General Relationship DiscussionAlthough anyone can post anywhere on Talk About Marriage, this section is for people interested in general relationship and marriage advice.
It was suggested (observed) in another post by (AFEH? AHEF? anyway (and correct me if I am wrong:
More recent years have seen a general dimming of the lines that define separate roles in a relationship (each doing more of what was once the believed domain (imposed domain, whatever domain) of the other.
Now.. the question becomes... what effects does this dimming of the lines have in the working of a relationship?
What happens when you share roles, meld them, lose definition? It was suggested that this role playing of recent years lends itself to the building of the "beta" man "nice guy" (whatever you want to call it). That, I believe, was the observation being made.
Further observation or suggestions, was that perhaps, after time, we don't like this. But why? Is it that subconsciously both men and women are stuck on previously imposed labels and roles and that we want to look to the other to fill those roles?
Do we secretly want our own domain in the relationship?... not saying it has to be indefinitely defined with no wiggle room or times and places to share a role, but that we want definition?
Are we equating roles to gender that don't need to be, but simply want either/or or another to be OUR ROLE/DOMAIN?
Does it confuse things not to have definition? leaving us wondering too often what we are supposed to do, or wondering exactly what it is we want the other to do? "I want him to do SOMETHING but I am not sure what myself, and nothing he is doing seems to be right?" (insert she where you want, I am a woman so it's coming out as him)
So just to ponder (no real need to insert gender beyond the fact that roles and domains in the house were once accepted or defined by gender... leave that out and just think... defined roles of any kind, with no determining factor for all such as gender...)
Question 2: can this even be discussed without the imposition of the gender discussion? HAAAAAA
Yes. I believe my wife does not truly want a man or a husband or a lover or even a friend or companion. I believe what she wants is an employee for her to be the archetypal irrational unpleasant 'bad boss'.
It was suggested (observed) in another post by (AFEH? AHEF? anyway (and correct me if I am wrong:
More recent years have seen a general dimming of the lines that define separate roles in a relationship (each doing more of what was once the believed domain (imposed domain, whatever domain) of the other.
Now.. the question becomes... what effects does this dimming of the lines have in the working of a relationship?
What happens when you share roles, meld them, lose definition? It was suggested that this role playing of recent years lends itself to the building of the "beta" man "nice guy" (whatever you want to call it). That, I believe, was the observation being made.
Further observation or suggestions, was that perhaps, after time, we don't like this. But why?
Are making an assumption that the "we" here is the vast majority of people? I see no reason to suspect that "we" dislike the change of expectation at all.
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Is it that subconsciously both men and women are stuck on previously imposed labels and roles and that we want to look to the other to fill those roles?
Do we secretly want our own domain in the relationship?... not saying it has to be indefinitely defined with no wiggle room or times and places to share a role, but that we want definition?
Are we equating roles to gender that don't need to be, but simply want either/or or another to be OUR ROLE/DOMAIN?
I like being able to define my own domain based on my interest and abilities rather than someone else' vision of what I am.
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Does it confuse things not to have definition? leaving us wondering too often what we are supposed to do, or wondering exactly what it is we want the other to do? "I want him to do SOMETHING but I am not sure what myself, and nothing he is doing seems to be right?" (insert she where you want, I am a woman so it's coming out as him)
My husband and I, GASP, TALK about these expectations. No wondering.
I am not even necessarily talking about needing a socially imposed role (though some people might need something of the sort as a starting point to creating roles in a relationship) I am saying.. do relationships need defined roles, and if they do... how do you define them....
If you DO define your own, are you allowing your SO other room do define THEIR own... Is it harder to do from scratch, on your own, without a starting point of what is socially imposed/believed/implied? If you succeed in this definition of roles in your relationship, how did you decide each and make it work? was there compromise? was it a natural taking by each? did you/ do you.. impose any role ON your SO without trying/realizing?
Don't just pick apart or react/respond... add more... lets get this going (with an attempt to leave gender discussion OUT HAHA now THERE is the true challenge of this thread MUWAHAHAAH JOKE!!!!)
SOOOOO not making this the gender discussion.. you want that... go make your own thread HAHA
I am not even necessarily talking about needing a socially imposed role (though some people might need something of the sort as a starting point to creating roles in a relationship) I am saying.. do relationships need defined roles, and if they do... how do you define them....
depending on what you mean by roles... We have a set of expected division of labor and responsibility. And there are some ares in which we are truly a democracy.
Within the realm of housework, we have worked out a system (kind of just happened) in which he tends to clean wide, and I tend to clean deep. But otherwise when the garbage needs emptying, someone empties it. I tend to put the laundry in the machine and dryer. But either of us is likely to fold. He washes the kitchen floor most often. I wash other floors more often. (The kitchen floor is by far the hardest, so it seems to come out even.)
