golfergirl

God know my H has issues but one thing I can't fault him on is his ability to see though these kids of girls and put them in their place without being rude but with them looking like and feeling like a fool to all. I wish your man could feel it and act on it. In watching some interactions of people close to me lately, I've come to the conclusion either you're born with it or not, and insisting on appropriate behavior just doesn't last. I've seen some real scum lately who would lose their family, house, car and be financially ruined and still doesn't stop him! Just sad!
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jnj express

Hey tobio---OK---you have whipped the other girl, and we know you don't like her---but that ain't your problem is it!!!!!

Your H., is your problem----he had an EA with her, you let it slide, I have no idea what consequences, you applied, upon finding out about the EA---but obviously they were not harsh enuff

You now have a boundary----he crossed the boundary---SO WHAT HAVE YOU DONE ABOUT IT????---No consequences, no action on your part---he will violate this boundary again, and again----TALK DOES NOT WORK---THERE MUST BE ACTIONABLE CONSEQUENCES

Your beef is with your H., not this chick who flirts with all the guys----you did not take vows with her, you do not share a life with her---F'ing forget her----what are doing in re: your H., continued contact and cheating

WHY HAVE YOU NOT IMPOSED NC, ON HIM----he has an A., with a woman---and he is allowed to be near her by you---that I do not understand----then he hugs and kisses her----and you are asking us what to do----YOU KNOW WHAT TO DO----get in his face and lay out your terms----let him know POINT BLANK-----if he even looks cross-eyed at this woman again---he can begin to prepare to defend a D. action-------YOU CANNOT BE NICE ABOUT THIS----If you want it stopped---then F'ING STOP IT---AND DO NOT BE NICE ABOUT IT.

Lon

Tobio, if this is an agreed to boundary between you and your H, then the issue is why he crossed it knowingly, or if perhaps he felt unable to act within it at the time (of course alcohol may be a factor too).

For me, I rarely move in for a hug on female friends (or male friends) however the nice guy in me would not leave someone hanging, plus if someone wants to hug me it makes me feel accepted (and I don't mean in any kind of sexual way).

Maybe your H really isn't fine with such a boundary but agreed to it to appease you (not like that is an acceptable behavior either). Or maybe he just decided that it would have made more of a scene and caused more discomfort to himself, you or present company to dis someone in a friendly social setting.

But one thing I can tell from your posts is that you are unable to see this unemotionally, your fear is really coloring your ability to judge his position objectively. Before anyone can advise you what to do when he crosses your boundary you really need to discuss this with him and come to an understanding on what his thought process was, and start working together on how to make it more effective because even though it sounds like he wants to respect you he doesn't have the skill or knowledge to navigate this one.

Affaircare

Here's the main issue I see:

A boundary is a limit, or a fence if you will, that YOU set around YOURSELF...not someone else. When you get in the business of telling someone else what they can and can not due, then you have crossed the line into being controlling.

So the way that a boundary works is like this: around you is a little fenced in area (we'll call it "your space") and you decide what you will and will not allow in your space. You also decide who you will and will not allow in your space. As it relates to your husband, he has made certain promises to you about "forsaking all others" and whatnot, but the BOUNDARY you would set up about this issue would be something like this:

"I can not control what you do or do not choose to do. But I do know that I can control myself and what I will allow in my life, and I will not have a person who breaks their promises on a regular basis. I also won't be able to open up and feel vulnerable and intimately share myself (my hopes, dreams, fears, thoughts and feelings) with someone who does not consider how their actions might hurt me. "

So he is completely free to choose to act however he's going to act--you can't put a boundary around HIM. But you can say what kind of people you will let into your life and into your heart, and you can determine for yourself whether you can or can not open up to and be vulnerable with and feel safe with someone who knows that XYZ hurts you and they choose to do it anyway. That effectively is saying, "I choose to do this knowing it will harm you."

Can you see the difference? And the consequence is not always "I am going to leave you" because if you do that, it's just a threat to get your way. Nope, be more real. YOU made a promise to him too, and if you are constantly threatening the relationship you're the one who's causing the instability! So honor the promises you made to him--make it clear you will make the marriage stable on your side--but that in order for you to be open and transparent with you, you need to feel safe first, and you will just NOT feel safe if he keeps reacting to the attention-seeking of other females. Maybe the first consequence is one night of having to not be close to him or something. But if the goal of the marriage is two individuals who are mature and equal, who CHOOSE to be together and intimate on every level....then he will WANT you to feel safe to do so and he can make choices to reach that goal!

