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post #46 of 383 (permalink) Old 11-30-2016, 10:07 PM
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Re: Wife still cheating. I just filed for D

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Originally Posted by blueinbr View Post
I wonder how many of you are coming down hard on OP's wife, including any attempt by her to R, as a proxy to get revenge on your exWW.

Are you going to label any R attempt as false or doomed to fail long term?

Not every cheater is the spawn of evil. The WS may actually need help to get out of the situation and return "home".

If your recommendation is for OP to divorce and never look back or attempt R under any circumstances, then say that clearly.
Not all WW's are evil but most are just less emotionally evolved, they don't fell empathy the way decent people do. They just don't, how could they and do the evil things they do. This is why most are not really good candidates to R with. They are just kind of self centered, emotionally stunted people, and therefor not worth the investment. I would say about 1 in 50 is worth it, and this would only be if they had like a one night stand. I hope they get help but I don't think they should be married at least not to the BS.

Occasionally they have an epiphany but then other issue is, even if they change and you get them back, so what what do you win, the person who hurt you most in life. Your life is almost always better without them. You get to settle for plan B, a marriage that is tainted, by distrust and rightfully so. It's like winning a broken watch, looks nice, doesn't tell time though.

Unless you were a monster as well then maybe you can both change and have a better marriage then before. But if you are the typical guy/girl who posts in the just found out thread of SI then you can do much better, because you have the capacity for empathy and loyalty, and you will be happier with someone who also has these traits. It really is only fear, convenience and love that keeps you. All those things are not worth it, and love can be found with someone else and you can still have a life that is Plan A.

So people are not being mean they are just being truthful. WW pretty much suck and going back to a WW is settling for less. Why?

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post #47 of 383 (permalink) Old 11-30-2016, 11:18 PM
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This doesn't strike me as a very happy positive story. It's just kind of sad. You listened to your own wife go NC with another man, call him to break up with him and remove pics and that is a success?
Well... Issue there is that I discussed a snippet of a start and you call it sad? The NC was about transparency. You know, one of those aspects of a relationship or repairing one. It was a start.
Still 8 months of MC since then, that she has gone to all of them, gladly. During R, we still did final orders in which I have primary rights to our son. Actually, she gave me all that is legally allowed by state law. It was to show & prove that she wasn't playing me to get out of court or fight me. I told her that I am not stopping any legal process in play and will still go to final orders whether we do R or NOT (this was when she asked me to give her a chance). She agreed to it and never complained about it. We even brought it up during MC.

Early on, she exposed her entire legal side of things. Her lawyer info, battle plans, etc. She basically exposed her belly. Her position was weaker than I thought... And I had spotted that her lawyer was scamming her - saving her thousands of dollars.

We're finishing up MC with a few more sessions that my insurance has already agreed to pay for... And we're in great shape. We'll do sessions here and there if we feel like either one needs it... But no more regular weekly sessions. He says the "not just friends" by Shirley Glass (recommend to me by people on this site) has been very helpful to us.

Honestly, the relationship with my wayward is by far, BETTER today in every way than it was before the affair. Even after exposing her affair to everyone which created a lot of issues... We got past it. We are better taking care of each other and our son than before. We are still a work in progress. Her friends are happy that she got her act together.
Marriage is work that both of us needed to learn. Yeah, she cheated as we had typical problems that newly married people don't know or not told about. We are better equipped for a long term marriage today that we never had before. We are both better people, more mature since we started working on ourselves for which we were already doomed with our problems. The affair kicked us both in the guts (I got the worst of it, which she admits I never deserved) that we needed.

I can still only hope for the best for us and everyone else.

