Any way back from 2nd EA? - Talk About Marriage
Coping with Infidelity Relationship recovery from the destructiveness of infidelity.

User Tag List

 317Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread
post #1 of 224 (permalink) Old 02-09-2017, 11:44 PM Thread Starter
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 54
Thumbs down Any way back from 2nd EA?

While my now wife were dating 15 years ago she took a job at a company and struck up a friendship with one of the executives who was many years older, she told me how much of a nice man he was. I didn't think much of it at the time. Around the time of our wedding 4 years later he helped her get a part time job and I knew she had met him for lunch. At this stage I still didn't think anything of it. It wasn't until our 2nd child was born some 7 years later and my parents were visiting from my home country and we gave them my wifes old mobile phone to use while they were with staying with us. I was showing my Father how to use the phone when I started to delete some of the text messages to free up some space it was then I started reading some of the texts from this man who she had struck up the friendship with.
It was clear from the text's that this man was madly in love with my wife saying things like 'You're the love of my life and I love you so much' she never told him she loved him but would sign off with things like "lots of love and hugs xxx" but never made an effort to repal these outbursts of undying love.
I confronted her about this and she broke down begged me not to leave her and promised me on our childrens life that she would never have any contact with this man again and it was only ever a friendship and that it wasn't a PA. I took her word for that.
Fast forward 6 years and we now have 3 children and have moved back to the country of my birth. I was on our family laptop doing some work and I accidently click on her work gmail account instead of my gmail account to find an unread email sitting right there from the same man. I can't describe how I felt, I nearly vomitted into my mouth it was like deja-vu.
I read through every email and the theme was the same as before, her confiding how she was feeling (nothing about our relationship) about things etc, him persistently declaring his undying love for her and how he had been sad since the day we moved countries. It also showed that the 2 of them had chatted at least once on the phone but she had tried to call him at least 3 or 4 times. She initially said she turned to him when she was home sick and feeling down but I was suspicious as to how he knew that we'd moved countries if this was the first communication since she promised to cut all ties.
I confronted her about it and told her I was leaving her. She again broke down and told me he meant nothing more than a good friend and she was flattered that he felt so strongly about her and how he just listened to her and understood her problems. I asked how he knew we had moved countries and she come up with some lame reasosn. She denied this several times over the course of the next month but finally admitted that she had been in email contact before we left and had met him for lunch one time before we left.
I'm trying really hard to believe her that it was never a PA and she loves me and our kids more than anything. But something in my gut just can't trust her, there has to more.
She has never volunteered anything about the EA and only told me the truth once I'd already found out more about the extend of the deception. We are now receiving marriage counselling but I just don't know if I can ever trust her again. I was able to forgive the first EA but the second I'm not so sure. How can I trust her that she is telling the truth and not holding anything else back? I'm 99% sure it's never progressed to a PA but that 1% is eating me from the inside and I'm sure there is more I haven't been able to find out and she's not telling me for fear of my walking away.
Is there anyway back from this even though we love each other and have 3 children. I feel so hurt and betrayed.

cjadek is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 224 (permalink) Old 02-10-2017, 12:02 AM
Member
 
GusPolinski's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: TX, USA
Posts: 12,288
Re: Any way back from 2nd EA?

EA + physical proximity = PA

Virginia: "Why can't you kids leave well enough alone? Everything was fine until you started digging around."

Burt: "You sound like a Scooby Doo villain."
GusPolinski is offline  
post #3 of 224 (permalink) Old 02-10-2017, 12:04 AM
Member
 
Graywolf2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 871
Re: Any way back from 2nd EA?

Have ways to monitor her communications in place (VAR, key logger, etc.) See the link below.

Standard Evidence Post

Then do what I call “kicking the ant nest.” Voice your suspicions and see who she contacts. It may not be the other man (OM). It could be a friend she’s telling how much she loves you or how crazy you’re acting, Or she could tell them about a PA.

One way to “kick the ant nest” now is to tell her that you’re going to DNA the kids. That should get her talking to someone. It’s quite simple. You just buy a kit at about any drug store or even Amazon. You swab the inside of your cheeks and the kids and send it to a lab.
Graywolf2 is offline  
 
post #4 of 224 (permalink) Old 02-10-2017, 12:25 AM
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2016
Posts: 4,262
Re: Any way back from 2nd EA?

