugs. And what those drugs tell her is that you make her feel bad and the OM makes her feel good, which she then has rewritten into a script that say's "he was never this, I never loved him" and whatever BS is coming out of her mouth.

If you push for a decision right now, she's going to choose him. She'll say it more like, I need time to be alone, time to think, get to know myself, but all those things mean him, not you.

The hardest part of this first part is to get past your desire for clarity and be willing to live with uncertainty. It's so much more stressful, but if you want to reconcile it's what you need to do.

Make sense?
 
#28 ·
The 1st thing to come to mind after reading the last part of your post was "does she feel the same way".

I mean you have these feeling of working things out, but face it she loves the OM. Let go or at least until she lets go of OM.

If you've been reading these post at TAM then you know there is no point in forcing your feeling on your wife and until OM is out of the picture it will be a one way street for you.

The f~cked up part is alot of time the WW thinks they want the marrige but seems to always go back to OM.

I hope your trip together pans out and you guys find your selves on the same page. Just be careful b/c we all here at TAM have seen it go south months later..... again and again.

For what its worth this is more of a warning more then anything else.

Good luck I hope it works out.
 
#29 ·
Let her go.

Letting go is not a sign of weakness, just the opposite it shows tremendous emotional strength.

Emotional strength in a man is very attractive to a woman. It shows that a man is confident no matter what the outcome.

By telling her "You should be with the OM, I hope he makes you happy, good bye" you cease chasing her.

Animals runaway from that which is chasing them. Human beings are no different. The more you pursue your wife - who is in love with the OM - the more she'll runaway from you. It is this futile pursuit which is pushing her more and more to the OM arms.

Let her go.
 
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