Last edited by TaDor; 12-01-2016 at 01:22 PM. Reason: typos and clearing up a bit more details.
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post #48 of 383 (permalink) Old 12-01-2016, 02:00 PM
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Re: Wife still cheating. I just filed for D

Some waywards are not evil at heart, we've all talked about the fog, the fantasy of the affair. How it re-wires the brain turning them into a narcissist. Some are worse than others. Some people get killed, etc.
Some are not recoverable and some will be. A serial cheater is a lost cause, a narcissist down to the core.
The ones who go out of their way to cheat, dump. The ones who get sucked up by the affair because of co-workers, which is VERY common and unplanned - that has variables and factors that will require time and consideration. As we see, infidelity causes mental issues - murder and or suicide. Does the WS get out of the fog in time? How much damage was done? Regret vs Remorse. Can or does the BS have the ability or desire for R?

The WS deep in the fog is not even possible to do R, unless knocked very hard with a 2x4 (divorce, loss of everything) and that is still a maybe.
The WS that has gaps in the fog, but no tools to get out. Then its a matter of timing and desire for R. As we see, many times a WS won't want to do therapy (MC) because its a waste of time - they would rather rug-sweep equal failure and little remorse.

When my wayward was coming out of the fog on her own (we're no longer married by then) I ordered a book from Amazon in 2 days and gave it to her on the next child visitation. Two days later, we're both in MC. It was still a rough start, but we both told the therapist we wanted to work things out. A friend sent me a message soon after WW and I started R and MC, as she too was a WW and fought to get back and doing MC herself. "Climbing the mountain to get to the other side is worth it. It's hard, but anything worth it, is worth fighting for".

So yeah, I've had a few WW tell me that remorse is possible and they did horrible things they wish they never done. I thank them for their insight.

PS: I now that some friends are cheaters or ex-cheaters... *sigh*

Supporting those who want to divorce or reconcile. Not every relationship is the same.

Last edited by TaDor; 12-01-2016 at 02:15 PM.
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post #49 of 383 (permalink) Old 12-01-2016, 02:12 PM
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Re: Wife still cheating. I just filed for D

So to OP collin8550: You are all over the place, it sucks but its normal. (fear, love, anger, dispair - sometimes all in a matter of minutes) but you must continue 180 and consider her gone, continue divorce. That can always be stopped. Hell, we told the judge we are working on R we were told we can postpone things. I said "nope", going to let that part run its course.

She seems to say she wants back, but she isn't ready for it. (I forgot is you exposed or not. You should to the family.) As you have said the following:
Quote:
""you don't understand what he is to me and how he cares about me." Basically that sounds like "I want to be with him and have his family and my family be OK with it and not think I am bad."
= She cares about herself more than you going by your "sounds like". But what SHE said is what ALL women cheaters say. "It's special, you DON'T understand" in reality, there is nothing special. If the OM cared, he wouldn't have wrecked her life or played her... or accept such a relationship. (Man or woman, doesn't matter). Your kids and family are NOT okay with it, that doesn't happen. As soon as the realizes that there was NO special thing, the attractiveness of the AP goes down.

Quote:
"you were in my life for over half of it. How do you just rip yourself out of it so fast like you don't care?"

I wanted to tell her I didn't do the "ripping". But I let it go.
You are correct, she did the ripping. This is the consequences. Many of us had tried to explain that to our waywards. They don't see it. Its YOU being controlling, taking away their candy.

Anyway, if you feel that she wants to do R, tell her to do her part to prove herself. Hand her a book, which I'll link below. But overall, limit your communications with her. If you want to give her the book and she has any reasoning in her brain, she may start to "get it".

The book : How to Help Your Spouse Heal From Your Affair: A Compact Manual for the Unfaithful
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/14...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

It's a short read designed for the cheater. I consider it a tool to help through part of the fog. It's only a start.


Also get "Not just friends" : https://www.amazon.com/Not-Just-Frie...84HAT6DF28G1RW

Overall, women are twice as likely than men to NOT want to really do R. About 65% are gone for good. And it takes WORK to do R.

Supporting those who want to divorce or reconcile. Not every relationship is the same.
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post #50 of 383 (permalink) Old 12-01-2016, 02:21 PM
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Wife still cheating. I just filed for D

Quote:
Originally Posted by TaDor View Post
Some waywards are not evil at heart, we've all talked about the fog, the fantasy of the affair. How it re-wires the brain turning them into a narcissist. Some are worse than others. Some people get killed, etc.

