Says he'll NEVER marry again while divorcing.. is this knee jerk or real? - Talk About Marriage
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post #1 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-17-2011, 04:09 PM Thread Starter
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Says he'll NEVER marry again while divorcing.. is this knee jerk or real?

Ok, So, I've been dating a man I met 11 months ago.. dating full swing 8 of those months.. we are both in the midst of divorces finalizing.

A bit of Back history.. we both were in long term marriages, we both were basically separated, living in separate bedrooms for years before we finally separated from respective spouses. We met AFTER we separated.. so, we are really the typical "rebound" dates fresh out of a relationship REALLY.. the relationships were long over before legal documents drawn up.. at any rate.. we have fallen madly in love with one another... neither one of us are looking to rush things and move in immediately after the divorces are final in a few weeks, but we are committed to one another and making long term plans and dreams.

When I first separated I swore I'd never marry again.. thought it was the doom of the century.. when I met him, he expressed the same.. and from there we discussed how it wasn't a necessary thing.... well, as time as evolved and I have fallen more in love with him than I ever was with my spouse.. I am starting to have pangs of eventually wanting to marry him.. no time soon, but am finding an issue with being an old woman and still someone's girlfriend..

The topic of marriage rarely ever comes up.. and when it does it isn't referenced in terms of us.. just comments about (from him now.. I've stopped commenting) how he feels the papers tend to ruin the relationship.. (which mind you was how i viewed it when I was despising my husband and wanting out).. but this past week as he was paying taxes.. he makes quite a bit of money.. he was online noticing how much his soon to be ex was running up his credit cards and he again blurted he would NEVER get married again. .. it was said with such venom.. he is having to pay her quite a hefty amount in alimony.. along the lines of over 100k a year.. and after a bit of asking why he was SO opposed to it.. seems the bottom line on it is.. MONEY..

He seems to waiver back and forth unconsciously.. he will make "fruedian slips" and say things like.. when we are old pple with think you are married to a nut.. .. but when he is making conscious statements he is clear to point out he will never marry.

we had a vague conversation about it about a month ago and I commented I could take marriage or leave it at this point..the only thing that annoyed me were the laws around non married couples.. for example if he were in an accident.. I may not be allowed in etc b/c I wouldn't be next of kin... he commented.. well precautions can be put in place for that sort of stuff.. documents can be put in place stating you have rights to those sorts of things and.. we can have rings and state our vows etc and be married in every way..

so, he is sort of confusing to me... he wants to be in a committed relationship, he wants me.. he doesn't want to be alone..says little things off the cuff that indicate us as married in the future, yet will get annoyed over things.. usually money and usually after dealing with his soon to be ex.. that makes him scream I WILL NEVER marry...

so.. is this one of those situations where it is probably more of a knee jerk reaction to the sting of this situation he is in at the moment and in time he's one of the ones likely to change his mind on it? .. Or is this one of those red flag things that I need to really lay on the table right now that if he really means NEVER I need to know so I can decide if it is something I can live with.

I think, from my perspective.. if a mutually agreeable situation is set up that we both feel we are getting what we want from the relationship.. something that settles his fear of a marriage license.. and appeases my need for some form of solid commitment.. then the paper is not the thing.

Just wondering what pples gut reactions are on this one.. I can not imagine ever finding a more loving or more perfect match.and don't want to leave it in hopes of better.. but don't want to set myself up for a dumb scenario.
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post #2 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-17-2011, 06:29 PM
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Re: Says he'll NEVER marry again while divorcing.. is this knee jerk or real?

Two thoughts come to mind. Only dating 11 months and $100,000 a year in alimony. Yowza! That's a lot of dough. If I were him I'd probably be a bit leery of getting married again if I had that kind of money. I shudder to think of paying TWO ex's much less one.

I say give it time but keep in mind that he may truly never marry again. So you will have to decide on your own how long you are willing to wait or if you are willing to just be his girlfriend. It's okay to want that for yourself but that doesn't mean that he will agree with that.
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post #3 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-17-2011, 06:37 PM
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Re: Says he'll NEVER marry again while divorcing.. is this knee jerk or real?

