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Admins, can we start a WS Stories forum section?

24K views 368 replies 29 participants last post by  Truthseeker1 
#1 ·
In PMs, I have been asked by numerous TAM forum members to recount my FWW's affair stories. Not so much the sordid details of who did what and certainly not to brag, but the why questions; what were you thinking at the time, contributing factors/circumstances/conditions, who did you get to be in this relationship that you couldn't be at home, what did you get out of the affair, what did you hope would happen next, etc.

And I think this might make for an educational forum section, so that any BS can ask questions and try to understand why the WS did what they did. Each thread could start with a WS story, then followed by questions for the WS.

I spoke to my W last night and she is willing to write the first thread post about what goes thru the mind of a WS, with full honesty and candor describing any one of her serial affairs. And she will answer any questions, as long as they will help others to gain a greater understanding of the motivations of a cheater.

I am willing to post my WS story as well, although most may not find mine nearly as helpful I suspect.
 
#4 ·
I am willing to post my WS story as well, although most may not find mine nearly as helpful I suspect.
I applaud your efforts, and smile at your naivete.
 
#15 ·
I think it is important that a person can hear both sides of a situation: right, wrong, or otherwise. If not we just continue with the majority BS TAM posters saying she is lying about why she felt the need to do what she did, and there is never any honest feedback from the WS.
 
#16 ·
I think it is important that a person can hear both sides of a situation: right, wrong, or otherwise. Otherwise we just continue with the majority BS TAM posters saying she is lying about why she felt the need to do what she did, and there is never any honest feedback from the WS.
Sorry, Maj, but a good chunk of the forum has no interest in the WS side of the story as anything more than a hook for injecting abuse.

I would find the thread worth the trouble, but I don't know too many people who have skin thick enough to deflect the inevitable.
 
#21 ·
While I haven't been "run off." I rarely post. I most definitely try to stay out of CWI. It isn't worth the stress.



I deleted my original thread to one particular poster repeatedly attacking me. Kinda sad as I had gotten quite a bit of good advice. Oh well, c'est la vie.
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I was attacked via PM for my journey thread in LTSiM. It happens all too often even for boring threads like mine. So I could only imagine the feeding fest in a sub forum in this area. It would either be crickets because no one would dare post there or it would keep the mods too busy.

Short thread jack, however I still believe a home and garden fixit section in the same section as social and P&R would be useful. End thread jack.


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#28 ·
I would share my story, my thoughts, my "reasons" what have you. But I have developed an iron skin here. I've been told off here more times than I can count. :)

I don't know that a wayward forum would be a good idea.....unless that wayward is a masochist.

Read the first 15 pages of my thread, they destroyed me! Which I am fine with, it helped me. But how many WS run off here after a day? They don't want to hear it. I think you'd have very few contributors
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#61 ·
LH from what I can tell you are really reformed, however -

No offense but you destroyed yourself by cheating. No one would have had the ability to destroy you if you had made better choices. Again it's like driving drunk, there are consequences.
 
#30 ·
Sorry, Maj, but a good chunk of the forum has no interest in the WS side of the story as anything more than a hook for injecting abuse.
A good chunk of the forum doesn't seem to really have a lot of interest in a lot of things like how "going full Alpha" isn't the way to solve all marriage problems. I'd argue that's a hook for injecting abuse myself.

Just because the forum as a collective doesn't want to hear something doesn't automatically mean it would be bad for them to hear.
 
#31 ·
I guess I really don't think there is anything to be learned by waywards posting their stories. You'll get the same rationalizations that most of you have already heard. Why, because no one wants to be seen as an unfeeling monster. People tend to rationalize, especially if they know they are being judged. Look, I'm a serial wayward. And no matter what any serial wayward will tell you, the only reason the cheating happened is because they think with their genitals a lot more than they should. A lot more than most other people. That's pretty much all there is to know.
 
#35 ·
I guess I really don't think there is anything to be learned by waywards posting their stories. You'll get the same rationalizations that most of you have already heard. Why, because no one wants to be seen as an unfeeling monster. People tend to rationalize, especially if they know they are being judged. Look, I'm a serial wayward. And no matter what any serial wayward will tell you, the only reason the cheating happened is because they think with their genitals a lot more than they should. A lot more than most other people. That's pretty much all there is to know.
There is something to be learned by the Wayward after they have posted their story.
 
#38 ·
Perhaps by having a place where cheaters could tell their stories, those of us who don't already know, would realize how screwed up they are and come to the healthy and rational conclusion that there is no point in reconciling with a cheater who thinks of no one but themselves and their own needs.