Some are not recoverable and some will be. A serial cheater is a lost cause, a narcissist down to the core.

The ones who go out of their way to cheat, dump. The ones who get sucked up by the affair because of co-workers, which is VERY common and unplanned - that has variables and factors that will require time and consideration. As we see, infidelity causes mental issues - murder and or suicide. Does the WS get out of the fog in time? How much damage was done? Regret vs Remorse. Can or does the BS have the ability or desire for R?



The WS deep in the fog is not even possible to do R, unless knocked very hard with a 2x4 (divorce, loss of everything) and that is still a maybe.

The WS that has gaps in the fog, but no tools to get out. Then its a matter of timing and desire for R. As we see, many times a WS won't want to do therapy (MC) because its a waste of time - they would rather rug-sweep equal failure and little remorse.



When my wayward was coming out of the fog on her own (we're no longer married by then) I ordered a book from Amazon in 2 days and gave it to her on the next child visitation. Two days later, we're both in MC. It was still a rough start, but we both told the therapist we wanted to work things out. A friend sent me a message soon after WW and I started R and MC, as she too was a WW and fought to get back and doing MC herself. "Climbing the mountain to get to the other side is worth it. It's hard, but anything worth it, is worth fighting for".



As you posted



So yeah, I've had a few WW tell me that remorse is possible and they did horrible things they wish they never done.


I think there are other issues as well - and that is guilt from the BS for helping create a marital environment that wasn't completely safe for their spouse.

In your case @TaDor, you had a very complex relationship with multiple partners that probably muddied the waters and eroded boundaries. So I suspect you took that into consideration when assessing how you wanted to respond to your WW (who was pretty dam awful if you ask me). I think the fact that you did some soul searching and found things to address allowed you to accept her back.

By the same token, Lonely Husband initially was decisive and physically left the state after he discovered the A and went 100% NC with his WW. What changed his mind was the fact that he also assessed himself, took action to address his issues, and realized both he and his W had issues.

In both cases BOTH spouses owned up to their issues and genuinely worked on R.

That isn't the case most of the time here on TAM. A WS of either sex who blows up their marriage when there isn't a really significant existing marital issue is not in the same category.

Just my $.02


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post #51 of 383 (permalink) Old 12-01-2016, 11:06 PM
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Re: Wife still cheating. I just filed for D

Speaking as a moderator:

The thread jack stops now. Any further infractions will lead to a three day time out.

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post #52 of 383 (permalink) Old 12-01-2016, 11:20 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Wife still cheating. I just filed for D

For those that asked, I have exposed to everyone right after D-day. She went ballistic, but eventually calmed down and the fog lifted for a while. But resumed again in a week or less.

Is it normal for wayward wives mood to change constantly? For instance, one day she is begging me to come home and stop the divorce, the next day she is being mean and acts like she doesn't want the marriage.
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post #53 of 383 (permalink) Old 12-01-2016, 11:25 PM
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Re: Wife still cheating. I just filed for D

Yep!

Virginia: "Why can't you kids leave well enough alone? Everything was fine until you started digging around."

Burt: "You sound like a Scooby Doo villain."
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post #54 of 383 (permalink) Old 12-02-2016, 08:03 AM
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Re: Wife still cheating. I just filed for D

She wants to play and for you to pay.

How could you not just let her have her fun?

Get her out of your life!
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post #55 of 383 (permalink) Old 12-02-2016, 08:28 AM
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Re: Wife still cheating. I just filed for D

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Originally Posted by collin8550 View Post
Is it normal for wayward wives mood to change constantly?
Oh yeah.

Her fantasy is crashing down all around her. You got both feet out the door and her Mr. Perfect OM will soon dump her like last's night garbage, she knew this all the time, but you were her fall back.

She is scrambling back and forth looking for a soft landing.