Quote:
Originally Posted by cjadek View Post
While my now wife were dating 15 years ago she took a job at a company and struck up a friendship with one of the executives who was many years older, she told me how much of a nice man he was. I didn't think much of it at the time. Around the time of our wedding 4 years later he helped her get a part time job and I knew she had met him for lunch. At this stage I still didn't think anything of it. It wasn't until our 2nd child was born some 7 years later and my parents were visiting from my home country and we gave them my wifes old mobile phone to use while they were with staying with us. I was showing my Father how to use the phone when I started to delete some of the text messages to free up some space it was then I started reading some of the texts from this man who she had struck up the friendship with.
It was clear from the text's that this man was madly in love with my wife saying things like 'You're the love of my life and I love you so much' she never told him she loved him but would sign off with things like "lots of love and hugs xxx" but never made an effort to repal these outbursts of undying love.
I confronted her about this and she broke down begged me not to leave her and promised me on our childrens life that she would never have any contact with this man again and it was only ever a friendship and that it wasn't a PA. I took her word for that.
Fast forward 6 years and we now have 3 children and have moved back to the country of my birth. I was on our family laptop doing some work and I accidently click on her work gmail account instead of my gmail account to find an unread email sitting right there from the same man. I can't describe how I felt, I nearly vomitted into my mouth it was like deja-vu.
I read through every email and the theme was the same as before, her confiding how she was feeling (nothing about our relationship) about things etc, him persistently declaring his undying love for her and how he had been sad since the day we moved countries. It also showed that the 2 of them had chatted at least once on the phone but she had tried to call him at least 3 or 4 times. She initially said she turned to him when she was home sick and feeling down but I was suspicious as to how he knew that we'd moved countries if this was the first communication since she promised to cut all ties.
I confronted her about it and told her I was leaving her. She again broke down and told me he meant nothing more than a good friend and she was flattered that he felt so strongly about her and how he just listened to her and understood her problems. I asked how he knew we had moved countries and she come up with some lame reasosn. She denied this several times over the course of the next month but finally admitted that she had been in email contact before we left and had met him for lunch one time before we left.
I'm trying really hard to believe her that it was never a PA and she loves me and our kids more than anything. But something in my gut just can't trust her, there has to more.
She has never volunteered anything about the EA and only told me the truth once I'd already found out more about the extend of the deception. We are now receiving marriage counselling but I just don't know if I can ever trust her again. I was able to forgive the first EA but the second I'm not so sure. How can I trust her that she is telling the truth and not holding anything else back? I'm 99% sure it's never progressed to a PA but that 1% is eating me from the inside and I'm sure there is more I haven't been able to find out and she's not telling me for fear of my walking away.
Is there anyway back from this even though we love each other and have 3 children. I feel so hurt and betrayed.
Have you told his wife yet? Why not. How many men do you know that would keep a 15 year EA, without the possibility of sex? You would be stupid to trust her again, because she is not trust worthy. You should never trust her again, this is only logical. Only you can decided if you can live with that. Looks like she loves you for your financial stability but gets off on his emotional neediness. There is no way back to your old marriage, the truth is she has basically been in two relationships since before you were married. There has never been a point in your 15 years where she was completely committed to you, or at least treated you with the respect a wife is supposed to treat a husband. Even when she knew the consequences.

You must accept the fact that there is something wrong with her, she probably doesn't have it in her to be faithful and honest. This is harsh and it pains me to say it but I would DNA test my kids. I would also make sure she knows you are doing it. She needs to see some real consequences from her actions at the very least. You have no idea what is true here, no one would. Your wife's behavior is irrational and disconcerting.

Look man she showed you who she was years ago a you chose to go with your heart. How did that work out for you?

By the way the question you should be asking is not "is there a way?", but "is it in your best interest?"
sokillme is online now  
post #5 of 224 (permalink) Old 02-10-2017, 01:23 AM
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2016
Posts: 2,046
Re: Any way back from 2nd EA?

She didn't have a second emotional affair,she had one that lasted fifteen years.You would be very foolish to believe that nothing physical happened in fifteen years,can you account for every minute of that time,of course not.She has shown you that your ultimatums or opinions do not matter to her so she needs to face some consequences.Dna the kids as previous posters have said,tell his wife immediately and contact a lawyer. Make sure she knows you have done all this AFTER you have done it otherwise she will warn the om and he will feed his wife some story,but make sure she knows exactly what you have done.Also try and save as many of their messages as you can,on the cloud for security.I would also ask her to move out for a while but under no circumstances are you to leave the marital home,she could cite abandonment.
Andy1001 is offline  
post #6 of 224 (permalink) Old 02-10-2017, 03:06 AM Thread Starter
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 54
Re: Any way back from 2nd EA?

