How does the sand taste bremik? I told you so..... - Page 9 - Talk About Marriage
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post #121 of 480 (permalink) Old 04-04-2017, 08:14 AM Thread Starter
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Re: How does the sand taste bremik? I told you so.....

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Originally Posted by Rubix Cubed View Post
You have mentioned this a couple of times. The answer is that you have ZERO blame for her cheating on you. If things were so bad she should have divorced you and pursued J, but she didn't. You may carry responsibility for marital problems , but the cheating is 100% on her.You also mentioned you can't recognize any problems you may have caused but guessed at a few. Maybe you're not to blame. Maybe your wife is a self centered cheater who cares only for herself. I doubt the Nice guy that you are has considered that. You need to stop making excuses, and justifying your misery and follow @eric1 's advice to a tee. Filing for divorce does not mean you have to follow through with it , butif you deem it fit you can. The farm and all the other stuff will sort when the time comes. you can either be miserable plan B while your wife has a boyfriend or you can get yourself out of infidelity and go from there. The choice is obvious to us as well as you.Then you can work on making yourself a better you to assure yourself that you are not part of the problem in the future ,be it with your wife or any future relationships.
You and eric1 do a great job of staying focused! Awesome, thanks!

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post #122 of 480 (permalink) Old 04-04-2017, 08:25 AM Thread Starter
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Re: How does the sand taste bremik? I told you so.....

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@bremik,

I took a look at your past posts, all the way back to 2009, and I want to address a couple things.

First, I do not tell people to divorce lightly. I'm very pro-marriage and believe people should do everything they can to save the marriage and family. That doesn't always mean the marriage survives--but it does mean you can hold your head up high because you did everything you could!

Second, I grew up on a farm, so I do understand how that whole cycle works unlike some folks who just haven't lived that life, so no need to explain that to me. I think that makes talking a whole lot easier, don't you?

Okay, so here's the way I see it--tell me if you notice anything I got incorrect. Way back in 2009 (eight years ago), you signed up for this forum and you wrote that you just had this gut feeling that your wife was way too chatty with this fella, Jay, who was her old interest back in the day...like college, pre-you. Now she did MARRY you and life seemed okay, but at some point she took a job in the same company Jay and his buddy work for--way different departments and all, but same company--and that was the door he used to start things up again. At first, they texted, and you didn't see a smoking gun that she was cheating, so you asked her to stop and she said you were jealous and/or controlling etc.

Then you caught her at it again, and she said she was sorry but didn't stop. Then you caught her deleting texts, and caught her at it again and again, and a couple more times where she promised to stop but didn't. NOW--eight years later--she forgot her phone and you had a chance to look at it, and really she's been talking to this Jay fella all along, despite crying crocodile tears and telling you it was nothing and promising to stop, etc. They've been hiding it on a chat program, and she made his name be the name of his farm so you wouldn't be suspicious.

And in your head you can't decide if it is an affair or not, and is it worth blowing up your world over or not, and you're afraid if you lose her income your farm will go bankrupt, etc.
Is that about it??
______________________

Here's the thing: how do you define infidelity? unfaithfulness? adultery?

My definition is "Giving any affection, loyalty or companionship to any other person than me." (Disclaimer--I mean adult romantic love, not parent-child or siblings-family kind of love.) See, my Dear Hubby made a promise to me during our wedding that he would FORSAKE ALL OTHERS for me only, and that he would give 100% of his affection, 100% of his loyalty, and 100% of his companionship to me. So if he were to give some affection to another person (male or female), he would be giving away to them something that BELONGED TO ME. It's not his to give!

And if he gave some small bit of loyalty to some other person (male or female) above me, then he would be giving away to them something that was MINE! And finally if he preferred the companionship of some other person (male or female) over me and was giving them his "time" and "fun", then he would be taking from me something that he promised to only me!

