I've been reading the forums for awhile to get some perspective on what others are going though. I finally felt it might be good to get some perspective on my own situation.
Here's my story. I met my wife in 2008 and after about 1.5 years of dating, we got married in 2010. We got pregnant during the honeymoon. We're both in our mid-30's and is slightly older than me.
While we were dating, I had some sexual hangups (lower drive, difficulty reaching climax) that interfered with my ability to have a "normal" sex life, one being a low level of testosterone. I didn't know it at the time though, but at her urging, I got it checked and sure enough it was low.
She frequently said that sex was very important to her in the relationship and something that we should figure out before getting married. Part of me was stubborn and I didn't want to admit that my low drive or inability to arrive at orgasm quickly was a problem. There were times were I wouldn't be able to climax at all. Looking back, I should have addressed this issues with fury, but I didn't and I regret it.
The dating and courting period was great (other than the sex life). We had fun, traveled, spent alot of time together and she would tell me that she loved our life together. But shortly after the wedding, when we found out she was pregnant, things took a turn for the worse.
She became really naggy about everything and I figured it was just due to the nesting that a pregnant woman goes through. Things were okay, but I didn't feel that we were as close as a newlywed couple should be (again, I chalked it up to the pregnancy hormones).
We started going to a birthing class, and I remember her getting pretty snippy with me at one point. As we walked back to the car after the class, I said "you could act like you love me, ya know" or something to that effect, and she kinda just shrugged her shoulders. That was probably the first time I realized that there was a real problem. During the length of the pregnancy, she was fairly cold and distant, not wanting to cuddle, etc..
After the baby came, things pretty much stayed the same but the focus went onto the little one. If I tried to be intimate or physical with her, she would pull away and say she was tired. So we went the better part of 8 months without having sex after the baby was born.
I asked her about it at one point, and she said that one of her friends had only had sex with her husband 2 times since their baby was born (a couple months before ours), which didn't make me feel better.
During this period, I went to a doctor who put me on a medication for Low-T, which made a huge difference in my drive. Now I was eager yet my wife was unresponsive. I'd say things like "ironic how now I have a strong drive and you don't have any", and she would respond "oh, I'm plenty horny". Which, in essence, meant that she was horny but not for me.
She'd say she didn't want to go back our old sex life b/c it was awkward, even though I was on supplements and feeling like a changed man. So I started seeing a sex therapist to help work out my issues. The sessions with the therapist quickly turned into relationship therapy. I felt like I wasn't going to get anywhere with the sex thing if we weren't close on the relationship.
So we started seeing the therapist together, which as of today, hasn't produced much result. I intend to talk to the MC directly to see if we can speed things up. During these sessions, she mentioned that she "wasn't sure why she couldn't be affectionate towards me" and that "I deserved to have that kind of love and so did she". She also said that she didn't have that "I can't live without you" kind of love.
We did resume having sex recently (in the past couple of months), but it's been spotty at best and she doesn't seem to really enjoy it the way she used to...like she is going through the motions.
But, the thing that really bothers me is that I believe she is having or is on the verge of having an EA, and I'm sure it's part of the reason she feels so uncertain about us. Back when we were first dating, she maintained a relationship with an ex, and insisted it was just a friendship and no more. However, she would go out of her way not to flaunt any aspect of our relationship to him and I finally confronted her on it. At the time, she said she didn't want to hurt his feelings by rubbing it in that she was dating me.
Well, we got engaged and she was still talking to him (she let it slip that he had been emailing her), and I got angry and told her to let him know that she was engaged. She reluctantly did so (again, saying she didn't want to hurt his feelings!....what about my feelings???).
I thought that was put to bed, but flash forward a couple years and I learn that she's still talking to this guy and in fact asks me if I mind if she meets him for a drink for a bit (he was in town for some interview). When she got home, I told her I was surprised she was even still talking to him and she said again that it was only friends and that she didn't feel she needed to tell me everyone who she talks to via email (which I agree in purpose, but not in this case)
Trying not to be Beta and show jealousy, I drop the subject after confronting her on it. She brings up the point that I maintain friendships with some ex's too (but not ones that still have feelings for me!). But now my radar is up.
She at one point had left her email open on my computer and I my curiosity got the best of me. (I feel bad for admitting this). I notice that she had been emailing other ex-boyfriends (one of whom I met and I know there's nothing going on between them).
She vents to them that her marriage is a failure and that she loves being a mom but isn't sure what she wants to do about me. In a later email, she tells one of them that she knows she has a good life and that I'm a good father and totally dedicated to her, and that maybe she's not being fair. She also says that she is going to give it her best effort. Regardless, I'm really hurt by the fact that she is venting her marriage issues to them and not to me.
