Big fight - Talk About Marriage
Coping with Infidelity Relationship recovery from the destructiveness of infidelity.

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post #1 of 61 (permalink) Old 02-05-2017, 03:33 PM Thread Starter
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Big fight

although we are fine today, we keep having the same fight it seems. Although it's been a while since the last one.
A 29 year old woman who apparently must be at the gym hubby works out at friended him on FB. Her husband always works out there as well and he and hubby are buddies. This was a few days ago. I saw the "so and so are now friends" feed on my FB. I just sighed to myself, wondering why she friended him. She is one year older than our son! The guy she married was her former teacher and is 50.
Then, at the bball game last night, they said hi to each other (ignoring me, I was her teacher in junior high) and then I saw him glancing at her again.

We proceeded to have a good evening out with our friends and when we got back I mentioned that it felt threatening to me that he is friends with her. I said you always mention everybody else at the gym, why not her? when he explained how he knew her.

so we went around and around, he told me I Was stalking him (he obviously doesn't understand how FB feed works). Then he said I caused my own pain by starting all this. and then he apologized and then not and said I drove him to say those things. And things were said and crap and I had had enough and left the bed. Then he apologized.

What the hell is the answer here? I don't think he's having an affair. But why even go there. I would NEVER be friends with someone like that on FB. She obviously looked him up as they have no shared friends. WTH?

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post #2 of 61 (permalink) Old 02-05-2017, 03:46 PM
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Re: Big fight

Okay, politically incorrect answer here.

Apologies to bleeding hearts.

Rather than a bitter response, think of this as an educated response. I'm only offering my opinion.

Many young women today are well versed in how to get and keep a man. They are well educated in the fact that men are visual. They know they are attractive and what that means. They know how to have great sex and aren't afraid to have it with whomever they choose.

They also enjoy the attention that a man gives them whom they would never sleep with. He doesn't know it, because she will just keep him nibbling at the bait, thinking he has a chance. hahahaha. surrrre..he does.

And as added fun....it sure does screw with your head and marriage. Did you give her a hard time in middle school? Yeah, many today, men and women will find a way to get revenge. There is little they won't do and they think it is fun.

Laws today are such that a wife can have a child and get child support. She can then no-fault divorce and find another man who she believes will be a better provider. As she gets older, she will settle down with a man who has never had a woman with such sexual experience, but has plenty of money and a good reputation.

All of that and they can have a great career, too.

In other words, many women today know they can have it all. So, they go for it.

"I'm significant!! Screamed the dust speck." - Bill Watterson

"And this, too, shall pass away."
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post #3 of 61 (permalink) Old 02-05-2017, 04:02 PM
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Re: Big fight

Since she likes older men, which is why she married one, I'd say you have reason to wonder. Not be concerned, but wonder. I think your husband shouldn't have argued with you, he should have simply ''unfriended'' her if he saw how upset you were. If you're a normally reasonable person, and have been married a while, he should put your feelings above what some random chick at a gym thinks.

I have friends who are men, and my fiance is mutual friends with most of them. But, if I started adding men I meet at the gym to my FB friend list, no matter their age, my fiance would wonder. She's not interested in being friends, that's my guess. She's interested in getting male attention, and your husband shouldn't have accepted the friend request. He should unfriend her if he cares at all about your feelings. The fact that he made a big deal about it is telling, though.
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post #4 of 61 (permalink) Old 02-05-2017, 04:04 PM
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Re: Big fight

From what you have written. Is it typical in your marriage to have arguments like this?

If my wife told me that she was uneasy with a female friend, I would drop that friend out of respect for my wife.

His arguments and his defending the friendship makes me a little uneasy to tell the truth.

Maybe not an affair - yet. The old saying applies - "This is not Hell.........but you can see it from here."
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post #5 of 61 (permalink) Old 02-05-2017, 04:07 PM
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Re: Big fight

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If my wife told me that she was uneasy with a female friend, I would drop that friend out of respect for my wife.