Whats a wayward going to say that matters? "I wanted to have sex with another person, I didn't give a rat's ass about the person I was supposedly in love with and had total disregard for the pain I'd put them through because my needs are overwhelmingly more important than they are".

Why stay with a person like this? There's nothing that a cheater could possibly say that could change my mind.
 
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#63 ·
I am against it if there is filtering like SI. I have no problem kicking people out when there is genuine abuse. However if you can call there actions and thinking abhorrent then it won't really be about them getting help. Infidelity is like a cancer it needs to be cut out, cutting things cause pain.
 
#37 ·
A woman posted on LS recently that it was by reading WS stories that she came to better understand her spouse's AP. Before that she was just angry and bitter.

I have to say, MD, you would be exposing your wife to a lot of potential abuse by asking her to post here. It would be very charitable for her to do it, though.
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#49 ·
If people need a separate WS section there are other forums for that - the problem is on those other forums there are 1000 silly rules - who can post where and dont get me started on those stupid stop signs in the wayard section of SI...just awful..TAM is working fine - if a WS truly wants to tell their story they can post it here or even start a private group to discuss it with certain people but "safe spaces" for cheaters? bad idea....
 
#50 ·
^This^

CWI does not differentiate with who is coping with the infidelity, cheater or cheated, they both have to cope with it (although some may take a long time to realize it). Let them post it here where they will receive input from all.
 
#75 ·
The topic of having a separate forum for WS has been brought up here on TAM several times over the years. The response from the admins has always been NO.

If such a forum were to exist, there would be strong rules about not attacking the WS who post there.

While attacking and shaming might help some people, usually when a WS is hit by a wall of attacks, shaming, etc. the leave. I don’t blame them a bit. It’s perfectly possible to reach someone, to get them to the right place without abusing them. Here on TAM there are mostly BSs and most seem to relish the chance to abuse WSs.

It is what it is.
 
#82 ·
I don't know I think this world could do with a whole lot more shame. When did shame become a bad thing? If we had more shame we wouldn't have to deal with the Kardashians for instance. :laugh:
 
#113 ·
Just wanted to add that some women do well being in charge of their marriages. They take responsibility for their husbands and are the emotional rock in their marriages.

I have recommended it to some women who want to stay married no matter what. Instead of being upset about what their husbands are not doing in whatever way, they can accept it and just learn to take care of business and meet their needs on their own. You cannot expect people to do things beyond their capacity, anyway.
 
#127 ·
@Cletus - I didnt just merely repeat TAM is fine as is i also gave my reasons for it - too many rules, micromanaging interactions, etc...I have avoided continued participation in this thread because the arguments become circular - with each side digging in..I do feel strongly that TAM is fine the way it is for the reasons I've listed in previous posts and you obviously feel strongly about your perspecitve so we can agree to disagreee
 
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#134 ·
I think there is always something to learn from sharing these kinds of experiences. Some WS paid the price by losing their spouse/kids and learned from the experience, others reformed, others figured out they weren't cut out for monogamy, etc. Some are still learning. I doubt we'll hear much from an active BS, given the mob mentality of TAM for these people, but if even one does share and does learn from the experience, isn't that worth it?

If this section is too restimulating for any BS, perhaps they simply need not participate?
 
#138 ·
I think there is always something to learn from sharing these kinds of experiences. Some WS paid the price by losing their spouse/kids and learned from the experience, others reformed, others figured out they weren't cut out for monogamy, etc. Some are still learning. I doubt we'll hear much from an active BS, given the mob mentality of TAM for these people, but if even one does share and does learn from the experience, isn't that worth it?

If this section is too restimulating for any BS, perhaps they simply need not participate?
One would think, Sapi. Unfortunately, those who are still raw from betrayal are the ones who jump on Wayward threads, first. And they are the ones who end up being most vociferous. And the ones who are more into "crucifying" WS are the ones who keep hammering. The Voice of reason gets swallowed up by that "mob mentality". 😔

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#139 ·
So @MAJDEATH,

This is why TAM does not have a forum for WS's. In real life, I think if a WS were to come here and write what they they truly think and feel, it would erupt into the sludgefest we have going on now.

What I WISH, and I mean this sincerely... WISH, could happen is that WS's could come here, in their fog-filled, irrational state of mind, be honest with their thoughts and feelings, and one of the strong former-WS's could come along side and point out "Oh that's fog" or "Here's where you're not thinking clearly"... BEFORE the BS's come along and start namecalling and generalizing. I also suspect there's the potential to learn a lot about marriages and where people have weaknesses, etc. if we only had a safer place to talk.

