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I'm curious as to what you may think or have opinion on forcing kids into religon/church.
Brief synopsis: Due to a few years unmarrital bliss, my husband as turned to what he feel is last resort for him self and that is church. He has not been since he was 10. (now 51) He said he was forced through age 10, then when parents divorced they stopped. I too growin up until about age 17, went. Through younger years parents were youth leaders. Then we all slowly stopped. People in the church changed, typical hypocrit/judging etc started up and slowly we just all (except for mom) stopped. Mom was pianoist/organist. She stopped for while and went back.
Anyhow, I believe he is going because a good friend of his, whose faith is pretty strong compared to most we know, went through a divorce a few years ago. They were what I would call church going fools. (not in a bad way) They went every Sunday morning, night, during the week etc. Non-stop. So..in my husbands eyes and others, HOW could someone like that get divorced? They are great friends now, have strong parenting skills even though apart. He has since remarried to another strong faith/church person. So..for me, I'm feeling that is why H is giong. And yes...he's going to thier church..or friend.
Well, not long ago our daughter didn't feel good. Had her big bday party day before..rollerskating! Had many major falls. That same day, there was a major emotional fight and what I feel is abuse to her from my H. That's a whole other thread I have here as well. So..the next day she says to me she doesn't want to go. She doesn't like it and her back really hurts. Which she was very stiff and sore even night before. She has only been 2x and each sat in the adult sermon. We know no one there and non of the kids. She isn't comfortable if not with us. So...I told her I'd stay home with her. Well, H says "if your back hurts that much, probably shouldn't go to grandma's either". It was her actual bday and we were celebrating with family at my moms. I was so mad! So...I talked her into going to save 'peace' with him.
He later tells me he seen this preacher on TV that said you must do what it takes to get your kids involved in church as they will grow up to make terrible decisions, get into trouble etc. I think thats hooey! THAT starts with the parents. Don't get me wrong, I'm not against church or her going. But to say she will grow to be a bad person, make wrong decisions? Ummm...strong faithed people are NOT God and perfect.
Any how, we tried a different church just once as her school friend goes there. It was okay, and she did join her friend in the kids section. She had gone with her friend one other time during a Wed. night services. She seemed to like it so that's why we tried a Sunday morning services. As we pull into the parking lot she starts crying and says "I dont want to go in there...I don't understand it. I don't understand what they say" and she is sobbing uncontrollable. My heart just bleed for her! WE did explain it was okay that she did not have to understand she was still too young and that even mommy and daddy doesn't understand sometimes.
So...any way...my H has been going for a month now, I've gone with him 3x. Our daughter is aware of God and heaven. She has a childrens Bible that we read to her once in a while. She understands prayers. For most part, I just do not like how H has done this 380 seeking Church to fix our marriage so I know my first issue is resentment. I resent it b/c again...it's me doing what he wants on his terms and with the people he approves. (one of the many issues we have).
I didn't mean to get off track...I truly was curious as to how other's felt if 'forcing' kids into church and all is healthy? She is 7 and not stupid. Like me, very possibly could start to resent it? Like that Sunday, when she was upset over what I feel was a bribe to make her go...to avoid her getting upset and him then starting in on her because she will start crying and whining, I interven with something to conform to his way to appease him and head off what I feel may turn into anger with him.
She did spend all daycare and preschool (age 6mos. through age 5 before Kindergarten) in a church so again, she does know very basics. Maybe I'm wrong in my thinking. I don't mind going once in a while and I think she would be fine with that too. But the forcing thing, making her go kicking and screaming (not literally......yet!) just not comfortable with that. Definately not comfortable with the thought process of if we don't she will grow up a bad person per say. That is so wrong in my eyes.
He later tells me he seen this preacher on TV that said you must do what it takes to get your kids involved in church as they will grow up to make terrible decisions, get into trouble etc.
Disclaimers necessary here. I think your husband is a mental case, abusive SOB. There is not one piece of judgment that you have expressed about him here that has NOT made me want to throttle some sense into the MoRON.
