In situations like this I think that honesty is the best policy. Just put all the facts on the table and whatever happens happens. What other choice do you really have?
There are people who advocate not telling about an affair if you stay with your spouse. The problem with that your wife is very likely to find out about it anyway... .the OW is probably the most likely person to tell her once the OW realizes that you have walked away from her.
So yes you have created your own hell. {I'm not being judgemental here... there are cases in my life where I too have created my own hell and getting out of it is not all that easy. I'm just making an observation about your situation.}
Lord Mayhem...
How many times do I need to explain???
My marriage is *NOT* "soooooooo BBBaaaadddd".
It's, by definition, what I would describe as "SEMI-HAPPY".
Seriously, look it up. It explains a lot of what I'm (and others) are going through.
Momma2Four: I actually don't believe the OW will confide with my wife. Because of what's transpired, she's partly on the fence with a preference to stay with her husband at this stage anyway.
I'm just at a point where I'm at the end of my rope and can't live this way anymore.
Ah, so the OW is not all that interested in leaving her husband for you. That does change things quite a bit.
Thank you for your kind words of righteousness. I'm so happy to hear this board is filled with people with superior morality over me.
That being said, you have no idea what the human body is capable after dealing with years & years of stress. This wasn't a sudden active choice like what pants to wear. This was a slow gradual degredation of a relationship (the marriage) to the point where I just didn't care anymore. Once I reached that point, I no longer respected my wife. I no longer respected (or was emotionally invested) in the marriage.
While cheating was not the answer to the marriage problem, it was the (temporary) answer to the emotional need that was unfulfilled. But little did I know... to my complete surprise... that I fell head over heels in love with this person. During the first couple years of the affair, I felt relatively little guilt. As far as I was concerned, my wife was already emotionally "checked out" anyway.
I'm sure you would not understand my human emotional drives because your moral compass is so far above mine. Be thankful that you are in a terrific relationship with your significant other and that you would never even consider or contemplate such a devastating act.
What we need is more people like you running our country than our politicians.
Cheating is an act of compromised integrity. Having a compromised integrity can happen to people from all walks of life. This happens when one has poor boundaries and makes poor choices. They get their needs met by others and fall in love with them. Happens everyday. This is the most common scenario. Along with this comes history rewriting. But the biggest problem here is that it causes a marriage to spiral downwards. It cheats the marriage and the family. The emotional energy given outside of the marriage is stolen from the marriage. There is no excuse to cheat. Every day that you continue to cheat you are making this choice.
So as has been stated you need to make a choice between working on your marriage or divorcing and moving on. Living in between as a cheater is wrong IMO. It is for sure selfish and cruel. You can disagree all you want. Cheating is wrong and you have been doing this for four years. Quality people have integrity. They choose not to cheat. You do the math. Start listing the qualities of a one who cheats and you have a rather undesireable list of traits. Not anyone to be associated with and not anyone you can trust. This is not as much moral as it is pragmatic.
All else equal are people who don't cheat better human beings than those who cheat? Most certainly they are. Would you be a better person in stopping the cheating. Absolutely.
I understand EAs and I understand how one can make the poor choices to go down that road. But there is no way to cover up the continued path of a cheater.
Through all of this obfuscation and attacking of people this is really very simple. Make a choice. Then follow it through. The damage is done. What you do with this situation defines who you are. You choose.
Insulting good folks is not a very good trait either. Take that with you.
Well if the OW might not be interested in leaving her husband for you, why would you even consider leaving your wife for her?
Perhaps you can make a pact with the OW... you both write letters to your spouses then you mail them out together ... or email them. So that you both tell your spouses about the affair and your intention of being together at the same time? That way you both know that the other is not going to back out.
Of course one or both of you could still reconcile with your spouse, but atleast you do not leave your wife to be left holding the bag.
