Basically---all of this is about the gap from 2 to 5 a m
Was she with any of her group, or did she ditch all of them, and go on her own??
It does not take 3 hours to eat fries, and puke---even if the puking was bad---it would not go on for 3 hours----how far away could the diner have been
If things are really bad for you---(inside your head)----you could force a confrontation, and demand answers---but if you are wrong----she is never gonna forget---and if you prove right---then your mge is gone, cuz she went outside of it, with another man
You should try somehow, to fill in that 3 hour gap----you have to anyway---cuz if you don't your sub-conscious is gonna keep throwing possibilities, and your mind is gonna drive you crazy----you got a major dilemma here!!
a few questions about the iphone, as it is possible to retrieve deleted texts-
1) does she physically sync her phone into a computer or does she use icloud for updates and backups?
2) if yes to the sync, PC or mac and what OS is it?
I love the approach some of the posters have mentioned, it seem provin, I also think she may leave during confronting her. I just have a feeling, knowing that its adeal breaker for Worriedhusband, then she may run, again this all comes from my point of view in deny until you dye.
I may be wrong but I have a sence that this ant her 1st rodeo, and Just like the folk here at TAM she has her support system in hidding her 2nd life.
She seems to be covering her tracks well, she knows not to confide in her true friends, she just seems to know all the tricks.
I maybe dead wrong and if she has no were to go she may stand her ground and admit to what her only knows ....and for some thats enough to bury this for a few years.
worriedhusband is the only one that has a any chance on what his wife will do. But even then she is no longer the women you married so there is no telling how she will play it out.
At the end of the day is Woorried willing to leave his marriage...until then his wife has his number and until he has the confidence to move on she will only admit to what he has and will string him along. IDK she may want to stick around and admitt everything.
Getting her to admit to a continous unhealthy behavior versus just a one night stand may serve her best.....with or with out Worriedhusband, and if there are kids then that may be the bottom line here.
JNJ - My wife has been on a health kick for a while just losing some weight etc. She actually gained a bit back latley. This week she has been to the gym 3 times but I don't think its cause for concern. I am not really good friends with any of her friends. We have been in MC for about 3 months and things seemed to be improving. This was triggered by me finding out she was talking to a guy at the gym. I found this out via the same Facebook group. I caught that very early and I really do beleive her that that was nothing.
Bandit - Do VAR make any noice at all? And yes I am going through hell. I need to know the truth. I gave her open opportunity to tell me but she keeps lying about going back to the room with her friends.
Entropy - We have been married for 10 years in November and we have 3 kids. The GNO thing is regular but typically just a dinner and then home. An over night only happens maybe 2 times a year. As far as I know there has never been infidelity by either of us.
10 years and 3 kids. Not an uncommon time to have these issues.
So marriage friendly GNOs except for when they blow it all out twice a year. The blowouts are less than marriage friendly IMO, but others disagree. I think they invite trouble ... like you have.
You have some Yellow Flags at the least with her behavior. Any chance she hooked up with a male friend she knew?
People can talk at the GYM. What was special about talking? Elaborate please. Did this spill over into FB, texting and email? Did she talk to him over the phone.
Was he helping her with her program? Always be extra weary about guys who invest time with your wife. The guys that volunteer to train them. Not good.
When these activities are viewed in agregation I think you have some reason for concern. She around 30? She is seeking validation at the least.
Start doing soem real investigation.
I would show up at the GYM unannounced next time and view things from afar for a bit.
Not knowing her friends is a concern. Peer pressure can be huge. Toxic friends can pull others under.
jns make a good point, I think a PI could be useful in investigating the "seen of the crime" he may be able to interview the waitress, hostest, bell buy, would'd it be great to get any security footage from the hotel. This all sound very costly, but it wouldn't hurt to ask around.
All of this still doesn't solve the need to have constant GNO's though. Or wait maybe it does!
Where do you draw the line on what would be suspicious enough to demand and answer, without feeling like you'll get sent to the corner in punishment?
Let's see - flirting on a night out of town doen't do it. A friend wanting a secret email so they can talk further doesn't do it. Spending the entire night alone, unaccounted for doesn't do it. Bleeding, which defies her normal state doesn't do it. (Do you REALLY buy this? More likely that she had unprotected sex and doesn't want to give you a STD until she can be checked) So, you can't expect to be treated with respect if you question suspicious behaviors unless you catch her with another man between her thighs?
