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post #76 of 598 (permalink) Old 03-01-2017, 04:38 PM
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Re: Not sure what to do - Positive HPV test

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My wife was my first kiss at 17. She had kissed two boyfriends prior to me but no other sexual contact. She told me once that in fourth grade, she and some of her friends (female) experimented with some stuff but that's pretty much it. Neither of us were molested that we know of... we spent a couple of hours last night talking about any possible scenarios that could have lead to this. Nothing of a sexual nature comes up.

To clarify slightly something I stated above, I have absolutely no reason to think that she would have been unfaithful to me recently (past 8 years). There were suspicions from the 5 or 6 years prior to that which were based primarily on my own insecurities but there were some legitimate questionable situations. I'm not referring to an emotional affair or anything of that type but rather situations that gave rise to concerns. Examples: Finding a door locked when she was having a private conversation with a male friend when I wasn't supposed to be home; Physical training sessions with a male trainer in a private location; etc... I didn't keep a log but for the most part they were things that, by the light of today sound like a jealous, paranoid husband talking but at the time, and during a 6 month period of significant marriage issues and no physical relations, fed my suspicions and insecurity. I trust my wife, I trust when she tells me that nothing happened. We talked through those issues and emerged with a stronger, more secure marriage. But I look back at those times and I wonder, would I even blame her if she slipped all those years ago... would she even tell me, knowing what it would do to our marriage and our family.
Why did she need to lock the door if you weren't home? Why did she need to lock the door at all?

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post #77 of 598 (permalink) Old 03-01-2017, 04:45 PM
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Re: Not sure what to do - Positive HPV test

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that did occur to me but I did not mention it at the time.
I think we will wait until the retest comes back at least.
That was a smart way to phrase it.

Really, at this point, there is little to do that you are not already doing unless the second test comes back positive.

"Our ability to feel joy is directly related to how much pain we are willing to feel." - Mavash.

"The truth is, everyone is going to hurt you. You just got to find the ones worth suffering for." - Bob Marley
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post #78 of 598 (permalink) Old 03-01-2017, 04:45 PM
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Re: Not sure what to do - Positive HPV test

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Your wife admitted that she had intimate sexual contact with her friends when they were adolescents acting out a scene they saw in a movie. If any of those girls were sexually active willingly or were sexually abused, she could have gotten HPV from one of them. The virus can lay dormant for many years and detection has vastly improved in recent years, so it's entirely possible she just never tested positive before now.

It's also possible that she fooled around a bit, without full on sex, before you married and kept it secret.

Also, not all doctors give all patients HPV screening when doing a routine pap or routine "just in case" STD testing. At some offices, the patient has to specifically request HPV testing or show symptoms of HPV or a related disease. Your wife has had more than one abnormal pap, we now understand the link between certain HPV strains and cancer, so she was a candidate for an HPV test. It's entirely possible she wasn't given an HPV test before those wonky pap's.

And, lastly, somewhere around a decade or so ago you were having marital problems and your wife was showing some serious boundary issues with other men. That's about how long HPV could lay dormant. So, yeah, it's also possible your wife either had sex or some kind of sexual contact with another man. I know it's not something you want to believe is possible, but it is. As has been mentioned before, many a spouse has come here and to my other relationship forum certain their beloved could never...until the evidence became overwhelming.

It's not uncommon for people who married as virgins to wonder what sex is like with someone else. Some, maybe even many, give in to that curiosity. It's gotten to the point, reading so many "we've only ever been with each other and s/he cheated!" stories that I actually consider virgin marriages to be a caution flag for possible infidelity at some point between vows and death.

Plenty of those who espouse family values and are committed to their marriages lasting until one or the other dies have cheated. They know they won't leave, think they'll never get caught and, therefore, the marriage was never in any danger.

Not to mention, if I knew I married a virgin as a virgin, knew I didn't cheat, and tested positive for an STD...well, my reaction would be legendary. Frankly, I think her NOT freaking out on you is a bit suspicious.

I suggest a polygraph. For both of you. If neither has ever cheated or hidden pre-relationship sexual touching, you'll both be put at ease. If she cheated or hid pre-relationship sexual contact from you, then you'll know and be able to work from there.