So my definition of infidelity is being affectionate with someone other than your spouse--being loyal to someone other than your spouse--and preferring the companionship of someone else other than your spouse.

Again--I'm talking about the kind of affection where you flirt, and get a thrill out of their attention, and send little hearts or get them little gifts, or give them compliments on their looks...adult romantic affection. And I'm talking about defending someone else or supporting them or having their back rather than being united and completely behind your spouse. And I'm talking about given the choice between spending time with your spouse and spending time with this other person...and you can't wait to spend time with someone else! Right?

So using MY definition--give me 100% or it's unfaithfulness--you tell me? Has your wife been faithful? You tell me. Has she demonstrated to you WITH HER ACTIONS that she has given and is giving ALL OF HER AFFECTION to only you? Has she acted like she can not wait to kiss you or hold your hand or cuddle up with you on the couch? Don't think about her words--think about her ACTIONS for the last eight years.

How about her loyalty? Has she demonstrated to you WITH HER ACTIONS that she is loyal to YOU and that she is standing behind her man? Has she acted like she has your back and would support you and be a united front with you even if she disagreed with you. Is it you and her against the world--or you against her? Don't think about her words--think about her ACTIONS for the last eight years.

Finally let's consider companionship. Has she demonstrated to you WITH HER ACTIONS that she wants to spend time with you--both working and having fun? Does she act like she can't wait to be with you? Does she have fun with you? Does she enjoy your company and invest her time and energy with you? OR does she rush to get to her phone? Does she act like she can't wait to 'get this over with' so she can go back to doing something with someone else--or make excuses why she can't be with you? Does she find being with you boring, hurtful or just icky? Does she dislike your company and invest her time and energy with someone else? Don't think about her words--think about her ACTIONS for the last eight years.

I think you have your answer. You don't really need to get any more of a smoking gun, do you? So what if she did or didn't sleep with some other person?

So really the question isn't, "Did she have an affair?" because in real life you know the answer to that question. NO ONE spends eight years secretly talking/texting/chatting with some other man and not have at least an emotional affair. And she is not investing her affection, loyalty and companionship with YOU.

The REAL issue here is facing reality. You don't want this to be real. You want to think that maybe there's some magical thing you could do or magical thing you could say that would make her drop Jay like a hot potato and love you! You hope that we can give you some advice that will let you keep her income, keep your income, keep your marriage, keep your family and keep your farm.

So here's the choice, @bremik. I believe in your heart you have known for a long time that what I'm saying is true. I am a Christian person, and I do not advocate for "open marriages" or "poly amory" or that sort of thing. But right now you get to choose: do you choose to accept how things have been going now for the past 8 years--or do you choose that the past 8 years are unacceptable and you will not continue. BOTH choices have a cost and a benefit:

Accept how things are going
Cost--You have to share your wife's heart and potentially her body with another man; you have to live in denial and constantly feel a little crazy
Benefit--You can keep your home and children and don't lose her income

'How things are going' is unacceptable
Cost-Lose her income, half the time with the kids, and VERY likely the farm
Benefit--You keep your self-worth because you are not sloppy seconds; you get to live in reality and have peace of mind

I won't kid you--a LOT of people choose to look past their spouse's infidelity in order to continue to live at their current standard of living. A LOT of people wring their hands and say they can't stand it anymore, and then make the decision to do nothing so they can keep their home, cars, property etc. They just don't want to say out loud that they are choosing to consciously pretend the affair didn't happen!

For you, I think the most profitable thing you can do for yourself right now is just get this through your head: FACE THE TRUTH. Your wife has already been unfaithful to you for eight years. If you do not intend to do anything about it, that is your choice: I'd say just admit to yourself out loud that you are choosing to let your wife be unfaithful. On the other hand, if you do not intend to let her continue her adultery, then that would mean that you will need to DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT...and that means that even though it hurts, you will have to live without her income and face possibly losing the farm. (Rather than lose the farm, if you actually love it why don't you show her the door and get a farm hand to help out in exchange for "room and board"? Just an idea! And before you say "Oh I just couldn't...." why not? Seriously?)

