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Did my wife cheat, or am I crazy???

86K views 243 replies 57 participants last post by  weightlifter 
#1 ·
Not sure if the wife is cheating, please help, I will try to be concise.
Evidence:
*lots of sexy underwear in her drawer she never wears with me, but I have seen her wear to work
*when I suggested a surprise weekday dinner out, she exclaimed "noooo!!" as if I was interupting other plans she was looking forward too. She quickly backed off and accepted the "date".
*passionless sex without eye contact or any effort on her part, just a chore.
* comments accusing me of cheating, and negative comments regarding my character, basic bickering, and pointedly "You better make more money so you can keep me".

Investigation:
*Installed a VAR, found nothing, though I only did it for a week.
*found no other evidence, no red flags, just my "gut feeling".

Confrontation:
I can't shake this "gut feeling" that something is up, so, as we were preparing for a trip abroad, I asked her at dinner "Do you still want to be in a realtionship with me... I had a feeling perhaps you were seeing someone else"...

*Her first response was "WHy are you bringing this up now?" , and she looked "concerned"and listened while eating and not making eye contact.
*I ask "why all the sexy underwear, I never see it, and why do you wear it to work", and she was somewhat speechless, said the underwear was uncomfortable to her, and anyway she didn't have that much sexy underwear, we look thru her drawer and it is actually more than 50% of what is in the drawer. She got a guilty look on her face, a sheepish smile.
*"Are you seeing someone at work"...and she laughed and asked if I saw all the ugly men she worked with. Then she mentioned she was "insulted" that I believe she would cheat, because cheating was a "character flaw" and "disgraceful". Then she CHANGED THE SUBJECT...
*I ask "Do you believe I cheat" and she laughed disrespectfully, as if this is incomprehensible, and said she doesn't suspect me of cheating. (My impression, she implied no woman would want me?).
*Then I asked about her old boyfriend, she once told me that he called her asking to meet for drinks. At this point she says THIS NEVER HAPPENED...then she added that I have a lot of baggage from my previous experience with the cheating X... and she insisted that I BELIEVE that she did not cheat.

NOW I see different behavior
*she became much nicer to me, now has "present sex" where she looks at me and makes an effort.
*A week later she brings this up out-of-the-blue: "I didn't cheat and I will take a lie detector test if you like".
* out-of-the-blue she tells me she loves me, and has mentioned that we will never get a divorce since "neither of us cheats".

I don't know what to make of all this. I am leaning towards believing she cheated, but I am also somewhat paranoid due to my x-wife's infidelity. I am confused. Any insight is greatly appreciated.
 
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#61 ·
You don't have to be an Alpha male to stand up for yourself and deserve a healthy relationship.

You also need to realize your wife isn't the catch you seem to keep telling yourself she is.
 
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#62 ·
You asked early on if anyone thought her agreeing to a polygraph actually indicated guilt & I will say that that was my first reaction.

I suspect she was disarming you. If she appears open to a test like that then your suspicions can be cut off at the pass; you will be relieved and stop asking questions.

You have many strikes against you here, in my opinion. As far as red flags for cheating, there are many, not least of which the whole sexy lingerie thing. Then there are your unorthodox living arrangements for a married couple; statistically, married people who live apart a large percentage of the time divorce at a very high rate. And then the whole 'she wanted to marry her millionaire' thing. Lots of strikes.

I would call her bluff on the poly. They are, as you note, not reliable enough to be used in court, but the prospect of one can be very effective at 'coaxing' the truth out of someone.
 
#67 · (Edited)
Thanks, this was my thought about my wife offering to take the poly: to end the suspciains and discussions. Let's face it, she prefers I never bring it up again, I could sense that. Since she offered to take the poly a week after my confrontation, says "Honey, I didn't cheat on you and I will take a poly if you need me to".

My first reaction: your guilty.
 
#77 ·
I wouldn't based on what the OP has been typing. The more he writes, the worse it looks. But let me lay out a scenario for you and tell me if you would give your husband the benefit of the doubt if you experienced this:

You are married to a man that owns his own place. You own yours and for whatever reason, the two of you elect to continue living in your separate homes and agree to go to spend time together roughly 3 to 4 days out of every week and live separated the balance of the week. You discover that your husband has a drawer full of fancy silk boxers and a bunch of new threads. However, every time you spend time together you only see him wearing tidy whities, with holes and pee stains, and sweat pants. If your spouse is not wearing the sexy silk boxers for you, then why does he have so many pairs of them?

That doesn't even cover the uncomfortable feelings his wife gets every time he asks her direct questions about infidelity.
 