In my years here I've seen one or two stick around long enough to end their affair and tell their spouse the truth and reconcile, but it's EXTREMELY rare because once they get that "all cheaters are ___holes" post, most leave and never come back. Let's be honest--many WS's have a pride issue anyway, and they'd rather lose everything than admit they are wrong! But, in my personal opinion, some people who could have been turned around never get that chance because they are driven away.

But that's TAM and I don't see it changing any time soon.
 
#145 · (Edited)
To @Maricha ‘s point, I can tell you I talked until I was blue in the face to my husband before my ONS about the things that I was unhappy about. I’m not knocking what she said by any means, BUT it was always my CHOICE to cheat. However, the downfall of the marriage up until that point also rested on my husbands shoulders, along with mine. I should have left if I was so unhappy. I absolutely, 100% agree and state that that is true. I didn’t. Whether it was because I was too weak, had too low self esteem, don’t value myself enough, etc. Point being, I never left even though I was unhappy.

But that is not to say I didn’t try to communicate what I needed. I don’t think a lot of you understand how pathetically I tried to communicate what I needed. I lived with a man who never once complimented me. I have never heard my husband say the words “you’re beautiful”. On our wedding day, he told me I looked “cute”. I have never once heard my husband say the words “you look nice, I like that shirt, you smell good, I like the way you _________, I’m proud of you when you _________” My husband does not initiate affection that doesn’t lead to sex. If I initiate affection, it’s met half a$$ed, like I’m bothering him. The last time my husband sent me flowers was my 30th birthday. I’ll be 38 next month. We’ve been married 8 years. That means my husband has sent me flowers ONE time the entire time we’ve been married. My husband complained often about everything I did. Either my cooking wasn’t as good as his grandmas, I washed a shirt that he didn’t want washed – but never a thank you for the millions of other loads of laundry that I did. He has only recently – since February of THIS YEAR started saying “thanks for dinner”. When our friends would say “dude, you have the BEST wife” his response was “well you don’t have to live with her”. When I would bring up my concerns to him, the things that I was lacking his response was “then go find someone that is better than me”. I never got gifts “just because”. He didn’t ask my input on what cars were purchased, what color we painted rooms. I never got date nights, heck, I rarely got time with him at all because he’d play softball 4-5 nights a week and the other nights go to his friends house and watch football/baseball/basketball, play golf, go on guys weekends to the islands. Then lets talk about the fact that he talked to his ex girlfriend non stop for 10 years no matter how many times I told him I didn’t like it, it hurt me, it damaged our relationship, it made me feel bad. Let’s talk about the fact that he text another woman and asked her to send a picture of her boobs. Let’s talk about his porn addiction, his financial infidelity. The fact that he constantly lied to me about the stupidest things that he didn’t need to lie about. “I’m working late” when he just wanted to go to a friends house to watch a football game. The fact that if he didn’t want to go do something with someone he would tell them “Well, the wifes getting upset I’m going and doing too many things, she won’t let me go” and then he would tell me that his friends thought I kept him on a short leash. No wonder they thought I kept him on a short leash while he was lying and blaming ME for not going when I never told him not to go. He doesn’t help with housework. He doesn’t do laundry, dishes, sweep, mop, dust, take out the trash, run the kids around.

I’ve only touched the surface above. Does that sound like a good marriage to you? If I’ve talked and talked and talked and talked about those things over the last 10 years and nothing has changed, does he have responsibility for the downfall of the marriage? Or does it strictly fall onto MY shoulders because I cheated one time for 30 seconds? I’m not minimizing what I did. It was AWFUL. But if THAT was my marriage pre-cheating, how happy do you think I was? I didn’t go out with the intention to cheat. I wasn’t looking for it. I’d never even thought of it. But in THAT moment, when every need that had been neglected the previous 7 years was being met, I failed. I fed in to every single smooth word that was said. I finally felt like a woman who was beautiful. I finally felt like I was being appreciated. Someone was interested in me. Someone wanted to hear me talk and touch me without being annoyed by it. It was like a drug to my soul.

I am NOT blameless. The state of my marriage did not force me to cheat. That was a CHOICE that I made, that I quickly realized was wrong and I stopped. But before that, my marriage was a JOKE. And no amount of begging and pleading I did with my husband changed ANYTHING.

Do you know what the first thing my husband said to me was? “I KNOW I wasn’t a good husband, but I didn’t deserve THIS”. And no, he didn’t deserve it. But the first thing he recognized AFTER I did what I did was that he had not been a good husband. I’m not saying I was a perfect wife, I’m strictly talking about him right now.