* I started this post more than an hour ago, but got distracted making lunch, prepping dinner, cleaning up the kitchen, and getting the dogs their potty breaks. If others have made the same suggestions or more info has been posted...umm.. *blush*
YOu said 'I actually consider virgin marriages to be a caution flag for possible infidelity at some point between vows and death.'

Its been shown that those who have had many partners before marriage are MORE likely to cheat than those who waited for marriage.
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post #79 of 598 (permalink) Old 03-01-2017, 04:49 PM
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Re: Not sure what to do - Positive HPV test

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We have never been separated except for long work trips back in those days.
After long discussions with that situation as one of the topics, I believe that she was not aware it was locked and was surprised when it was found so.
So she was inside a locked room and didnt know that it was locked? Really???
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post #80 of 598 (permalink) Old 03-01-2017, 04:52 PM
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Re: Not sure what to do - Positive HPV test

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It was the office... she said they were talking... about nothing in particular.
this is a 14 years ago so some of the details are fuzzy and I wasn't in a listening state of mind.
I saw that he was at the house, i walked in and looked around, no one in the living room or bedroom, found the office door closed, listened briefly, heard murmuring i think and I tried the door and found it locked

I hollered, pounded on the door, kicked it,
They got it unlocked and open before I got it open.

She was embarrassed and upset at my reaction, my 'friend' was laughing at me for overreacting.
My wife and I weren't always talking at the time so she wasn't exactly inclined to give me a lot of details.
"we were just talking, what did you think was going on?"

It lead to another fight, which were having lot in those days... which for us, even in those days, was rarely a high volume exercise. We don't now and never did yell very much... We just have very intense discussions.
You dont lock the door if you are 'just talking,' sorry.
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post #81 of 598 (permalink) Old 03-01-2017, 05:40 PM
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Re: Not sure what to do - Positive HPV test

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post #82 of 598 (permalink) Old 03-01-2017, 06:53 PM
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Re: Not sure what to do - Positive HPV test

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Wasn't your wife dying and your concern was she wasn't dying fast enough? That by the time she did die all the other good pickings women would be married off?

And isn't she terminal now and you "game" your wife? SMH.

Sorry for thread jack.
I am not saying I am mentally healthy brother, just the opposite, even I am struggling with what I want. Here is what I do know, my moral compass says, the wife should come home and die with her family around her, if that is what is to happen. Not her asshgole father and brother who have spent a total of like 80 days with her in 25 yrs.

Just saying, I can talk about how my marriage was, prior to her brother and father paying someone who was here helping care for her to drug her so she would leave. Really, please, I am full of contraindications. Here is my bottom line

I am choosing to forgive some very egregious things.

I can still talk to people about WHY there marriages are failing and much of it is outright betaness,

Women hate weakness, despise it, nothing will make a woman rn faster into the arms of another man then someone shes sees as weak and beneath her.
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post #83 of 598 (permalink) Old 03-01-2017, 07:00 PM
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Not sure what to do - Positive HPV test

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post #84 of 598 (permalink) Old 03-01-2017, 07:20 PM
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Re: Not sure what to do - Positive HPV test

FTR, sorry you're here.

Once there is a question about trust, it is extremely difficult to regain it. It is what it is. So the first thing is to not panic. Wait to see what the retest shows. I know very little about HPV, so maybe these comments are silly, but, I would look into what is known about accidental infection via unclean dr office equipment. Also, somebody mentioned the 10 yr incubation before it tends to show up. I'd look into that as well. And, are there different types of tests which could be done, perhaps by a different lab too? If your wife was exposed to a different virus which this test may be giving a false positive on, maybe there is a different test which would not be triggered into a false positive.

I think once you get confirmation that there really is a positive on the HPV, you have some choices. One is to rug sweep. Just accept that she either cheated or didn't. Or she may have had more sexual contact with other men before you than she has admitted to. If you can happily live with those things, just shrug and accept that something along those lines is what happened and it doesn't matter what the details are.

You brought up a few incidents in the past which bothered you. And that is what bothers me. Your gut is your best early warning system! You should trust your gut. Now I completely understand the whole questioning your own judgment looking back at something that happened many years ago. Here's the thing, when you have all the correct information (or enough of it) the pieces come together into a clear picture. You don't have the information, and you cannot get it except one way. That one way is a polygraph. I am not much of a fan of polygraphs in your situation unless it becomes a true last resort for you to be able to cope with the marriage. It could be enough of a problem for her that it seriously damages her ability to be in the marriage. Now I also don't recommend sticking your head in the sand rather than try to get the real dope. So I suggest that now is not the time to decide on a polygraph, and I would keep it as a possible course of action somewhere off in the future when all other avenues are explored.

