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post #646 of 670 (permalink) Old 03-29-2017, 06:54 AM
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Re: This blew up today.

Boss, boss' wife, etc need to go away and stay gone. Change phone numbers if necessary.


Virginia: "Why can't you kids leave well enough alone? Everything was fine until you started digging around."

Burt: "You sound like a Scooby Doo villain."
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post #647 of 670 (permalink) Old 03-29-2017, 08:10 AM Thread Starter
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Yep. I'll still do the meet up for my own reasons. And since she is a BS now, then she'll hopefully understand why I want her to bug off... But in a nice way.
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post #648 of 670 (permalink) Old 03-29-2017, 08:28 AM Thread Starter
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Okay. There was a 3rd element I forgot to add... While I consider my MAC to be generally good, he's not perfect, who is? He has had some 1 on 1 with us... That was helpful to me at times. But where he had a flaw with my wife is on honesty.

In our recent talks, when she talked about having? thoughts on the AP... She asked the MC if it was something she should share with me. He told her "no" and that with time the AP will fade away. As stated in the "Not just friends" book and that my wife is not a robot. It's expected that her feelings will take a while as well. I said I had my bad days as well... But they were not the same as hers since I didn't have any happy memories to forget. Her response was "you don't share with me when you're having a bad day as well". This wasn't in an insulting tone, but her point was valid. This is why it bugged the hell out of her that she lost the ability to vent to her sister who is in her own fog now. Ugh.

So we both are not sure how to help each other in this aspect. Any advice?
What I do is think about the good things about my wife and how she is so much better than before.

Her way has been thinking about the bad things that they did and the people she hurt, especially me.

But we want to be able to support each other...

I'll be setting up an appointment with the MC today, may take a few weeks to see him. I was planning on doing this in June... But in light of the recent things, we both want to see him for a session or two.

I do appreciate that she wants to work on us and not run away or rugsweep things. We are trying our best.
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post #649 of 670 (permalink) Old 03-29-2017, 08:41 AM
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Re: This blew up today.

@TaDor, this may sound a little childish, but bear with me.

When I'm having any sort of communication issue with my husband, because I'm so in-tune with good communication, I try to look at the source of the blip.
He's not at all expressive and I'm somewhat overly expressive. Part of me tends to hope that people will act in the same way that I do. My husband chooses not to tell me all sorts of things in regard to his feelings because that's just how he operates. Kind of a "get on with it and don't tell the wife" attitude. Problem is, I have to deal with his frustration when it arises due to things that I don't know about... because he won't share.

When I sense these rougher times, I literally sit down with him and play a game of conversation cards. I have about 5-6 different packs and I always find something new on Amazon. Thing is, when we do get talking about issues and things that ignite us both, the communication flows effortlessly. That effortless flow in some areas leads to greater chance he will share something more personal on his mind that is frustrating. It's like setting a baseline of comfort, for both of us, by doing something innocent like describing what we would do if we ruled the world, or what our favorite memory on our wedding day was.

So as I said, kind of childish and maybe corny, but it's the exercise of it that I personally find helpful. Not sure if it would be helpful for you as well.

"If you deliberately plan on being less than you are capable of being, then I warn you that you'll be unhappy for the rest of your life."

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post #650 of 670 (permalink) Old 04-16-2017, 04:25 PM Thread Starter
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Re: This blew up today.

I've not had that meeting yet with Boss' wife. Should still be within a week or so. I'm cool with myself having a line of communication with her "just in case" - but the wife, no - she has no reason to do so. Should meet up with this woman in a week or so as I have other more pressing matters.

It's just over a year since I threw my wife out of our home. I actually forgot the exact date among a few things about this time a year ago - I'd say it's a good thing to have missed such dates as they become less important.

At least wife's oldest sister is no longer fooling around with a married man. But IMHO - that, of course, doesn't change what she does or what she is willing to do. If you're going to have sex with a friend's husband - then doing that to a stranger would be much easier.