His arguments and his defending the friendship makes me a little uneasy to tell the truth.
Totally this. His reaction to your reaction OP, is the problem to me.
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post #6 of 61 (permalink) Old 02-05-2017, 04:23 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Big fight

I agree his reaction is like WTF? He HATES that I look at social media - once I saw him at a community lunch sitting next to a gal who later came up and hugged him while we were together and I was livid. He said she's just a jovial happy person. He accused me of looking at his LinkedIn page. I haven't looked at it in 2 years. But WHO CARES. He is a BS too! I would NOT CARE if he looked at my stuff. He doesnt' think it's healthy for married couples to do that. Well guess what, we're not the typical married couple.
He said if you don't trust me lets just end it. And then back pedaled. He just doesn't know how to NOT TAKE OFFENSE to anything I say. He said what's this about. I said EMPATHY!!!
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post #7 of 61 (permalink) Old 02-05-2017, 04:36 PM
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Re: Big fight

Some woman collect facebook friends like trophies. He may have just been polite to accept the request. No harm done.

Is she a gym rat in which she can offer fitness advice? In which case no harm done.

Or he is flattered he befriended him, there is possibly a little sexual tension on his side while she just wants male attention and never will PA or EA your husband.

I vote for the last one.

50 yo guy here.

Last edited by 225985; 02-23-2017 at 08:10 PM.
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post #8 of 61 (permalink) Old 02-05-2017, 05:52 PM Thread Starter
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Thanks blue. After all we've been through I can't handle much more. No less defensiveness instead if empathy.
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post #9 of 61 (permalink) Old 02-05-2017, 06:19 PM
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Re: Big fight

Who needs this crap. As we age our ego gets more brittle by the day.

He knows better.

When my wife stops being jealous of me is the day I would get really worried.

I went to just one H.S. Class Reunion. It was my 25th. I never had any contact with any of my former classmates. Why only one Reunion? As soon as we arrived at the 25th, a former High School girlfriend of mine screamed and jumped into my arms, her legs wrapped around my waist. My wife was horrified. I was dead meat.

He should be happy that his wife is protective of him. All within reason, of course.

I wish you the best.

This....This is the nub of the stick that pokes me in the eye when the light of day energizes my optic nerve....SunCMars.... The Allegory of the Cave--> On this, I did a '180' and stepped out.

The Lion in Winter. Invictus..By Will, Shall... Saved from harm by my friends.
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post #10 of 61 (permalink) Old 02-05-2017, 08:10 PM Thread Starter
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Being we've been through 3 affairs between us, I think ours is a case of exercising extreme precaution. Always protecting boundaries, if not for ourselves, but the feelings of safety for our spouse.

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post #11 of 61 (permalink) Old 02-05-2017, 08:17 PM
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Re: Big fight

You'll have to hope for those who've reconciled to come by with opinions. This is beyond most of us. I figured as much.

I'm going to suggest the old standby. Please, see a marriage counselor. Yours is not the typical situation. You could easily lose all you've worked for if you follow the wrong advice.

In the end, that may be best for both of you, but you will need counseling to help you determine what is worthy of leaving and what isn't.

Sorry you are here over this.

"I'm significant!! Screamed the dust speck." - Bill Watterson

"And this, too, shall pass away."
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post #12 of 61 (permalink) Old 02-05-2017, 08:23 PM
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Re: Big fight

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Being we've been through 3 affairs between us, I think ours is a case of exercising extreme precaution. Always protecting boundaries, if not for ourselves, but the feelings of safety for our spouse.
Tell him exactly what you have said above. He could not be that obtuse that he does not realise the importance in your case of boundaries.

If it was me, I would give him some of his own medicine and flirt with the guys at the next event you attend, if he responds negatively, tell him that is exactly how you feel. So if he is prepared to sit down and talk about it in order to protect your marriage, great; if not, then yu both have to consider moving on as you cannot live like that.
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post #13 of 61 (permalink) Old 02-05-2017, 08:35 PM Thread Starter
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I will tell him exactly that.
It now goes against my values to flirt with other men.
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post #14 of 61 (permalink) Old 02-06-2017, 03:39 AM
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Re: Big fight

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It now goes against my values to flirt with other men.
Yes @katies!!! One may need affirmation in other ways, but the good feelings that come from being found attractive and desirable? IMO, those belong to one's partner and him/her alone.

As to your husband having what was likely a relatively innocent (if ego-stroking) interaction with this ex-student of yours? If it makes you feel uncomfortable or upsets you in any way, then he needs to know that and appreciate it. What he does with that information is then his choice. Frankly, I cannot see why she should feature in either of your lives in any way.