So @bremik figure that out first. FACE THE TRUTH. You tell us if you are going to choose to do nothing and accept it...or you are going to do something. If you are going to do nothing, I can't say everyone will agree with you, but at least you'd be honest with yourself and with us! But if you are going to do something, why then we'll talk again.

Let me know.
I feel like I should pay you for that! That was extremely well thought out and hit the nail on the head. In fact it really hit home with me because I have told my wife numerous times that her actions don't match her words. And I think I said on here that even though jay lived states away and SEEMED to be out of the picture I knew that at the very least if any type of contact occurred it would be more of the same. So yes I always knew deep down he wasn't really
gone. Thank you very much!!!
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post #123 of 480 (permalink) Old 04-04-2017, 08:34 AM Thread Starter
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Re: How does the sand taste bremik? I told you so.....

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Originally Posted by GusPolinski View Post
@bremik, what kinds of things did you find in the texts?

Any ILU's?

Any sexting?

Constant, prolonged contact or just an occasional text?

Were they ever -- at least as far as you're aware -- a couple, legimate or otherwise?
Well it's about time Gus- that title was totally directed at you for good advice long ago! No ILU, sexting, and no on couple as far as I know- We were married the whole time she was in college and she wouldn't have known him before then. As far as the recent texting there are April and October texts- the big issue is none of those texts appeared to be the first time they have contacted each other in awhile, she wasn't supposed to have any contact with him by what she told me and by my request and most importantly she has a new unpublished ph number so how did he get it. Also the October texts were around a large dairy event in WI that my wife had been to in the last few years without me and swore she didn't see him yet here was this text trying to find out if she- not we- was coming up so it brings into question whether she had seen him or not in other years.
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post #124 of 480 (permalink) Old 04-04-2017, 08:42 AM
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Re: How does the sand taste bremik? I told you so.....

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Originally Posted by bremik View Post
Also the October texts were around a large dairy event in WI that my wife had been to in the last few years without me and swore she didn't see him yet here was this text trying to find out if she- not we- was coming up so it brings into question whether she had seen him or not in other years.
You already know the answer to this. Sorry.
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post #125 of 480 (permalink) Old 04-04-2017, 08:46 AM Thread Starter
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Re: How does the sand taste bremik? I told you so.....

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Originally Posted by eric1 View Post
I am with Gus here. While it was cheating her going through all of this to maintain a relationship with this loser, the next steps are highly dependent upon what kind of relationship she is having.
This is the guy that she -even though he had male roommates- had spent the night supposedly on his couch because she was too drunk to get home and neither she nor he called to tell me. He was the one always partying with her. He was the one she confided to in college when we had arguments about her staying out late to where he would tell her to ignore me and I had no right. He was the one that everytime we went to WI to a dairy event would get her to go off with him and pals when she was supposed to meet up with me after we had been apart for the day. He was the one who left the- what he thought was a funny- message at 2 am that she should get it on with another co-worker and how lucky that guy was. He was the one that she sat next to on the company trips while wearing what I would have considered one of her sexiest outfits. He was the one that came down on business and when we went out to eat in separate vehicles he asked her if she wanted to ride with him - I was the other driver! Maybe you get the idea by now?
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post #126 of 480 (permalink) Old 04-04-2017, 08:49 AM Thread Starter
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Re: How does the sand taste bremik? I told you so.....

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Forgive me if this has been discussed, but have you consulted a lawyer? Knowledge is power.
No I have not yet
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post #127 of 480 (permalink) Old 04-04-2017, 08:57 AM
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Re: How does the sand taste bremik? I told you so.....