Disclaimer two: I am a former Catholic forced into church turned atheist.
Whew.
What a load of crapola. In a mentally healthy family, a church can have a very positive effect on the overall development of family. But in the final analysis good parenting is what helps kids to learn the right way. Teaching SKILLS for living life; problem solving, interpersonal. character, integrity, discipline (TEACHING discipline not PUNISHING discipline).
Furthermore the role of TV evangelicals is to separate you from your money. Their job is to brainwash you into tithing. They are NOT like your local parish/congregation who actually knows or cares about you. It is Big Business for them.
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I think thats hooey! THAT starts with the parents. Don't get me wrong, I'm not against church or her going. But to say she will grow to be a bad person, make wrong decisions? Ummm...strong faithed people are NOT God and perfect.
Amen, sister.
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Any how, we tried a different church just once as her school friend goes there. It was okay, and she did join her friend in the kids section. She had gone with her friend one other time during a Wed. night services. She seemed to like it so that's why we tried a Sunday morning services. As we pull into the parking lot she starts crying and says "I dont want to go in there...I don't understand it. I don't understand what they say" and she is sobbing uncontrollable. My heart just bleed for her! WE did explain it was okay that she did not have to understand she was still too young and that even mommy and daddy doesn't understand sometimes.
I thought you were dumping his sorry butt. The ONLY thing that is going to come from forcing your child into religion that she doesn't want is
- absolute rejection of your religion
- rebellion against you in general
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So...any way...my H has been going for a month now, I've gone with him 3x. Our daughter is aware of God and heaven. She has a childrens Bible that we read to her once in a while. She understands prayers. For most part, I just do not like how H has done this 380 seeking Church to fix our marriage so I know my first issue is resentment. I resent it b/c again...it's me doing what he wants on his terms and with the people he approves. (one of the many issues we have).
Do you have access to therapy and/ or a domestic violence hot line so you can start reaching out to people who can help you understand how to break free of this pattern?
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I didn't mean to get off track...I truly was curious as to how other's felt if 'forcing' kids into church and all is healthy? She is 7 and not stupid. Like me, very possibly could start to resent it?
It worked so well for me! Not! Yes she will resent it.
Well, I've caught some flack from my friends on this one. I have raised my children in a Christian home. However, I'm not going to force them to attend church. That's something they need to decide to do. We want our children attending church for the right reasons. How will they ever experience the joy and peace religion is supposed to bring if they are coerced and threatened to attend church?
And quiet honestly I don't approve of some of the things which go on in some of the churches. Right now some of the fundamental Christians views don't need to be imparted on my teenagers. I want my children to have an open mind about our world.
I wish you luck with this one! Pray for God's guidance.
I would not force her to go - especially if her back was hurting her and it was her birthday.
This last weekend my oldest asked to go - and my youngest asked to stay home - and they both got their way. I honestly wouldn't have gone if the oldest hadn't asked me to take her.
And as far as church helping kids be better people - make better decisions or stay out of trouble - we had a rash of young, unmarried girls become mothers a few years ago. Was a bit sad to hear all of these proud church-going people announcing that their daughters were pregnant when there were no fathers in sight.
Small church - 100 people on a good week. I think I remember 3 or 4 such girls having kids that year.
I think being an involved parent - with or without church - is what makes the difference.
I, like vthomeschoolmom, was also raised catholic, told that if I "strayed", I would turn into a devil-worshipping, drug-addicted serial killer, and that "atheist" and "agnostic" were just nice ways of saying "satanist".
And like her, today I am borderline atheist/agnostic-and I consider myself a fine, upstanding and contributing member of society. I don't drink, smoke, cheat on my wife or my taxes, and I have never been in trouble with the law.
I get people telling me or anyone who will listen that if you don't force your kids to accept god, they will get pregnant, join gangs, take drugs, drop out of school and all sorts of rosy scenarios.
I remember our neighbor down the street: they were bible-thumping Christians who always attributed every thing that happened to them, good or bad, to be the "work of the good lord".