Somewhat oddly, a few of wife's friends have been involved with infidelity (WS and BS) and have talked to us about how we are working things out. When I blew up my wife's facebook with what she did a year ago, I guess some of her friends remembered that, but also see that with all the carnage - that we are back together again. One particular friend, I'd like to share - as he is has been cheated on by his GF of 3 years (now fiancee), but also they are both waywards. They are in the medical field, well known for mass cheating or sex among the staff which he has confirmed. I've only met him twice when he was still with his wife, because of distances and time, he's a high school friend of my wife. So we invited him over this past Saturday for talking, him to vent, etc.

He was married for 11 years without cheating on his H.S. sweetheart, but she was going downhill years ago - no sex, no nothing. Refused to see doctors for medication or therapy, begging her to get help. My response was: "Should have left her first". The co-worker he cheated with, cheated before him, and for a childish excuse of a reason (I'm not saying why) when she cheated on him a few weeks ago with 3 other men that are also his co-workers. He had fantasies of a revenge hookup with a GF of one of the guys who had sex with his fiancee (what a drama mess that would be). He loves her, she says she loves him and is "trying to prove" herself to him, going to IC and MC, begging him not to leave her. She was nervous of him being in my home, as she knew why he was over here, texted him a few times - which he ignored. Oh, he did state that he's being hit by karma.
I did talk to him about my own drama and what BS my wife did and how we got better, changed things - while she is in the same room. We also intermixed this with fun / off topic things so it wouldn't be so gloomy. I told him I'll give him my advice with what I know, what I learned here and books, my opinion with my own experiences before my wife's affair. Apparently, their relationship has been good - he has been aware for years that as they are both cheaters, that it would be challenging - especially combining the home of 2 kids each, under one roof. I said he may not like it: I said his wayward will NEVER change. That she likely had sex with more than the 3 guys at work (he agreed). That it was unrealistic to expect her to change, even tho their MC pointed out her flawed logic. No matter what, she's going to want to have sex with other guys. He'll either have to live with it or leave her. So to stay, he'd have to grumble while she got her side-penis from time to time... or go for an open relationship, that she is doesn't lie anymore and no more co-workers. If she gets side-penis, that he's allowed side-vagina.

Apparently, she has already offered him threesomes with another woman (FMF) as a peace offering. I replied, "That means she already has a female friend or two that she is aware that wants to have sex with you who are also likely cheaters themselves". Of course, if they become OR it doesn't mean it would save their relationship. He likes the idea of FMF threesome, but not the idea of her getting banged by other guys. "She is already getting it by other guys. Either dump her or learn to live with it and get something out of it. If the rest of your relationship was bad - then dump her for sure". He's never shared her with another person. They made it this far. He enjoyed the talk (as did I) and left undecided what to do, but aware he had 3 different choices to make. She is attractive, his type of woman, does everything imaginable sex-wise which he doesn't want to lose. Of course, by allowing their relationship to open - he is also "forgiving" her for what she has done. FMF isn't exactly punishment - but he's thinking about it, and not something he'd do soon - he isn't sold on it. She has never done FMF with him or with anyone apparently - and willing to do that until he is "satisfied". Of course, he could still do the FMF for a while and then dump her. Besides continued MC and some of the books I have read (I leaned him two of my books), I have nothing more to offer him - the rest is up to him.

I feel that my life is simpler. Thank god.

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post #651 of 670 (permalink) Old 05-07-2017, 07:39 AM Thread Starter
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Re: This blew up today.

Well, this Saturday was.... odd.

The AP called me out of the blue. Even still - I'm not really sure WTH he called for or his point. It took me a while to locate my VAR to capture the conversion and I'll review in the next few days. Of course, this is why I wanted my conversation with his room-mate to get a few things clear and that otherwise, NO CONTACT with boss-wife period. Only reason boss wife is allowed to call me is if there is a "broken contact" situation (this goes both ways). I barely know what he said, I kept my cool. So I'll just have to outline or bullet it.

1 - I became aware (through his room-mate) that POSOM has been arrested for drug possession and is awaiting trial. He is out on bond. I am indifferent about this, in general. Room-mate has stated that he has issues, has restarted some drinking. Not emotionally mature.

2 - POSOM is no longer romantically interested in my wife. But wants to hang out with her Saturday night for some concert event that he got tickets for. Something she would like. He is "over her"...?