So can you see the difference? A boundary is not you setting up rules for him. A boundary is YOU setting a fence around yourself and deciding what you will and will not let in to have access to the treasure that you are.

__________________
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tobio

I explained my boundary to him clearly and specifically. I understand it is for me. However I can clearly see that I am so hurt that he blatantly disregarded that it would hurt me. He does not have the argument that he didn't know or understand.

His reasoning is that at the time he simply didn't think about it. He said had I said when we got to the pub and saw her there, that I didn't want him to hug her then he wouldn't have. But otherwise it simply wasn't there.

I suppose it's not just that he did that, but that he did that knowing full well how I would feel. That is what hurts me. It was a recurring theme during counselling after his EA that he "didn't think" how something would look.

I don't WANT to be his thought police. I am fully on board with being clear about my feelings on stuff and from ghere leaving it to him as to what he does. But it is like he is placing the onus back on my shoulders. Saying stuff like he "can't remember" me explaining a boundary or he needs me to remind him. I don't WANT to control him. I don't want that responsibility! But wtf is the point of explaining I have boundaries in the first place if this is how much consideration he has for them, ie none?

And I am left still with not knowing what consequence fits this. I can't think of something appropriate?
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Lon

The consequence has already happened: your trust and respect have diminished. You need no further action except to keep maintaining your boundary.

tobio

No? I'm still thinking about it Lon. I honestly feel that whilst what you say is spot-on, with my husband... Well it's not something tangible for him.

When we were talking last night he reminded me of an incident a while ago involving this female friend. We were out one night in town again as part of a large group. She used to smoke, and my husband does. She asked him if he had a light, he was carrying beers back from the bar. He said yeah, but my light's in my pocket.

Now I can't remember whether he said she could get it or she asked or even if she juat did it off her own back, but I then watched as she reached into one of his jeans front pocket and got his lighter out.

I remember being pretty open-mouthed. We had a massive argument about it. I remember him saying then that it really didn't bother him for her to do that, that's "just what she's like."

Remembering this has made me really angry. I am sat here thinking of the many instances now he has either demnstrated poor boundaries on his own part or disrespected mine. What irks me is even with clear communication he is still disrespecting my boundaries. Or as he says he just doesn't think about them.

*throws hands up in air in frustration*
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2nd_t!me iz_best

maybe when he does stuff like this, go over and give a little kick to his nutz. i bet he starts to 'remember' then.

he really seems to have no consideration for you at all, especially when you are with him. god knows what might happen if he is around her and youre NOT there.

KanDo

Wow, I'm sorry but your boundaries are beyond western societal norms. A hug between friends is normal behavior. Your reaction to it is not. If she is such a big flirt and causes you discomfort, then you guys should not socialize with her. But your reaction to a hug in the presence of her boy friend and you is WAY over the top. You might want to look into why you feel this is an issue for you.

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KanDo

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canttrustu

Oh HELL NO!

canttrustu

I honestly cant imagine a woman being THIS ridiculous and being accepted by the other women in the group. I wouldnt tolerate another woman putting her hand on my H's thigh for even one second, NO WAY(totally disrespectful from someone who is supposed to be in a group of 'friends'). And why on earth would your H have trouble seeing why this would bother you? It would bother me even BEFORE my H had his EA let alone AFTER!. Your H doesnt understand b/c he doesnt want to...?

canttrustu

OMG!!! She reached in his pants???? Right there in front of you??? I would have told HER to back off. Wow, Tobio you are way too nice. I am pretty mello most times but on NO day is some chick reaching into my H's pants for ANYTHING, EVER! I am so sorry youre going thru this. My H has boundary issues as well so I understand your frustration. My H is learning to put up the walls so to speak(IC). Maybe some IC for your H to learn why he needs so much attention from these other women?

CandieGirl

Told her to back off? Don't you mean rammed your fist down her throat? She'd be picking her teeth out of her arsehole for a week...sorry. Bad mood today.

canttrustu

Whatever it took. Seriously. This would NOT have happened in my presence. NO touching. I dont share my toys!!!!

CandieGirl

I can only imagine seeing someone do this, then my striding over, all 5'11" of me, and grabbing her by the ear, twisting it, and steering her OUT.