Just a very painful story and I got nobody to blame but me - Page 3 - Talk About Marriage
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post #31 of 103 (permalink) Old 12-23-2016, 08:14 PM Thread Starter
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Thanks everyone for your advice. I am having trouble with my phone and being able to quote but I am paying attention to all replies.

I do know that my husband has given me so many chances and realize there is only so much one can take. At this point he would probably just be staying because of our daughter.* They have an amazing relationship, she looks up to him and they get along beautifully. Like him, our daughter is an extrovert who thrives on socializing and being outdoors and even likes to work out with him. She is also a happy child who unlike me cannot stand just sitting around and she has even told me that while she loves me very much, it is her dad who is the fun one. I am generally the one she turns to when she is scared or angry or has a problem. When she feels silly or with a desire to do fun active stuff she turns to her dad.

*It is insane to think that while I was consumed with messaging other men, it never crossed my mind the pain I would cause both my husband and our child.
I have nowhere else to turn at this moment. So please I need some advice. Tomorrow I will go with my daughter to spend Christmas eve as it was planned several weeks ago. My husband will not join us. I am only going because he doesnt want me around and needs some peace and quiet thus I am taking our daughter with me. Here is the problem: he has asked that I make it clear to our daughter that it is not his fault he will not attend. I told him I would say that he is not feeling well and thus he cannot come along. But he insisted that was not acceptable and that I must come up with something else where it is clear that it is not on him the fact that he won't be there. I know he is angry right now, I told him I have no issue with being honest with our child but that at this point I need him to try to work with me for the benefit of our daughter. I also told him that I recognize I should've thought of this while I was flirting with other men. I asked him to help me out but he is unwilling to do so (I don't blame him as he is probably going through so much turmoil that he also cannot think clearly) and so I told him I would try to come up with something. I am so sorry that I have to ask for help here but please I am not asking for myself but for my little one. What can I tell her as to why his dad cannot come with us tomorrow? In the past I could've turned to a facebook group for mothers but I know the last thing I should even consider doing.

I know I am triggering some of you reading this so I politely ask that you refrain from throwing insults or making fun of me. Yes I am a ***** like my husband has called me but my child is a victim here and I do not want to damage her anymore. I am just not thinking clearly right now and I do understand this is not an advice column..please disregard question..I'm so embarrassed.

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post #32 of 103 (permalink) Old 12-23-2016, 09:48 PM
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Re: Just a very painful story and I got nobody to blame but me

I may have missed this - but how old is your daughter?
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post #33 of 103 (permalink) Old 12-23-2016, 09:56 PM
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Re: Just a very painful story and I got nobody to blame but me

How old is your daughter? Sorry if you've already answered this & I've missed it.

At this point I would tell her the truth, in an age appropriate way. If she's young...."Mummy has been doing some bad things & I've hurt Daddy. He needs some grown-up time away from me to think about things. You are the most important thing in his life. He's very sad that he will miss spending Christmas Eve with you. He will be thinking about you all the time as he always does. Both Mummy & Daddy love you very much. If you have any questions,ever, you can ask either of us. We can take lots of photographs for you to show Daddy. He will really enjoy sharing that with you."

"Mummy isn't very well & I've been making some bad decisions but now I'm learning about my illness & I'm going to do everything I can to get better. I'm truly very, very sorry".

Can I ask you how you were feeling BEFORE you started obsessing on Facebook? What was happening in your life? Were you suffering from depression? Had you been going through any major/life-changing experiences?

How do/did you feel about your husband & your relationship? Do you truly 'like' him? You have been aware that having these 'relationships' is a very bad & painful thing. What do/did you tell yourself as you're logging-in? How do you justify it to yourself as you start typing? Although I do recognize that there's an element of 'addiction' here I still believe that's too easy! That's a bit of a cop-out for you really....just like a physical adulterer using the addiction excuse...it wasn't an addiction when you very first started doing it!! You CHOSE to do it. You choose to do it. How do you truly justify it to yourself? What do you say in your head?

