I guess it's easy to give advice but to actually have to accept the truth is just too hurtful, I'm not gonna give you advice.. You already know and have heard all the advice. Posted via Mobile Device
When the A was mentioned and she laughed about it if she knew she was being recorded she would not have done this.
Was it a nervous laugh or was she actually mocking your pain?
People sometimes respond strangely in difficult circumstances. For instance, we have all heard of those who laugh at a funerals. And I have read (or recall from psych class back in college ) that seemly inappropriate emotional responses can be a defence mechanism for the emotionally immature.
That said, what you are dealing with is heart-breaking. To be given a chance to be forgiven and to save her family and she treats it as if it's a joke instead of a precious gift is disgusting and she needs a huge wake-up call.
TDS - I am in denial. I want this to work. I only blame part of her behavior on my anger and that is only some of her current behavior not her A's.
Her saying that it was my porn usage that drove her to it I can't buy. My porn usage over the years was not excessive and it never replaced her. I understand her being hurt but like my BIL says, yea you looked at porn, many men do, but what she did was 1,000,000 times worse and is no excuse for what she did, over and over again. My BIL said her excuse makes no sense at all.
Hey now- don't just excuse the porn stuff with the "many men do" line. It is really hurtful to some women and feels as much like a betrayal as it would if your wife were lusting after other men. That said, what she has done is a million times worse than porn. Maybe a billion times worse.
The problem is, it isn't a supposed to be a contest. It is supposed to be your marriage!
You are obviously going forward with this new house --If that is the case, you should be looking forward to picking out your new house together and you are instead on edge about all of this drama, it seems like you'll be taking so much stress into this new space...
I am hoping for your sake, you can make it a sanctuary where true healing can take place.
TDS - I am in denial. I want this to work. I only blame part of her behavior on my anger and that is only some of her current behavior not her A's.
Her saying that it was my porn usage that drove her to it I can't buy. My porn usage over the years was not excessive and it never replaced her. I understand her being hurt but like my BIL says, yea you looked at porn, many men do, but what she did was 1,000,000 times worse and is no excuse for what she did, over and over again. My BIL said her excuse makes no sense at all.
Listen to your BIL.
What jumped out at me was when you were talking about the VAR recording - how you were disrespected - how they were laughing about her affairs - how she thought that buying a house was you attempting to isolate her but it was not going to work. All this and what you hang your hat on is that you did not hear her say she wanted to leave you. Really? How about all the things that you did hear? Snap out of your denial and see things how they really are and not how you want or wish they could be.
Did she say she was in love with you?
Did she say she was proud of you as her husband?
Did she say she respected you as her husband or as an honest man?
Did she say she was truly sorry and remorseful for the pain she has and is still causing you?
Did she say ANYTHING good about you or the marriage?
Sometimes doctors make the worst patients. Wake up councilor/minister. You have seen so much pain in your career that you are not clearly seeing the whole picture of your own life.
I really think you need to not see or talk to her for a while. A couple of weeks minimum - a month would be better. Take stock of your life. Decide what you need to do to be happy. Then do it.
She does not know about my posts here and honestly I don't want her to see them but I have nothing to hide. I really don't want her to know about this site, it is one of my safe spots.
I thought she might have found the VAR in the car. I don't think she did. The conversation with her sister was too raw. When the A was mentioned and she laughed about it if she knew she was being recorded she would not have done this.
Maybe, but she has won Oscars before... please take extra care.
Was it a nervous laugh or was she actually mocking your pain?
People sometimes respond strangely in difficult circumstances. For instance, we have all heard of those who laugh at a funerals. And I have read (or recall from psych class back in college ) that seemly inappropriate emotional responses can be a defence mechanism for the emotionally immature.
That said, what you are dealing with is heart-breaking. To be given a chance to be forgiven and to save her family and she treats it as if it's a joke instead of a precious gift is disgusting and she needs a huge wake-up call.
I'm very, very sorry.
With the VAR she found she found it the next day and it was ironic that she knew it was recording and when I was listening to it I know when she found it. I thought when I was listening to it that she might hove known about it because of the way conversations went on the phone and she did not take calls the way she normally did. So I thought that perhaps she did know about it.
The one in the car the conversation was not as if they were being recorded. Like I said, it was too raw, too spontaneous. If I am wrong on this then why would they have said what they said. It would have made no sense if they knew they were being recorded.
__________________
This kind of cosmic dumbassery occupies a temporal plane of ineptitude and lack of reason so profound a Zen master could spend a lifetime meditating upon its philosophical consequences.”
Sorry Thorburn. So sorry man. I'm not going to add anything to what everyone else has said, except this: you are getting played. Posted via Mobile Device
What jumped out at me was when you were talking about the VAR recording - how you were disrespected - how they were laughing about her affairs - how she thought that buying a house was you attempting to isolate her but it was not going to work. All this and what you hang your hat on is that you did not hear her say she wanted to leave you. Really? How about all the things that you did hear? Snap out of your denial and see things how they really are and not how you want or wish they could be.
Did she say she was in love with you?
Did she say she was proud of you as her husband?
Did she say she respected you as her husband or as an honest man?
Did she say she was truly sorry and remorseful for the pain she has and is still causing you?
Did she say ANYTHING good about you or the marriage?
Sometimes doctors make the worst patients. Wake up councilor/minister. You have seen so much pain in your career that you are not clearly seeing the whole picture of your own life.
I really think you need to not see or talk to her for a while. A couple of weeks minimum - a month would be better. Take stock of your life. Decide what you need to do to be happy. Then do it.