I wonder if they were saying that when all three of their daughters "disappeared" for a year, and their son was arrested for robbing an elderly couple.
But, I remember a certain painting that the preists and nuns all told me about. It was a picture of Jesus knocking on a door, but there was no latch on the door- the artist said that you had to accept Jesus, and open the door, on your own will. I exercised my own will, and I locked the door.
My daughter has no religion, but she is very kind, polite and a straight-A student, and frankly, I don't think one could ask for a better kid.
Now, if she wants to accept religion, that is fine with me-it has to be her decision, not my decision or the decision of someone trying to shame her into it.
He later tells me he seen this preacher on TV that said you must do what it takes to get your kids involved in church as they will grow up to make terrible decisions, get into trouble etc. I think thats hooey! THAT starts with the parents.
Your H is dead wrong! You are right. My mom is devoutly religious. never missed a day of church her entire life and she tried to force me and my siblings to go to church. It was a nightmare.
I am also an atheist, as is my boyfriend. I would never force my children into any religion. I feel that I made my decision. I did my research, looking at a huge variety of options including Christianity, Wicca, Buddhism, etc. I feel that the decision I made was an informed one I am comfortable with. And because I was able to make that decision for myself, I never doubt it. My children are entitled to that same certainty in whatever religion or lack thereof they decide to go with.
If they wanted to go to church, I would take them. If they decide they are a Christian, I will support them. If they decide they are an atheist like me, I will support them in that as well. It is all their decision.
I have read your other posts, and I also think your husband is abusive. I also think what he is doing is only going to push her further away from religion and God. You cannot force someone to believe in something if they don't; you cannot get them to be religious by forcing them to do something that makes them uncomfortable. If she believes and attends church, it needs to be because she wants to and she chooses to be there, otherwise it does no good at all.
I am also an atheist, as is my boyfriend. I would never force my children into any religion.
Or non-religion for that matter. I am a touch anti-organized religion. OK more than a touch. I think a lot of evil is done in the name of a poorly interpreted reading of various religious texts. Religion is as much a force for judgment and division as it is for charity and love.
That said, when my kids ask me, I am very careful not to bad mouth. They have religious relatives. I use statements like "I believe"... and "Christians believe" and "Muslims believe"... or whatever. And try to leave the judgment out of it. Over time, they need to acquire the information to make their own choices.
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I feel that I made my decision. I did my research, looking at a huge variety of options including Christianity, Wicca, Buddhism, etc. I feel that the decision I made was an informed one I am comfortable with.
Wandering a little... I like Buddhism, not so much a religion as a philosophy. I can be an atheistic Buddhist.
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If they wanted to go to church, I would take them. If they decide they are a Christian, I will support them. If they decide they are an atheist like me, I will support them in that as well. It is all their decision.
At 7, kids have parents who make decisions for them. If the decision is to go to church, they go to church. If the decision is to go to school, go to the mall, or go to Disneyland, they go. They can be given some age-appropriate decisions, but a 7 year old doesn't decide how the family spends the day. I think the problem here is not that 7 year old doesn't want to participate, but that you and husband aren't on the same religious page. This is why it's generally bad practice to marry outside one's own value/belief system. Your husband has made a very drastic change in his lifestyle and your values/beliefs are probably about the same as when you married. This isn't a decision for a 7 year old but one to be made between a husband and wife. As she gets older, she'll have the autonomy and the information necessary to make heavy decisions. Right now, her job is to be a kid.
I do agree with unbelievable that it is appropriate for a 7yo to be expected to church with the family. I think that if he wasn't already causing such issues with her and you, then there would be no force involved. Kids kinda tend to go along with what is going on. The sudden nature of the fanatical church going probably also adds to the friction.
Or non-religion for that matter. I am a touch anti-organized religion. OK more than a touch. I think a lot of evil is done in the name of a poorly interpreted reading of various religious texts. Religion is as much a force for judgment and division as it is for charity and love.
That said, when my kids ask me, I am very careful not to bad mouth. They have religious relatives. I use statements like "I believe"... and "Christians believe" and "Muslims believe"... or whatever. And try to leave the judgment out of it. Over time, they need to acquire the information to make their own choices.
