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Coping with Infidelity Relationship recovery from the destructiveness of infidelity.

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Old 03-26-2013, 08:42 AM   #16 (permalink)
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Default Re: Where is the line in emotional affairs?

Ginger, I used to be really shy as well. Never in a million years did I ever think I would cheat on my husband. It was never physical, but was still cheating. No, I am not suggesting that you go out and do the same thing, nor am I suggesting that you WOULD. But he needs to be made aware that even those who APPEAR to be the most faithful spouses DO, indeed, cheat.

Honestly, short of filing for divorce (it doesn't mean you have to go through with it) to wake him up to what he has really done to your marriage, I don't think there is anything you really CAN do to get him to see. And, if you DO file, then if he wants to actually fix the marriage, then he needs to come clean on everything, not "just enough" to get by, not just what he thinks you want to hear. And, he needs to find a new job, or be transferred at the company to somewhere he will not have to interact with this woman. You need to show him you are serious about it...and DO NOT BACK DOWN. He neds to see how wrong this is/was. Until THAT happens, and NC is established, you are going to continue to be at odds over this.

Oh, and PHTLump is a man.
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Old 03-26-2013, 08:54 AM   #17 (permalink)
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Default Re: Where is the line in emotional affairs?

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Originally Posted by Maricha75 View Post
Ginger, I used to be really shy as well. Never in a million years did I ever think I would cheat on my husband. It was never physical, but was still cheating. No, I am not suggesting that you go out and do the same thing, nor am I suggesting that you WOULD. But he needs to be made aware that even those who APPEAR to be the most faithful spouses DO, indeed, cheat.

Honestly, short of filing for divorce (it doesn't mean you have to go through with it) to wake him up to what he has really done to your marriage, I don't think there is anything you really CAN do to get him to see. And, if you DO file, then if he wants to actually fix the marriage, then he needs to come clean on everything, not "just enough" to get by, not just what he thinks you want to hear. And, he needs to find a new job, or be transferred at the company to somewhere he will not have to interact with this woman. You need to show him you are serious about it...and DO NOT BACK DOWN. He neds to see how wrong this is/was. Until THAT happens, and NC is established, you are going to continue to be at odds over this.

Oh, and PHTLump is a man.
x1000

Your husband wants to rug sweep this, and gas light you to the very end and keep on eating his cake, he's faced no consequences for this..none.

You may feel very weak at this moment, but actually YOU are in the drivers seat, you just dont know it.. but you are.

Sounds like your husband is in the "Fog" thier affair partners can do no wrong, they will defend them and thier relationship like a rabid dog, he needs to see this for what it is..WRONG!!! and sometimes it takes the threat of divorce or exposing it to people that will help end it for them to see the light, affairs of any type thirve on secercy, the thrill, the rush the chemicals in the brain, once the secercy of it is gone and the real world sets in, you have a chance of fixing things...

Dont let him manage you, stand your ground!
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Old 03-26-2013, 09:19 AM   #18 (permalink)
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Default Re: Where is the line in emotional affairs?

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you are welcome, not just friends will really open your eyes.

He says he knows you wouldnt do something like that...of course you wouldnt because you know its wrong, and so does he, he knows its wrong!!!!
He thinks it was not a big deal, i call bs!!! It is/was a big deal for you, so it should be a big deal for him.

I'm sure he isnt telling you it all, most dont when first confronted, it's called the trickle truth and it sucks, every time you get a little more new info, it's like starting all over.

He says he want to be with you and mend the marriage, then he needs prove that to you with actions and not so much with words, actions like getting away from her 100% no contact, no contact means, no contact ever again!!!!
this.
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Old 03-26-2013, 09:24 AM   #19 (permalink)
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Default Re: Where is the line in emotional affairs?

What youre going thru and about to go thru sucks. No two ways about it. He is fully aware of what he is doing. He knows full well that he's having an affair. He thinks you too stupid to prove it.