Firstly thanks for all your replies.
Our first 2 kids are IVF so they are mine. I broke down with her one night and ask if the 3rd was mine. She nearly vomited at the suggestion and the look on her face told me all I needed to know (not that I seriously believe that she isn't but the thought crossed my mind).
I told her tonight that I'm going to reveal the EA to the OM's W and she hit the roof, water works etc. Then told me to that either I trust what she is telling or we should separate.

I'm thinking of asking her to do a Poly any advice on how to approach this. Could that be the answer to my not fully trusting her?

I am being quite irrational atm, one minute all over her showering her with love trying to move on the next minute I'm sad and reclusive. This behavior leaves her not knowing where I'm at (to be honest I don't know either). I feel it's jeopardizing any chance of a reconciliation. We have 3 kids and W is from the other side of the world, part of me fears a separation will mean her returning to her home with the children.
cjadek is offline  
post #7 of 224 (permalink) Old 02-10-2017, 03:43 AM
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: UK
Posts: 1,874
Re: Any way back from 2nd EA?

It does sound as if its been going on continually for 15 years. Only they know if it went further, but her saying 'love and hugs' may show that there was some physical contact at least.
Interesting that your first 2 children were ivf but not the third? Trouble is if she isnt yours what will you do? It may well cause the child to be hurt.
The fact that your wife looked devastated when you asked her about the child means nothing. She would look devastated if she suspected the child isn't yours.

Its hard to know what to advise. Could you trust her again after so many years of lying and deception? Will she ever stop this EA or will it just go underground?
I do think its advisable to tell the OM's wife, and if he spins her some story then you have the proof in the emails. Poor woman, being with a man who for many years has declared undying live for another. At least it should stop the EA, although his wife may throw him out.

I dont think you should be showering her with love, I would stay consistently cool, polite and distant for now. Her getting angry and emotional when you say you were going to tell the OM's wife is appalling. This has been going on for 15 years, with her claiming it had stopped 7 years ago. Of course you cant trust her.What does she expect?Only a fool would trust someone who has lied and deceived for over 15 years. She isnt showing any repentance or understanding of what she has done to you, or of the fact that the trust is shattered.

Last edited by Diana7; 02-10-2017 at 06:28 AM.
Diana7 is offline  
post #8 of 224 (permalink) Old 02-10-2017, 04:20 AM
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 1,884
Re: Any way back from 2nd EA?

This lie has been going on for 15 years? Is there any way back? Only if you shut off all feelings and emotions. I mean, if you can live with someone who has disrespected you and your marriage for 15 years and didn't stop when caught and never really seemed to care to...well, I guess good for you.
Herschel is offline  
post #9 of 224 (permalink) Old 02-10-2017, 04:37 AM
Member
 
manfromlamancha's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 2,429
Re: Any way back from 2nd EA?

This has never stopped - that much is clear. Also, as others are saying, there is a very, very high percentage that this went physical. She has had over 15 years of opportunity.

Her reaction to telling his wife should tell you volumes of what you need to know. She is defending her lover and protecting him. Absolutely you should tell the OMW. For many reasons - shed light on the affair, it is the moral and right thing to do (for the OMW), to draw him out and expose hims to your wife so that she can see what kind of man he really is (based on how he handles the exposure).

Are you and your wife from the same country ? Is the OM from the same country too ? Would you mind saying what country that is ?

If she gave you the ultimatum "trust me or we separate", your reply should have been "neither - there is a third and most probable option - we divorce, not separate!" She should be in no position to be giving ultimatums.

Destroy the other b@st@rd through exposure to his wife and also the company that they met at (if he is still there). Do not accept any more lies from your "wife". Have your 3rd child DNA tested even if it is just for effect to show your wife what you think of her. Be prepared for plenty of trickle truth so plant some VARs, go into snoop mode on her phone and computer etc. and never reveal your source of any info.

You have to be ready to really let her go in order to come out the other side in tact. At the moment she is not showing any remorse (she is just sorry that she is caught). And it appears that she will never come clean on her own (she will just admit to whatever you have discovered).

This is not a 2nd EA but one long PA. One that has lasted longer than your marriage has (think about that - I wonder who she thinks of as the OM in this relationship).

For your own well being, don't rug-sweep, hide your head in the sand etc as you have been doing since the start. And besides going into surveillance mode (snooping), you should also secure your assets and finances as well as your custodial rights (get an attorney asap). And start the 180.