I so agree with you here. I do think that people, of all religions (with a few possible exceptions) choose to interpret their religious texts in the way that best suits whatever purpose they have at the moment.
I also try to leave the judgment and bad mouthing out of it. If I do feel the need to say something bad, I try to limit to a specific thing. For example, that Westboro Baptist Church that makes the news for picketing funerals and such. I despise them, I think it's people like them that make all Christians look bad. And I'm very careful to make sure my kids understand that it's that specific church that I am complaining about, and precisely why I am complaining about them: they don't do anything that seems to have anything to do with Christianity, they disrespect people who've done nothing to deserve it, and they're after nothing but attention and money. I also make it a point to tell my kids this is my opinion, and that they do not have to agree with it.
At 7, kids have parents who make decisions for them. If the decision is to go to church, they go to church. If the decision is to go to school, go to the mall, or go to Disneyland, they go. They can be given some age-appropriate decisions, but a 7 year old doesn't decide how the family spends the day. I think the problem here is not that 7 year old doesn't want to participate, but that you and husband aren't on the same religious page. This is why it's generally bad practice to marry outside one's own value/belief system. Your husband has made a very drastic change in his lifestyle and your values/beliefs are probably about the same as when you married. This isn't a decision for a 7 year old but one to be made between a husband and wife. As she gets older, she'll have the autonomy and the information necessary to make heavy decisions. Right now, her job is to be a kid.
You are completely correct. He has made a very drastic change in seeking religon as his 'saviour' in our marriage. He refuses counsling with exception of his new found pastor. Why? Becuase he believes his pastor (of only 4 weeks) cares for him, that he has nothing to gain out of this unlike someone being paid per hour. Funny, 2 weeks ago when I went to church with him, as we were leaving the pastor said to us, "Now, what are your names again?" On way home H says "that kind of bothers me he didn't remember our names".
Hmmmm...really? But he cares about you. Now because he called him Sunday, at his home and since the pastor invited to his home on a Sunday afternoon during time his wife was preparing dinner for their family...he feels HE, the pastor, is the right person for the job. Said he made more sense to him in 2 hours than any of the paid counselors. I did ask..'did he make sense to you because he told you what you liked to hear?' He says no, that he did "diagnosis" him with some things he didn't like to hear but they were fixable.
I don't mind going once in a while. But I am not at a point in my life to make IT my life. He all of sudden is. He watches it on TV now, he even has christian stations preset in truck! Like me in finding this forum, he now sits on computer finding and reading religous sites. He heard something on TV of these class married people can attend. He called the number, looked up the website, etc. Found one of them less than 60miles away wanting us to attend. He's completely flipped his lid, yet I'm the one on meds!!! Sorry, if I don't laugh I cry and make myself sick to my stomach.
I do agree with unbelievable that it is appropriate for a 7yo to be expected to church with the family. I think that if he wasn't already causing such issues with her and you, then there would be no force involved. Kids kinda tend to go along with what is going on. The sudden nature of the fanatical church going probably also adds to the friction.
Yes, all true. She's 7 and not stupid. I'm sure because I do not want to go all the time, she follows suite with mommy. Right or wrong that's just how kids are. If it was reversed, she'd probably do same with daddy.
I have, for so long, conformed to doing what I thought would make him feel better, make him not angry, edgy, or whatever and I already told him, I resent this whole church thing because it's yet just another controll issue. He feels because I grew up with it, I should have no problem going back. I use to sing in choir and as special music in church...he feels I should do that again. Says church will be a good place for me to make friends like I want, meet other women, get my "girls nite/weekends" by way of womens bible study or retreats. WHY...of course it would be as it will be women he approves and feels safe and secure with me being around! Sorry, my sarcasm is getting the best of me. Uggghhhh I'm just so drained. I'm sorry for all this blabbing.
Forcing kids into religon, whats your view? 
Sorry, if I don't laugh I cry and make myself sick to my stomach.