#86 ·
You better hope she isn't cheating because with you approach to it, forgiveness, rug sweeping, thinking your too far beneath her to speak up etc, if she did cheat she will find a man who is has enough self respect to demand to be her partner.

The way you write about yourself is incredibly passive, meek, and powerless. You've accepted her being in charge because you are fearful of her rejecting you and dumping you. You have handed her everything and asked for nothing.
 
#89 · (Edited)
EverMan

Have you ever just showed up at her place unannounced on a night or two when you were not expected because you missed her?

Or is your schedule so firm that she knows where you will be every minute of the day.

Because for your own trust issues you should mix your schedule up. And for the marriage you should show her some spontaneity.
 
#91 ·
Ever,

You started this new marriage without setting any boundaries. Didn't you learn anything from your first marriage? You need to be more alert and more aware of your marriage. Living apart does not give you this opportunity and only sets your marriage up for failure.

I really hope you take our advice to heart, because you can’t do this on your own. Since you already had a failed marriage, there is something truly wrong about how you are approaching decisions and marital responsibility. It is not only your Wive’s fault, of course the cheating is by choice and you’re not to blame, but you can be blamed for being negligent as you are so portraying.

This in itself can push a spouse away. You really need to change your ways if you want to have a successful and less paranoid life. You are the core of most of your problems based on what you have typed here.

Being passive and negligent will never produce you a successful marriage.
 
#92 ·
Well, everyone is all over the "not living together" which is only for a couple weekdays a month when I have my kids for overnights at my house. It was HER CHOICE to not come to my house to spend the time together; I do not have a chjoice AS PER THE LAW I have to have my kids for overnights on said days, the child support is based on it, further I need to maintain state residency for financial reasons. We both new this going into the marriage, her not coming to my home is HER CHOICE, and it cannot be changed without a court order.

After reading everyone's comments, clearly it comes down to this for nearly everyone, and even in my life folks hear this and have this reaction, yet for her and I, this is our schedule. SHe works late hours and on weeknights the evening would be a late dinner and shower, 1/2 hr of TV and bed, not missing much. However, I do agree with you all that this is a strain, it iis not ideal, and she has brought it up as an issue.

This is a blended family issue, all divorced couples with kids know this issue, HARD. Kids cannot be put SECOND, they are first, and frankly, I would give up the marriage for the kids. My kids are mine forever, the wife, she can leave easily, there are few ties. Yet we stay together, she says she loves me, she seems concerned that I suspect her fof cheating, and she is making more of an effort.

Honestly, one reason I would forgive her cheating is because of our difficult situation, and knowing I have to put my kids first in my life, this is hard for my wife, but this is reality. Kids are helpless, she is an adult, they need to be raised and loved, she could have been a part of this, but decided to phase herself out.

WHen the x left me, the kids were 3 and 5, it has been long and hard, not much fun, frankly, living this double life, and as Will Kane mentioned, what is in it for either of us?

Well, we seem to love eachother and want to be together, if she did have an affair, or saw the old boyfriend, if this helped "clarify" her feelings, or consider her options, she seems to want to stay with me.

This is not like a arranged marriage, as Will Kane speculated, we are together ONLY BECAUSE of companionship, we do not share funds, we are both financially independent, we both prefer it this way (for legal reasons as well).

I hope people in affairs are reading this and seeing how difficult life is in a blended family. I know that the KIDS are often the reason it all goes south, and when one partner has NO KIDS, they do not understand. My wife once said she wished my kids died in an accident. That is how hard this is; yet I stay. Maybe I should be the one leaving.
 
#93 ·
Well, everyone is all over the "not living together" which is only for a couple weekdays a month when I have my kids for overnights at my house. It was HER CHOICE to not come to my house to spend the time together; I do not have a chjoice AS PER THE LAW I have to have my kids for overnights on said days, the child support is based on it, further I need to maintain state residency for financial reasons. We both new this going into the marriage, her not coming to my home is HER CHOICE, and it cannot be changed without a court order.

After reading everyone's comments, clearly it comes down to this for nearly everyone, and even in my life folks hear this and have this reaction, yet for her and I, this is our schedule. SHe works late hours and on weeknights the evening would be a late dinner and shower, 1/2 hr of TV and bed, not missing much. However, I do agree with you all that this is a strain, it iis not ideal, and she has brought it up as an issue.

This is a blended family issue, all divorced couples with kids know this issue, HARD. Kids cannot be put SECOND, they are first, and frankly, I would give up the marriage for the kids. My kids are mine forever, the wife, she can leave easily, there are few ties. Yet we stay together, she says she loves me, she seems concerned that I suspect her fof cheating, and she is making more of an effort.