I also notice that she is buried in her phone lately and always texting someone back and forth so I did check it (again, I realize this is wrong), but come to find out she is texting very frequently the first guy and venting about our relationship and told him that she was glad they were able to have nice conversations (mainly via text or facebook).
Now, nothing has indicated that she is actively engaged in a PA and there's no indication that anything "inappropriate" is being said (things like "I love you, etc...it's all pretty above the cuff), but still, it really really bothers me that she's carrying on with this guy.
I brought this up with my MC and she said not to confront her just yet, but to monitor the situation. So that's what I'm doing. Today my wife is being nice to me and attentive, but I'm having a hard time looking at her.
I also am really bothered that our day-to-day life is pretty good, we don't fight and we get along pretty well, but she doesn't seem to be putting any effort into the future of the marriage. It's like she's resigned to the fact that it's flawed. There's just not alot of loving affection. She even admits that she is happy day-to-day, just not sure what she wants long-term. I wish she would talk to me about her problems rather than running off to ex-boyfriends to vent.
I absolutely love her to death and don't want to see my marriage fall apart, and especially am fearful of our family being ripped apart, but I just don't see us recovering while she is maintaining this contact with OM. (I'll call him that for lack of a better term).
I know at some point, I will have to confront her on this, or have the MC help with it, I just wanted to vent alittle and get some perspective. I feel she is not putting any effort into the marriage right now. This really sucks so badly, I'm very lost and confused about how we got to this place.
It sounds like your wife never was in love with you to begin with and right after the wedding got a bad case of 'buyer's remorse'.
You should seriously consider detaching emotionally from her since she's having multiple EAs with various ex-boyfriends. She may be looking for one of them to provide a way out of the marriage since many women seldom leave a marriage - not counting an abusive one - without having another relationship already waiting in the wings.
You are right. She is not putting any effort into the marriage.
Morituri said you might want to start to detach from her.
What she is doing it using bad mouthing you to get attention from many men. That's pretty low.
If you want to work on the marriage.. then let her know that you know about her talking to all those men and telling them her what she thinks are her problems. That either she stops all communications with all of them, gives you the passwords to all of her computer accounts and her cell, and she agrees to work on the marriage or you are filing for divorce.
If anything is going to shock her out of her fog, that will.
If you do not do something like that... then your marriage is gone. She is not going to agree to anything in counseling because she does not respect you.
Just because your wife made a mistake doesn't mean you're not a worthwhile guy who will find love again. It seems pretty obvious your wife is not actively working with you and never has. If I were you, I would begin to consider leaving your wife. Recognize that you have a lot to offer the right woman.
I realize you have a child. That child will need you as a father and I really recommend you make sure that you stay in this child's life, not saying you won't, but she might make that difficult if she finds out that you actually are considering leaving. She might also imagine that she can replace you with this other man who she obviously currently uses for all her emotional intimacy needs. Make sure you retain a lawyer and retain joint custody. Make sure you ignore her threats and take care of yourself.
So all of what I'm writing might seem foreign to you. You are still be hoping she will snap out of it. My best guess is the only chance of you having her even consider snapping out of it is if you recognize that you are willing to leave rather than live in a loveless, sexless marriage. You don't deserve to be treated the way she is treating you. Unless there is something big you're not telling us.
I don't think I'm ready to just walk away from the marriage just yet. I have too much invested (both emotionally and physically) to raise the white flag - although the thought has crossed my mind on more than one occasion.
I have seen glimmers of hope at times during our relationship in the past months. She is certainly conflicted about her feelings and I can easily sense it. She talks about the future with me (like not wanting a short sale on a condo I own b/c it will mess up our ability to buy in the future), there are moments where we've connected on a different level (a sexual encounter recently comes to mind) and our daily life isn't unpleasant most of the time. She admits that her life isn't so bad.
I do think she has rewritten our history to a degree though, saying that we never had a passionate beginning. I have found emails dating back to our first couple years together and they are full of notes from her saying "can't wait to see you tonight!!" and "you make me so happy!!". She also was the one who said I Love You to me first, pushed for an engagement ring and wanted to have my kids.
She is a very non-confrontational person and it totally fits her personality not to directly confront her issues. So, even though I don't agree with it, I know why she didn't want to tell this OM why she wasn't interested in him when we first started dating. She truly didn't want to hurt him. But by keeping him around as a "friend", I do believe she is starting to become clouded by what her feelings are in our marriage. And of course, this OM's motives are selfish, I'm sure.
