Things are generally so good with us that when we do have a problem I think maybe I am blowing it out of proportion, but I'm not sure.
I am reading 'Not Just Friends' and last night something struck me so I asked hubby why it was that he felt the need to hide his porn viewing from me back when we first got a computer in about 2000. I didn't ask in an accusing way or anything, I told him I had a question and proceeded to ask it. I'm very careful that way.
Anyway, he answered that he DIDN'T hide it. Which threw me for a loop, because he went on the computer late at night while I was sleeping and looked at porn. To me, that's hiding it. He didn't invite me, despite the fact we sometimes read magazines together and watched movies. But he didn't delete his internet history, which to him translates as not hiding it. I figured maybe he didn't know how, but he now says he just didn't see it as a big deal and he didn't think it would upset me. At the time, as now, I tried to explain very carefully that I really don't care if he looks at porn, but don't hide it (ie don't do it late at night while I am sleeping) and don't leave links for the kids to find.
Then he started to get angry because he thought I was really talking about the 2009 internet porn/chat site/sexsearch site stuff he did, despite the fact I hadn't mentioned it. It wasn't even on my mind.
So we ended up having a fight and rolling onto our own sides of the bed and going to sleep.
I know it frustrates him when I keep bringing these topics up. I am trying to understand things. Maybe I should just give up trying to understand. Maybe he really didn't try to hide what he was doing back in 2000. But now today I also have an email from him again talking about the 2009 stuff (he brought it up) and saying he DID delete internet history and cookies from a computer we had before he had his laptop. Till now I had though he started up all his shenanigans when he got his laptop. This is the third time he has moved the timeline back. First he told me it all started in Sept, then June, then May, now earlier, because he got his laptop in May. So I still don't have a firm time about when it all started.
Should I care? I don't really care when it all started because it's over now. but it bothers me that he's changed his story about this detail like that. Again.
Sigh. I didn't need this right before our vacation I wish all this had never happened.
He sounds like he is still defensive about his behavior. Emphasize to him that you want honesty. You are a safe place for his thoughts; he does not have to hide anything from you.
Hope, you and I share that same need to know every detail. I still ask questions 20 years later. I don't think I can help it. For a while my wife got very defensive when I asked questions years after we R. She interpreted it as me throwing it in her face over and over. It took a long time and many years before she realized that it was just my need to know everything that fueled my (warning - Monty Python reference) "Spanish Inquisitions" as she liked to call them. I think you need to ask yourself if its worth knowing all the details. If you are asking questions and like me just need to know then talk to your husband and help him understand that you are not doing it to cause friction. Maybe come up with some sort of signal that says that you are going to ask "one of those questions" again. Whenever I'm about to inquire I make a Monty Python reference to Morrigan and she rolls her eyes while saying "again?" Of course now she smiles because she knows its not done out of anger or resentment. Decide for yourself whether you really need to ask these questions and why? Then talk to your husband and see how you can mutually handle it without animosity.
Hope..I understand where you are coming from about wanting to know details,e tc.
From his perspective I do find that alot of men are not as good with dates, etc. and do not have the kind of memory that women seem to have.
I do understand about wanting to know details, etc. I am the exact same way. H. sometimes will get annoyed with me because I want to know details of stuff that we have talked about over and over.
I know how you feel. My H only admitted to his porn addiction last Friday and told his therapist on Monday. I finally feel like we are getting somewhere. They have to be honest with themselves before they can be honest with anyone else. He agreed he tried to dismiss his use of porn and refused to believe it was connected with the eventual affair, ONS and use of prostitutes. He admitted in therapy with me this week that he first got into porn at about age 12. This progressed to him mastubating to porn on the internet pretty much every night after I went to bed...for the last 10 years!! Been married for 14 years, so not much chance for intimacy. I knew he looked at porn occassionaly, but had no idea that it was that intense. I just hope that he can now get the help he obviously needs. He comes to bed with me every night now, He said that it helps him feel connected to me and prevents the monster of porn destroying any chance we have for reconciliation. Facts, dates and times help to put things into perspective and get your head around the extent of the problem. Time will tell.
Which threw me for a loop, because he went on the computer late at night while I was sleeping and looked at porn. To me, that's hiding it.
I'm on your husband's side. Doing something while you're asleep isn't the same as hiding it. If he were watching TV, which I assume you also don't care about, would you accuse him of hiding his TV watching?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hope1964
He didn't invite me, despite the fact we sometimes read magazines together and watched movies. But he didn't delete his internet history, which to him translates as not hiding it.
If it wasn't a big deal, then he wouldn't be compelled to invite you.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hope1964
Then he started to get angry because he thought I was really talking about the 2009 internet porn/chat site/sexsearch site stuff he did, despite the fact I hadn't mentioned it. It wasn't even on my mind.
I can see your husband's side here, as well. You're bringing up porn viewing, which you claim not to care about. If you don't care, then why bring it up? If it's really not an issue, why does it even matter if he hides it? For example, I don't care if my wife reads her books during the day, or at night, or in front of me, or after I'm asleep. I have no opinion on it. She is free to choose the time, place, and manner of her reading. And I'll never bring it up. Because I don't care.
But you've brought it up. And, it turns out that your husband has had some boundary issues with porn sites. It's natural for your husband to assume that you're leading up to the real problem.
I say you either talk about the real problem, or let it go.