Nine people out of ten will say that it appears that she cheated on you. If it happened to me, heck, I'D even think I cheated. When it comes to our marriage, when the rest of us get into a situation where it appears that we had a one night stand, we feel the burden of proving our faithfulness, and would never blame our spouse for doubting us, because it is our stupidity that got us into this.
One day, you'll wonder why you were never in a marriage where your wife cared enough for you to explain her blatant disregard for your feelings. When you get older, you might even realize that part of being a man includes standing up for what you believe to be right, even if your wife makes you stand in the corner as punishment.
Personally, I'd bring it up, and if the counselor tried to shut it down, tell them that you do not need their services again. If your wife makes you out to be the bad guy, take it to be what it obviously was. If the friends with her, the ones who saw the flirting behind the pictures, feared that she was with another man at 5:30, then I think that it is okay for her husband to think the same thing, and not feel like he'll be punished by his wife for doing so.
Gabriel - She has never bleed with me so who knows maybe this guy was big. Again just me being paranoid if she did something. Its more of the timing thing that worries me. If she was bleeding why was she out until 5:30 AM when she told me it started at 2:30 PM
Shaggy - Ironically she had a gyno appt on Monday already scheduled. She told me the DR said no sex for 2 weeks and did labs. She said the Dr. said it was a clot but who knows since I know she lied to me about something already
Suspiscious. You have no legal right to know what the truth is.
I am so sorry man. Let's hope it's nothing, but there are clearly some bad signs here. The doctor is obligated to keep her medical conditions secret, so there is no way for you to know if she is telling you the truth about the 2 week sex hiatus.
Is she on your insurance? If so, you can call your carrier and likely get info on the services provided (not results), and the dates of service - this may give you more clues. They will just tell you the name of patient covered, and date of service, and maybe the type of provider (ie gyno, laboratory, etc, etc). Carriers also issue things called Explanation of Benefits. They are somewhat detailed - it would say if she went to a lab for test results, for instance, but wouldn't reveal any results of course. These typically are issued several weeks after the service, however. But maybe by calling, you can get the info sooner. When calling, you can just say you are settling payments with the provider and need patient name/dates of service/amount charged/type of service. This might get you somewhere, it might not.
Even if she's not on your insurance, find out who her carrier is, and make sure to catch the mail. These statements are mailed to the home - again, weeks later though.
I would probably make the mistake of confronting her now, because I don't have a lot of tolerance for misery. But that might not be the best move at the moment. What have you asked her, exactly?
You could confront her with just the information you were able to deduce from what she told you. Or, you could say you ran into one of her friends and thet told a different story, and maybe she should reconsider what she has said. This one is risky though.
At some point one would have had to sign a HIPAA form. Hopefully she did that.
I am so sorry man. Let's hope it's nothing, but there are clearly some bad signs here. The doctor is obligated to keep her medical conditions secret, so there is no way for you to know if she is telling you the truth about the 2 week sex hiatus.
Actually, here the doctor have to disclose if it's STD to everyone who can be affected. Disease control.
Of course it's a different matter if she was just ripped a bit in rough sex.
Take my opinions with a grain of salt. In my opinion, far too many guys seem to live their life in a low-level state of fear, trying to obey some set of diplomatic rules on how to keep your wife from cheating, or from getting angry. Some like this end up here after it progresses through failure. I'm not at all suggesting that this describes most cases of infidelity behaviors, because far too many come here when they are already the kind of man or woman who would attract their spouse, if the spouse wasn't just broken in some way.
So, I'm talking about those relationships where they guy timidly dances around the periphery of a certain set of diplomatic rules that his wife has helped him to build every time she lashes out because he has the audacity to question her flirting or communications with others. About the only thing that is guaranteed in this personality is that your wife senses it. Always senses it. It is not at all attractive to her, either.
Why not live like a man who respects himself, and is worthy of respect from his wife? This has nothing to do with being alpha, or a guy who has no compassion for his wife. In fact, the opposite is true. You feel confident that you SHOULD be enough for her, and that she should never want to scuttle away and start a relationship on Facebook, or a one night stand. If you don't agree with her weekends alone with the girls, or her personal trainer, because she flirts, then you do not tolerate it. Period. If she has a problem with your doubts about what happened, she should really fear instead that you will give her one shot to open up her email records, and doctor visits, to prove her innocence. That should be the only fear that matters in this situation.