I believe if the OW is satisfied with how things are resolved and moving on with her husband she will not go out of her way to ruin mine. Keep in mind that she feels the same way about me as I do. We both were at a position where we wanted to leave our spouses and spend our lives together. Because of the damage divorce would cause, I couldn't follow through (even though my heart seriously wanted to). A constant battle between my heart and my brain this is. I sometimes feel very depressed with losing the OW. Because of the amount of years living in a medicore passionless semi-happy marriage ironically I don't feel depressed losing someone I have very little emotional connection with.
The main thing my wife and I have in common is our children. The main thing my OW and I have in common is each other (but little else). There are addictive feelings towards the feelings the OW brings - not because it's a "renewed feeling" I haven't felt in a while but moreso because it's an intense feeling I have never felt before at all.
- Breakup with OW / love of my life. Tell my wife all about the news of 4 - year affair. Roll the dice and take the chance wife doesn't divorce me (even though I actively choose wife over OW). Statistical odds indicate chance of success in marriage is probably less than OW / love of my life. I end up alone (which I'm sure you all feel I deserve) living in 400sq foot apartment paying child support. OW lives on with her hubby (since I never wanted a relationship with OW under "desparate" terms anyway). Kids are mad & devastated. Wife is hurt. Family is pissed off. Basically the same results than if I "man'd up" and divorced wife to live with S.O. The only difference is doing it YOUR way the family devastation STILL occurs (and I get "righteously punished") versus doing it MY way (where I actually live the rest of my life with a spouse who truly loves me).
Er. No. What we are saying is that in all probability you will end up alone in a 400sq ft apartment paying child support. REGARDLESS of your next move.
There is 3% chance your love is real and that you will go on to a happy fulfilling life.
There is a slightly higher chance that you will be able to salvage something out of your marriage. our wife may have checked out already, you just haven't noticed.
The reality is brutal for all concerned, we know. We see is all the time.
Quote:
I bet if the shoe was on the other foot... and if I was an "abusive bastard" that drove my wife to cheat... you all would root for me and wish the same punishment on her. In the eyes of this forum, the ONLY thing that is seen is the cheater is an "evil coward" and the other party is the "innocent victim".
Er No. however. cheating is well, cheating. You get more than you deserve because your well, cheating. You have not mentioned abuse, therefore no discussion.
Entropy3000... Thank you for the hearfelt & honest advice. I'm at the point where I need to get off the fence and make a choice.
Riding the fence was what happened the 1st couple years. Nobody got (directly) hurt, but you are right in that both marriages were not given the full dedication it deserved to thrive. Sad to say but once you hit a point where you don't care anymore, it really doesn't matter.
Even though I'm desperately in love with OW, the attitude change in my wife this last year has given me serious pause. Before (in the past), these "subtle improvements" were always fleeting moments that went by the wayside after the dust settled. I sometimes wonder if this is another game she's playing, or if she's finally for real about it. Several months ago I emailed my wife (I NEVER email my wife - lol) some deep feelings and concerns I have over things. It was a long thoughtful letter. She said she "needed some time" to sort things through her head before responding. To this day she hasn't responded. This is her typical pattern... of pretending to be supportive (or desire to meet my needs) and choosing the "lazy way" out and passively forget something that is important to me in hopes I didn't remember.
EleGirl... I'm still torn about hurting the children. I'm also not looking forward to hurting my wife's feelings either, but would do it when necessary to live an honest life. I'm also very afraid of causing all this turmoil & damage over NOTHING... given the low % chance we probably have at successfully "living happily ever after".
One avenue to consider would be to cut our losses and just move forward with our spouses. No more lies or cheating. Fessing up to the affair is really a tough call. On 1 hand, it will be awful living for decades on end with that deep dark secret. Terrible. Think about that!!! (OTOH, it wouldn't be all that awful if the choice of divorce was made to stand by the OW but let's put that aside for now). On the flipside, if the affair is kept secret only I would live with the guilt (which will hopefully fade). I suppose if wife somehow finds out I could come clean at that point. I guess that would be better than to continuously deny.