Honestly, one reason I would forgive her cheating is because of our difficult situation, and knowing I have to put my kids first in my life, this is hard for my wife, but this is reality. Kids are helpless, she is an adult, they need to be raised and loved, she could have been a part of this, but decided to phase herself out.

WHen the x left me, the kids were 3 and 5, it has been long and hard, not much fun, frankly, living this double life, and as Will Kane mentioned, what is in it for either of us?

Well, we seem to love eachother and want to be together, if she did have an affair, or saw the old boyfriend, if this helped "clarify" her feelings, or consider her options, she seems to want to stay with me.

This is not like a arranged marriage, as Will Kane speculated, we are together ONLY BECAUSE of companionship, we do not share funds, we are both financially independent, we both prefer it this way (for legal reasons as well).

I hope people in affairs are reading this and seeing how difficult life is in a blended family. I know that the KIDS are often the reason it all goes south, and when one partner has NO KIDS, they do not understand. My wife once said she wished my kids died in an accident. That is how hard this is; yet I stay. Maybe I should be the one leaving.
You weren't ready to get married. She was not prepared to deal with your kids. Neither of you ever fully committed to this marriage. IMHO, it wasn't even built on love - just the comfort of two friends with benefits spending time together.

If neither of you two are willing to move in together regardless of how inconvenient it may be, then this marriage is dead. Why bother living a farce? At this point, why do you even care if she was cheating. Neither of you two ever treated each other like husband and wife.
 
#95 ·
Are you kidding me dude? I bet there are numerous men on this site that have been divorced, trust me you are not the first to be in this situation.

I am a divorced husband who remarried to a very lovely woman, who is very trustworthy. My first wife and I had a son who my current wife defintely doesn't shower with love (he is 10 now) but she new him since 2 years old. However she would never wish those ill things to my children. She still loves my son and will give him advice if needed.

If any woman ever wished ill things of my children, I would ****ing kick her out so hard. Wow you are amazing me, you really appreciate a woman like this? Speaking ill of your kids?

You need to divorce her and keep her around for a booty call and get more of those. You don't need to be married to this woman.

Why waste time posting here for advice if you are so negligent? Why waste your time with a woman who has no sense of care for your family? Your wife is selfish, self centered, SOB, that is definetly fcvking her rich friend. You are being played like a flute.

Be honest with yourself, but you don't care either way. You rather be or have sloppy seconds. Digusting!!!!
 
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#98 ·
Thanks everyone for all the love. While my eyes are being opened, a lot of this is OLD NEWS, but I am including it to illustrate why my parenting my kids is not a shared experience with the wife. This is divorce.

My life has been plagued by divorce. I have a step-mom, and I have had several step-dads. My life has been one of instability, parental neglect, being on my own, being poor. The simple reality: within a blended family each persons personal "best interests" are often at odds, witness "MacBeth". The allocation of "resources" are stretched and strained, including parental love. These dynamics are built into the structure, read "Wuthering Heights", these are timeless issues. If any spouse in a blended family is completely honest with themselves, they would prefer to not raise someone elses kids. This is always a "sacrifice" except in the rarest cases.

WHile I do not know what oasis of utopia you all reside in, none of my issues should be some kind of shocking surprise to anyone who has resided in the realm of "divorce", as child, parent, or both. I have seen my biological mother pull a knife on my Dad and threaten to kill him, I have seen my Dad punch my mother in the face as she was kneeling down crying... are not these shocking, they happen all the time to people. My Dad was a serial cheater, these scenes are the result.

My wife says a lot of nasty things, frankly, it comes out in a moment of anger, my reaction used to be to simply walk-out the door, now I have grown accustomed to this, perhaps I should not, but given my background, my goal has always been STABILITY, that is all I have ever wanted out of life, even against my own personal best interests. I was married for 20 years to the first wife, through good and bad. I want to stay married to my current wife, that is why I am here, I appreciate the advice, as this thread evolves I can see the issues, I can see how I am a "doormat", taking abuse in order to cling to something stable, to find love.

I suppose that is how I am "ruined" by my divorce upbringing: I always had to compromise as a child as I had no choice, and I am continuing that pattern of being the "doormat", the compromiser. I can see how I prefer to stay in a bad relationship rather than face "the abyss", and I can see how I am giving this advice to others who are struck by infidelity.

While I cannot change the fear I feel that makes me accept abuse, I can find an effective way to be more assertive and maintain my dignity and self-respect, this I can sense is GOAL ONE, for me, thanks for all your help.
 