The last time you were well aware of the agony you would be inflicting on your husband by betraying him in this way BUT you continued regardless. What was your internal dialogue? WHY?

I do get that you got caught-up in the attention. We all enjoy getting our ego strokes! You made a conscious decision to go back to Facebook & you made a very conscious decision to write & encourage those men. What did you say to yourself to give yourself permission to do this AGAIN?

I've read everything that you've written. I think that YOU need to look a little deeper. I get the psychological analysis that leads to "Why I enjoy that kind of 'high'". That's not what I'm asking. For reasons stated you like it BUT how do you give yourself permission to endulge in the 'high' knowing the pain you will inflict?

An alcoholic or heroin addict would say that they need a fix to stop the physical symptoms of withdrawal. You can't say that....or can you? If you honestly can, WHY?
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post #34 of 103 (permalink) Old 12-23-2016, 10:43 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Just a very painful story and I got nobody to blame but me

Thanks for the advice. It will be very useful. My daughter is 8. She is a very sensitive little girl. I think the hardest thing will be to keep myself from crying...I do not want to scare her and of course it wouldn't be fair to her to have to help me cope with my feelings. She needs me as her mother. So I definitely will do my best to stay strong and be a source of comfort for my litle one.
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post #35 of 103 (permalink) Old 12-23-2016, 10:49 PM
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Re: Just a very painful story and I got nobody to blame but me

@Itwasjustafantasy Will you delete your Facebook account?

This is action that you can do immediately . While you are actively involved in online relationships your real ones stands no chance of recovery.

If you want to even start to save your marriage.

DELETE FACEBOOK NOW.
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post #36 of 103 (permalink) Old 12-23-2016, 11:04 PM
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Re: Just a very painful story and I got nobody to blame but me

Sokillme
No offense intended. Really. Hate my views all you want, but saying she showed NO courage in posting here, taking the 2 x 4's and asking for advice is a start for her and it takes at least a bit of courage to expose yourself on TAM. Why don't you give her some of your sage advise instead of criticizing mine. Where do you propose she get help if not from the internet?
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post #37 of 103 (permalink) Old 12-24-2016, 08:01 AM
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Re: Just a very painful story and I got nobody to blame but me

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Originally Posted by Itwasjustafantasy View Post
Thanks for the advice. It will be very useful. My daughter is 8. She is a very sensitive little girl. I think the hardest thing will be to keep myself from crying...I do not want to scare her and of course it wouldn't be fair to her to have to help me cope with my feelings. She needs me as her mother. So I definitely will do my best to stay strong and be a source of comfort for my litle one.

It doesn't matter if you cry a little. My kids are around the same age. I've cried in front of them. I've lost my temper on occasion. They know that I'm not perfect, I'm human! What I ALWAYS do if I make a mistake is apologize & make sure that they feel safe, protected, loved. I always explain (in an age appropriate way) so they can understand that the most important thing isn't 'always getting it right'. It's about 'always trying to put it right & do better in the future'.

I've lived the horrendous ordeal of reading 'Just words' written by my husband to another woman. It's NOT just a fantasy! I think that your husband NEEDS to see that you get, truly get, the agony that you have inflicted. Saying that you're messed-up or broken isn't enough. It wasn't enough for me!!

It made me very angry when my H continued to hurt me, shatter me, whilst moaning on about his inner 'midlife crisis' turmoil. Why? Because it was still all about HIM!! Any guilt or regret or pain he was feeling was NOTHING compared to what I was going through. What HE was/had put me through. He nearly destroyed my FAMILY, the thing I treasure above anything. He destroyed our 'love story', everything that we were, for his own SELFISH needs. I needed to believe that he truly got that because if he doesn't what's to stop him doing it again? As you've shown so far...nothing!!

You NEED to put your husband's pain above your own. You NEED to show him that you are willing to do anything to put this right. Unfriend every man & person who is not a friend of your marriage from ALL social media. Why on earth are you posting to strangers? I'm a family woman. My only online friends are real friends. Friends don't help you destroy your marriage & family in any way. Get rid of ALL of them! Even girlfriends who encouraged your behavior. You don't need them in your life!

