There is no R in our marriage. She made it very clear that we are not working toward reconciliation. In fact, she rejects that word altogether.
This is starting from the ground floor. I told her I think that she has an EA going with the other man, and you are right that I have no moral grounds to stop it.
If she slept with someone else, even for revenge, I wouldn't call it cheating at this point. There is no marriage to cheat on. The best I can hope is that she doesn't fall in love with someone else, and perhaps we can bring a union back together with just she and I in the end...
To your last comment, I don't think ANYTHING will alleviate the severity of my cheating. In fact, at times I am afraid of our future life together because I know that this will change the rest of our lives. Together or separated in the end, this situation that I have put us in will change the course of both of our lives forevor.
There is no R in our marriage. She made it very clear that we are not working toward reconciliation. In fact, she rejects that word altogether.
This is starting from the ground floor. I told her I think that she has an EA going with the other man, and you are right that I have no moral grounds to stop it.
If she slept with someone else, even for revenge, I wouldn't call it cheating at this point. There is no marriage to cheat on. The best I can hope is that she doesn't fall in love with someone else, and perhaps we can bring a union back together with just she and I in the end...
To your last comment, I don't think ANYTHING will alleviate the severity of my cheating. In fact, at times I am afraid of our future life together because I know that this will change the rest of our lives. Together or separated in the end, this situation that I have put us in will change the course of both of our lives forevor.
This is all semantics. Being married is like being pregnant - you either are - are you aren't. YOU AND SHE ARE!! Either divorce and then she can date or she needs to come home and work on the marriage. If she really wants to divorce and see if she would choose to marry you again then she needs to divorce you and really try it on. This middle ground is in reality cake eating.
There is no R in our marriage. She made it very clear that we are not working toward reconciliation. In fact, she rejects that word altogether.
This is starting from the ground floor. I told her I think that she has an EA going with the other man, and you are right that I have no moral grounds to stop it.
If she slept with someone else, even for revenge, I wouldn't call it cheating at this point. There is no marriage to cheat on. The best I can hope is that she doesn't fall in love with someone else, and perhaps we can bring a union back together with just she and I in the end...
To your last comment, I don't think ANYTHING will alleviate the severity of my cheating. In fact, at times I am afraid of our future life together because I know that this will change the rest of our lives. Together or separated in the end, this situation that I have put us in will change the course of both of our lives forevor.
well I hate to say this but I don't think there's much hope for your marriage, as long as that EA continues she will happily stay separated and not divorced for you to finance her affair, she will cake eat as much as you did and maybe moreso
The 6 month draught (spelling) was expected based on your initial post.
- she may initiate during hysterical bonding - in general she dislikes it
- you may need to accept that she is never really going to initiate a meaningful amount
- was she comfortable rejecting you? Repeatedly? That is toxic and needs to be addressed
So now she gets a revenge affair eh? Ok. Sure seems like your core model with your wife is:
-I pretend to be ok with her behavior even when I am not
- when it all gets to be too much, I find comfort from another woman
If it was me: I would tell her, either focus on the recon or don't. I can't work a recon while you and "OM" pursue somethng that looks at minimum like an EA.
Followed by a real boundary: if you prefer him, we can proceed with a divorce.
As for the 6 months - that was not a unique thing for you two - the physical part of your marriage is too flaky for stability.
Unless that was you being stubborn about her initiating.
If she doesn't reject often, and genuinely is into it when you get her going - you need to accept that is how she is.
If you are getting the hurry up and finsh vibe, or lots of rejection, that is different.
UOTE=Barnowl;797578]Sigma - I did read that link. Thank you.