It seems to me that your argument was not about him continuing his "friendship" with this woman. (I don't think you said whether he wants to do this? If this is the case, then my advice changes) You were hurt that he had acted as he had - you saw it as him not respecting healthy boundaries. And he was hurt that you were checking up on him because he saw this as a lack of trust. (He probably also felt guilty after you told him about how you felt, which wouldn't have helped him see your feelings objectively.) Neither of you can control which feelings you have in response to this situation, they simply are. Sharing them is part of honest, open communication. It is understanding what to do with them and why they are there that matters. (For what it is worth, I would also have felt threatened and angry if I were you.)

However, the reality is that you need to trust him to be faithful in order to move forward in your marriage. Perhaps you already do so, at least in part. But, you also need to trust that he is fully invested in your marriage. That your comfort and happiness are important to him, even if it means respecting boundaries that he might not think are necessary. Trust like this is built over time by a thousand small gestures. It needs to be nurtured. Respecting your partner's feelings is absolutely necessary (and that works in both directions). Does your husband understand that you are not actually accusing him of having an affair? Were you hurt more by his initial behaviour or by his response when you told him how that behaviour made you feel? Your history possibly makes it difficult to have these types of discussions without one of you demanding that the other prove their love and commitment by showing trust first. The whole discussion then becomes stuck in a chicken and egg loop. Have you tried MC before? Or perhaps writing down your feelings so that you can share things like this more neutrally?

I hope that you can get through this together. It sounds as though you have both had painful journeys to get to this point.
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post #15 of 61 (permalink) Old 02-06-2017, 05:56 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Big fight

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Yes @katies!!! One may need affirmation in other ways, but the good feelings that come from being found attractive and desirable? IMO, those belong to one's partner and him/her alone.

As to your husband having what was likely a relatively innocent (if ego-stroking) interaction with this ex-student of yours? If it makes you feel uncomfortable or upsets you in any way, then he needs to know that and appreciate it. What he does with that information is then his choice. Frankly, I cannot see why she should feature in either of your lives in any way.

It seems to me that your argument was not about him continuing his "friendship" with this woman. (I don't think you said whether he wants to do this? If this is the case, then my advice changes) You were hurt that he had acted as he had - you saw it as him not respecting healthy boundaries. And he was hurt that you were checking up on him because he saw this as a lack of trust. (He probably also felt guilty after you told him about how you felt, which wouldn't have helped him see your feelings objectively.) Neither of you can control which feelings you have in response to this situation, they simply are. Sharing them is part of honest, open communication. It is understanding what to do with them and why they are there that matters. (For what it is worth, I would also have felt threatened and angry if I were you.)

However, the reality is that you need to trust him to be faithful in order to move forward in your marriage. Perhaps you already do so, at least in part. But, you also need to trust that he is fully invested in your marriage. That your comfort and happiness are important to him, even if it means respecting boundaries that he might not think are necessary. Trust like this is built over time by a thousand small gestures. It needs to be nurtured. Respecting your partner's feelings is absolutely necessary (and that works in both directions). Does your husband understand that you are not actually accusing him of having an affair? Were you hurt more by his initial behaviour or by his response when you told him how that behaviour made you feel? Your history possibly makes it difficult to have these types of discussions without one of you demanding that the other prove their love and commitment by showing trust first. The whole discussion then becomes stuck in a chicken and egg loop. Have you tried MC before? Or perhaps writing down your feelings so that you can share things like this more neutrally?

I hope that you can get through this together. It sounds as though you have both had painful journeys to get to this point.
Mizz - what great feedback. Thank you.
We have tried and been dismissed from MC for 2-3 years now.
Yes, he really takes it personally that I don't trust him entirely. He has done many 1000 things right. I told him I didn't think that he was having an affair but was not being cognizant of boundaries. And that when he throws me stalking him in the face he's not being empathetic.
Where we differ is that I don't take it personally if he doesn't trust me. It effects him much more than me. He thinks its some sort of prize he should get for doing everything right. When I call him on things, he gets defensive and super resentful.
When he gets mad at me for bringing things up, he then says I goaded him into saying these awful things. That's when I said that was it and that I'd had enough and that I was done. I said if I have that much power in your life then you're not healthy.
So yes, we do go around and around. It is very difficult. We are great if i keep my mouth shut. What a marriage though. I won't allow him to manipulate me into not talking/sharing.
I DO show him trust! He11, he goes to work right next door to OW1 every single day.
Many of the things you have mentioned I will write to him.
Thank you.
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