This is my quest, to follow that star
No matter how hopeless, no matter how far
To fight for the right, without question or pause
To be willing to march into Hell, for a Heavenly cause
manfromlamancha is offline  
post #10 of 224 (permalink) Old 02-10-2017, 04:41 AM
Member
 
dianaelaine59's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Posts: 117
Re: Any way back from 2nd EA?

Ugh! You told her you were going to tell the OM's wife??? NOT a good idea!


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

dianaelaine59 is offline  
post #11 of 224 (permalink) Old 02-10-2017, 05:11 AM
Forum Supporter
 
arbitrator's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Central Texas/Brazos Valley
Posts: 11,669
Cool Re: Any way back from 2nd EA?

As the old saying goes, "Fool me once, shame on you! Fool me twice, shame on me!"

You have effectively let 15 years of the deception and "trickle-truthing" water flow, almost totally unchecked beneath the bridge!

Think about it! There is not a snowball's chance in hell, that over the span of those 15 years, that the pair of them weren't exactly smart enough to find themselves some cloistered, out-of-the-way place to keep their little covert PA perpetuated! And if you happen to somehow disagree, then the good, profitable business folks out in Las Vegas would absolutely love to quote you some rather interesting odds!

In essence, it's well past time to do "the 180," schedule an appointment with a good "piranha" family attorney to advise you of both your property and custodial rights! And since they both work for the same firm, what is wrong with reporting these findings to their HR Department? Companies nowadays take an extremely dim view of worker sexual fraternization, both on and off of the premises, more especially with the company being used as largely a staging ground for it!

There's an infidelity iceberg that is sticking up out of the water where you can only see some 10-15% of it!

What you don't see is the other 85-90%!
Be wary!

"To love another person is to see the face of God!" - Jean Valjean from Les Miserables

My Story!
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Last edited by arbitrator; 02-10-2017 at 07:07 AM. Reason: Edification
arbitrator is offline  
post #12 of 224 (permalink) Old 02-10-2017, 06:01 AM
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Posts: 256
Re: Any way back from 2nd EA?

Quote:
Originally Posted by cjadek View Post
Is there anyway back from this even though we love each other and have 3 children.
Back to what? This guy was basically in your relationship the whole time since she met him while you where dating and then throughout your marriage. You want back to that?

There never was relationship of just you and your W. You would have to make something new from scratch. Regardless if there was something physical (and it's unlikely that there never has been any sexual contact) she used him for support, to vent etc. All this was never part of the relationship between the two of you, just between her and him. I highly doubt that she will be able to change herself and these dynamics after all this time. The marriage you thought you had was just a facade for a threeway relationship with you out of the loop. Basically your relationship only "worked" as it was with him in the picture.

P.S.
Swearing on your children's life, getting sick at the thought of your kid being his etc...that's all BS you can't take seriously, especially under these circumstances. Millions of kids would be dead by now for everyone that lied and swore on their kids' life. The same goes for getting sick. Could be the truth, could be guilt, could be that she does not know, could be the realization that it could be possible...who knows. Because you can't trust her, her every reaction and statement on this matter is questionable without evidence.

Why did you have to resort to IVF? Was the problem on your end or hers?

P.P.S
Her "trust me or leave me" is just blackmail, and shows no sign of you being the love of her life. Regarding the kids and your W taking them abroad you should consult an attorney what you could do about that. First thing I would do is store their passports at a safe place (bank safe, parents etc.) just in case.

Last edited by rzmpf; 02-10-2017 at 06:08 AM.
rzmpf is offline  
post #13 of 224 (permalink) Old 02-10-2017, 06:22 AM
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: UK
Posts: 1,874
Re: Any way back from 2nd EA?

In the uk a parent cant legally take the children away to live in another country without the other parents permission. As the above poster said, put their passports in a safe place where she will never find them to make sure she doesn't run off with them. Get some good legal advise.
Diana7 is offline  
post #14 of 224 (permalink) Old 02-10-2017, 06:42 AM
Member
 
alexm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 2,834
Re: Any way back from 2nd EA?

I'm going to go in a slightly different direction as the others here have gone. Not saying I'm right, just a different POV.

I think your wife has a certain loyalty to this man, for starters. He got her a job, and likely helped her in her previous career (where they met). She obviously liked him then (though not necessarily liked him) and he's clearly shown her a certain level of admiration.

And that's something that's difficult to reject, especially after so long. That doesn't mean AT ALL that she shouldn't, for your sake, of course, but it's clearly not something she wants to consider.

I don't think she's IN love with him. I do think she loves him, but not romantically. For starters, 15 years is a long time, and it's highly likely that she's never seen anything but the 'good' side of him.