Be strong. Be strong for your family. You can do this!! Please stop putting yourself down & making it seem like something beyond your control. It's NOT! We make choices every single day. Start making good choices & you do that by stopping putting yourself & your problems first. That's what got you into this mess. Put your husband & your child before you. It's a state of mind that's very hard for the depressed & broken to achieve. Depression is incredibly selfish.
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post #38 of 103 (permalink) Old 12-24-2016, 01:57 PM
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Re: Just a very painful story and I got nobody to blame but me

Get off of facebook. Now and stay off.

Do not get married again until you can stop hurting your family.

Think about how you would feel if your H cheated on you.

Would that be fine for you?

you are causing your H and your daughter pain with your actions. Get some help from affair recovery.com.

how can you not see that you are hurting both your H and your daughter?

that is very selfish of you.
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post #39 of 103 (permalink) Old 12-24-2016, 03:13 PM
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Re: Just a very painful story and I got nobody to blame but me

@Itwasjustafantasy,

I am speaking to you as someone who was a former disloyal spouse, so I've BTDT and have the ability to speak to you maybe as a triggered loyal spouse can not. And one thing stand out to me like a flashing, glaring red light: you do not take personal responsibility for ADULTERY. Oh you don't say it was someone else's fault or say it was the "right" thing to do, but you act like you are not entirely responsible "because you have an addictive personality" or "you have an addiction". In addition, rather than naming it what it is, you skirt around with euphemisms and minimizing phrases like you were "flirting" on FB or "getting an ego boost" or whatever terms you have in your head.

So #1 I would highly encourage you to stop minimizing what you did. You are not some naive, innocent little waif who went tripping into a minefield over which you have no control and blew off your leg. You did not harmlessly flirt. You did not enjoy "just a fantasy." It was ADULTERY. Say that out loud and embrace the fact that something inside you balanced "the safety of the people I love" vs. "the thrill of adultery" and picked ADULTERY as the winner! Here's why that's important: until you can stop minimizing what you've done, you will spend a lot of time trying to convince others it wasn't all that bad, it didn't go that far, you shouldn't hurt that much, etc. In reality you made a promise to your husband to forsake ALL OTHERS (all...not most, or some). In reality you made a promise to spend your life learning about him and behaving in a loving way toward him (not "staying if I get my needs met" or "... if you make me feel XYZ"). Thus, you are the character of person --right now-- who not only breaks their promises, but also blames others and tries to hurt them in order to feel better about yourself! Now I don't say this necessarily to hurt you or call names, but rather to speak truth and hopefully to shock you that you have sunk that low! Because once you are honest with yourself about how love you have sunk, then you can begin to be honest with yourself and start to do the work to be a better person. As long as you're still lying to yourself "it was just a fantasy" it makes real change impossible.

#2 I would highly encourage you to stop minimizing your responsibility. You purposely chose to commit emotional adultery over and over, even knowing that the price of doing so would be losing your family. No one forced you. No one tricked you. You are not the victim. You KNEW that acting like this would do irreparable harm to the man you claim to supposedly love and the father of your child, and you KNEW that the result would be tearing up your child's security and home...and you made the conscious choice to pursue it anyway. You are not helpless. Your addictive personality is not like a flu that "has to" run it's course. That puts the control in the addiction's hands rather than where it firmly belongs: YOUR HANDS. The men on FB are not responsible. Your husband not giving you as big of a thrill is not responsible. Your addictive habits are not responsible. You are an adult and you CAN be self-aware enough to know you have a weakness, and you can choose to do something to protect your family from your own weakness, but you made the conscious decision to do NOTHING> So, stop hiding this from yourself, and you may be able to take a step forward.