Here's what I know about the communication that she's been having. The OM is the only one she has regular communication (they seem to go in spurts of texts or emails every few days). The other guys are very sporadic, maybe a series of emails over the course of a day and are spread months apart. So, I don't think there's anything going on with those ones, other than the obvious disrespectful nature of the conversations. She also never bad-mouths me specifically, she says things like "I feel like I choose poorly yet again" (*she was married once before) and "I need to be true to myself over the long run". But I am definitely concerned about her continuing communication with OM, especially since she knows how much it bothered me in the past.
During my last counseling session, I went solo and the MC said that she wanted to bring my wife in for a solo session to balance things out. I am not sure when she'll have an apt. with the MC but hopefully it's this week.
I'm tempted, even though the MC has said to wait and see, to confront my wife without dropping the bomb. I know enough to know that she is keeping on with the OM. I want to know why she isn't trying and why she feels the need maintain a relationship with him. I do not believe she even knows what she has at home, and I think she is stupid and naive to throw it all away.
I will give you my unfiltered, fresh eyes opinion of your marriage.
Judging from what you're telling me, it sounds like she was cheating on you while she was pregnant. Also, based on what you're saying, it sounds like she was physically cheating on you while she was pregnant. Also, based on what you're saying, I would be very anxious about the child even being mine.
I know that sounds horrible and crazy but there are a LOT of kids with misdiagnosed parents.
From everything you said I would be insanely surprised if she wasn't in an EA, but more importantly, I would be surprised if she wasn't still sleeping with some of these men. Sounds like she never really gave up her ex, and if he lives anywhere within a one-day drive, I wouldn't be surprised to hear that they are still hooking up regularly.
I'm sorry this came off as crude or harsh, but I'm not invested in your relationship and from the little you've told me, it does not look good.
My advice: get insanely good at snooping. Get a VAR in the house and car, try to read text messages, keylogger on the computer, try to read emails and FB messages, GPS tracking on the phone/car, etc. You know you're going to get proof, you just don't know what the proof is yet.
Second, I would get a swab from the kid and do an at-home or mailaway paternity test. She's lying to you now, how do you know she's not lying about that? Her snippiness was a little too convenient if you ask me, I think you're paying for someone else's kid.
While this is going on, I would be adamant about NC with any exes or opposite sex. You need to grow some balls. It's not "not beta" to not bring up her talking to exes. In fact, the way you handled it, makes you sound sans-balls. No guy is going to be OK with her wife talking to an ex like she is. It doesn't make you sound jealous, it makes you sound like a pushover that you would keep letting her do it. You're basically tacitly approving of her chatting up old flames, she even called you out with the "Oh I'm horny, just not with you" line. She's actively telling you she's got the hots for other people, probably having sex with them, right under your nose.
I will give you my unfiltered, fresh eyes opinion of your marriage.
Judging from what you're telling me, it sounds like she was cheating on you while she was pregnant. Also, based on what you're saying, it sounds like she was physically cheating on you while she was pregnant. Also, based on what you're saying, I would be very anxious about the child even being mine.
I know that sounds horrible and crazy but there are a LOT of kids with misdiagnosed parents.
From everything you said I would be insanely surprised if she wasn't in an EA, but more importantly, I would be surprised if she wasn't still sleeping with some of these men. Sounds like she never really gave up her ex, and if he lives anywhere within a one-day drive, I wouldn't be surprised to hear that they are still hooking up regularly.
I'm sorry this came off as crude or harsh, but I'm not invested in your relationship and from the little you've told me, it does not look good.
My advice: get insanely good at snooping. Get a VAR in the house and car, try to read text messages, keylogger on the computer, try to read emails and FB messages, GPS tracking on the phone/car, etc. You know you're going to get proof, you just don't know what the proof is yet.
Second, I would get a swab from the kid and do an at-home or mailaway paternity test. She's lying to you now, how do you know she's not lying about that? Her snippiness was a little too convenient if you ask me, I think you're paying for someone else's kid.
While this is going on, I would be adamant about NC with any exes or opposite sex. You need to grow some balls. It's not "not beta" to not bring up her talking to exes. In fact, the way you handled it, makes you sound sans-balls. No guy is going to be OK with her wife talking to an ex like she is. It doesn't make you sound jealous, it makes you sound like a pushover that you would keep letting her do it. You're basically tacitly approving of her chatting up old flames, she even called you out with the "Oh I'm horny, just not with you" line. She's actively telling you she's got the hots for other people, probably having sex with them, right under your nose.
You need some self-respect ASAP!
Whoa! I appreciate your bluntly honest assessment of my situation but I don't think it's that horrific!