It's also highly likely she doesn't see the forest for the trees. They guy is in love with her, clearly, and while she probably knows this, she also doesn't quite see what he's doing - and that's playing the long game. I'd be surprised if she hasn't, at some point over the years, assumed she's made it clear he's not an option. She's married, he knows this. She has kids, he knows this. She doesn't even live in the same country any more.

From her POV, she feels that this is safe, IMO, and that she can continue to talk with him, confide in him, etc. just like friends do, because, in her mind, nothing will ever happen between them.

That doesn't make any of it okay, but I don't get the impression she feels she's carrying on an affair, let alone an EA, despite her trying to keep it somewhat underground.

If I were in OP's shoes, I wouldn't be making accusations or even getting visibly upset. I'd be sitting down and talking to her about the optics of this, and how it impacts our marriage. How it's not okay to accept other people showing romantic love, regardless of whether you feel the same or not.

And that's what I think this is - he's in love with her, she loves him as a trusted (and old) friend, who she feels some sort of loyalty towards. They're each getting totally different things out of this, and the distance between them allows her to feel safe about her choice to continue with him in this manner.

But the underlying issue, to me, is that she doesn't see this for what it really is, or how the OP sees it. It's an EA, to be sure, but not necessarily a romantic one for her. As OP said, the messages he's come across seem to be rather one-sided on OM's part, with nothing more than non-romantic affection returned by his wife. No mention of anything sexual, either. And no mention of whether she tells this guy how unhappy she is, or otherwise negative comments about her marriage or OP in general. From the sounds of it, she speaks to him like she'd speak to any other friend.

That said - it's not okay, of course, and it should stop.

*ETA - this reminded me of a girl I knew back in high school. I had been dating another girl for well over a year at that point, and this girl had a thing for me. It was clear and obvious, and my girlfriend was not comfortable with it. From my POV, which I remember clearly, I saw no problem with it all - because I had zero interest in this other girl. She wasn't a side-chick or a back up plan to me, she was just a girl that happened to like me, which was not MY problem. Because she hung around in the same circles as I did, it wasn't as simple as never speaking to her, let alone seeing her. Besides, I liked her, but as nothing more than a friend. Basically, I didn't think twice about it, especially in regards to my girlfriend. She was no threat TO ME, but she definitely was to her. I didn't get that at the time.

Then one night, she tried to kiss me. I (obviously) never once said anything or did anything with this girl that she may have construed as interest in her - or so I thought. In hindsight, not saying "no, not interested" CAN be construed as her maybe, possibly having a chance, especially if I were to find myself single. She didn't wait until I was single. Lesson learned.

This is kind of how I feel about this situation. Again, I may be wrong, but this is what I'm seeing from what OP has so far posted. Apart from his wife simply speaking to this man, it doesn't appear that she's actually said anything romantic or sexual or otherwise indicating those kinds of feelings towards him.

What I don't think she's seeing is that the relationship she has with him is FAR different than the one he has with her.

"Every time I read your posts about your wife I want to swallow strychnine."

Last edited by alexm; 02-10-2017 at 07:15 AM.
alexm is offline  
post #15 of 224 (permalink) Old 02-10-2017, 06:43 AM
Member
 
VladDracul's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: Southeast USA
Posts: 998
Re: Any way back from 2nd EA?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Andy1001 View Post
You would be very foolish to believe that nothing physical happened in fifteen years,
I don't know Andy, I've known men to stay married for fifteen years where next to nothing has physically happened.

Regrading her getting pissed off when CJ said he was going to tell the other cats wife does not, in and of itself, indicate anything physical happened. (but bear in mind what I've said about when a man and a woman are friends, one or both are thinking about sex) If most guy's wives would falsely accuse them of banging the neighbor's wife and threatening to tell the husband, they'd go ballistic to. When accused, an innocent person will typically give you a unequivocal, no frills, flat out, and often angry denial. Beating around the bush, swearing on their mother's grave, weak and mumbling denials, avoiding outright denials, denial via reasons why they couldn't have done it, are signs that something may be rotten in Denmark. I'm more impressed that a person is innocent when they fly in your face like a bantam rooster when they are accused.

If you don't embody controversy, what you say will become just another part of the media driven culture of stifling thought and debate about issues.
VladDracul is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on Talk About Marriage, you must first register. Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

Important! Your username will be visible to the public next to anything you post and could show up in search engines like Google. If you are concerned about anonymity, PLEASE choose a username that will not be recognizable to anyone you know.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in









Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



Thread Tools Search this Thread
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome