Talk About Marriage banner
Status
Not open for further replies.

A cheater doesn't love you, or doesn't understand what love is

33K views 243 replies 61 participants last post by  remorseful strayer 
#1 · (Edited)
I was talking with a few people about this. If you really, actually love your spouse, you would not betray them by committing adultery.

If you stab your spouse in the heart like that - you DO NOT love them. And if you think you do, you don't have a grasp of what love actually is.

My stbxww said to me in tears "I need to figure out how I could hurt someone I love so much so badly". It's not love. It can't be. She constantly still tells me how much she loves me, that she always did - she never stopped.

That is a lie.

No offence to anybody trying to R with their ws, but if your spouse cheats on you, they do not actually love you, and may be incapable of love. They may think they love you, but that is NOT love.

Love is many things. Respect, loyalty, honesty, protection both physically and emotionally, affection...when your ws f*cks someone else during your marriage, they have proven beyond a reasonable doubt that they are not any of the things that make up love.

It's proof they do not in fact love you.
 
See less See more
#70 · (Edited)
I really believe that going in to the relationship that in some inate way, that they deceive themselves first into believing that they do, in fact, love you; or if they don't exactly feel that way initially, that in time, they might feel a marked potential for that love to come to flourish.

In essence, the "cheater" has already got their "practice sessions" in by initially deceiving themselves. Once that act has been accomplished, then they can move on to deceiving others.

They have so aptly proven that they cannot truly love others more than they love themselves or their own jaded sense of entitlement.

Isn't it amazing that a cheating wife can find it in her heart to leave a husband she finds that she does not love, and break up the nucleus of that family in the process. Then she runs off into the arms a paramour where she once again thinks that love really resides, sadly finding in time that she was, once again, mistaken!

And if her paramour had an ounce of common sense, he would have to face the realization that if this cheater would do this to her husband, that in time, she would repeat the entire process in doing the very same thing to him.

But alas, these "stage door johnny's" seem to be moreso governed by their raging hormones and their anatomy rather than by that logic and common sense~ greatly leading one to think that, they too, have contracted that same malady and are just as incapable of true and lasting love as is the cheater!
 
#71 ·
Knowing my WH's past, the way he was brought up, etc., I can see that while he thinks he knows what love is, his feelings are very skewed. I truly don't believe he knows how to love. I've come to realize that his recently diagnosed mental illness is a part of this, but that doesn't make his actions any less painful to me. He was telling me how much he loved me while moments before he had written an email to a former lover, telling her how much he loved her then, and will always love her...how much her kisses meant to him and how no one else's kisses have ever done that to him. Similar words to those he's spoken to me as well.

He doesn't have a clue how to love. Knowing this doesn't change the pain it causes me either. I've not confronted him with what I know for several reasons, but I suppose the main reason is that having had some recent surgeries, I'm not in a position to be independent just yet. My first reaction was to confront him, but then I had to think about the consequences because once I confront him, I feel the only option is for my marriage to end. I'm conflicted in "using" him financially when I am withdrawing emotionally, but I also have my daughter to think about in this ordeal. She is developmentally disabled, and she adores my husband.

With my husband having been diagnosed with multiple mental problems, including class b personality disorder, I think he'll want to blame it all on this. I'm just not sure that cuts it in the end. Even if that does explain his actions, I still feel unloved by him at the end of the day. And just when I think the pain of DDay is over, I am sitting here crying all over again. I don't even know for certain what the trigger was this time.
 
#72 ·
If you stab your spouse in the heart like that - you DO NOT love them. And if you think you do, you don't have a grasp of what love actually is.
I disagree. I believe there are varying degrees of love. Perhaps someone who betrays you does in fact love you, but it obviously is not a "pure" love. Perhaps they believed they would never get caught so therefore there would be no "harm" to you in their eyes.

That line of thinking is certainly flawed as they are forgetting about "respecting" their partner and how selfish they are being, but I still think they can love their spouse. Forgetting about or not grasping consequences does not equate to lack of love, imo.

Like the song, it is a "Tainted Love".
 
#74 ·
Anytime you believe and make a general statement like your's, you are guaranteed to offend and come off sounding like a close minded bitter soul.