I know for certain my baby is mine. She looks exactly like me and we can time our conception (like I said, she was created during our honeymoon).
While I don't believe that she has ever physically cheated, I cannot prove so, so it's always going to be in the back of my mind. And I'm realistic enough to know that if the EA continues, it will eventually evolve into a PA.
The OM does not live anywhere near here, fortunately, however he does travel here occasionally for a variety of reason (at least as far as I can tell). I've seen the facebook logs and so far, there is NO evidence of any dirty deeds yet.... It just seems like 2 friends talking about a variety of mundane things in a friendly, excited manner. No proclamations of love, or a desire to leave her marriage for him or anything like that.
The emails between the other ex's have mainly been about them asking about each other's relationships. When it's her turn to share, she seems to say how she's finding herself in yet another failing marriage. One of the guys actually gave her good advice and told her how much hard work it was to have a baby and be married and to hang in there.
I do agree with you that I have to grow a set of balls about her continuing to talk to the OM. It does piss me off royally knowing she is talking to him as often as she is. She does not know that I know how much she is actually talking to him and I feel I need to plot my course carefully.
I don't think it's in my best interest to run in with guns blazing and ask questions later. I think I need to have a calculated plan. I'm trying to save this marriage, if it even is savable. I don't want to destroy it.
I don't think it's in my best interest to run in with guns blazing and ask questions later. I think I need to have a calculated plan. I'm trying to save this marriage, if it even is savable. I don't want to destroy it.
Then why don't you calmly, quietly and respectfully ask her if she wants a divorce so she can be happier and free to be with somebody else? Tell her that you'd rather live by a dream than live by a lie.
Whoa! I appreciate your bluntly honest assessment of my situation but I don't think it's that horrific!
I know for certain my baby is mine. She looks exactly like me and we can time our conception (like I said, she was created during our honeymoon).
While I don't believe that she has ever physically cheated, I cannot prove so, so it's always going to be in the back of my mind. And I'm realistic enough to know that if the EA continues, it will eventually evolve into a PA.
The OM does not live anywhere near here, fortunately, however he does travel here occasionally for a variety of reason (at least as far as I can tell). I've seen the facebook logs and so far, there is NO evidence of any dirty deeds yet.... It just seems like 2 friends talking about a variety of mundane things in a friendly, excited manner. No proclamations of love, or a desire to leave her marriage for him or anything like that.
The emails between the other ex's have mainly been about them asking about each other's relationships. When it's her turn to share, she seems to say how she's finding herself in yet another failing marriage. One of the guys actually gave her good advice and told her how much hard work it was to have a baby and be married and to hang in there.
I do agree with you that I have to grow a set of balls about her continuing to talk to the OM. It does piss me off royally knowing she is talking to him as often as she is. She does not know that I know how much she is actually talking to him and I feel I need to plot my course carefully.
I don't think it's in my best interest to run in with guns blazing and ask questions later. I think I need to have a calculated plan. I'm trying to save this marriage, if it even is savable. I don't want to destroy it.
OK that's good news! You don't need to run with guns blazing but you need to be up front and stern about it. Talking to exes is bad mojo period. Talking to exes about relationship problems is a ticking time bomb.
You need to get all this out in the open, maybe not details about what you know, but about how she's not happy and how she's doing some things to bother you (like talking to her exes, and the attraction to you issue). Rug sweeping isn't going to win you any awards.
MC is a good start. Make sure she is committed to it.
Whoa! I appreciate your bluntly honest assessment of my situation but I don't think it's that horrific!
I know for certain my baby is mine. She looks exactly like me and we can time our conception (like I said, she was created during our honeymoon).
While I don't believe that she has ever physically cheated, I cannot prove so, so it's always going to be in the back of my mind. And I'm realistic enough to know that if the EA continues, it will eventually evolve into a PA.
The OM does not live anywhere near here, fortunately, however he does travel here occasionally for a variety of reason (at least as far as I can tell). I've seen the facebook logs and so far, there is NO evidence of any dirty deeds yet.... It just seems like 2 friends talking about a variety of mundane things in a friendly, excited manner. No proclamations of love, or a desire to leave her marriage for him or anything like that.
The emails between the other ex's have mainly been about them asking about each other's relationships. When it's her turn to share, she seems to say how she's finding herself in yet another failing marriage. One of the guys actually gave her good advice and told her how much hard work it was to have a baby and be married and to hang in there.
I do agree with you that I have to grow a set of balls about her continuing to talk to the OM. It does piss me off royally knowing she is talking to him as often as she is. She does not know that I know how much she is actually talking to him and I feel I need to plot my course carefully.
