Originally Posted by Relationship Teacher View Post
Extremely few narcissists exist. Overgeneralizing in this fashion is a fundamental attribution error, compounding (not solving) problems. According to the DSM-V, 0 to 6.2 percent of the population are narcissistic (NPD) (p.645, DSM-V). Compare that to the rates of cheating...... non-sequitur.
And this would be why I said "one of the two spouses is N or shows narcissistic tendencies
." But rather than engage in "I'll show you my links and research and you'll show me yours," let's just say this: diagnosed NPD is very low, partly because no true Narcissist would go to a p-doc--they don't think they need therapy! LOL But even getting beyond that, true NPD is very, very different from narcissistic tendencies
, and tendencies are very, very different from healthy self awareness and self love.
I do not think that every disloyal spouse is diagnosable NPD--that would be foolishness. But I do think most disloyals do cross the line of healthy self-interest into unhealthy self-centeredness no matter the cost to others, and very often (not always) even cross into tendencies and behaviors that could be on the N spectrum.
This confuses the fact that the unfaithful could be the co-dependent one. Think about attachment theory. The main thing one needs to understand about NPD is the self-absorption and grandiosity.
How is the relevant to @sokillme
's posting of the article about co-dependency? The article about the book was suggesting that maybe co-dependent people are like magnets for N-spectrum people, and that's why those relationships tear apart. The second link talked about the fact that even if co-dependent people do attract N-spectrum people, that doesn't relieve them of their duty to protect their children. So I commented to those links. The book link didn't really tell me much, but the second one was much clearer, AND I agree with it.
I think a vast majority of the problems today with most relationships (marriage, and parent-child) are that people are not willing to be PERSONALLY RESPONSIBLE. They want to blame someone else for what they chose to do, and they want to experience no consequences for their choices.
And yep--either partner "could" be the N-spectrum partner. We can all fairly easily see self-centered grandiosity in waywards--they are "above the law" and shouldn't have to endure consequences! But it can
be the other way around--maybe the betrayed as a narcissistic all along and was an ass behind closed doors. It's possible.
I'm not sure what you are saying about how attachment theory relates to the theory of co-dependents attracting narcissists, but rather than guess, I will allow you to explain your idea.
Someone that "lacks empathy" is not a narcissist. There are 9 diagnostic criteria to evaluate for NPD. Empathy can erode for many reasons outside of narcissism. It is human to tend to disregard others that we don't really care for. This occurs in and outside of romantic relationships. Additionally, those that do harm DO use empathy (often) to add poison to their swords. Empathy is an understanding of another's emotional plight; it does not involve feeling for another. Some affairs are characteristic of a partner trying to level the power balance by finding an affair partner. This is a manipulative use of pain to create future balance.
Okay who's talking about empathy? The articles are about the possibility that maybe co-dependent people attract narcissists like a magnet. I commented that cheaters were the partner that TENDED toward N-spectrum or were more often the self-absorbed, grandiose partner, and that the betrayed TENDED to more often be the co-dependent partner. Not always.
But the lesson isn't a mathematical prediction of who's N-spectrum, who's co-dependent, and who's to blame for infidelity. You want to know who's responsible for infidelity? The person who chooses to be unfaithful!! The whole topic of this thread (I think) is that we are responsible for ourselves and defending our children! Now if you got a different message, how about if we discuss the article?
Reconciliation (post-affair) occurs for the majority of relationships.
The vast majority are unwilling to admit they were wrong? I would love to see what supports your claim.
How many disloyal spouses do you see on this forum who unequivocally admit they were wrong, and it was not "something their spouse made them do"? How may loyal spouses do you see on this forum who admit they were wrong in the way they acted in their marriage pre-affair (and just to clarify, not that the adultery was in any way something that "made" their spouse cheat, but it is something that might have to be considered to become a better spouse for the future...whoever they are with)? It is very rare for either
spouse to look at themselves--human nature wants to defend yourself and blame someone else.
If you know of spouses committing adultery who immediately accept personal responsibility and do not blame their spouse, good for you!