You fell madly in love with him and presume he feels exactly the same way about you.

He can love and not want marriage, especially since the divorce is not final.

Your way of thinking is that you were against remarriage until you now are for it.

So he has to share your thoughts on marriage if he really loves you?

That's not fair, nor true.
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post #4 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-17-2011, 06:43 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Says he'll NEVER marry again while divorcing.. is this knee jerk or real?

yeah, I know.. and the fact is I'm not in any position to remarry anytime soon anyway.. so I've got time to hang on and enjoy the ride and see how things pan out, but then there is that nagging feeling in me that says.. if he'd just quit saying NEVER!.. it did come out that it was a financial thing that had him shy on the whole thing.. I said well that is what prenups are for.. and his reply to that was.. but all a prenup is is a piece of paper assuming failure is inevitable anyway so why bother with any of it.. just live and be happy. .. I get it, I see the logic in it.. but I also see the value in just the comfort of "giving your all" (and I'm not talking about finances) of being able to know the man you love with all your heart is your husband.. and not sure what sort of agreement could be made that would soothe that in me... a ring and the title of fiance maybe? just something to show the world for my own piece of mind he's and I are both off the market.. i don't know.. I'm not even sure why it matters to me really.
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post #5 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-17-2011, 06:46 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Says he'll NEVER marry again while divorcing.. is this knee jerk or real?

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You fell madly in love with him and presume he feels exactly the same way about you.

He can love and not want marriage, especially since the divorce is not final.

Your way of thinking is that you were against remarriage until you now are for it.

So he has to share your thoughts on marriage if he really loves you?

That's not fair, nor true.
no..I'm not thinking he has to share my feelings.. I'm just suprised at how "hurt" for the lack of better word.. i am feeling realizing he isnt feeling that way now that we are both proclaiming to each other we are in love like we never have been before.. when I realized how much I loved him is when I realized I didn't feel the same way about never marrying again... I guess bottom line is I'm suprised at how "I" feel.. and wondering how many men say this sort of thing at the time of their divorce only to realize they didn't really mean NEVER after all the dust settled.
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post #6 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-17-2011, 07:06 PM
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Re: Says he'll NEVER marry again while divorcing.. is this knee jerk or real?

I'm in a failing marriage and I am absolutely positive that I will never marry again even if I find someone to love.

30 years is enough out of one life to devote to marriage, IMHO.

The tethers bind too much now.
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post #7 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-17-2011, 07:22 PM
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I'm in a failing marriage and I am absolutely positive that I will never marry again even if I find someone to love.

30 years is enough out of one life to devote to marriage, IMHO.

The tethers bind too much now.
I'm in a good marriage and will never marry again if I were to divorce.
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post #8 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-17-2011, 07:38 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Says he'll NEVER marry again while divorcing.. is this knee jerk or real?

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I'm in a good marriage and will never marry again if I were to divorce.
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interesting that you would say that.. why? you are in a good one.. so if you fall in love with someone that you want to spend the rest of your life with, how would you show commitment? Not saying marriage is the only way.. just wondering how others find ways to feel as secure in a long term relationship as marraige makes one feel..even though, going through a divorce myself I know a marriage isn't a guarantee of squat.. just something comforting about it.
... Don't get me wrong.. if there is another way to feel the same level of comfort and commitment I'm all for it.. just feeling the oats here and wondering the alternatives of it all
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post #9 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-17-2011, 07:47 PM
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Re: Says he'll NEVER marry again while divorcing.. is this knee jerk or real?

He's not a jerk, he's a man who invested a lot - far more than money - in a marriage and is scared of making a commitment that might cost another fortune. I don't blame him - I've been there, my first divorce ended up costing far more than I'm willing to say other than I wish it were only $100 K. Right now he's going through the final agonies, seeing the numbers in black and white, reminded of dreams that have died.

I get the impression that kids aren't going to be a part of your relationship so why do you want to marry? What benefits do you think it would bring to your relationship? Does your state recognize domestic partners?