Finally I would STRONGLY encourage you to be upright and honest with your little girl. Her world is about to be blown apart and she is going to lose half her time with her mom, and half her time with her dad, and she deserves a REAL answer! She deserves the truth. And yes it's going to hurt her, but you chose to do this, so now you are experiencing the natural consequence of your choice. See, you are not stupid. You're a mental health professional! You know that each and every choice we make--in public and in private--has both a BENEFIT and a COST. The benefit of your fantasies was that you got the thrill. You felt interesting and attractive and maybe "loved.' But the cost of your fantasies is the look in your little girl's eyes when she hears that her and her daddy are moving out because you picked fantasies over her safety! And yes, don't kid yourself--you did!!

If you want to make it right, the way to do that is not to keep lying!! The way to make is right is to stop being dishonest, experience the consequences of what you chose to do, work on yourself to become a better woman-mother-wife, and continue to be honest even when it's scary or hurts. THIS is how people might gradually begin to trust you again, because right now you have demonstrated to them, in your actions, that you are not trustworthy! And even though it is going to HURT YOU when you tell your little girl, you can tel her honestly in an age appropriate way why her daddy is not coming. I liked this suggestion earlier:

"Mummy has been doing some bad things & I've hurt Daddy. He needs some grown-up time away from me to think about things. You are the most important thing in his life. He's very sad that he will miss spending Christmas Eve with you. He will be thinking about you all the time as he always does. Both Mummy & Daddy love you very much. If you have any questions,ever, you can ask either of us. We can take lots of photographs for you to show Daddy. He will really enjoy sharing that with you."

Try working with that and making it sound like something you would say. She needs to understand that YOU did something hurtful, that her dad is not being a jerk or blaming you, that he is not "at fault" and has a right to be hurt, and that it is reasonable for someone to take some time to figure things out if they were hurt. This will be a lesson to her--people don't just break up over "not getting along" or "drifting apart" (otherwise what if she "doesn't get along" with a teacher at school--can she break up with that teacher?). She can be taught that everyone, even mom and dad, do something wrong, and that the way to FIX IT when you've done something wrong, is to admit exactly what you've done, take responsibility for it, ask for forgiveness, and then STOP DOING the wrong thing.

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post #40 of 103 (permalink) Old 12-25-2016, 07:20 AM
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Re: Just a very painful story and I got nobody to blame but me

My brother took his own life over his wife's infidelity & cruel behavior. WS frequently underestimate the agony that they inflict on others. I know it's human nature to attempt to justify our actions, particularly to ourselves! I know it sounds trite for me to say "Just STOP!" but you have been given so many chances AND far too much understanding & compassion in my opinion.

Your husband has been an incredibly supportive & loving man. You have been truly blessed in life. It's time to repay him, even if you don't stay together. He has earnt it! My advise to you is change, grow, become the wife he so deserves.

I hope that you are spending Christmas together as a family for your daughters sake. I hope that your husband gives you one more chance & you spend the rest of your live earning it.

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post #41 of 103 (permalink) Old 12-25-2016, 09:06 AM
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Re: Just a very painful story and I got nobody to blame but me

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My brother took his own life over his wife's infidelity & cruel behavior. WS frequently underestimate the agony that they inflict on others.
I feel badly about your brother and I've read countless stories about people (mostly men) who can't handle the stress and live changing effects of divorce especially when the person is pulled away from their children, their marital home and at least half their assets, and left with barely enough - if enough- to provide a roof over their own head. That much being said, I was there, I got through it, most people do, and those who choose to end their lives cannot place the blame on their expartner- sure they inflicted a boatload of pain and suffering but we don't all respond to it in the same way.
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post #42 of 103 (permalink) Old 12-25-2016, 01:15 PM
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Re: Just a very painful story and I got nobody to blame but me

Thank you browser. Everyone's situation is different. Everyone is different. There are different levels of cruelty.

I was truly shocked by my own reactions to abuse. I NEVER thought for one moment I could be so beaten down that I could no longer even imagine an escape. I got through it. Some don't.

I say "Never judge until you've walked in another's shoes." No-one knows what they would do in the SAME situation.