(pause / blink) Yeah. What The #@!*&#@!?! It took me a few minutes to locate my VAR and throw in batteries to get it going. Why talk to him, get intel on whats going on. I told him "uh, no. That is not happening. There is no communications allowed. There is no friendship. Our family is against you and your family is against her. You're not thinking in the real world".

POSOM had asked me at least 3 times or so as to "Why can't I be friends with <wife's name>?" And I said 3 times why. I don't recall my exact response to each one. I told him that what he is doing is hurting himself, hurting me, my kid and my wife. That he needs to go away. He's 22 or so years old and needs to go away to college. Or die from drug overdose or something.

3 - I told him he needed therapy, read books. I warned him that if HE sees me or my wife, that he better find a way to be gone before he's spotted. I stated "I am friendly know, giving you advice. It's the last time. Trust me on, if you talk to me again or I have to engage with you - it won't be fun." That was almost 20 minutes of oddity. I kind of kept him on hold or stalled until I got the VAR going.

It took me quite a while to digest and think about it. I haven't much, I had other things to do. Family stuff. I'm not having any stress issues.
I texted his room-mate about what happened, and she is strongly considering throwing him out of her home, because of that.

I could contact the DA and offer to be a witness to his "drug sales" and character. But that also means pulling both myself and my wife into his crap-storm. Exposing my family into his family issues. Perhaps even consider doing another R.O. against him. Which would likely involve getting his lawyer dad on my ass. So I may consider calling his lawyer dad to say "Try to get a handle on him before I have to deal with the court or DA".
His drug charge can be 2~15 years if convicted. It's the old "its not mine, its my passenger's drugs in the bag" story which are generally weak.

My wife an I are doing quite well, having a good weekend together and with family. And yeah, I told her about him calling and his inability to grasp the concept of what I told him. She was shocked that he would call, and understands his emotional and substance abuse instability. That any form of contact with him (like the room-mate) is unhealthy for him and could be a stalker in the making.

PS: Yes I have access to all her accounts. I did ask to look over them on her devices, which I did in front of her. Things look pretty good. In general, I am not stressing out over this. We actually ended up having a good talk for a few hours over many topics of the affair, our feelings, her issues and such. I have more to digest. After half a day of reflection - and typing this out. I have to wonder if the POSOM was stoned or drunk - but he seemed more stoned. I don't as I haven't seen or heard from him in about a year.

Annoyed and not pleased with this. Drama crap.

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post #652 of 670 (permalink) Old 05-07-2017, 07:48 AM Thread Starter
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Re: This blew up today.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GusPolinski View Post
Boss, boss' wife, etc need to go away and stay gone. Change phone numbers if necessary.
I can't. It's my business cell number. It's a great number that I'll keep forever.

But yeah, even before you posted that - I agreed the boss' wife needs to be gone.

I hope to not hear from her again. I don't want to know about his court status... but like I said, that kind of info is handy for me to be a vindictive. It would be relatively easy to locate his public record and find the prosecutor on the case. It would be mean, yep. But I'd rather not see POSOM or deal with his crap. I'm considering telling my wife about it, my idea of doing such an action in retaliation for his phone call or if he calls me again or contacts her... not sure.

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post #653 of 670 (permalink) Old 05-07-2017, 11:20 AM
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Re: This blew up today.

There have been times in my life, TaDor, where I listened to someone's logic and thought 'huh?' and simply couldn't process - like my crazy BIL who was arrested for D&D and quietly explained the next day that he 'had to kick out the car in the police car because the cop was looking at him.' He had to do it, right? Anybody can understand that, right? Or the postal worker who carefully explained to me that I would have to pay more to send a package with anything written in it. Why? Because it costs more if there is anything written included. Why is that? Because it's more expensive than just the merchandise. And on and on until the man next to me says, 'just give up.'

Some people are incapable of mature, intelligent critical thinking. Something is just askew in their reasoning. Sometimes they are literally just dim bulbs, but other times I think they have been raised with some abnormal inputs.