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Originally Posted by bremik View Post
No I have not yet
I urge you to consider just getting a consultation. It is usually free. I realize you are not at that mindset right now and I understand. But I think that at least some of your fears could be put to rest once a lawyer tells you how the financials would pan out. It really wouldn't hurt to just go consult with one.

Eta: seeing a lawyer does not mean you have to do anything further. You can choose to take absolutely no action. The choice is yours. I just think it would behoove you to stop operating from a place of fear and start operating from a place of knowledge, at least.
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post #128 of 480 (permalink) Old 04-04-2017, 09:14 AM
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Re: How does the sand taste bremik? I told you so.....

You have a lot of unknowns. It's not a certainty that this is an affair but it's certainly a betrayal of trust at this point.

You need to get to the bottom of how she and he traded contact information. If she is unwilling to do so then you should proceed as if this was a standard infidelity case and visit a lawyer, expose and the full transparency as a requirement for any hope of reconciliation.

----
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post #129 of 480 (permalink) Old 04-04-2017, 09:18 AM Thread Starter
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Re: How does the sand taste bremik? I told you so.....

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Originally Posted by TRy View Post
You may understand farming, but you saying "NETS the most not makes the most" shows that you do not understand business. If you spend more to run a business than you
you earn from that business, then the business "makes" nothing, and in fact loses money. Currently you have your wife, children, and you, working in a business that loses money, such that what your wife makes is used to not only pay 100% of your living expenses, but is also used to cover the loses of your the farm business. If you got out of the farm business, got a job that actually pays you, not only would part of what your wife earns no longer be used to cover the farm's loses, but you would be able to provide for your own living expenses as well as be able to help your wife in providing for your family, thus giving them a better quality of life. The fact that your wife and children would no longer be wasting their time and energy doing farm work that nets the family nothing, is just an added bonus in improving the entire family's quality of life. The problem with you is, that like with your wife's cheating, you do not take meaningful action when it comes to earning a living. You either learn to run the farm at a real profit that fairly compensates everyone for the assets and labor put into the business, or you sell the farm and find a job that really lets you earn a living. Your wife may be a cheater, but I would not blame your wife if she has lost respect for you for not doing what you need to do in order to best provide for yourself and family. I hate to be so tough on you, but you need to wake up and realize that the status quo is not working, and start do something about it.

With this in mind, get a job, sell the farm, and then confront your wife from a position of strength. Only then will she respect you enough to start to take you seriously. You are a good person. You can make life better for you and your family if that is your focus. Be well.
I am sorry to jack my own thread and go back to this but there have been false assumptions made due to interpreting data the wrong way on this farming issue and also how it has affected my children in a negative way. Try I am not picking on you it is just your thread had about everything that people have referenced when talking about the farm. I have 3 children. The 20 year old will be completing his Associate's Degree in Agriculture Mechanization and systems and already has a job with a local concrete business pouring concrete for various ag projects as well as private and will start out at $25/hr because the owner is so thrilled at my son's ability to think, comprehend, improvise and work hard. He also wants to farm. My 2nd oldest will be graduating HS and is going to college pre-vet with the desire to be a large animal veterinarian and help with the farm. He currently helps milk, is in charge of feeding cows and comes up with his own farm improvement projects. My youngest is 16 and she is actively involved with milking and feeding calves- for that matter they all are involved in the farm. All kids have been A/B honor roll and the senior got inducted into the National Honor Society this year. My 2 youngest just finished in the high top end of FFA and 4 H dairy judging in the state. All children know how to work, improvise, understand the cycle of life and are in high demand by many people in the community due to their work ethic. We don't have dish tv or cable, or video games or a tv half the size of the house. My kids drive vehicles as old as 40 yrs and don't complain. I would put my kids up against anyone's and would ask anyone on here to think twice if you think somehow the life I have given my children has damaged them or held them back. It isn't a martyr complex to be able to look at the BIG PICTURE and realize that I am setting my children up to be the 2nd generation on this farm and they will have those advantages I didn't have- this IS how farming works. And yes I would do this all again because it sure looks to me like they have appreciated what they grew up in, benefited from it and are returning to it. I am proud that my children aren't the stereotypical couch potato video playing overweight kid everyone is obsessed with these days.
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post #130 of 480 (permalink) Old 04-04-2017, 09:20 AM Thread Starter
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Re: How does the sand taste bremik? I told you so.....