Coming clean and asking for divorce would solve much of this anguish, but will stockpile MANY problems thereafter. Coming clean and asking to stay would also stockpile MANY problems. Letting things lie and ending the affair discreetly but with full honesty on keeping on that path is probably the lesser of the 3 evils.
Some people advocate for not telling the spouse about the affair. They say that telling only serves to relieve your own guilt and lays the pain on your spouse.
As a person who has been cheated on many times i wonder about the wisdom of that. Would I have appreciated not knowing, avoiding the pain? I'm not sure. At least in knowing I know who I was married to and was able to make decisions based on the truth.
In both of my marriages to men who cheated.. the infidelity was not the ultimate reason for the divorce. Their lying and mistreat of me was the reason. I would have divorced them had they cheated or not.
The problem that I see with not telling is that true intimacy is based on total transparency and openness in a marriage. If you are lying to your wife and she does not know the depth of your unhappiness, etc., how can there ever be true intimacy in your marriage?
Some people advocate for not telling the spouse about the affair. They say that telling only serves to relieve your own guilt and lays the pain on your spouse.
As a person who has been cheated on many times i wonder about the wisdom of that. Would I have appreciated not knowing, avoiding the pain? I'm not sure. At least in knowing I know who I was married to and was able to make decisions based on the truth.
In both of my marriages to men who cheated.. the infidelity was not the ultimate reason for the divorce. Their lying and mistreat of me was the reason. I would have divorced them had they cheated or not.
The problem that I see with not telling is that true intimacy is based on total transparency and openness in a marriage. If you are lying to your wife and she does not know the depth of your unhappiness, etc., how can there ever be true intimacy in your marriage?
EleGirl... This is so true. But cummon, my wife was told (both verbally and NON verbally) for years how unsatisfied I have become. Only this past year did I see any signs of improvement.
EleGirl... This is so true. But cummon, my wife was told (both verbally and NON verbally) for years how unsatisfied I have become. Only this past year did I see any signs of improvement.
I understand the frustration with a spouse who will not respond when you tell them clearly what you need. This is often coupled with them not telling you what is missing for them.. what they need. I get this. I've lived this. I gave up.
The reason that your wife responded this last time is that you let her know that you were dead serious, that you were going to leave. It's sad that it took that for her to start to wake up.
But now that you are in an affair, your marriage cannot grow to it's full potential even if she became your perfect wife. Your attention is elsewhere.
There are some books that I think you would benefit from... Dr. Harley is the author of all of them.
"Surviving an Affair" and then the other 3 are linked to in my signature block below for building a passionate marriage.
Although I'm in favor of damage control, my honest opinion on what my wife's best interest pretty much lies in what happens in our future. If my wife and I work hard at rejuvenating our marriage and are living happy again I guess I could say this chapter in our lives is water under the bridge. The children and my wife would all be spared the emotional turmoil of either divorce of an angry emotionally distraught wife.
If my wife and I try to work things out, but end in divorce later I would say we should have just divorced now (or 2 years ago) and saved each other the time & headache (and is irrelevant if wife was made aware of affair or not).
If I divorce my wife to be with OW, it would probably be in her best interest to know the entire truth (including why I prefer to divorce) even though I would prefer to spare her feelings of me leaving her for another woman.
If I divorce my wife to be on my own, I could go either way (telling her about previous affair or not).
If I choose to be with my wife and if I stupidly stray again, it was absolutely in her BEST INTEREST to know all the facts before making a decision.
At least I'm aware now that having an affair is not the answer. Sitting down and being blunt with your partner is the best choice.
Getting a divorce and starting a new relationship is probably 2nd best choice (or first best if you find the love of your life). Be as it may, I have seen first-hand a couple relationships that were "soul-mate" style from start to finish after a previous marriage. It's a little cloudy if an actual physical affair was going on. I think chances are it was, but surely NOT for 4 years (maybe a few-several months). Still, it can be frustrating for the partner reminding the spouse to make changes (but nothing seriously comes about).
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Re: Seeking Honest Advice for a Soul in a Pickle 