There are major, major financial issues with second marriages especially when one partner has made money along the way.

I've told my GF that although I can envision growing old with her I won't remarry, adding that as we both have children from our first marriages I don't want my kids' inheritance going to her children or a lover/husband she might find after my death. Wanting to provide for her I would set up a trust to benefit her that would revert to my children or grandchildren under a variety of circumstances.

The other big financial issue is medical care - husbands are responsible for their wive's care, it can quickly bankrupt even the wealthiest. A good friend recently died from ovarian cancer at 63, between surgeries, hospitals, doctors and chemotherapy I think they were spending well over $100,000 a year and probably a great deal more over the course of several years. In case you are wondering how they could afford that w/o good medical insurance - my friend's husband grew up in poverty more severe than seen in the US today, in HS he had the choice of taking the bus or having lunch, she was the daughter of a lower middle class family, the two of them invested very wisely, $10,000 in 1985 grew to well over a million by 2005.

I'm currently going through my second divorce, very unhappy that despite not having kids with her, paying most of our bills for over 25 years, she has refused mediation and asked for alimony and a large lump sum as well as the house I put a great deal of time, effort and money into. I was happy to do so when we were enjoying each other, but as she was the one who effectively left my bed I'm p***d that I will have to pay for the privilege of not living with her.
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post #10 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-17-2011, 07:59 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Says he'll NEVER marry again while divorcing.. is this knee jerk or real?

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He's not a jerk, he's a man who invested a lot - far more than money - in a marriage and is scared of making a commitment that might cost another fortune. I don't blame him - I've been there, my first divorce ended up costing far more than I'm willing to say other than I wish it were only $100 K. Right now he's going through the final agonies, seeing the numbers in black and white, reminded of dreams that have died.

I get the impression that kids aren't going to be a part of your relationship so why do you want to marry? What benefits do you think it would bring to your relationship? Does your state recognize domestic partners?

There are major, major financial issues with second marriages especially when one partner has made money along the way.

I've told my GF that although I can envision growing old with her I won't remarry, adding that as we both have children from our first marriages I don't want my kids' inheritance going to her children or a lover/husband she might find after my death. Wanting to provide for her I would set up a trust to benefit her that would revert to my children or grandchildren under a variety of circumstances.

The other big financial issue is medical care - husbands are responsible for their wive's care, it can quickly bankrupt even the wealthiest. A good friend recently died from ovarian cancer at 63, between surgeries, hospitals, doctors and chemotherapy I think they were spending well over $100,000 a year and probably a great deal more over the course of several years. In case you are wondering how they could afford that w/o good medical insurance - my friend's husband grew up in poverty more severe than seen in the US today, in HS he had the choice of taking the bus or having lunch, she was the daughter of a lower middle class family, the two of them invested very wisely, $10,000 in 1985 grew to well over a million by 2005.

I'm currently going through my second divorce, very unhappy that despite not having kids with her, paying most of our bills for over 25 years, she has refused mediation and asked for alimony and a large lump sum as well as the house I put a great deal of time, effort and money into. I was happy to do so when we were enjoying each other, but as she was the one who effectively left my bed I'm p***d that I will have to pay for the privilege of not living with her.
I most certainly see your point of view.. and do not disagree with it in the least.. no, there will not be children.. I do have three and he has two.. his are grown mine are not..but that is irrelevant here.. we have discussed the fact that anything that is mine goes to my kids and anything that is his will go to his.. period.. he has indicated that he would not leave me destitute should he die on me.. would certainly make provisions for me to be cared for in the event old age rolls around and he were to die first.. and I don't have any issues at all with a prenup.. it is not his money I am after.. so I guess the question to this paragraph is.. if money is the issue, but you want have the intention of a lifelong relationship.. and one is scared over money, the other prefers the bond that marriage implies.. then what is the problem with marriage with a good prenup?.. seems to me both get what they want.. a lifelong committed relationship free of fear of being robbed blind should the relationship fail?