Your WW's OM sounds like one of these types to me. Sure, he's young, but men that age go to war and have families. He's responsible for his reasoning now. He's an adult. And he can't really think straight, imo. For me it's the chicken and egg - is he orthogonal to the rest of us because he's a druggie or is he a druggie because he can't think? At some point those things can no longer be separated because the drugs do so much damage.

What I'm saying is that you will drive yourself nuts trying to make sense of his behavior. Block him as much as you can. Block all of them. Do the RO if you must. Sweep the crazy out of your life.

As always, best of luck. I'm rooting for you and your family.
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post #654 of 670 (permalink) Old 05-07-2017, 11:52 AM
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Re: This blew up today.

I would definitely call his dad. And maybe suggest to his dad that he LET his son spend a short time in prison so as to help him grow the hell up. That babying him and making all his problems disappear is probably why he's such a putz in the first place. Give him something to think about; most parents who baby their kids and end up with putzes aren't aware they're hurting their kids.

Overall, sounds good.
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post #655 of 670 (permalink) Old 05-07-2017, 03:16 PM Thread Starter
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Re: This blew up today.

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Originally Posted by alte Dame View Post
There have been times in my life, TaDor, where I listened to someone's logic and thought 'huh?' and simply couldn't process ~~

Your WW's OM sounds like one of these types to me. Sure, he's young, but men that age go to war and have families. He's responsible for his reasoning now. He's an adult. And he can't really think straight, imo. For me it's the chicken and egg - is he orthogonal to the rest of us because he's a druggie or is he a druggie because he can't think? At some point those things can no longer be separated because the drugs do so much damage.

What I'm saying is that you will drive yourself nuts trying to make sense of his behavior. Block him as much as you can. Block all of them. Do the RO if you must. Sweep the crazy out of your life.

As always, best of luck. I'm rooting for you and your family.
Agreed on all your points. Of course, it still a "What the hell is going on" type stuff. I'll likely play it back to the wife, so she can hear him not seem to understand things, repeating himself - this is after I review it and take the time to put things together. I said what was needed. I'll plan my actions, no knee-jerk reaction.

Yep on the drugs... I understand how they mess up people, but me personally - I don't do drugs so I have no personal experience on how it messes up the mind. His mom is a coke head, they did lines together. From what I recall, he's been doing drugs and booze since before the age of 15. For the most part, NOT MY PROBLEM - except when he is attempting to insert himself into my life/wife.

"You have no business hanging around my wife, go meet girls. You cannot just go to a concert and talk about work and non-romantic type talk. The end result will be the same, people are going to get hurt. Your parents are going to be pissed off." etc. Of course, I doubt he got the whole message when I hung up. I'm not going to lose sleep over his crap.

I know it creates issues within my wife as well (we discussed it), even I have some sympathy for the guy - to some extent. And if it was legal to do so, I'd enjoy causing a world of pain to him. But for the most part, I just want no interactions with him and his family. My only wish is that some years from now, he gets married - has a kid or two and his wife cheats on him.


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Last edited by TaDor; 05-07-2017 at 03:27 PM.
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post #656 of 670 (permalink) Old 05-31-2017, 03:51 AM Thread Starter
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Re: This blew up today.

Well... we have made it past 1 year of reconciliation.
Still challenging... for both normal and past infidelity reasons.

The reconnection of WW with her boss, which had started crap with the POSOM has been stressful on both of us. Seeing so many other people be cheaters or betrayed is a bit depressing and also has a negative effect on us. Had another run-in with the POSOM with text messaging as he (A) still open to having a relationship "just friends" with my wife while at the same time (B) doesn't want me "HASSLING HIM"... like WTF.

Like er... YOU doing anything involving my wife - means you get me on your ass. After that text, I didn't even bother responding. I talked with a good friend of our relationship about the POSOM. He had met the OM 3 times or so before things went to hell. He told me that the OM was a Bull-****ter user type personality. He wants people feeling sorry for him. With the limited communication and looking back at my older evidence (past text messages). I see a clearer picture of this guy, including manipulating and lying to the boss-wife who she thought of as her "troubled little brother". I brought this up with the wife - who I know isn't 100% over him. This is not unexpected as stated by our MC and "Not just friends" book.

