Big fight - Page 4 - Talk About Marriage
Coping with Infidelity Relationship recovery from the destructiveness of infidelity.

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post #46 of 61 (permalink) Old 02-12-2017, 01:13 PM
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Re: Big fight

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I don't think there is anything wrong with allowing insecurities to surface. Aren't we supposed to be vulnerable?
Nor do I... I think vulnerability is a critical component of self-love, less fearful of any rejection and not worrying about what one looks like when openness is no longer an issue, but a asset.

This is what I meant by how we allow them to surface, removing those things that keep us guarded and disguising our authenticity.

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post #47 of 61 (permalink) Old 02-20-2017, 07:44 AM Thread Starter
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I'm dragging this thread out because I'm not quite sure what to do.
I found out how to find out what you've searched for in Facebook. I looked at hubbys.
In December he searched three time for a business women's name. She's very attractive and about our age. She is not in any line of work he is in but I suppose as a business person their paths have crosssed.
So why look her up? They have two mutual friends. I don't have access to his LinkedIn account so no idea of they're friends there.
He hasn't looked for anything else but sports teams.
He was very supportive of me this weekend when I did my hobby type job.
My gut is that he saw her or maybe met her somewhere and then looked her up.
If I ask him about it I'll give away my source and he'll accuse me of stalking him.
He's obviously interested in knowing about other attraactive women. Do other men do this?
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post #48 of 61 (permalink) Old 02-20-2017, 03:20 PM
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Re: Big fight

Probably. Men like to look at pretty women. They're much more visual that way. He may just be playing what if in his head.
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post #49 of 61 (permalink) Old 02-20-2017, 03:21 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Big fight

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Probably. Men like to look at pretty women. They're much more visual that way. He may just be playing what if in his head.
I think the "what if" has been played enough in his head after what we've been through.
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post #50 of 61 (permalink) Old 02-22-2017, 07:48 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Big fight

I'm going to start by saying that I need to talk to him and that I really want to be in a marriage where divorce isn't threatened when we talk about uncomfortable things...
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post #51 of 61 (permalink) Old 02-23-2017, 06:33 PM
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Re: Big fight

That's how you're planning to start talking to him?
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post #52 of 61 (permalink) Old 02-23-2017, 06:36 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Big fight

well considering how the last fight went, I'll probably start with that. yep.
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post #53 of 61 (permalink) Old 02-23-2017, 07:55 PM
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Re: Big fight

Read what you wrote. It's an attack. A sideways attack, but still an attack. So he will instantly stop listening to you. IIWY, I'd go to a therapist and ask him/her to help you set up a conversation.
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post #54 of 61 (permalink) Old 02-23-2017, 08:08 PM Thread Starter
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I'm going to do exactly that. Going next Thursday. I would not, in the same conversation, mention both things. I would just say I'm not happy with any fight turning into a threat of divorce, that we should be able to talk without threats and leave it at that.
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post #55 of 61 (permalink) Old 02-24-2017, 03:11 PM
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Re: Big fight

This thread strikes a little to close to home for me.

I'm offering my take on this. I am no expert but my situation is a bit similar. I don't know your whole backstory, so I could be off base completely.

I have a very hard time respecting my wife after her A, even years later. Deidre mentioned it, and I think that's probably his biggest issue in communicating and interacting with you. I have done what he's doing too. If anything comes up in an argument I don't like, I throw down the you cheated card or if you don't like it GTFO. Or my fave, duck this let's get a divorce. I'm was not trying to understand, compromise, or express empathy - it was about "winning" or punishing. Sometimes even purposely causing her pain because my pride was damaged. I know what buttons to push and it sounds like your husband does too. I would pick, or escalate, arguments just so I could throw these barbs. I usually feel like complete crap afterwards, but the damage has been done. I would never apologize for any of this either. I did it mostly because she accepted it. I came to see it as childish and stupid but it took way too long for me to figure that out.

So, I would say just don't accept it anymore. Remove yourself from the situation when the argument takes that tone. I would also talk to him about this line of thought, outside of any other discussion or argument, and see what he thinks. At least plant the seeds in his mind.

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post #56 of 61 (permalink) Old 02-24-2017, 04:08 PM
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Re: Big fight

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This thread strikes a little to close to home for me.

I'm offering my take on this. I am no expert but my situation is a bit similar. I don't know your whole backstory, so I could be off base completely.

