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I need help really, really bad.

121K views 356 replies 92 participants last post by  IIJokerII 
#1 ·
I'm 52 years old, have been married for 30 years and have 4 kids (8,10,12 & 14). Never cheated on my wife once ever. Lied to her about stopping smoking many times, stare at attractive women once in a while, but never, ever touched. My wife has been home many years raising our kids while I worked. She recently got a job as a school crossing guard, and all of a sudden has developed a social life again.
Yesterday, she dropped the bomb shell on me. She met a guy last September, started off casually with coffee at the diner for 4-5 weeks, a few days a week. Last get together, they jumped in his truck took a ride. Kissing, touching led to unprotected sex. She says she cried as soon as they got intimate and stopped doing it very quickly, at which point the guy yelled at her "why'd you start something you couldn't finish?". He had giver her a TracPhone which she eventually gave back so they could call each other and set up meetings without me knowing about it. Since this ended back end of last year, he disappeared. Can't find him by name, and he was on Long Island for work and had North Carolina plates. Said he loved her and wanted her to leave me. Things haven't always been good with us, normal marriage issues over the years, but never like this. She says this is the first and only time she's ever been with another guy since she met me. To make things worse, she now tested positive for Herpes 2, which I got tested for this morning and am awaiting results.
I don't have any friends to talk to about this, and have a lot of mixed emotions. Don't know if I'm more mad at the picture in my mind of them having sex in the back of his Denali, or the fact that she now has a disease she may have given me. It disgusts me to picture her naked with another guy, and all the things that led up to them getting physical that day. Also mad that I may never be able to have sex with her again because of the Herpes, and can't picture myself getting intimate with her, while I'll picture them together in my mind. This whole thing really rots. I feel like if I find him I'll kill him. I'm mad, embarrassed, grossed out, depressed and a little numb. When she told me yesterday in tears, I held her close and told her people make mistakes and as long as you learn from them we can work it out. By the time I got home from work, I was very angry, took my wedding ring off, and couldn't sleep at all last night, again picturing my wife naked, touching a strange guy is killing me.
Please help with some practical advice, as my life as I knew it just fell apart.
Thanks,
Larry
 
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#232 ·
You misread what I wrote. The punishment is not the new accountabilty, rather the constant interrogations, accusations and general hatred for the past 3 weeks. That had to stop or there was no way to move ahead. And that was punishing both of us at the same time, especially for me having to re-live all the glorious details.
 
#235 ·
Hey Larry---I have no answers, about anything---there are no answers---ultimately this is all on you, and what you can live with

What I am saying to you is this----your wife of 30 yrs---replaced you, not legit, by a D., or Sep. but by just going and taking another man to herself-----she is married to you, but dating her lover---she climbs in the backseat of his truck---she voluntarily went, SHE KNEW WHAT WAS GONNA HAPPEN---also she got you an extra little present------that AMOUNTS TO THE MURDERING OF YOUR MGE.---In relationship parlance it is a crime, the one crime that goes along with the cheating----if this were a crime that would go to the D A, you and everyone else would be demanding punishment---so far there is no punishment here----

By demanding that she check in, and her whereabouts be known to you every minute---how is that equating to a punishment----for replacing you with another man, for destroying you, the making her check in, is nothing----how your destruction is balanced out with punishment---I have no idea---I know what I would do---but that only serves for me---but you cannot just let her back into her prior lifestyle--2 weeks after her admission of guilt, with nothing more than checking in, for a punishment---just my opinion.
 
#236 ·
I appreciate your opinions, and am just curious. If it were you (and in many cases, you have been in my shoes), except for murder or revenge, what is justifiable punishment for infidelity (seriously)? Many seem to think its the threat of spending the rest of her life alone; the threat of losing everything she has after a 30 year lifetime with me; the loss of security and someone she knows she can trust to grow old with? Aside from those, what do you all think since that seems to be a current discussion-that 2 or 3 weeks is not enough punishment no matter what that punishment has been.
 
#237 ·
The problem is that you seem to be confusing "consequence" with punishment. You're not trying to hurt your wife. Transparency, counseling, these are not punishments. These are meant to strengthen your marriage and get to the bottom of the affair and your marital problems.

You're trying to get her to come to terms with her infidelity. You need to know why she did what she did. This is not a "punishment." How can you stay committed to a woman who cheated and doesn't know why?