So yes, I personally feel that it should be brought up. I feel that the most important discussion you can hold today, in front of a marriage counselor, is in telling her that she has one opportunity in the next few days to show you the changes she will committ to so that these doubts about her fidelity will never be an issue again. She needs to talk about exiting from relationships with other women where there is a secret set of rules that protect her FROM her husband finding out what they do. If she is not willing to committ to a relationship of 100% trust, then she needs to accept that her future will not include you.
I'm saying that you tell her that what you already know just cannot be tolerated in your marriage anymore. She may have indeed avoided spreading her legs, but what you already know is TOO MUCH. You can say that your greatest wish is for a marriage of real trust, and that it would be with her. Tell her that you will assume that she was with another man that night, even if it wasn't actual intercourse. You've observed the flirting. If she commits to changes that build a mutually satisfying marriage, you'll move forward with masculine confidence. Future flirting, though, would mean divorce. No discussion.
In post like this, I feel like it is just wasted words. But I strongly feel that if you proceed in a relationship where you always fear her possible betrayal, she will lose any attraction she might have had to you. She'll go after the guys who show strength that is built on confidence and self respect.
The problem is that if you wait until the point where she has lost the attraction, and the respect, then suddenly taking a stance might actually push her ahead of schedule on the inevitable end. Instead of slowly building confidence in her ability to flirt, or live that second life of pursuit of others, she could decide to end the marriage.
When you are in a dynamic that includes actions that indicate that she is pursuing sexual relationships with others, VARs and devices have their place in catching her, I agree. We always make these discussions about the fog, but you still may be at the place where a confident, bold personality could make the VARs and keyloggers a moot point in the future.
If you already know that she has done things that are unacceptable to you, then realize that spying is only a confirmation for you. You have NOTHING to prove to her, and if you turn it into a diplomatic or contractual discussion that is better fit for a courtroom, you've lost the relevance over what is really important in the marriage. The marriage will become a test of her ability to push the boundaries, and hide things from you.
If you have been a good husband, and strive to meet her needs, then the most important thing you can do is live like that. Expect to be treated like a man who does that. If you really feel that you do not falsely accuse her of improper behaviour, but usually give her the benefit of the doubt, then don't let her shame you for being a man. That is fitness testing. You fail, or accept these types of tests, and her atraction for you plummets. Just my opinion.
This one of your best points. Very insightful. It cuts to the chase and is real life as far as I am concerned.
Bleeding heavily after the absence of a period is not always a sign of sex. It is possible that hormones, lots of dancing, lots of walking, time at the gym, and other physical exertions are related. Hormones can be affected by things like stress, too, and that can have an effect on the cycle. Additionally, you say that she had gained a lot of weight and is now starting to lose it because of exercise; this tends to have an effect on the cycle, too.
However, she is being really strange and shady. Can you find out what kind of prescription the doctor has given her? It will give you some indication of what's happening.
Halien nailed it 100%. He captured every thought I had and put it in one post.
If you listen to only one post on this thread, make it that one. This is exactly what I wish I would have done when she was acting afool.
I don't know why it's ingrained in us "nice guys" that we have to live up to the BS situations our wives put us in. For fear of being called controlling or mean or hateful we allow our wives to do things we know to be inappropriate. Don't wait any longer to establish boundaries, sack up, and do what you know is right.
If your wife can't handle simple boundaries to protect the marriage, she's not married to you anymore.
My gut is telling me the bleeding is a completely separate issue from the "I got back at 2:30, but really it was 5:30" issue. She had the appt made well before the GNO trip was planned, he said. She had a hysterectomy for God's sakes - it could be a number of things.
OP, you need to focus on the timeline first - let us know how marriage counseling goes today/tonight and report back. Hopefully, you'll learn a lot one way or another.
Worried, IMHO, GNO is one thing; GNO w/ bar-hopping and flirting w/ other guys is another altogether. GNO and staying out all night is way out of bounds. You should take the opportunity to discuss this in MC. Re the no period in 4 yrs, there are hormonal contraceptives that cause this; you didn't mention her method. If she's not on one of them, she should consult her gynecologist. That can lead to problems.
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Re: I am concerned my wife may have cheated 