I have a very hard time respecting my wife after her A, even years later. Deidre mentioned it, and I think that's probably his biggest issue in communicating and interacting with you. I have done what he's doing too. If anything comes up in an argument I don't like, I throw down the you cheated card or if you don't like it GTFO. Or my fave, duck this let's get a divorce. I'm was not trying to understand, compromise, or express empathy - it was about "winning" or punishing. Sometimes even purposely causing her pain because my pride was damaged. I know what buttons to push and it sounds like your husband does too. I would pick, or escalate, arguments just so I could throw these barbs. I usually feel like complete crap afterwards, but the damage has been done. I would never apologize for any of this either. I did it mostly because she accepted it. I came to see it as childish and stupid but it took way too long for me to figure that out.

So, I would say just don't accept it anymore. Remove yourself from the situation when the argument takes that tone. I would also talk to him about this line of thought, outside of any other discussion or argument, and see what he thinks. At least plant the seeds in his mind.
@fleek - that was a very honest and insightful post. My H does the same thing - despite the fact he says he is over my A (25years ago- but he only found out 2 years ago- I disclosed)
He recently said he wouldnt care if I gave OM a gift to thank him for helping out our DD- (om saw dd's name and allowed her to co-op with his business). I was tryng to get him to empathize with some of his actions regarding his suspected EA. I would never dream of doing the gift thing- I think that would be hurtful.

Do you think you will get to a point where you no longer want to hurt your wife? Can you see yourself ever falling back in love with her? I know it would be different but some posters say it can be a more intimate kind of love after getting through everything?
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post #57 of 61 (permalink) Old 02-24-2017, 04:26 PM
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Re: Big fight

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Originally Posted by katies View Post
I'm dragging this thread out because I'm not quite sure what to do.
I found out how to find out what you've searched for in Facebook. I looked at hubbys.
In December he searched three time for a business women's name. She's very attractive and about our age. She is not in any line of work he is in but I suppose as a business person their paths have crosssed.
So why look her up? They have two mutual friends. I don't have access to his LinkedIn account so no idea of they're friends there.
He hasn't looked for anything else but sports teams.
He was very supportive of me this weekend when I did my hobby type job.
My gut is that he saw her or maybe met her somewhere and then looked her up.
If I ask him about it I'll give away my source and he'll accuse me of stalking him.
He's obviously interested in knowing about other attraactive women. Do other men do this?
Does your marriage seem more like a friendship/roommate kind of thing, rather than a husband and wife bond with passion, etc?

Sometimes, you fall in love with the most unexpected person, at the most unexpected time. ~ Unknown
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post #58 of 61 (permalink) Old 02-24-2017, 07:00 PM Thread Starter
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No, it's very much an in love, passionate, 30 year marriage with history, 4 grown kids and deep love and friendship.
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post #59 of 61 (permalink) Old 02-25-2017, 05:52 PM
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Re: Big fight

@katies, I've been quietly watching. I'm sorry that you're feeling the pain and distrust that you do. But you need to start doing something differently.

You write of your pain and your hurt. How you feel almost deliberately misunderstood and how your husband pushes you away - using his anger and and his knowledge of your vulnerabilities to keep you at a distance. Some people avoid intimacy right from the beginning. Others learn it as a tool to prevent future hurt, especially against those who have hurt them before. Your husband loves you, but he does not want you too close because you have and can hurt him more when you are close. This is a natural defense mechanism. So, he feeds off of your pain and your hurt. He turns it back on itself to keep you away.

My uh... extensive knowledge of martial arts has been painstakingly constructed through many discounted movie theatre visits and very late night television. But I do know that jujutsu is "the art of manipulating the opponent's force against himself rather than confronting it with one's own force" (thank you Wikipedia). Your husband cannot turn your hurt and pain back on itself if you do not aim it at him in the first place. Find your inner ninja.

Empathy and communication are both two-way streets. You are very adept at keeping the flow coming from your side, but perhaps he is not as good at maintaining the flow from his? If he can only whisper of his needs and hurts, then you also have to listen better than he can. So a strategy for now - instead of trying so hard to be heard, try only to listen. Instead of speaking your hurt and pain, try only to hear of his pain and hurt. Instead of demanding that he voice his love, try only to tell him yours. Do not misunderstand me. Your needs are important. Your pain is important. But if you can get close enough to him, then you will only need to whisper it, when the time is right.

I have learned now that while those who speak about one's miseries usually hurt, those who keep silence hurt more.
― C.S. Lewis
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post #60 of 61 (permalink) Old 02-25-2017, 09:49 PM
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Re: Big fight

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No, it's very much an in love, passionate, 30 year marriage with history, 4 grown kids and deep love and friendship.
Considering the affairs... You and Him, don't complain that much. Yeah, y'all have issues, but it seems you and him are faithful now. The reality of R. It's not easy, the blinders have been pulled off it's never really goes away, it just sits there in the corner of the room waiting to be brought up and tossed. Fact check... forgiveness is/will never be forget.

I guess it comes down to a simple choice, really. Get busy living or get busy dying... Andy, Shawshank Redemption.
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