My statement was that most WS's justify & minimize their behavior. That MUST STOP if the OP is going to grow & change to become a woman worthy of her family.
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post #43 of 103 (permalink) Old 12-25-2016, 04:09 PM Thread Starter
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ShatteredStill,
You have asked some questions and made some great points that are allowing me to do some way overdue self-reflection. If it isn't obvious by now, I cannot seem to keep my replies concise.
The only connection between my behavior and how it compares to other addictions is in that when I feel anxious or overwhelmed with any negative emotions I want to immediately find the comfort in my drug of choice:facebook. Once there I start with checking how many likes I got, friend requests, etc. Of course I am fully aware of what am doing and while I could stop right there and find another way of soothing my distress or pain or whatever, I find it much easier to rely on the validation and perceived approval I get from others...especially men. For all my facebook friends know I am just being friendly but while at first is a source of escaping to a fantasy world where I am supposedly liked and admired, when I'm off it I am back to reality. Now my reality is one which many would like to have, I have a house, food, clothes, I'm in good physical health,* I have a great husband, a healthy daughter, a good job, respect from my colleagues and yet that is not enough for me. In reality there is nothing that will make me appreciate all the good things in my life. I always feel I am lacking, I always feel empty, unfulfilled, miserable and sorry for myself.
Another poster suggested that my behavior has been selfish and that I am minimizing. Absolutely,* I cannot disagree with that. While I am messaging other men, I tell myself "at least I am not actually sleeping around, I am not even sending pictures of myself, they just have one or 2 pictures of me on my page and nothing else, I would never ever send sexually suggestive pictures, I would never actually go and meet these men in person, so how is this adultery?" But I know that if I believed there was nothing inappropriate I would not hide it from my husband and I wouldn't feel yucky afterwards...so during the time I am actively exchanging messages with other men, I feel wanted, loved, desired. When I log off facebook I am just a regular woman who nobody would notice as I am rather shy and reserved. Does my husband notice me? Sure he does, but it is never ever enough. I want to feel adored, as if he could not live without me, as if he needed me more than he needs oxygen...perhaps because that is my sick definition of being loved.

Just want to add that I am so grateful for the feedback, I needed a place to express my emotions so that I could be calm enough by the time I got together with my family yesterday. I was able to keep my composure and actually seeing my little girl and nieces so happy opening their gifts, etc really helped me relax a bit and thus be able to stay strong for my child. My husband insisted that I do not ruin our daughter's holiday by even hinting at any problems between us and told her that he just wasn't feeling well to join us. My daughter accepted that explanation and that was it.

This morning my husband sent me some messages, telling me how much he hates me, etc. I know I am paying for my cheating so I just try to go lock myself in the bathroom, cry a bit and then go on. I know my husband is devastated and furious and my instinct is to ask him to please stop the hateful messages because I cannot function well around our daughter but I am sure he is suffering a lot more so I refrained from doing so. He has told me that he hopes that after he sent out screenshots to my family that I am finally starting to feel a bit of the pain I put him through. I told him that his messages are hurtful but that I deserve them. He said he wants to be calm but the messages I exchanged with other men are in his mind constantly and he just cannot find a way to deal other than to make me feel his pain. He finally said he may talk to me tomorrow when our daughter is at a friend's house because he wants to spare our daughter the problems I have created and the consequences.

Thanks everyone. I am paying attention to your insight. I only hope this time around I actually put into practice the advice, I don't even trust myself to do this but I don't think I can make things any worse.
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post #44 of 103 (permalink) Old 12-25-2016, 05:39 PM
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Re: Just a very painful story and I got nobody to blame but me

Without strong immediate action you are making things worse.

Your choice to stay on Facebook will finish your marriage. If you feel that you can not delete facebook then at the very least you must give your husband ALL your social media login details.
Can you do that?
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post #45 of 103 (permalink) Old 12-25-2016, 06:43 PM
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Re: Just a very painful story and I got nobody to blame but me

One can not love without trust. You can but it is a very unhealthy love.

Your H will have built up resentment and may very well have a PA.

This has no way of ending well....

A-Every single thing that has ever happened in your life is preparing you for a moment that is yet to come.
B-We know what we are, but know not what we may be
C-Never make the person in your present pay for the sins committed by people from your past
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