Edited to add.. I frankly hope that I am in a position to NOT need to be "Provided for"..I prefer my independence, so I dont' want that to come across wrong.. I really am not after him for money. .. the other thing.. I don't even know what it means for a state to recognize domestic parnters.. gonna have to google that.
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post #11 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-17-2011, 10:39 PM
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Re: Says he'll NEVER marry again while divorcing.. is this knee jerk or real?

Hi Claire,

Thanks for clarifying your intent, it is more than honorable but it may run into legal issues that are outside your control.

In CT my attorney tells me that the law states one third or more of a spouse's estate has to go to the widow(er). We didn't address the question of a prenup's effects.

Now that I'm in sunny California I expect the law is similar or worse when viewed from my desired results, this is one of many community property states.

I want to retract my suggestion about domestic partnerships now that I've read Wikipedia and several other pages dealing with CA laws. It offers many of the same pros and cons as marriage but is aimed at same sex couples or differing sex couples where one partner is over 62.



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I most certainly see your point of view.. and do not disagree with it in the least.. no, there will not be children.. I do have three and he has two.. his are grown mine are not..but that is irrelevant here.. we have discussed the fact that anything that is mine goes to my kids and anything that is his will go to his.. period.. he has indicated that he would not leave me destitute should he die on me.. would certainly make provisions for me to be cared for in the event old age rolls around and he were to die first.. and I don't have any issues at all with a prenup.. it is not his money I am after.. so I guess the question to this paragraph is.. if money is the issue, but you want have the intention of a lifelong relationship.. and one is scared over money, the other prefers the bond that marriage implies.. then what is the problem with marriage with a good prenup?.. seems to me both get what they want.. a lifelong committed relationship free of fear of being robbed blind should the relationship fail?


Edited to add.. I frankly hope that I am in a position to NOT need to be "Provided for"..I prefer my independence, so I dont' want that to come across wrong.. I really am not after him for money. .. the other thing.. I don't even know what it means for a state to recognize domestic parnters.. gonna have to google that.
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post #12 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-18-2011, 07:50 AM
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Re: Says he'll NEVER marry again while divorcing.. is this knee jerk or real?

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interesting that you would say that.. why? you are in a good one.. so if you fall in love with someone that you want to spend the rest of your life with, how would you show commitment? Not saying marriage is the only way.. just wondering how others find ways to feel as secure in a long term relationship as marraige makes one feel..even though, going through a divorce myself I know a marriage isn't a guarantee of squat.. just something comforting about it.
... Don't get me wrong.. if there is another way to feel the same level of comfort and commitment I'm all for it.. just feeling the oats here and wondering the alternatives of it all
I wouldn't get married again because it isn't beneficial to men besides on April 15th. Look at the words you use "level of comfort", to me that sounds like you're saying "I've arrived" and can slack on the things that you did to make your man want to make you his one and only. Without that "level of comfort" you are on your A game and so is he. How many times have people on this board written about going back to how it was when they dated? There is a reason for that. Just because I wouldn't marry again does not mean I wouldn't be monogamous but marriage is a lot of work and life is too short.

ďIn thy foul throat thou liest.Ē
― William Shakespeare, Richard III

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post #13 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-18-2011, 08:06 AM
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Re: Says he'll NEVER marry again while divorcing.. is this knee jerk or real?

Only time will tell if this is a knee-jerk reaction or if he will always feel this way.

The question is . . .can you live with it if he never changes his mind and never commits to a marriage with you? Can you live with a long term relationship without the 'benefit' of marriage?

And I'm changing the subject a little bit here - but why does his supposed soon-to-be ex still have access to his credit cards? If he is really in the process of divorce then joint credit cards should have been canceled a long time ago - like before he even moved out of the house. Sounds like he needs a better lawyer to advise him.

Last edited by SadieBrown; 04-18-2011 at 08:40 AM.
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post #14 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-18-2011, 08:24 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Says he'll NEVER marry again while divorcing.. is this knee jerk or real?

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Only time will tell if this is a knee-jerk reaction or if he will always feel this way.