I guess it comes down to a simple choice, really. Get busy living or get busy dying... Andy, Shawshank Redemption.
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post #56 of 383 (permalink) Old 12-02-2016, 08:47 AM
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Wife still cheating. I just filed for D

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Originally Posted by collin8550 View Post
For those that asked, I have exposed to everyone right after D-day. She went ballistic, but eventually calmed down and the fog lifted for a while. But resumed again in a week or less.



Is it normal for wayward wives mood to change constantly? For instance, one day she is begging me to come home and stop the divorce, the next day she is being mean and acts like she doesn't want the marriage.


From personal experience this is common with both WW and WH.

First, this is a "good" sign. If she was totally done with you, you would clearly know without doubt.

IMO she wants to return but is still hooked on the OM chemically. That dopamine rush she gets when contacting him is incredible and addicting and very hard to shake off. Even if she wants to. I think she does.

Treat this like an addiction. She is going through withdrawal. Yes it is freaking ridiculous that she is mean to you when SHE cheated. That is why I mentioned earlier about helping her return and helping her out of the hole.

Yes, she cheated. This is all on her. She is struggling to come back. It is your choice. Dump her if you want. You owe her nothing.

Others say you are Plan B and that she is begging to come back because OM won't have her. And they might be right. Maybe. Maybe not. I am not disagreeing, just giving you another possibility.

It wanted you to hear a view from the other side. My comments however might be totally wrong in your situation. Good luck.

Last edited by blueinbr; 12-02-2016 at 08:58 AM.
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post #57 of 383 (permalink) Old 12-02-2016, 08:49 AM
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Re: Wife still cheating. I just filed for D

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Originally Posted by collin8550 View Post
For those that asked, I have exposed to everyone right after D-day. She went ballistic, but eventually calmed down and the fog lifted for a while. But resumed again in a week or less.

Is it normal for wayward wives mood to change constantly? For instance, one day she is begging me to come home and stop the divorce, the next day she is being mean and acts like she doesn't want the marriage.
Continue to inform people, as the opportunity arises, that she continues to cheat, and that is why you are not together. You never know when enough pressure is enough.
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post #58 of 383 (permalink) Old 12-02-2016, 09:26 AM
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Re: Wife still cheating. I just filed for D

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Is it normal for wayward wives mood to change constantly? For instance, one day she is begging me to come home and stop the divorce, the next day she is being mean and acts like she doesn't want the marriage.
Mine was this was in the days following dday for sure. It's good times.
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post #59 of 383 (permalink) Old 12-02-2016, 12:01 PM
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Re: Wife still cheating. I just filed for D

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Originally Posted by collin8550 View Post
For those that asked, I have exposed to everyone right after D-day. She went ballistic, but eventually calmed down and the fog lifted for a while. But resumed again in a week or less.

Is it normal for wayward wives mood to change constantly? For instance, one day she is begging me to come home and stop the divorce, the next day she is being mean and acts like she doesn't want the marriage.
Oh yeah, it is normal and confusing to you. She may feel a twinge of regret over how it will affect the kids and want to go back to when you knew nothing (but her still having the affair), but then she talks to or pays a visit to AP and is the unrepentant cheater again.

This woman is no where close to ready for an attempt at R. You should not even mention that R is possible while she is still in the affair. If she dumps AP, comes to you on her knees begging for another chance - then maybe you could consider R. Bur even then, you would need to confirm that she dumped him and not the other way around.

So much has happened, you need to take a step back and decide if you even want to consider R with this woman now that you know what she is capable of doing and how she can treat you and your kids. Even if she comes to you begging and crying, can you believe her, can you trust her, will you be able to live without looking over you shoulder for another affair 5, 10 or 15 years from now?
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post #60 of 383 (permalink) Old 12-02-2016, 12:21 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Wife still cheating. I just filed for D

From what I've learned in all my spying before I left, I don't think it's likely OM will dump her. She has dumped him 3 times already and he whined and got mad and stalked her. But she eventually returned. And he already divorced his wife to be with her after WW tried to dump him the first time. So he has nothing to lose. He can have her when he wants and be talking to other girls (or wives) while she dumps him for a couple weeks at a time.
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