So, get his phone records. Put a VAR in his car under the drivers seat and install a keylogger in your computer for starters.... I had to, it works and ONLY when faced with UNDENIABLE evidence will they sometimes come clean and you can start to R. Get all of yourevidence AND learn as much as humanly possible about HER. Where she lives, who her parents are, where she went to college, her best friends name....."KNOW THY ENEMY"
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Old 03-26-2013, 09:30 AM   #20 (permalink)
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Default Re: Where is the line in emotional affairs?

Sorry to say this, but if he's kissing her on the lips it's a physical relationship. I don't mean because of the kiss, I mean that kissing like that on the lips is something you do between lovers , it requires lowering of personal space barriers.

For it to become part of a simple goodbye shows that those barriers are completed dropped down between them. If a physical affair was something forbidden and unexplored they would not casually be kidding on the lips. Instead that would be weird and awkward between them.

Nope, they've clearly done are are doing much more.
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Old 03-26-2013, 09:34 AM   #21 (permalink)
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Sweet the guys are in the marjority right. You H is playing the field, hes lied and the incident where he phones the OW and annouced you were listening in was a clear indication that he was firing up the waring signals, what is worse , he did it in front of you which in my book says hes disrespecting you in a big way. Not a thoughless act but a calculated one to protect the other woman. Ive had female co workers who have phoned me and text me and I can honestly say even with those who I was close (in a business way) would NOT have kissed me on the lips end of, would not have called me darling or loved me at the end of a call and if they had, Id have distanced myself immeadiately! Your H owes you a massive appology and a full explaination with the TRUSTH and not hiding the bits he wants to hide. I suspect that the relationship was more than a little lip kiss. he may indeed need a boot in the rear with you producing the name and address of your lawyer, He might just see that you are not putting up with the rubbish
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Old 03-26-2013, 09:36 AM   #22 (permalink)
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Default Re: Where is the line in emotional affairs?

He is in an affair with this other woman (OW). When people first begin to discover an affair, they rarely have as much confirming information affair as you now have. Contrary to what your husband and the OW say, kissing another woman on the lips and telling her that he loves her, is a big enough betrayal on its own that most husbands would be begging for forgiveness for having done just this; you would be naive if you bought into their lie that it was not a big deal. Your husband telling her that you were in the room when he called on speaker, after agreeing not to, proves beyond a doubt that as bad as it sounds so far, there is more that he is trying to hide. His attempted blame shifting as to your faults and his grass is greener comment, confirm that he is rationalizing why it is OK to cheat. Cheaters always try to hold you to a standard of perfection that they do not hold themselves too, knowing that as a human you will fail such a standard. Do not let him do this. If he had a problem with you he needed to work with you on it. Cheating never fixes issue in a marraige. BTW, the kissing makes it no longer just an emotinal affair, and the fantasizing about her comment indicates even more.

You must be willing to end the marriage to have a shot at having a marraige worth saving. Stop listening to his lies and second guessing yourself. He crossed the line and is in an affair. See an attorney to learn your rights and let him know that you are doing so. Tell him that to even have a chance at saving the marriage that he must end all non-work-required contact with the OW and demand full transparency which includes passwords without complaint. Also demand that he acknowledge that what he did was cheating and start showing remorse for it.

I am sorry that you are here. Be well and good luck.

Last edited by TRy; 03-26-2013 at 09:45 AM.
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Old 03-26-2013, 09:47 AM   #23 (permalink)
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Default Re: Where is the line in emotional affairs?

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You must be willing to end the marriage to have a shot at having a marraige worth saving. Stop listening to his lies and second guessing yourself. He crossed the line and is in an affair. See an attorney to learn your rights and let him know that you are doing so. Tell him that to even have a chance at saving the marriage that he must end all non-work-required contact with the OW and demand full transparency which includes passwords without complaint. Also demand that he acknowledge that what he did was cheating and start showing remorse for it.
This is the most important advice you will ever get. Please follow it.
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Old 03-26-2013, 10:21 AM   #24 (permalink)
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Default Re: Where is the line in emotional affairs?

The grass looks greener on the other side of the fence because it's fertilized with bullsh!t.