The question is . . .can you live with it if he never changes his mind and never comments to a marriage with you? Can you live with a long term relationship without the 'benefit' of marriage?

And I'm changing the subject a little bit here - but why does his supposed soon-to-be ex still have access to his credit cards? If he is really in the process of divorce then joint credit cards should have been canceled a long time ago - like before he even moved out of the house. Sounds like he needs a better lawyer to advise him.
To answer can I live with it... right now.. I just dont' know, it is only now surfacing within me that uh.. my feelings are changing on this topic wonder if his will too and if not. hmmm how much time do I give it? How much am I willing to invest in this before going down the rabbit hole.. I dont' have a clear formed opinion on this in my mind yet.. really just here trying to sort it all out. I've read alot over the last day about how cohabitating without marriage fails even more than marriage b/c there ISN"T that symbol of devotion that gives that extra push to try and work it out. .. I want this relationship to have every opportunity to flourish and grow and be one that lasts.. I've had enough divorce and pain.. The part to me that I find appealing about the institution of Marriage is the symbolic nature of it.. the.. "WE ARE TOGETHER>> KNOW IT< FEEL IT AND RESPECT IT" energy it puts out to yourself and others.. If I could figure out a way that just cohabitating would give me that same comfort (and this was addressed by the person above.. I am giving a slightly different definition to what I mean by comfort..) Perhaps comfort isn't the right word.. I don't want comfort so I can slack off I want the feeling of security.. (false security perhaps, but is a psychological thing) in knowing that our intentions to one another are committed to working through to the best of our ability before calling it quits if it comes to that... the act of just cohabitating makes it very easy to call it quits and not give something its all in the end to me I think... Oh I don't know.. Maybe cohabitating with the term "fiances".. with the symbol of a ring to show our meaning to each other would be enough for me without ever actually signing a paper.. I don't know.


As for the credit card thing... he did separate out the bank accounts, but he is a very generous man.. he is trying to end this marriage on the friendliest and most trusting of terms, so he left one joint credit card there for emergencies till it was all said and done based on trust... and up until now.. she has left that alone.. but then.. she didn't know about me then either... LOL.. now she knows he's moved on and isn't going to leave me.. so a little spite is rearing its head.. I think that priveledge just got yanked.
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post #15 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-18-2011, 08:48 AM
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Re: Says he'll NEVER marry again while divorcing.. is this knee jerk or real?

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he is trying to end this marriage on the friendliest and most trusting of terms, so he left one joint credit card there for emergencies till it was all said and done based on trust... and up until now.. she has left that alone.. but then.. she didn't know about me then either... LOL.. now she knows he's moved on and isn't going to leave me.. so a little spite is rearing its head.. I think that priveledge just got yanked.
Well of course she is not liking that he's not even divorced from her and already in a relationship with someone so soon after. Anyone would feel that way. Is your soon to be ex seeing anyone seriously right now?

If neither of you is divorced yet, tread carefully.

It does come across as you both being eachothers' rebound relationship. Going through a divorce is gruelling. I found myself the entire time saying I will never remarry. I just got divorced 2 weeks ago and it's like a little something has lifted for me, but I'm still wary of marriage.

Being fresh off a divorce, I cannot even fathom going on date with someone at this point, let alone being in another relationship so soon afterwards, especially not a "serious" one.

Some folks absolutely DO NOT want to remarry. Ever. Some do want to.

My feeling on this situation is to take him at his word. If he says he's not into marriage again, then believe him. You won't be able to convince him one way or another. Maybe he is saying this now cause of what fallout of his marriage and the divorce and the financial issues that go along with it. Divorce changes a person. It makes you a little more cynical, you lose a certain innocence, and you aren't as "trusting" anymore, if that makes sense. Maybe one day he will change his mind. You have to decide if you are willing to wait for that.

In the interim, it's up to you to decide whether you want to continue this or not.

My advice is, get your divorces (if you haven't already) and go from there.

Nonetheless, you should talk to him about how you're feeling.
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