#97 ·
Ever-Man said:
My wife once said she wished my kids died in an accident. That is how hard this is; yet I stay. Maybe I should be the one leaving.
Maybe?! No, you need to GTFO now. I feel for your kids, but not for you. Since you don't have kids with this creature and since she makes more than you, the financial damage won't be too bad. Let her go have her fun with whomever she wants. Just get her out of your life.
 
#103 ·
I truly appreciate everyone's honest reactions to my situation, it has pointed me in a direction I had not expected to go. I came here to simply ascertain if there was enough evidence to suspect my wife of cheating, and the responses have shown me how deeply flawed the relationship itself has become, and my "blind spots" or denial of certain issues that I have accepted, that perhaps are the essence of the problem.

Perhaps I need stability so badly because, due to my lack of self-respect, emanating from my feelings of helplessness and abandonment issues, I am not providing enough stability for MYSELF, and strive to find it in relationships with other people. This causes me to cling to relationships and accept abuse, which then makes my wife loose respect for me and therefore treat me badly and, due to my anxiety about facing "the abyss", I don't assert myself (or I assert myself "passively") thus causing more marital instability.
 
#108 ·
Ever-Man,

My wife read your thread. These are her words.

There is no blended family here because there is no family at all. And there is no marriage here to save. What I see is a dysfunctional friendship with benefits and not much benefit to the OP. He cannot be comfortable and secure with anyone else because he is not comfortable with himself. And that discomfort will be transfered to his children if he doesn't find a way to be happy inside himself. They are already adversely affected because they see daddy in a relationship with someone that doesn't like them. So if daddy's woman doesn't like them maybe daddy doesn't really like them or maybe there is something wrong with them. He should divorce his wife and concentrate on being happy alone with himself before he tries to be happy with someone else.
 
#112 ·
Thanks for your input, and even involving your wife, you are drawing extreme conclusions without all the information, which admittedly cannot be fully conveyed in forums such as these.

Your input is illustrative of why these kinds of forums can be very bad places for vulnerable people to go looking for "advice".
 
#118 ·
Ever-Man I know some people are coming off as harsh but it's not because we enjoy it. I've been on this site for 2 months now and it's extremely frustrating how many people (and I've only seen this with men for some reason) come here looking for advice, don't like what they hear or aren't told what they want to hear, leave, then come back weeks or months down the road saying how they wished they had listened to what people here were telling them because what they tried either didn't work or blew up in their face.

Granted no one here can put themselves in your shoes directly and none of us personally know you or your wife, but if what you've said is accurate even if your wife wasn't cheating on you (and I find it hard to believe she either hasn't or hasn't seriously considered it), I'd still say you need to walk away from that marriage.

Your wife doesn't sound like a great person and you sound like you have some serious self-esteem/self-respect issues which would make it hard for many women to want to stick it out in the long run. Women are just not attracted to men who put them up on a pedestal, yet have very little respect for themselves.

Have you at least started looking at any of the suggested reading that's been mentioned in this thread?? And if you aren't still in counseling I think you might want to give it another go.

Once again people aren't saying these things for kicks. They genuinely want to help you.
 
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#127 ·
Harsh and blunt is one thing, but drawing conclusions for which there is not enough information, and then basing your opinions on such conclusions with life-altering advice for vulnerable strangers who are in emotional anguish, and doing so with a tone of authority, and utter certainty is a very dangerous tact to engage on this site. I was that way with a few posts and quickly realized that I am not a professional, and should take a less 'authoritative" voice. We all need to be careful with the advice we give troubled and perhaps impressionable adults who are in the midst of life-altering moments in their lives.
 
#137 ·
OP..I don't get it.

You found a forum where tons of people have been right where you are but didnt have the benefit of advice.

They are giving you advice worth it's keystrokes in gold and you're willfully ignore pretty much all of it because it's not what you want to hear.

You're obviously a good father, and probably a good husband too. But you are a terrible friend...to yourself. Nobody knows for sure if she's cheating or not but her. But people are telling you based on their experience in these matters that it sounds more likely than not. Add to this your "gut" which is natures own lie detector, and you have at least reason to be concerned.

To alleviate major doubt about infedility in your marriage it was suggested you live with your wife full time. You proceeded to post numerous reasons why this arrangements works for the two of you, even though your wife flat out told you it's not working for her.

Now you're saying all you want to talk about is whether or not she cheated. Not the factors that could have created the issue or what you should do as next steps. This is the equivalent of "taking your ball and going home". Nothing in the rules says you can't but it makes me seriously question if you're here for help or to just solicit answers that you want to hear.

I wish you and your children luck.
 