Morituri - My wife is certainly in "Hall Pass Mode." I wasn't going to bring this up, but this is a good enough segway. The first week after D-Day, she started texting many friends who were helping her cope with what I had done to our marriage. One of these friends just happens to be a great looking single guy who is "So nice" and "Just a friend". They text every day, they text into the evenings, and she has been hanging out with him. Of course this makes me insanely jealous, but she is her own woman who can make her own decisions. We both talked about her going out and having her own sexual experiences, and as hard as it was to talk about, that might just be a reality. At this point, what she and the other guy have going could easily (and in my opinion already is) become and emotional relationship. I don't know that they share enough compatibility for them to actually date and my wife leave me for him, but the knowledge that they might become intimate is certainly on my mind.
Honestly, sex was the major problem in our marriage. She never initiates it, and a few years ago we went 6 months with no intimate physical contact at all. (In my opinion, from the cheaters perspective) That is what I used to justify my actions. Should I have left her, probably. Was cheating a bad decision, most definitely. I just couldn't leave her though...
If she has sex with someone else, then that is something I will deal with at that time. Being a stupid jealous male, I may be inclined to try to hit the guy in the face, but that is a bridge I will cross when I come to it.
As odd as it sounds, this situation has actually jump started my wife's libido. We have been fairly active in the past month since D-Day. That is a concern because now I know that she could be ready and willing for another man...but, that doesn't stop me from wanting to allow her to be intimate with me as much as she is comfortable with.
This entire situation is unpredictable at best. It could literally become the unraveling of my entire life, or it could lead to the most amazing connection possible with a woman that I have loved since I was in junior high. Is it weird for me to want her to have her own sexual experiences? For her to have thoughts and memories the same as I do now? I think that would help her. Maybe she would find someone better, maybe she would leave me...or maybe she would see that sex is sex, and she would still want to be with me in the end.
I honestly have no idea at this point. It is moment to moment...[/QUOTE] Posted via Mobile Device
What if she does sleep with another guy? She could justify this still wasn't enough because it will be 3-to-1. You had three affairs.
You said yourself you are a jealous male. If she sleeps with 1, 2, 3 guys to even the score, you are going to get angry, despite not having the moral ground to stand on. Revenge affairs, especially ones that are out in the open, are just horrible ideas.
You are still married - even if you say the marriage is pointless and meaningless. At this point, my description of your marriage would be "open".
My point of that is this arrangement isn't going to work, long term. And she's still "dependent" on you if you are paying for her apartment. The whole thing sounds ludicrous for working toward any sort of meaningful re-"connection".
You are making a HUGE HUGE HUGE mistake by giving her permission to date. Call it what you want to, I am going to call it R, you cannot have ANY kind of successful marriage unless you are both 100% committed. ONE HUNDRED PERCENT.
Read the link in my sig about Understanding. That's how she feels right now, and you will feel if she 'dates other people'.
I think that you want her to have an affair(s) because it would make YOU feel better about yourself. In your mind, it would once again level the playing field. But the fact is, that a RA (revenge affair) seldom helps the recovery of a BS (betrayed spouse).
Yeah this might be true. There is a lot of good information here on this page for me to think about. I keep going back and forth. Yes my wife rejected my physical advancements. This caused me to emotionally shut down in our marriage, which fed the vicious cycle of not having an emotional connection with my wife that ultimately helps lead to a better sex life between us. It is a bit like chicken and the egg. I get rejected, I shut down, I don't emotionally connect with her, that causes her to shut down, and then she rejects me. Ugh, that is an ugly thing to type out and say.
The EA or whatever she is having is really up to her and her actions to decide how to proceed with. I know the guy, he is Mormon, and my wife and I aren't, and he seems to be pretty committed to it. This leads me to believe that he won't sleep with her, but there is a real possibility that they will date and kiss, and become close. Being in Utah, we deal with the mormon religion a lot, and there is no way my wife will end up with this guy long term. That is at least one comfort, haha. But, he is a Man first, a friend second, and a mormon third, which leads me to believe that he will think with his *ick instead of with his head. I think most men do that anyway...