One of the purposes of consequences is to force her to feel guilt and remorse for what she did. Consequences also let the cheating partner know that the BS is not fooling around, and is capable and willing to put their foot down and fight against the things the do not tolerate in their marriage.

I daresay knowing she got an STD as a result of her stupidity is "punishment" enough. However, you need to know if she feels true remorse for her actions. You need to know if she feels bad for what she did to you. Exposure tends to helps, since it reveals to the people that she loves that she has been unfaithful. Nothing guilts you quite like your mom and dad knowing you ruined your own marriage.

Take a look at that chart. If your wife is doing the actions on the right side, you know she isn't actually remorseful, and is simply looking to sweep this all under the rug.

 
#238 ·
Hey Larry---let me take this one step further, then I won't bother you anymore

If someone were to just plain for no good reason, they can come up with, or for spite, or to experience some excitement---they were to slam your bike over and damage it---basically beyond repair----what would you do, what would you want-----this would not be put to rest in 2 weeks would it---you would want retribution, civilly, and criminally, would you not

You are not far from your golden years, where you will spend, much more time with your wife, than you do know, its just the way it is-------your wife knew that this was all approaching, and yet she willingly, voluntarily put it all at risk---does she just get to walk away, as if nothing happened, while you suffer all the hurt/pain, she has wrought, for who knows how long.

I got tell you one other thing---I don't care what your wife says---they were together for at least 25 dates, are you really gonna tell me nothing happened but talk and coffee, TWENTY FIVE TIMES????????
 
#239 ·
And Larry in time you will realize there is no punishemnt worthy of infidelity.
Murder does fit. Revenge does not make it go away it just adds misery.

Not even her std because that is a reminder to her of her poor choice and a daily reminder to you of her betrayal/stupidity.
Posted via Mobile Device
 
#241 ·
Without the pox, she'd still be banging the guy. Larry, if you're bound and determined to stay with her no matter what, how do you feel about open marriage? I mean, you need to get some relief somehow, right? And you won't be doing that with your poxed wife, will you?

Here's the thing; you're going to have to use a rubber with your WW from now on and that means your wife won't be able to absorb the testosterone and other mood altering chemicals in your semen. She'll be getting less and less out of sex, in the happy mood and libido department. Your sex life is just going to get worse and worse. Is that any way to live?
 
#242 ·
Strengthening the marriage,I think thats the important thing in this case.
I think you and your wife need to understand what that need was that made her behave the way she did.
And if having sex in public or some other kink comes up then the both of you need to act on it. But first you have to figure what the behavoir is so you as her spouse can fill it.
 
#243 ·
@ machiavella, he can always pull the condom off and put his semen on her face and she can eat it with her hands. Would that get the absorbsion that you talk about?

And to other, for some women that could count as a consequences?

Again here I go thinking out side the box!
 
#247 ·
Other punishments---no sex for a while, no marital bedroom for a while, let her live in a small room, with all her clothes, and cosmetics---take away her spending priveleges--isolate her for a while, just as she did to Larry, there are things that can be done, to show some form of punishment.

If she doesn't like any of these things, or won't put up with them, then I guess she doesn't really want the mge---But a woman in her early 50's is not just gonna pull up stakes, and leave her mge----she won't be able to just go it on her own

Just some random thoughts on punishment---none of it has to be tooooo long, but just enuff to let her know, that she just doesn't get to come back as if nothing happened, aside from monitering
 
#250 ·
Larry consequences are not punishments, its a way to keep the marriage stronger.
Now you know your wife had issues with boundaries, how such a person can have the privacy, she need your help in keeping her boundaries and making the marriage stronger. Is this a punishment, NO.

BS wants to believe their WS and move on with their life. They want to forget and forgive as soon as possible, this is the same all the WS also wanted. If you feel that you questioning her for 3 weeks was too much for her or you then what will you say about people who asks questions about the A yrs after their R.

You are not going to forget it, even if you wanted badly, but you can forgive her for your peace of mind and move on with your life KNOWING what she is capable of/did. But you should know the full truth.

Many people who replays to your thread don't believe that you know the full truth or your wife is truly remorseful (from what you wrote here). R can only succeed if the WS is truly remorseful and ready to answer any question repeatedly for any time in near future, This is not punishment.
 