#138 ·
Thanks for your input. I have taken everyone's advice in earnest, thought about it, considered it, and admitted that the unorthodox living arrangement is a strain in my marriage, I have known this. I also know my kids are a strain on my marriage. These are issues to be considered, but they are not the complete point. Everyone has "imperfections" in their marriage, and reasons to cheat; the salient issue is ARE THEY CHEATING?

There seems to be an assumption here on TAM that everyone's advice is "worth their keystrokes in Gold", and it is "what you need to hear", and if a recipient of such advice isn't isn't open to it, their is a problem with this person, they are in some sort of denial, etc. That is nonsense. All I am pointing out is that much advice given to people ALL OF US is NOT GOOD, and much of it is so bad, that to take such advice could really harm someones life. I pointed out that we all need to be careful, not in the advice we give, but how we offer it.

If I told everyone that my wife is always available to have dinner with my kids on Fridays, she always has a treat for them when she sees them, she is generous on their B'days and Holidays, offers them advice, goes to their school events and is positive and supportive with then, we all get together with our families during Holidays, etc., does that change the opinions that her ugly outburst should send me packing out the door?

If I explained that my wife has a tendency to say a lot of ugly things about her own family, about politicians, and even herself, does that alter anyone's opinions? She can be a harsh *****, but she can also be a supportive loving partner. She is a "round" character, not a stereo-type.

If I go into all these nuances, it takes a lot of effort, it is a novella, and for the purposes of these forums I am trying to be concise. As I explained before, a lot of posters jump to conclusions and run away with certain details and draw conclusions based on these single events without knowing the whole picture. I am not trying to mislead, it is an inherent flaw in forums like these. Anyway, I went with it, I even mentioned that I have been sent in a direction I was not expecting to go.
 
#145 ·
I agree Ever-Man. There is advice here that is just simply put foolish. And you'd be wise to laugh at it and ignore it.

When a person comes here in pain the majority of people try to help relying on their own experience as a teaching tool. We're all different people though so no guarantees it would work for you and your wife. Point taken.

1 more thing. I get that perhaps it was an emotional outburst and that your wife does care for your children and do nice things for them. And I get that the fact that you have them is a strain on your relationship. But if you add those 2 things to the circumstantial evidence you've gathered, it's looking more and more like cheating may have occured.

Because she doesn't you technological devices it will be more difficult to prove. Perhaps you could hire someone to find out for sure? A PI could do it but they are expensive.

I think it's a waste of your time and effort since you've already resolved to automatically forgive and move forward with the marriage. So my advice in this case would be to assume she has and continue to live accordingly.
 
#147 ·
Thanks, that is kind of what I have done, assumed she has cheated (I suspect I know the time-frame), and I told her straight-up, "you can't fool me, this has happened to me before, I know what it feels like". She didn't like this and needs to have me believe she did not cheat, and she offered to take a lie detector. This made me more suspicious.

In the end, if I believe she did cheat, primarily to protect my psyche, I do treat her differently, which is a problem if she did not cheat, and this is not fair to her.

Unfortunately, I feel I need to try to know for sure, one way or another.
 
#151 ·
When my children were young, my H traveled close to 50% of the time. He said, not jokingly, that the airport was a second home to him.

Yes, there were advantages. I made unilateral decisions about home and children, so there was not much to argue over there. Our finances were almost completely separate. The home was my domain, not his. He had his own world, if you will.

But the downside outweighed the ups by far. The distance this creates is deleterious to a marital relationship, in my opinion. Statistics show that infidelity, for one, is far more likely in scenarios like this.

Back to your original post - I definitely believe that there are red flags for you to be seriously concerned about.
 
#167 ·
I really think people are getting too focused on the living arrangments. While not ideal there are a myriad of other problems which I think are more relevant. Even if these 2 did live together I doubt it would really address the underlying issues.
 
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#175 ·
Ever-Man - I'm very sympathetic to you. You are faced with a very murky situation, one that doesn't present itself clearly, but could have very serious repercussions.

Your decisions on your marital living arrangements spark such a huge discussion, I think, because people don't see those arrangements as separate from your concerns about infidelity. And no matter how you argue the point, statistics show that a higher percentage of couples who live apart report infidelity and separation/divorce. So, connecting these two issues isn't coincidental or pig-headed on the part of the posters here.

I lived for many years with a spouse who was absent for much of every month & it was a challenge and a lot of work to make it work for us. We are still together, so we're not part of those famed statistics.

I would urge you to continue to follow up on the red flags, if for no other reason than the seriousness of the consequences for both of you if your suspicions turn out to be well-founded. As far as the living arrangements, they don't help things on balance, in my experience, but different strokes, so you could wind up on the happy side of the statistics.
 
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