Quote:
Originally Posted by lucy999 View Post
I urge you to consider just getting a consultation. It is usually free. I realize you are not at that mindset right now and I understand. But I think that at least some of your fears could be put to rest once a lawyer tells you how the financials would pan out. It really wouldn't hurt to just go consult with one.

Eta: seeing a lawyer does not mean you have to do anything further. You can choose to take absolutely no action. The choice is yours. I just think it would behoove you to stop operating from a place of fear and start operating from a place of knowledge, at least.
Thank you for your input - I WILL do this

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post #131 of 480 (permalink) Old 04-04-2017, 09:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bremik View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by TRy View Post
You may understand farming, but you saying "NETS the most not makes the most" shows that you do not understand business. If you spend more to run a business than you
you earn from that business, then the business "makes" nothing, and in fact loses money. Currently you have your wife, children, and you, working in a business that loses money, such that what your wife makes is used to not only pay 100% of your living expenses, but is also used to cover the loses of your the farm business. If you got out of the farm business, got a job that actually pays you, not only would part of what your wife earns no longer be used to cover the farm's loses, but you would be able to provide for your own living expenses as well as be able to help your wife in providing for your family, thus giving them a better quality of life. The fact that your wife and children would no longer be wasting their time and energy doing farm work that nets the family nothing, is just an added bonus in improving the entire family's quality of life. The problem with you is, that like with your wife's cheating, you do not take meaningful action when it comes to earning a living. You either learn to run the farm at a real profit that fairly compensates everyone for the assets and labor put into the business, or you sell the farm and find a job that really lets you earn a living. Your wife may be a cheater, but I would not blame your wife if she has lost respect for you for not doing what you need to do in order to best provide for yourself and family. I hate to be so tough on you, but you need to wake up and realize that the status quo is not working, and start do something about it.

With this in mind, get a job, sell the farm, and then confront your wife from a position of strength. Only then will she respect you enough to start to take you seriously. You are a good person. You can make life better for you and your family if that is your focus. Be well.
I am sorry to jack my own thread and go back to this but there have been false assumptions made due to interpreting data the wrong way on this farming issue and also how it has affected my children in a negative way. Try I am not picking on you it is just your thread had about everything that people have referenced when talking about the farm. I have 3 children. The 20 year old will be completing his Associate's Degree in Agriculture Mechanization and systems and already has a job with a local concrete business pouring concrete for various ag projects as well as private and will start out at $25/hr because the owner is so thrilled at my son's ability to think, comprehend, improvise and work hard. He also wants to farm. My 2nd oldest will be graduating HS and is going to college pre-vet with the desire to be a large animal veterinarian and help with the farm. He currently helps milk, is in charge of feeding cows and comes up with his own farm improvement projects. My youngest is 16 and she is actively involved with milking and feeding calves- for that matter they all are involved in the farm. All kids have been A/B honor roll and the senior got inducted into the National Honor Society this year. My 2 youngest just finished in the high top end of FFA and 4 H dairy judging in the state. All children know how to work, improvise, understand the cycle of life and are in high demand by many people in the community due to their work ethic. We don't have dish tv or cable, or video games or a tv half the size of the house. My kids drive vehicles as old as 40 yrs and don't complain. I would put my kids up against anyone's and would ask anyone on here to think twice if you think somehow the life I have given my children has damaged them or held them back. It isn't a martyr complex to be able to look at the BIG PICTURE and realize that I am setting my children up to be the 2nd generation on this farm and they will have those advantages I didn't have- this IS how farming works. And yes I would do this all again because it sure looks to me like they have appreciated what they grew up in, benefited from it and are returning to it. I am proud that my children aren't the stereotypical couch potato video playing overweight kid everyone is obsessed with these days.
Tell your kids about their mom's behavior. They are old enough to handle it.
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post #132 of 480 (permalink) Old 04-04-2017, 09:34 AM
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And I also would consider reaching out to Jay and saying something between these 2 extremes:
1 we are trying to work on our marriage and your involvement is not welcome, so please stop all contact with my W
2 if you make contact with my W again, in any form, I will find you and beat your head in with a baseball bat