My example: I talked to plenty of men and women too, who swear they love their spouse and families but believe that cheating is essential to the survival of their marriage. Why? Because their spouses are not interested in sex. I'm not saying this is right and in my opinion it is f'ed up, but I can't begin to assume they don't love their spouse because they are cheating,

Generalizations are "generally" wrong :)
Posted via Mobile Device
 
#76 ·
Generalizations are "generally" wrong :)
Posted via Mobile Device
Kermitty, that is too funny! I would generally agree about generalizations.

One thought I have about the meaning of love follows the old golden rule; would you do something, if you truely love them, that you would not want them to do to you?

I hope that this idea does not irritate any of those coping with issues in their relationship. We all have hurt, or we wouldn't be spending time on TAM (generalization). ;)

It is a given that others do not share this view. It is also my opinion that all love is on a spectrum. Shades of grey (not refering to those naughty books).

Maybe our disagreement is what shade of grey defines love.

Don't you just enjoy the debate? It is generally good for the soul to reflect and think as life gives us challenges. :)
 
This post has been deleted
#80 ·
OK I am calmer today :)

Someone once told me that the secret to a long and happy marriage is to never fall out of love at the same time, and that has really stuck with me. I really do believe that our love waxes and wanes over the years. The feelings I had for him for the couple of years before D day certainly weren't 'in love' feelings, but I did still love him. I think we both were in it for the long haul, but we'd also both decided to just soldier on in the face of adversity until something changed. And he decided that, while he waited, he'd get a little action on the side. I know he intended that I would never find out. He wasn't wracked with guilt about it - he had convinced himself that it was his 'due' because of the way I was treating him. But he still wanted to grow old with me, and he really did think that the whole bad time would just blow over eventually and we'd reconnect.

So, I guess you can call that love, or not, whatever you prefer. We certainly were not IN love at that time, but the potential for it was still there.

I think what pisses me off about these discussions are the people who insinuate, or just say outright, that there is no way the he loves me today because of the fact he cheated. That just isn't true. The 'read his mind' comment was a result of me feeling this was being insinuated, so if this isn't what you were saying I apologize.
 
#86 ·
I think my only issue with this is the title of the thread. It's too absolute. Too definite. The Universe just isn't like that.

How do I know Regret loved me during her affair?

Because I felt loved. I truly felt her love when we were together. There is no way to prove that just as there is no way to dispute it.

THAT is the Universe.
 
#142 ·
I'm quoting myself cuz I can.

Mostly I'm quoting myself cuz today is exactly 1 year from Dday.

If any of ya's think I'm diluted, delusional, or dumb you might wanna check the mirror. That anger and rage that you're projecting is YOURS...not mine. Not any other betrayed who is working on reconciliation.

Yes. Cheaters are cowards. Yep...no denying that cuz they couldn't handle their issues in a proper manner, but instead chose to give in to their silly ego driven affairs.

But.

Don't think everyone is incapable of love because of YOUR personal hurt. I mean even Hitler loved Eva Braum.
 
#88 ·
The-Deceived,
Do you sense the denial in some of these responses? This is an example of the evilness of adultery. Good people having to desperately rationalize the meaning of there cheater's behavior. Who the hell would accept some of these definitions of love before they got married. Imagine someone's spouse turning to them the night before their wedding day and saying, "I am going to cheat on you with your sister and you are going to believe I loved you."

I bet if you changed the title to your thread to "A MURDERER doesn't love you, or doesn't understand what love is" people would rationalize the murderer's behavior to show they loved the victim.

I sat in a Planned Parenthood office for four hours waiting for an HIV/STD test because my WW did not think condoms were necessary because her OM was married too. I then had to wait seven days for the result. My stomach was in a knot when I called for the results. Thank God they came back negative.

Cheater's love? Please....
 
#93 ·
Love itself is no more subjective than the color red. some people just happen to be colorblind.

If you reject everything in the Judeo-Christian tradition, consider accepting the translation of Corinthians 13:4-7 that the Catholics use.

Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. It does not dishonor others, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.

Does that sound like a wayward spouse? They may have loved you before and they may love you again, but unless (perhaps) you are in an open marriage, they don't love you during.
 