So he thinks it would be better with her? Give him a dose of reality. Contact a lawyer and discuss your legal options.
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Old 03-27-2013, 10:57 AM   #25 (permalink)
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Default Re: Where is the line in emotional affairs?

@shaggy, I hate to think you are right, but you make a very good point. In reading this I get a bad feeling in the pit of my stomach.

@Pault- My husband is having a hard time apologizing, he said he learned in AA meeting that you do not regret things that you do that are wrong. So he says he does not regret this friendship and therefore does not have remorse for it.

@TRy- Your second paragraph is a very valuable piece of advice and I am taking it to heart.

I told my husband no none business contact with her at work. But last night he tells me when she is going to lunch she checks to see if see can pick up something for him. I told him to me it seems she doesn't want to end the special friendship and he says she is only being polite. Unless I'm over thinking everything she does, I think it is time for me to make a more drastic move, to wake him up.
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Old 03-27-2013, 11:14 AM   #26 (permalink)
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Default Re: Where is the line in emotional affairs?

Sweet Ginger, have you thought about heading to an Al-Anon meeting to help you in your own quest to detach (in love) and gain some perspective? It can help with the 180. That bit about him telling you he learned to not regret anything in AA is a twist of mier-duh. I've been in the rooms plenty and I never heard it twisted quite like that. If there was no regret or remorse there would be no need for the 8th step: "8. Made a list of all persons we had harmed, and became willing to make amends to them all." Your husband owes you an amends. He's not making that step a priority in regards to you. What we learn in the rooms is that all of the damage, the hurt can be turned around and be used for good BUT it comes through a new way of life. Admitting our wrongs, making amends. NOT using it as a justification for the very acts existence. He's manipulating AA to manipulate your emotions. Betcha if you tell him your going to Al-Anon for yourself because you want to know yourself he'll stop pulling the AA-line because you'll have his number.

All of this is just secondary though. It's incredibly painful stuff because he's walking the cheaters walk. It hurts!

You can do this. You can stand up to him. You can be strong. You won't find better direction and clarity than "Not Just Friends".

Can you get your husband to read it with you?
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Old 03-27-2013, 11:16 AM   #27 (permalink)
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@Pault- My husband is having a hard time apologizing, he said he learned in AA meeting that you do not regret things that you do that are wrong. So he says he does not regret this friendship and therefore does not have remorse for it.


Boy that seems like BS. Holding on to something you regret is a bad thing to do if your a recovering Alchoholic or you sugffer depressive states, but not to admit to something that is WRONG which is what hes saying here then boy this world is finished.
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Old 03-27-2013, 11:38 AM   #28 (permalink)
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Default Re: Where is the line in emotional affairs?

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Boy that seems like BS. Holding on to something you regret is a bad thing to do if your a recovering Alchoholic or you sugffer depressive states, but not to admit to something that is WRONG which is what hes saying here then boy this world is finished.
It is BS. But, I think, there's no regret because he does not think what he's doing IS wrong.

Interesting that Sweet Ginger's H mentioned her asking about lunch. It's not really that objectionable, is it? The problem is that he's trying to classify this with other behaviour such as kissing the OW on the lips.

I wouldn't do anything 'drastic'. The suggestion of reading "Not Just Friends" might work as it's less confrontational.
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Old 03-27-2013, 11:51 AM   #29 (permalink)
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Default Re: Where is the line in emotional affairs?

I used to think male female friends were acceptable. I would have drawn the line at romantic or affectionate talk or flirting. Now my rule is simple. No friends of the opposite sex. Anything elese is asking for trouble.
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Old 03-27-2013, 11:53 AM   #30 (permalink)
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Default Re: Where is the line in emotional affairs?

I think you need to go all Molly Shannon in Talladega Nights and start kissing all of his friends on the lips right in front of him.

Oh, I'm just kidding. Probably not a good joke.

But I think he DOES know its wrong---deep inside---he's just minimizing cuz he's trying to convince himself and you in order to justify. Typical.
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