I don't think it's in my best interest to run in with guns blazing and ask questions later. I think I need to have a calculated plan. I'm trying to save this marriage, if it even is savable. I don't want to destroy it.
At the very least, you need to follow COguy's advice about snooping. Get as much tracking ability as possible in place so you can watch her every move. It's sad you have to do this, but the amount of freedom you've already given her to continue talking to all these OMs is profoundly dangerous, and the chances she has taken advantage of this freedom you've given are "more than likely".
Although you may not be ready to throw in the towel on your marriage just yet, I think you need to seriously put your mindset in an acceptance of that kind of situation, and actually start building up counter-measures for yourself that it becomes a very real outcome of this. Start researching good divorce lawyers, do the paternity test anyway, snoop the hell out of her, and get all your finances in order... secretly.
If you find out the worst news that she is cheating, and you confront her, and divorce actually becomes her own agenda, then she is going to come after you like a vicious banshee and you will be blindsided in the fury and sucked completely dry if you don't have your defensive plan in place by then. The more evidence you have in this situation the better off the outcome for you if it does come to divorce.
Be extremely careful, be extremely smart, and Godspeed my friend.
Then why don't you calmly, quietly and respectfully ask her if she wants a divorce so she can be happier and free to be with somebody else? Tell her that you'd rather live by a dream than live by a lie.
I'm not certain I want to put it in those terms, as if I am okay with that outcome.
I have been thinking about this quite a bit lately and I think the conversation I want to have with her will go something like this:
"I'd like to know what your intention is with OM. The fact that you have maintained contact with him all this time leads me to believe that you are having an EA with him and I need you to know I'm not okay with this. There is no positive outcome for our marriage if you maintain this relationship.
You have husband who loves you deeply, even with your flaws, and a beautiful child. I believe you think the grass is greener somewhere else, yet you had opportunities with these ex's before and they led you nowhere. You are chasing a flawed dream. If you insist on continuing this relationship and not putting effort on this marriage, you are telling me that you are willing to throw everything away. I think you are foolish and naive. "
I want to have a conversation with my MC first before having this conversation though.
Dear confuseddad, I'm sorry for your difficulties in your marriage. It is not to late to keep it alive! First of all, if anything keep it going for your child's sake. Then take your wife to a "weekend to remember" conference. It will change your marriage. Get the book, 5 love languages by Gary Chapman and this will open your eyes. So here is some help. When you dated your wife you had to romance her and gave her a reason to fall in love with you. However, you stopped dating her. You have to continue to date your wife! She needs to feel completely loved and cherished by you. Key: find out what her love language is and start loving her today! When you plant a garden, you don't just leave it, you have to cultivate it, water it, weed it, and so on. The same it is with marriage. Since there are problems in your marriage, then humbly go to your wife and ask her to truly share how you can be the man she needs you to be. If she say this and that, then do this and that. Your an amateur at this marriage stuff, but tell her you want to be an expert! Write down your love story and read it to her. Why did you marry her, what is it that attracted you to her, and so on. Give her a reason to love you. Communication! Communication! Communication! Is the key. However you can only do this with a loving, humble heart. No saying her faults, just focus on yours, and often she will admit to her own faults. Even if she doesn't though, keep pursing her. Love is a choice not a feeling! See the Bible verse 1 Corinthians 13: 4-7 to understand what love really is. Don't try to prove that she is wrong on keeping up correspondence with an old ex boyfriends. (I do believe it is wrong) However, this will only say to her that she has done something wrong and it will possibly make her willful and defensive. Even if she is wrong, she will be embarrassed to admit it. So don't lose hope, just learn what it truly means to love. I am not a counselor, I am a wife to one husband of 26 years strong and a mother to 8 beautiful children. My husband and I have had to work at our marriage, but in the long run we have had an awesome marriage! Invest in your marriage and it will become very valuable to you. May God help you as you love your wife.
I'm not certain I want to put it in those terms, as if I am okay with that outcome.
I have been thinking about this quite a bit lately and I think the conversation I want to have with her will go something like this:
"I'd like to know what your intention is with OM. The fact that you have maintained contact with him all this time leads me to believe that you are having an EA with him and I need you to know I'm not okay with this. There is no positive outcome for our marriage if you maintain this relationship.
You have husband who loves you deeply, even with your flaws, and a beautiful child. I believe you think the grass is greener somewhere else, yet you had opportunities with these ex's before and they led you nowhere. You are chasing a flawed dream. If you insist on continuing this relationship and not putting effort on this marriage, you are telling me that you are willing to throw everything away. I think you are foolish and naive. "
I want to have a conversation with my MC first before having this conversation though.
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My wife says she made a mistake 