I showed her the crazy text from him... went over details of what his actions were in the far past and recent.

That the OM is a troubled young person who only cares about his own needs. He played me... and he played my wife. he's a drug user who I hope the worse for him. After that last text, I told my wife: I have zero sympathy of the guy - who simply accidently got caught up with the "just friends" fantasy that only felt good, that in reality hurt our entire family. This conversation was over a week ago. As I contemplated on how to respond to his last communication, as both the wife and I come up with something – some way of saying “screw off” / go away. Whatever.

I don’t want to come near his crazy. And I came up with following.
No response. Nothing. No threats, no ultimatums. No insults or trying to explain he should learn to get his life together and move on… we’ve already done that crap a year ago. He’s a troll. Stop feeding the troll.

I filed his communications as evidence for future use if needed. I told the wife, his recent interactions with our family is a threat. His words are illogical and will be used in an R.O. if he decides to do anything further.

The wife and I talked quite a bit about each other, our personal issues and try to find ways to help each other out – this was on a rare deep level we haven’t talk in quite a while. We have to be a team.

I also gave the wife a single warning… that my trust level has gone down. That if anything is going on behind my back, that *I WILL* hurt him criminally – ie: help send him to prison. That it’ll take me an hour to locate his court docket, contact the D.A. and provide witness and evidence. That if I am hurt, I will hurt back. ie: hurting him would hurt her. This was not a mean discussion, it was simply a matter of fact of a reaction.

Yeah, contact with the boss-lady was a mistake, and she has thrown him out of her home – since I told her he contacted me and what he said to me.

Yeah, I don’t need this crap. But overall, I think I’m handling it well. Wife is glad we’re going to MC for a few sessions. We’ve had a pretty good week otherwise and overall things are still looking better for us. Being with my wife and the various functions – reminds us why we love each other. We people watch heheh… and I have no interests in other women.

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post #657 of 670 (permalink) Old 05-31-2017, 08:46 AM
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Re: This blew up today.

Try more than a few MC sessions. It will take you a good year to get down to the real issues you guys have and work through healthy ways to approach them. Especially after infidelity.

Last edited by turnera; 06-01-2017 at 07:57 AM. Reason: missing word
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post #658 of 670 (permalink) Old 05-31-2017, 11:01 PM
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Re: This blew up today.

Warn him that any further harassment means an RO & then follow through. He's a little pos.
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post #659 of 670 (permalink) Old 06-02-2017, 03:58 AM Thread Starter
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Re: This blew up today.

(accidental double post)

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Last edited by TaDor; 06-02-2017 at 04:22 AM. Reason: (accidental double post)
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post #660 of 670 (permalink) Old 06-02-2017, 04:21 AM Thread Starter
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Re: This blew up today.

@turnera : I was planning on a few sessions after 6 months since our last anyway. Our MC thought this would be good as we were doing very well last Dec. We had agreed that we would do MC as needed, but also I wanted to do mandatory MC session or two every year as a tune up and help have an expert who has worked with us help catch issues that we may be missing. HE and wife agreed to this.

Yes, the POSOM situation has stressed me. But job situation is now stressing me more at the moment. Wife is job hunting now. It has caused our bills to pile up quickly. If she gets hired in the next few days (cross fingers) - then we can budget MC sessions. At least 2 (once weekly) and go from there. Like a monthly session, etc. Seriously, the last 3 sessions in NOV/DEC were almost boring... we were doing quite well.

@alte Dame : Yeah... it's on a back burner for now. But like I posted. For now, I am going to do nothing. As long as he and WW are not in contact and he's not contacting me (its been a few weeks now)... I don't want to give him my time and energy. I think its like feeding a troll. By engaging with the POSOM - it brings him into our home / life. Its court, its time, its money. So if he does anything, I'll call his lawyer daddy and let him know that I may have to involve myself with the DA. Some time ago, my wife created a "witness" when she told a friend of ours (more mine) that he was selling drugs and I retained other evidence as well. Overall, I don't want to spend a minute more than I have to on the legal front. I already got a lot of crap on my plate. In general, I'm feeling better every day.

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