You can tell me my action was more severe than his, and to a big extent, I will agree with you. I HATE what I did. If I was so unhappy, I should have left. I will never say that isn’t true. But up until the very minute I did what I did, I had hoped, cried, prayed, sobbed and begged for him to see all of the ways our marriage was falling apart. And he could never see it. He didn’t want to put any effort in.

So now we decided to stay together.

Last night, after my nightly bath of washing with coconut soap, mango body wash and hibiscus coconut lotion that I cover my body in, I asked my husband “how come you never tell me I smell nice?”

His response was to plug his nose and look at me funny (joking around that I didn’t smell nice). I said “I’m serious”. His response was “you take everything too damn serious”.

So here we are 5 months into reconciliation. I have changed more things about myself in the last 6 months than I can count. He’s admitted he wasn’t a good husband. He still doesn’t compliment me. He’s still never told me I’m beautiful. He still doesn’t tell me I smell nice, he likes my shirt, I look nice. He still doesn’t do any laundry, dishes, cook or clean. He’s golfing and playing softball constantly. He still doesn’t send me flowers. He still tells me I’m difficult and hard to love. He blames every single thing that happens on me.

So let me ask you, the state of this marriage going forward – who is responsible for the downfall of it? I am still begging and pleading with my husband for the things that I need to help me feel wanted in this marriage and they aren’t being met. He’s still acting the same way he was pre-affair, AFTER admitting to not being a good husband.

I will NOT cheat on him again. I’d rather die. So the choice is for me to stay or leave. But if I choose to leave now, who does the fault rest on? Me? Him? Or both of us?
 
#148 · (Edited)
So though this doesn't excuse the ONS I am terribly sympathetic to this. This is just plain awful LH. I think you should move on, you could do better at this point. He doesn't appreciate you. My opinion is it is not on you if you leave but it is on you if you stay. He is not going to change so if you are going to stay you have to accept it.

I guess I did stick to my standard divorce point. But really what else can she do. :frown2:
 
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#250 ·
TAM is a placto ofe for lost persons, either B or W, to seek help and advice. If you are not going to support the OP, and by support I mean offer help (even in the form of a 2x4), then don't post on the thread. TAM is not the right venue for anyone to deal with the anger they have with their ex spouse by attacking a W OP telling their story. If you have anger, get therapy to deal with it.

A separate WS forum would be a magnet for every angry person here to come and attack the WS. As it is now some waywards do start a thread but the angry people need to find them. With a separate forum the same angry people will post the same message in every thread. We already have enough people doing that now. Different thread, same post.
HUH? The forum is only for lost persons? Where did you come up with that? Is it in the guidelines?
 
#177 ·
sa The fact that you cheated doesn't absolve your H of anything HE did in your marriage to contribute to the dysfunction. It sounds like he did a lot to harm you. The fact you cheated isn't a free pass for him and HIS issues. Not at all. Many BS wrap the betrayal around them like a blanket that allows them to believe this. Not so. Tell anyone who suggests this to fcuk off.[/QUOTE said:
Not true,IMO. I have observed the opposite with BSs trying desperately to take too much responsibility.
 
#184 ·
What I see here in this discussion is people using extremes - my WS is just a nympho or a psycho or the BS didnt have sex with me for 20 years, didn't wash their feet and made me kiss their toes..they are awful!! The fact is infidelity occurs i many "normal" marriages - maybe not stellar marriages but ones where the WS chose to cheat out of selfishness. The perceived trangessions of the BS are nowhere near what @Maricha75 describes - typically its been my experience both are unhappy BUT only the WS chooses to cheat. They have a really sh!tty coping mechanism. If you read threads where cheaters are shielded form reality their POV is breathtakingly self-centered - even the ones in R. I've read a case where the WW's BH was pulling the plug after a few years of trying and she is mad at him for "not being a man of his word" and sticking with the marriage. WTF? Are you kidding me? Is the BS always a saint - hell no but they are rarely the swine described here.

And if they are swine does that make them a less sympathetic victim of infidelity? Sure it does but it doesn't change the fact that the infidelity is their WSs coping mechanism and its not a good one. Its been my experience like I stated earlier that more often than not people cheat in "normal" marriages - I know such people.

The slugfest this thread has turned into should show just how corrosive and vile infidelity is. It strikes at the core of the person and arouses dark passions in all involved. When you cheat you turn down a dark road and anything can happen. There are consequences for arousing such emotions and more often than not the cheater is not prepared for that.
 