As I am currently not working outside of the home, I am expected to do the lions share of housework. This seems more than fair. He has already started habituating himself to doing more so that when I get a job, he is ready to partivipate and contribute.
We have come to these expectations through time just showing us how things are going to be to some extent but also through a lot of discussions.
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If you DO define your own, are you allowing your SO other room do define THEIR own... Is it harder to do from scratch, on your own, without a starting point of what is socially imposed/believed/implied?
Honestly? I think that is largely influenced by how much otherwise goodwill the relationship has. EVERYTHING is going to be difficult when there is no good will. If there is ill will, each will be attempting to defend their own turf.
But with good will it is easier to just do for the other. I HATE car maintenance. DH just does it, for example.
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If you succeed in this definition of roles in your relationship, how did you decide each and make it work? was there compromise? was it a natural taking by each? did you/ do you.. impose any role ON your SO without trying/realizing?
We each tried to take on what the other least liked. We also each try hard to do the best job. There is some degree of patience to just let things go. I forget to clean the bathroom sink when I am done in the am. Makes him nuts. He sighs. I hate that he leaves dirty dishes at the computer. I sigh.
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Don't just pick apart or react/respond... add more... lets get this going (with an attempt to leave gender discussion OUT HAHA now THERE is the true challenge of this thread MUWAHAHAAH JOKE!!!!)
SOOOOO not making this the gender discussion.. you want that... go make your own thread HAHA
We don't seem to have any gender specific "roles". We both largely do the same work. If the wood rack is empty, someone fills it... We both parent equally. We both cook and clean. When not requiring home schooling, we both work.
OK, VT... question... have you ever, or can you imagine yourself ever thinking that you just want the MAN "quintessential MAN" in a moment? Might be hard to say yes or no... Such as if you hurt and you want the MAN to hold you (make it all better kind of stupid sappy moment that I, personally, am more than happy to admit I have looked for)?
OK, VT... question... have you ever, or can you imagine yourself ever thinking that you just want the MAN "quintessential MAN" in a moment?
I don't even know what that means.
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Might be hard to say yes or no... Such as if you hurt and you want the MAN to hold you (make it all better kind of stupid sappy moment that I, personally, am more than happy to admit I have looked for)?
I certainly want my HUSBAND to hold me. Or more likely talk to me, in my case. But I am the wrong person to ask this of. I self identify as bisexual and biamorous. So being married, I want me lovin' to come from my love. But if he were ever to say, kick, the next relationship would not necessarily be with a man.
I certainly want my HUSBAND to hold me. Or more likely talk to me, in my case. But I am the wrong person to ask this of. I self identify as bisexual and biamorous. So being married, I want me lovin' to come from my love. But if he were ever to say, kick, the next relationship would not necessarily be with a man.
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And maybe I seem a bit confused. . .but maybe, I got you pegged! Ha! Don't know what to do about those tossed salad and scrambled eggs. . .they're posting again. Scannerguard has left the building.
I don't have a problem doing "women's work" like laundry, cleaning, cooking, etc, so long as the woman don't mind mowing the grass, shovelling snow, cleaning up after pets, maintaining/fixing the car, etc. It's all about general equality. Neither gender is property of the other, and I never complain about doing dishes when dinner is made when I get home from work!
Every relationship must figure out who is gonna do what.
It has nothing to do with sex or gender.
We have a home that we want to have clean. If we are both working earning an income 5 days a week then those tasks must be divided up in a manner that makes sense given our schedules. If one person works less hours it seems natural that more household tasks would fall on them.
However, men and women (or shall we say both parents) should be equally responsible for raising the children no matter what.
If there are tasks that need to be done that neither has the time, talent or inclination to do than they will just need to hire out.
I don't have a problem doing "women's work" like laundry, cleaning, cooking, etc, so long as the woman don't mind mowing the grass, shovelling snow, cleaning up after pets, maintaining/fixing the car, etc. It's all about general equality.
I would state it slightly differently than this. REAL equality comes when you don't worry about whose work, man or woman, it is. When the work needs to get done, you get off your ass and do it.
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Neither gender is property of the other, and I never complain about doing dishes when dinner is made when I get home from work!
Which is great. When the woods needs to be brought in, I don't ask whose job it is. I send the kids! Just kidding. We ALL do wood. We all do lawn. We all do dishes.
And when you get to a decent place in your marriage, you don't have to worry or fight anymore about roles. You see what needs to be done. You do it.
Roles in relationships 
HAHA
Just kidding. We ALL do wood. We all do lawn. We all do dishes.