#101 ·
We also steal from blind people, kick crippled beagles, pull the wings off of flies, and rub our boogers on your toothbrush at night while you are asleep.

Mocking orphans we save for special occasions. Mocking idiots isn't actually a sin but we do it anyway.
 
#107 ·
Deceived, all WS are not immature, psychopathic, unloving, crazy, needy, narcissistic tramps. Some of us are caring, loving people who made the wrong choice to deal with issues inside ourselves or inside our marriages. We are struggling to fix what we broke every day.

You do not know if I am incapable of love. You have no idea what any WS is capable of except your own flawed wife. Oh and the second hand stories you read on an anonymous forum.

It is frustrating to see blanket statements like that. I'd never post about how all BS are frigid and cold and distant just because my husband behaves like that. That would be insulting and downright untrue.
 
This post has been deleted
#114 ·
Is there some way to have a 'cooling off' period for some of these betrayed spouses who are still in the 'want to break a chair over their heads' stage?

Lots of heat but little light.
 
#128 ·
My wife stopped loving me - as a husband, as a lover - as she fell for OM. She put me in a different role in her heart. And she suffered a lot in this process o carrying the contradictory life. She couln't pretend. She's not of the type to have extra "fun", she falls in love. She can't compartimentalize, she can't love two people. She just can't.
Many others do. I know it's true.
 
#130 ·
This is all semantics. Are we talking about love the feeling, love the deep bond of attachment, love the decision?

What's going on with a particular WS vis a vis his or her spouse during the affair (or ONS) is going to vary from person to person. They may downright hate their spouse! They may be indifferent. But surely some of them love their spouses, whatever definition you choose.

There's a concept in psychology: cognitive dissonance. It means you hold onto two seemingly contradictory thoughts at the same time. Happens all the time. "I want to lose weight - but I'm going to eat this piece of chocolate cake." "I love my spouse - but I can't wait to have sex with 'X.'"

The kind of love that could have been present - even during sex with X - is the deep bond of attachment. Especially if the WS feels guilt over the affair. People do bad things - all the time. We have to decide on a case by case basis if there's some basic decency that overrides this transgression. I'm not particularly religious, but I like the saying: Let he who is without sin cast the first stone. I know this is a big sin, but my WS has done a lot of things in his life - for me, for my family, and for a number of other people - that suggest that he is at heart a good man who has mostly made the world a better place.

My WS says he felt guilt the first time he had sex with the OW, and knew right away he'd made a mistake. He didn't stop seeing her (no brownie points there), but he lied to her to get out of seeing her as often as she wanted - the meetings WERE very few in number and spaced apart. He has some anxiety problems, including panic attacks, and I have cut him some slack because he's got "issues."

I don't doubt that he loves me now, I don't think he stopped loving me then. But he's got a lot of work to do - he was in IC before the affair and continues with that. He apologizes a lot. He answers my questions as best as he can remember (I think anxiety has fuzzed up his memory, but most of it has eventually come to him). He can't talk with me for long periods because he gets anxious, but he tries.

I think people use the word "stray" because that's what really happens in some cases. I think my WS was off his rocker for awhile; it wasn't that he stopped loving me during that time.
 
#131 · (Edited)
I agree with TheDeceived in that cheaters no longer love their spouse or are so self-absorbed that they are incapable of loving anyone but themselves.

There are no better people to understand what true love is than us faithful BS. Many here keep saying over and over that they would have NEVER done something so hurtful to their spouse no matter how bad the M was. THAT is love.

Love that you can put in a box and use whenever convenient for you is not love, it's a security blanket, a safety net, a plan b, whatever you want to call it.

Cheaters are cowards. They want it all without having to sacrifice anything. They want to explore other relationships but will not let go of the one they already have, because hey, they don't want to end up alone.

Selfish as they are, and gullible as you are, why wouldn't they take advantage of the safety and unconditional love you provide? What cheater wouldn't stay with a loving BS when faced with the scary option of venturing out on their own and risking ending up with no one. Those tears and that fear you see after dday are not for you, they are for them. It suddenly hits them that they've damaged their security blanket and might lose it for good this time.

The love given by cheaters may feel like love but IMO it's only attachment and deep caring for the person they've shared so much history with.