#251 ·
The only way I can gauge remorse is by her actions. She has apologized profusely over and over again. The other night while she was laying in my arms, she sobbed for about an hour and a half. I think she's realized her mistake and how it has affected both of us individually and as a couple. I want to move on and make the future as good as it can be for us, given the circumstances. I can only hope that at some point she will recognize what drove her to do this, and why she did it, and internalize it so it doesn't ever happen again.
 
#253 ·
Figured you all deserved an update on my situation, as you were all there for me when my life took a turn for the worse. Life is moving on. A new life. Meetings with the marriage counselor once a week for an hour and a half are helping a lot. The initial anger and disbelief have basically subsided, although I do have an occasional relapse. I have stopped waking my wife up in the middle of the night and interrogating her, which has reduced the pain for both of us, but we still discuss it when I have questions. The sex...well that's kind of weird. We've gone back to it. Not on a regular basis like before, but once in a while. Wearing a condom for the first time in 30 years just plain sucks, and is a constant reminder of this event. I can't get the same feeling or sensitivity with it as without it, so I basically wear it for a while, then take it off, and she finishes me off with her hands. I think that's about the best we can hope for. I'm constantly worried about where its OK to touch her with the threat of herpes and that takes a lot of the fun and spontaneity out of it, which also sucks. I've spoken to my primary care physician, her gynecologist, the CDC in Atlanta, the National Institue of Helath in DC, the NY State Dept. of Health, and an infectious disease specialist, and hit most every website on the net for Herpes 2 info. Its amazing how such a prevalent disease has no consistency at all in diagnosis or prevention. Each resource has different opinions. For example, she tested positive by a culture which is like 100% guaranteed, but tested negative in a blood test. I also tested negative. Her gyno says there's a high percentage of false negative tests, and I probably have it even though my blood test came back negative. My doctor says that's totally untrue, and if I tested negative, there's a 99% chance the test was right. The most exact tests come in around 94% positive accuracy, and 99% negative accuracy. Worst of it is, if she's got asymptomatic shedding, I really don't know for sure where I can touch her, whcih means cuddling, touching etc. is virtually out. Someone here likened it to having a room mate rather than a wife. Now I understand.... To make matters freakin' worse, 2 condoms already broke during intimacy. Now I have to go back for testing in a few months AGAIN. Anyway, we're still together and making the best of a new relationship on many levels. The accountability is now there on a daily basis, and that plus her actions are slowly allowing me to get trust back into the relationship. Well that's it for now. Life goes on....
 
#255 ·
It's interesting that the sex drive is stronger than the wish to stay healthy. I think it's the biological need to procreate.

You know she has it because of her outbreak. And it can only be detected with a culture test. Maybe that's the test you need in the future to confirm when you have your outbreak.
 
#256 ·
The accuracy is reported in studies, which the ones I have seen online are all based on how long since exposure. The test which differentiates between HSV1 and HSV2 has a very low rate of false positives, but the false negatives are dependant on time. If a person is already HSV1 infected (oral herpes), it takes longer for the HSV2 antibodies to build up and be detected.

I would have her retested for the blood test. She might have had a false negative because of taking the test too soon.

The culture should be 100% if it came back positive. Plus she had some kind of lesion which was swabbed to do that test. Seems like a definite diagnosis, but I would also have that test repeated if she has another outbreak.

I presume both tests she had were specific to HSV2?
 
#257 ·
The sex drive is part of a normal marital relationship. Its mostly the only thing we have that's (supposedly) still between just us. That is what brings the closeness together, and hopefully that is what will help re-build the relationship. As for the herpes, if I never have an outbreak, I can't get a culture as there's nothing to test. The blood test apparently doesn't check for a virus, rather the antibodies against the virus. Sometimes it takes months or even years to build up the antibodies. Some places say I'll never build up antibodies unless I have an outbreak, in which case I may test negative forever. Since most of the virus is spread by people who don't even know they have it, I now understand a little bit more about it. Its the asymptomatic shedding that's still the mystery. It seems that an infected person can shed the virus once, or several times a year without any signs or feelings that an outbreak is coming on. As such, the virus can still be spread with my skin touching her outbreak area on her skin, even though she has no open sores. Its much easier to spread in a mucous membrane area, which is why women get it easier and more often than men. It can go through microscopic cuts in your skin, and in bodily fluids and some say; it isn't easily spread in the mouth as its an acidic environment. Most agree that both Herpes 1 and 2 can get on your lips or genital area-either one truly sucks I guess. Unless I wear a full body condom, there's a chance of her bodily fluids still getting on me down there, and getting inside me somehow. Can't believe how much I'm learning, and still have to learn. The question keeps coming up: If I stay with her for the rest of my life, is there any chance things would be easier if I actually had, or get Herpes from her? Sounds crazy, as no sane person would ever want genital lesions (as infrequent as they might be), but at least then the pressure and stress would be gone as far as our sexual relationship. I can't be the first one to ever have this crazy thought. I'm not considering doing that on purpose, and I equate it to suicide, just thinking out loud.
 