Last edited by MAJDEATH; 04-05-2017 at 01:11 AM.
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post #133 of 480 (permalink) Old 04-04-2017, 09:38 AM
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Re: How does the sand taste bremik? I told you so.....

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Originally Posted by bremik View Post
This is the guy that she -even though he had male roommates- had spent the night supposedly on his couch because she was too drunk to get home and neither she nor he called to tell me. He was the one always partying with her. He was the one she confided to in college when we had arguments about her staying out late to where he would tell her to ignore me and I had no right. He was the one that everytime we went to WI to a dairy event would get her to go off with him and pals when she was supposed to meet up with me after we had been apart for the day. He was the one who left the- what he thought was a funny- message at 2 am that she should get it on with another co-worker and how lucky that guy was. He was the one that she sat next to on the company trips while wearing what I would have considered one of her sexiest outfits. He was the one that came down on business and when we went out to eat in separate vehicles he asked her if she wanted to ride with him - I was the other driver! Maybe you get the idea by now?
JESUS ... if I'm keeping up correctly and based on the above, this has been 20+ years of disrespect from WW and OM (and yes, if they've been this "chummy" for 20+ years, this is a LTPA ... it just can't be otherwise) and lack of self-respect of OP. She has blatantly rubbed Jay in your face for over 20 years and has chosen him over you, seemingly every time. If I'm correct, then I'm backing out of this one as this is just too much dysfunction for a anonymous infidelity forum to adequately address. You need professional help ... I'd start with an attorney that has a good working relationship with a private investigator, because it appears you are clueless about what is going on in your own life.
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post #134 of 480 (permalink) Old 04-04-2017, 09:54 AM
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Re: How does the sand taste bremik? I told you so.....

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Originally Posted by bremik View Post
This is the guy that she -even though he had male roommates- had spent the night supposedly on his couch because she was too drunk to get home and neither she nor he called to tell me. He was the one always partying with her. He was the one she confided to in college when we had arguments about her staying out late to where he would tell her to ignore me and I had no right. He was the one that everytime we went to WI to a dairy event would get her to go off with him and pals when she was supposed to meet up with me after we had been apart for the day. He was the one who left the- what he thought was a funny- message at 2 am that she should get it on with another co-worker and how lucky that guy was. He was the one that she sat next to on the company trips while wearing what I would have considered one of her sexiest outfits. He was the one that came down on business and when we went out to eat in separate vehicles he asked her if she wanted to ride with him - I was the other driver! Maybe you get the idea by now?
I get the idea she was alone with this guy a lot.

And she swears nothing physical happened ?

And you believe her ?

Why should she stop with this guy if you know all of this and haven't raised holy hell about it?

“The time's gone by for sentiment and all that foolery. Mercy's all very well but after all it's justice that clinches the bargain.”


“The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.”
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post #135 of 480 (permalink) Old 04-04-2017, 11:30 AM
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Re: How does the sand taste bremik? I told you so.....

So you haven't asked her to take a polygraph?

At the beginning of this particular thread more than one man was mentioned. Is their actually a worry she has been unfaithful with more than one man?

Have you discussed this wth Jay's wife?

Long term affair partners don't usually talk/text each other any differently than long term marriage partners. So no sexting or discussing things regarding their sex life means nothing.
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