I want to fix our marriage, because when it is good, it is the most amazing thing I have every experienced. Likewise, when it is bad, it is completely toxic, enough so much for me to walk away from obviously.
Maybe I am asking the wrong questions...maybe I am going about this wrong. Why hasn't anyone written a book that will help dictate my actions??
The six month separation was dictated by the lease contract, and it is actually 5 months. It will be done in October. She will be done with the apartment either way. We discussed that if we are going to divorce, then she will move back with her parents so she can afford to keep going to school and finish her degree. Financially we are totally separate. I still pay for her car payment, but the car could be sold at any time and she could pick herself up one. Other than that, I am not financially holding her hand through this...which, after 6 years of taking care of the finances, feels really strange to me!
Then what's there left to discuss? File for divorce and go dark on her.
If I could walk away from that woman then I would have three years ago. I get physically sick thinking about filing a divorce and walking away cold turkey. I can't quit this woman!
If I could walk away from that woman then I would have three years ago. I get physically sick thinking about filing a divorce and walking away cold turkey. I can't quit this woman!
Believe me I know how gut wrenching it is and I was the BS whose cheating wife was on her hands and knees, hysterically crying her eyes out and begging me not to leave her on DDay.
Nevertheless, you would be wise to consider that if she truly believes that there can never be R between you, that she is essentially telling you that the marriage is over. So if in her eyes, the marriage is dead, then the only thing remaining is to bury the body (divorce).
letting her 'cake eat' is poisoning your chances of a future with her.
I understand you feel its penance and your holding onto a picture where she realizes how much she loves you and comes home.... but, Your insuring that is not going to happen by playing this game.
How do I bring that up to her as the BS without sounding like the guy who had an affair, and now he just wants to bail. I don't want to bail. I want it to work out, but I want to get tot he bottom of how she feels.
I think it is too early to honestly know. I think she deserves the 5-6 months of my time trying to make it work...seeing if she wants to go the route of a revenge affair...really just let things play out. We have shared 11 years of our lives together. I think she deserves a few months of my time to hopefully figure out what she wants.
At this point, my plan to win her back is really going to depend a lot on how much effort I put into courting her. I know she loves me. She still tells me she loves me, but she is not going to move past what I have done to our marriage without me making some serious effort to show her that she is the only woman for me.
If we stay married, then I have this feeling that it is going to be the most amazing bond possible. That all of the isues we have been dealing with the past few years in our marriage that I used to justify stepping out will disolve, and we will be good.
Maybe that is just a "cheaters perspective" and reality will be hitting me in the face...who knows. I just can't imagine my life without her, and I want to do anything I can to keep her in my life.
It's more likely reality will eventually hit her in the face.
Using marital difficulties as a reason to step out or to address issues, is a huge mistake.
Most of the times it is a fatal mistake for the marriage.
You do sound remorseful though, and if you continue with the heavy lifting and never cheat again, your marriage may last.
It will never be the same though, and although some aspects of it may improve. She will never trust you again.
Also, just a question. Since you think that cheating may resolve the marital issues and make your marriage better, are you okay with her stepping out for awhile to make things better and to address issues?
Also, just a question. Since you think that cheating may resolve the marital issues and make your marriage better, are you okay with her stepping out for awhile to make things better and to address issues?
I kind of discussed this a bit. I don't have a problem right now with her going out and gaining her own experiences. I just don't want her to fall in love with someone else. But, as for sex...if she needs to go out and do that with someone else, then I am all for it.
I feel like the marriage is over. She feels like the marriage is over. We both feel like there is enough of a bond between us to attempt to date again and reconnect. It will be a new marriage though. She will never trust me again, at least never the way she did, and I understand that.
I am certainly remorseful, and I have been trying to do the heavy lifting. There is still a lot bouncing around in my head about what I want for my future too...nothing is set in stone here. Barely one month past D-Day, I would say that everything is still really fresh on our minds...
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Re: A cheater's perspective - 4 weeks past D-Day 