#258 ·
Thoughts are good. There is a lot to think about.

My h had reocurrent outbreaks after the 1st one, almost like constant. He finally got a rx for it, and he says it hasn't come back since then. (we aren't intimate anyways, we are done) but for him, his doctor agreed it was the stress of hiding it from me that contributed to his outbreaks. Once he told me, things calmed down.

And I do think there is some merit that the first few years are worse. If someone has had it for a very long time, the outbreaks are mild and far between, if at all.

Yeah, I have a close female friend with an exH who's had it for many years. She has tested positive for antibodies, but never had an outbreak, or so mild she never noticed. She made a choice to stop using condoms along the way. Because he rarely ever had an outbreak, only once every few years and they abstained.

Uncircumsized men are a higher risk, same as women.

How "bad" was her outbreak? Several sores, or just one? Has it come back? There are milder strains... and persistent ones.

It's part of her now. It can't be undone. You accept it, or you don't. The truth is, anyone who has sex is at risk for herpes.

But there might be something to waiting for about a year. I think I read that the chances of shedding \ passing it on decreased with the length of time a person has had it. Until it becomes more dormant. Just thinking out loud myself.
 
#259 ·
Just one sore this July, and first and only outbreak almost 9 months after being exposed and none since. I'm still worried about getting it when she shows no signs of shedding. An outbreak can be either with or without a sore. With a sore is easy--hands off and stay away. Without a sore can be most anytime, anywhere with no external signs, Just becasue she ****ed up, doesn't mean I'm interested in the same thing. Given a choice, I would rather have no sores-thank you very much. If your friend decided to stop using condoms just because her ex had outbreaks so infrequently, how did she not know he wasn't really having an outbreak, just not showing signs of it, meaning he was contagious? I was specifically told that just because you don't see sores, doesn't mean you can't get it or give it.
 
#260 · (Edited)
So its been about 2 years since this crap started, and I've been trying to make things work. Had a blood test done right after I found out and tested negative. Had another one done this past Saturday, and results came back positive today. I'm f***ed. Doctor said cases of false positives are rare, but recommended having another test done in 3 months. According to the HSV-1 test results, anything between 0.90 and 1.10 is "equivocal"; anything over 1.10 is "positive". I scored over 5.00. According to the HSV-2 test results, anything between 0.90 and 1.10 is "equivocal"; anything over 1.10 is "positive". I scored 1.16. My lucky, freakin' day. Sucks to be me today......
 
#265 ·
So its been about 2 years since this crap started, and I've been trying to make things work. Had a blood test done right after I found out and tested negative. Had another one done this past Saturday, and results came back positive today. I'm f***ed. Doctor said cases of false positives are rare, but recommended having another test done in 3 months. According to the HIV-1 test results, anything between 0.90 and 1.10 is "equivocal"; anything over 1.10 is "positive". I scored over 5.00. According to the HIV-2 test results, anything between 0.90 and 1.10 is "equivocal"; anything over 1.10 is "positive". I scored 1.16. My lucky, freakin' day. Sucks to be me today......
Damn she cheated on you, admitted to having herpes, you took her back anyway and now you have the HIV/AIDS virus. Have you considered suing the brilliant marriage counselor who advised you guys to start having sex 2 years ago in order to reconnect??? Man these marriage counselors are something else.
 
#263 · (Edited)
Sorry to hear Larry. I know those who live with it. It can be done. What is the wife's reaction? Has she had further testing?
 
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