The question was about the hiding, not the porn. And it isn't even a huge problem. I was reading and something I read brought the question to my mind and I asked it.
Beowulf, how did you get to where you could talk about this stuff with your wife? I don't even really have a burning need to know, it just comes up every once in a while. And if he hadn't been right there when the question popped into my mind, it wouldn't have even come up.
I just don't know how we got into a big fight about it
The question was about the hiding, not the porn. And it isn't even a huge problem. I was reading and something I read brought the question to my mind and I asked it.
Beowulf, how did you get to where you could talk about this stuff with your wife? I don't even really have a burning need to know, it just comes up every once in a while. And if he hadn't been right there when the question popped into my mind, it wouldn't have even come up.
I just don't know how we got into a big fight about it
It was a long time. The first couple of years she realized it was part of the R that she would have to answer all my questions. She started blanching a bit once she thought we were stable. Then when I would ask she would get mad and ask why we had to dredge all that up again. Then it would get to a point that I would want to ask but didn't want to get into a fight about it. Unfortunately I realized that I was just building resentment so I finally sat down and told her that I would always ask questions because I was an inquisitive person. But I wasn't doing it to cause issues. I said if she was having a problem with my communicating with her she needed to go to counseling to deal with her defensiveness. Basically I tossed the ball into her court. That must have been around 5 years or so after D-Day I'd guess.
I must come clean and tell you I did trick her a little. I'm sure she realizes this now but I would always do something special for her right after I asked her about the affair. Kind of like a positive reward for indulging me. Sometimes it was taking her out to a movie she wanted to see. Sometimes out to dinner. Sometimes I rewarded her in the bedroom but I won't go into detail about that. When my wife and I saw this episode of The Big Bang Theory we both laughed outrageously because I kinda did this to her. Watch it and you'll get a huge laugh.
BTW, the reason you both got into a fight about it is because he still carries a lot of guilt for his behavior. It's going to always be there in some form but it will take time until its not such a raw nerve for him.
I feel like I'd be holding onto resentment too if I don't ask. Because I'm at the point where I sometimes don't, just to avoid the fighting.
It's funny you say that about the guilt. He has a hard time admitting that he does feel guilty. I need to make me a safe person to talk to somehow - I don't think he gets that quite yet - he still thinks I'm on the attack when I'm not. I try so hard not to attack.
I feel like I'd be holding onto resentment too if I don't ask. Because I'm at the point where I sometimes don't, just to avoid the fighting.
It's funny you say that about the guilt. He has a hard time admitting that he does feel guilty. I need to make me a safe person to talk to somehow - I don't think he gets that quite yet - he still thinks I'm on the attack when I'm not. I try so hard not to attack.
Gotta have another 'talk'. Sigh.
I struggle with that as well..where I tell myself do not say anything anymore but then I have this strong desire to vent. I do find that for myself it almost became addicitng this desire to vent because then I would feel so much better only to have it build up again and then the whole vicious cycle would continue.
It is so interesting how dealing with this crap sure plays a number on you.
I feel like I'd be holding onto resentment too if I don't ask. Because I'm at the point where I sometimes don't, just to avoid the fighting.
It's funny you say that about the guilt. He has a hard time admitting that he does feel guilty. I need to make me a safe person to talk to somehow - I don't think he gets that quite yet - he still thinks I'm on the attack when I'm not. I try so hard not to attack.
Gotta have another 'talk'. Sigh.
Its all part of the process.
After all the hurt and pain that she saw me go through she couldn't believe that I was actually okay at some point. Its almost like her brain was rewired to expect: pain - anger -regret - remorse - sorrow - guilt - resentment. It was like she couldn't see I'd moved past it enough to talk about it without intense emotions. I was just telling canttrustu in another thread that I can actually joke about her affair sometimes now. Even when I started doing that she thought initially I was being mean and insulting. Believe me your husband feels the guilt...a lot. All WS do even if they won't admit it to themselves.
Yeah, the venting can do more harm than good. He doesn't need me to rag on him over and over. But I think he still has some of the mentality that he did the very first MC session we had, when we hadn't laid eyes on one another for over 2 months. When we sat down the counselor asked him why he was looking at me the way he was (like a deer in the headlights) and I told her it was because he expected me to start whaling on him. He could only nod, he couldn't even speak he was so terrified. He had to swallow and breathe for about 2 full minutes before he could talk.
Cheaters repackage what they are doing to make it acceptable to them. Some of that repackaging language lingers on for a long time. It is not a disservice to him to have him reexamine what his thinking processes were at the time. My H told himself ( among a legion of other things) that his never mentioning that he was involved with OW was not lying to me. Because I did not let him off the hook on that he now understands that keeping something from me that I have every right to know is lying by omission. Fessing up is his way of showing you that he is serious about fixing things. It is an unselfish thing, that is done for the good of another, and it restores your faith in him as someone you can trust again.
You know what, there is a difference between hiding something and being bored/lustful at night and viewing erotica... I think you are making problems where none exist. I wonder why your H pron viewing from more than a decade ago are so important to you? I realize you need to make your own peace with your circumstances and I am happy for you that you are in R; but, quite frankly I would not entertain repeated questions along this line a decade later.
JMHO
Good luck
3Likes
A step back 
I wish all this had never happened.
That was hilarious. I love BBT 