She did not say anything positive about me and that is what pained me the most.
__________________
This kind of cosmic dumbassery occupies a temporal plane of ineptitude and lack of reason so profound a Zen master could spend a lifetime meditating upon its philosophical consequences.”
Sorry Thorburn. So sorry man. I'm not going to add anything to what everyone else has said, except this: you are getting played. Posted via Mobile Device
Bandit, thanks - my goal is to make this work and I know what everyone is saying. For me, it is all dependent on her becoming an open book and she is resisting.
__________________
This kind of cosmic dumbassery occupies a temporal plane of ineptitude and lack of reason so profound a Zen master could spend a lifetime meditating upon its philosophical consequences.”
Bandit, thanks - my goal is to make this work and I know what everyone is saying. For me, it is all dependent on her becoming an open book and she is resisting.
I disagree because I care about you bro. This is a game to her. She is manipulating you and being cruel. Its almost sociopathic. Posted via Mobile Device
If you're a counselor, you're probably also a fixer. A problem solver. The sane one in your M. The mature one. You get the picture.
I've read and was told by my MC years ago, that when one partner overfuctions, the other is able to underfunction.
When you let someone fix their stuff and stop doing it for them, surprisingly many of them rise to the challenge. And if they don't, well I suppose therein lies your answer.
During counselling, my H even admitted that he was less mature and emotionally inept in comparison to me. The counsellor told me in a private session that I needed to stop fixing his life for him.
Our R was going well until one day about 6 weeks in, I was sharing my reservations and my doubts and he had the nerve to say, "I don't think you're every going to forgive me. We should probably just D." Then he started to cry. He also refused to go to our counselling session. Something in me just snapped and instead of reassuring him, I looked at him and said "I'm the one who was betrayed. You don't get to have doubts so spare me your Bullsh!t!" and then told him that if he EVER mentioned D to me again, he better have his lawyer on speed dial and the papers drawn up. I also said, "You broke this, you better damn well fix it because I am tired of cleaning up your mess! And we ARE going to counselling so get your damn shoes on now."
He stared at me in shock but he got his shoes on and then laughed because he said he's never heard me talk to him like that before. I don't say bullsh!t.
Hey now- don't just excuse the porn stuff with the "many men do" line. It is really hurtful to some women and feels as much like a betrayal as it would if your wife were lusting after other men. That said, what she has done is a million times worse than porn. Maybe a billion times worse.
The problem is, it isn't a supposed to be a contest. It is supposed to be your marriage!
You are obviously going forward with this new house --If that is the case, you should be looking forward to picking out your new house together and you are instead on edge about all of this drama, it seems like you'll be taking so much stress into this new space...
I am hoping for your sake, you can make it a sanctuary where true healing can take place.
Lost, thanks for your comments. I hear you about the porn.
I did not want the drama. The issue for me is I could list so many times my wife came up with things she was going to do and then turn around and not do it or tell me later that she only said it because that is what she thought I wanted to hear. And this is what is getting old. The lies, because that is what they are. Don't tell me that you are mending the fence with your sister and by the way I am not discussing us. I am only going there to help her through her grief. Then I find out it is all about talking about me. And then more lies about this and that. It has gotten old very fast.
__________________
This kind of cosmic dumbassery occupies a temporal plane of ineptitude and lack of reason so profound a Zen master could spend a lifetime meditating upon its philosophical consequences.”
Thanks, Cant. I am not very open to be beaten up at this point for being such a fool.
Thor,
Youre not a fool. You want to believe her. You love her. You have alot of years together. You are not a fool. Dont say that. It takes guts and sheer will and determination to endure what you have. Sending prayers and good thoughts and a (((CTU hug)))
Lost, thanks for your comments. I hear you about the porn.
I did not want the drama. The issue for me is I could list so many times my wife came up with things she was going to do and then turn around and not do it or tell me later that she only said it because that is what she thought I wanted to hear. And this is what is getting old. The lies, because that is what they are. Don't tell me that you are mending the fence with your sister and by the way I am not discussing us. I am only going there to help her through her grief. Then I find out it is all about talking about me. And then more lies about this and that. It has gotten old very fast.
Denial (or stupidity if you prefer ) is doing the same thing, the same way, over and over again and expecting a different outcome.
She cheats - you forgive - hope she won't do it again.
She lies - you forgive - hope she won't do it again.
She cheats (again) and lies repeatedly - you forgive (again) - hope she has learned a lesson (this time) and won't do it again.
She lies - you forgive - she lies- you forgive (again)- she lies-you make excuses - she lies - you ignore her behavior and try to to avoid the simple truth that will not change - your wife is a lying, serial cheater and has been for years.
Sorry for being blunt and harsh, I know you are being torn apart TRYING TO R, TRYING TO JUSTIFY R, trying to excuse your wife's behavior. At some point you have to focus on yourself, not her and not the marriage. She simply may not be capable of being the wife you want. Stop beating yourself up.
You really have to think about yourself now in terms of moving on without her. You have to at least consider that this is what is going to happen eventually. Remember the Boy Scout motto "Be Prepared".
Well the thing he son't know is whether she is cheating now..yes she did in the past..it's her behavior about her past that's not right. Glad you confronted her about it but what to do next is the question..she found the vars so how can he really trust her I do not know Posted via Mobile Device
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Re: Need support 
) that seemly inappropriate emotional responses can be a defence mechanism for the emotionally immature.