When she gets the new results, I suggest you verify it. See the report itself, or go with her to the doc's office. This way you can be sure it is true if she says it came back negative.

My understanding is that for men they can only diagnose HPV by taking skin samples from a wart. And, in men HPV tends to either disappear or go dormant after a while. If you haven't had any warts, you may or may not have been infected. If you do get any wart like growths, you could have them sampled.

Let's all hope this second test is a definitive negative.
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post #85 of 598 (permalink) Old 03-01-2017, 07:42 PM
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Re: Not sure what to do - Positive HPV test

My inclination would be to wait until you know for sure she is indeed positive for HPV. Don't blow up your marriage over a potentially false test. Right now, your wife needs your support more than ever. She is scared and confused. Stop with the 20 questions game and just support her for now.

If the retest comes back positive, be there for her again. This will be hard for her. Gather all of the information you can and arm yourself with positive ways to be there for her. Your wife could be facing cancer. That's no small situation and you need to be her support.

You have some reasons for concern, but you have nothing conclusive. Unless your wife suddenly changes her story, your only options are to do a polygraph, or seek out the douche ex friend and the trainer and try to get some info from them.

Personally, I would trust my wife until I have conclusive proof that she is lying. The STD could have come from her playing around in 4th grade or there may be other possibilities. Right now, just hold tight and support your wife.

Oh yeah, I almost forgot... I do not see you as a Beta male in any way, shape, or form. Handle this as you want to. Don't be swayed by some of the "divorce her" crowd.


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post #86 of 598 (permalink) Old 03-01-2017, 07:52 PM
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Re: Not sure what to do - Positive HPV test

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I appreciate the detailed response. One thing you highlighted is probably the primary reason I'm here. She didn't freak out... I mean she was upset and crying but that was also caused by the possibility of cancer. I told her I was faithful, I explained, as I have in the past, the precautions I take to remain so... and she looked into my eyes and accepted that. That could mean any number of things I guess... but that's probably why I kept thinking about it.
I told her I was faithful. Did you ask the question from her?
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post #87 of 598 (permalink) Old 03-01-2017, 08:03 PM
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Re: Not sure what to do - Positive HPV test

You both need to get polygraphs.
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post #88 of 598 (permalink) Old 03-01-2017, 08:26 PM
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Re: Not sure what to do - Positive HPV test

You've been 'exclusive' for 29 years, right? I am no doctor, but that would have to be a record for dormancy of a viral infection?? Trust your gut.
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post #89 of 598 (permalink) Old 03-01-2017, 09:24 PM
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Re: Not sure what to do - Positive HPV test

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My wife is very outgoing and friendly and some guys can mistake that for interest. In some ways, despite her intelligence, she is very naive and she simply doesn't consider the way things are perceived. I attribute her actions during that period to naivete, rather than intent.
Man, DaNile ain't just a river in Egypt, is it?

Keep making ridiculous assumptions about how innocent and Godlike your wife is and you'll continue to find nasty little surprises like this HPV scare that proves otherwise.

Hold off on that Sainthood ceremony you're planning for her. Maybe it will open your eyes.
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post #90 of 598 (permalink) Old 03-01-2017, 09:35 PM
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Re: Not sure what to do - Positive HPV test

Just a quick look at some web medical sites indicates both strains of HPV found in the test are considered "Low Risk", meaning they rarely lead to cancers. Some other strains are high risk, and docs will suggest frequent pap smears to monitor in case a cancer occurs.

Furthermore, these sources indicate that the low risk HPV infections (maybe the high risk, too, but I didn't look at those) frequently cure themselves in about 2 years.

Anything is possible, and I hope the follow up tests come back negative. If they come back positive, if it were me I would need to get some answers on a number of fronts.

One consideration alluded to but not stated overtly in this thread yet is this could be some kind of innocent infection but your wife is worried that you cheated. So I think it is perhaps correct to contemplate both of you getting polygraphs. If you get to the point of discussing it, you should come here first to get some varied opinions on how to approach it.
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