#187 ·
What I see here in this discussion is people using extremes - my WS is just a nympho or a psycho or the BS didnt have sex with me for 20 years, didn't wash their feet and made me kiss their toes..they are awful!! The fact is infidelity occurs i many "normal" marriages - maybe not stellar marriages but ones where the WS chose to cheat out of selfishness. The perceived trangessions of the BS are nowhere near what @Maricha75 describes - typically its been my experience both are unhappy BUT only the WS chooses to cheat. They have a really sh!tty coping mechanism. If you read threads where cheaters are shielded form reality their POV is breathtakingly self-centered - even the ones in R. I've read a case where the WW's BH was pulling the plug after a few years of trying and she is mad at him for "not being a man of his word" and sticking with the marriage. WTF? Are you kidding me? Is the BS always a saint - hell no but they are rarely the swine described here.

And if they are swine does that make them a less sympathetic victim of infidelity? Sure it does but it doesn't change the fact that the infidelity is their WSs coping mechanism and its not a good one. Its been my experience like I stated earlier that more often than not people cheat in "normal" marriages - I know such people.

The slugfest this thread has turned into should show just how corrosive and vile infidelity is. It strikes at the core of the person and arouses dark passions in all involved. When you cheat you turn down a dark road and anything can happen. Their are consequences for arousing such emotions and more often than not the cheater is not prepared for that.
Also a pure examination of the relationship prior to affair only helps in certain instances. I know a plenty of infidelity that was was the result of drunken one night affairs from a BNO or GNO. Neither of those spouses were unhappy but they are included in this as well
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#188 ·
@LosingHim - your situation is not the norm and your indiscretion if I remember correctly was brief. I've read your posts - not all of them (you can flame me if you want to) but you seem to be trying to love a man who does not exist. I mean after your A came to light he hung around with the OM correct? What BH does that without putting his fist down the OMs throat?
 
#202 · (Edited)
Here's the unpleasant truth:

1. Excellent spouses who are truly blindsided by a WS must have some problem with their self-esteem or picker. There are always red flags with truly evil, manipulative people or those with a mental disorder or just plain selfish. Anyone who says otherwise is either very naive or disingenuous.

I would argue that being truly blindsided is very rare for the average intelligent person who is reasonably self-aware. Cue the stereotypical "good wife" who chooses to overlook her husband's tendency to check out other women b/c he happens to bring home a fat paycheque. Or a man who chooses the hot wife over the 'nice girl', ignoring signs she is high-maintenance and attention seeking, because having a hot wife strokes his ego and rep with his buddies.

These people made their choices for their own reasons to set themselves up with people who are, let's call them, "higher risk" for an affair. Eyes wide shut. None of this excuses the WS for their behaviour, but it does up the responsibility level for the BS. I get that some will be very uncomfortable with this concept, which I would argue is part of their problem.

2. Spouses who both contribute to relationship dysfunction often "betray" their spouses, but they call it different things. Overt cheating is just a particularly nasty, blatant form of it. Shaming, withholding sex, emotional or financial abuse, being miserable/uncommunicative/unsupportive, often over a period of years... these are all forms of betrayal, IMO.
 
#204 ·
Here's the unpleasant truth:

1. Excellent spouses who are truly blindsided by a WS must have some problem with their self-esteem or picker. There are always red flags with truly evil, manipulative people or those with a mental disorder or just plain selfish. Anyone who says otherwise is either very naive or disingenuous.

Cue the stereotypical "good wife" who chooses to overlook her husband's tendency to check out other women b/c he happens to bring home a fat paycheque. Or a man who chooses the hot wife over the 'nice girl', ignoring signs she is high-maintenance and attention seeking, because having a hot wife strokes his ego and rep with his buddies.

These people made their choices for their own reasons to set themselves up with people who are, let's call them, "higher risk" for an affair. Eyes wide shut.

2. Spouses who both contribute to relationship dysfunction often "betray" their spouses, but they call it different things. Overt cheating is just a particularly nasty, blatant form of it. Shaming, withholding sex, emotional or financial abuse, being miserable/uncommunicative/unsupportive, often over a period of years... these are all forms of betrayal, IMO.
Based on my own experience in picking,I disagree. Yes,I was young,but the signs were not evident. A true NPD may be difficult for the normal person to spot. They seem to be very good markers.
My Xw looked good,but,she also had an advanced degree,a good job and came from a good family( at least on the surface).
I did not marry right away and got to know the image she presented so well. Despite my youth,I dare say even older,more experienced folks would have been taken in.
And,my self esteem was good. I had been a good student,really good athlete and was progressing nicely in my career.
Sometimes,one just gets taken in,despite having normal sophistication for one's age and decent self esteem.
Your theory on this fails to consider the talent for deception of many Cluster B's and that many of us were ,merely,at a normal level of life experience for our age vs being naive.
Perhaps your navel might help you understand this (remove lint first).
 
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