Cheater love = caring, attachment, comfortable routine, friendship, sex
True love = exclusivity, respect, admiration, trust, enduring passion, true intimacy (meaning baring your soul to that person, not sharing a bed while leading a double life), deep caring and a deep understanding that this person is your best match, the only one in your heart and the only one you want to share your life with.

Anything short of that is not love IMO, it's taking advantage of someone's love while only caring for them in return.
 
#132 ·
Cheater love = caring, attachment, comfortable routine, friendship, sex
True love = exclusivity, respect, admiration, trust, enduring passion, true intimacy (meaning baring your soul to that person, not sharing a bed while leading a double life), deep caring and a deep understanding that this person is your best possible match, the only one in your heart and the only one you want to share your life with.
Anything short of that is not love IMO
, it's taking advantage of someone's love while only caring for them in return.
Are you talking about how you loved your WH or is it's how you identify every BS's love? Faithfull = True Love?
Because being betrayed doesn't mean you love your spouse this way.
Many couples with no infidelity in the mix don't love each other this way. At All. And they both claim to love each other.
 
#134 ·
This topic is one that we are going through right now, my ws has made the comment you don't believe me when I say "I Love You".
While I do believe she loves me, I also believe that she didn't love me enough to not cheat on me and the love she has for me now after she was caught is maybe out of desperation (not wanting to lose what she has).
One other thought to this is that maybe she has seen my sacrifice, devotion and willingness to forgive and the light did go off that there will never be another man who will love me like this and now that I f*cked this all up I must do everything to show my love for him.
It will take time for this to play out someone who is coming from desperation will eventually tire of the effort and will once again justify their actions by blaming their spouse for their shortcomings.
For those that have seen the light they will work hard to match the love that they have been given.
Funny one thing I have realized is that there are no absolutes in this road I travel, there are many answers to every question and the only thing you can do is keep moving forward if you are lucky backward if you must.
 
#141 ·
I think in a broad way an affair can't happen unless feelings are sufficiently eroded.

People do not cheat on someone they're madly in love with. Imagine back to the "hot" phase of when you met your wife or husband. Thoughts of cheating were probably the last thing on your mind.

That doesn't mean they don't love them *at all* however. But I think it's a stretch to say you can be madly in love with someone and then reconcile that with cheating. It doesn't make sense.

But as I said this is a broad view and in the real world there are many cases where I'm sure none of this factors in. Cheating under the influence of drugs or alcohol, or in cases where someone is vulnerable emotionally, or heck i'm sure these affairs happen often because someone feels unloved and wants to "get back" at their partner. There can be many scenerios where one feels love but has a ONS or affair anyways.

Again though, in the majority of cases it would make sense that it requires an erosion of love or caring.
 
#144 ·
I think in a broad way an affair can't happen unless feelings are sufficiently eroded.
Again though, in the majority of cases it would make sense that it requires an erosion of love or caring.
Hmmm.. can we agree that the simple pass of time, past the "madly in love" initial phase is erosion enough?
You only have to feel good, flattered to be persued or lusted, a moment of weakness and selfishness to put the ball rolling.
I higly suspects many affaris happens for silly reasons, most of them start this stupid way and then develope becasue giving up the "feel good" is hard and we are selfish criatures. Then the rationalizations began, defense mechanism help us, emotional attachments solidify...
 
#147 ·
I think one of the most difficult thing that one has to do is to admit and accept the fact that the one true love that we thought to have finally found was nothing but a mirage. The soulmate was just a construct of our own mind. May be it is not the same for everyone, but it is true in my case. I was in denial for a long time. Finally it was time to wake up and smell the s##t.
 
#148 ·
I say on behalf of your wife:

I'm sorry for you, but you are totally wrong on this. Totally.

Your (understandable) emotions are mixed up with your perception of reality. People are not limited to being in love, or loving only one person. That is a fact.

Another fact is that one can temporally be in the Fog and think all kind of thoughts they didn't have before and won't have after.

A fact is that reality is not a black and white schema you have in your mind but is a mixture, a Bell Curve of all kinds of occurances of love, arousal, infatuation, intimacy, friendship etc. etc.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
You have insufficient privileges to reply here.
Top