Talk About Marriage banner
Status
Not open for further replies.

My life is a Jerry Springer episode. Need advice...

2K views 13 replies 7 participants last post by  gouge_away 
#1 ·
Hi all.

So much going on here that it fits into multiple of the forum categories. Would like advice and perspective from anyone who can relate to any aspect, and particularly men as I try and do my best to go easy on my husband.

Honest feedback is good. If i am out of line, please tell me up front. If i have a point, tell me straight. I'm pretty good like that ;)

DYING AND HOMELESS FIL

My father-in-law has had cancer for many years and has now been given months to live. Within a few weeks of being told this, he moved out of the apartment he was sharing with my husband's brother (his son). (For background, bro-in-law is an addict to opiates and prescriptions, and him and the FIL were dealing prescription drugs for a while).

So the FIL moves out and comes down to the city, and no questions or requests, just decides he will stay with someone here. Which fell on us, and my husband's sister. Since then, he has been couch surfing between ours and sis-in-law's place, virtually homeless, a few changes of clothes, and no offer on his part to pay for anything.

GAMBLING HABIT AND MISSING WEDDING RING

I have an unresolved issue with him, being that he stayed with us a while back in another place we lived in, and around that time, my wedding ring disappeared. I was and am still devastated. I am careful to not say it was definitely him without irrefutable evidence. All I know is that it was there and then it wasn't, and it happened in or around the period he was staying with us. The other possibility is that it could have been taken by one of a few tradesmen my H showed through (he was present with each of them). But I may never know.

So part of the reason I suspected him is that he has a serious gambling problem, and around about that time, asked my husband to go guarantor for a $30,000 dollar loan. (To which my H declined).

SINCE THEN...

He stayed with us one more time after that incident, in a different place. I told my H i did not want him staying with us again, until or unless we talked to him about that. But H ignored my request because he can't say no to his dad so all of a sudden there he was on our doorstep and I was fuming at H. All i did basically that weekend was be home because I didn't want FIL home alone at our place. I also hid all my other precious things (i don't have that much stuff but i made sure it was all hidden in our room) and kept my things away from him.

AND NOW...

So now that he is officially dying, my H can't and won't say no to him. FIL turns up on our doorstep and that's the end of the matter. Like, that is the END of the matter, that's it, there is no ifs or buts. No conversation, no mutual decision making on anything. Not even any kind of planned discussion with FIL about our (my? our?) concerns, because, well, no one talks about FIL's gambling problem because FIL doesn't.

On the one hand I feel so frustrated that i can't even try to resolve the things that come up. Things like, FIL getting grumpy and mouthing off and criticising everything about our house and has the nerve to criticise OUR financial choices. I have had to bite my tongue so much, but at the times i have snipped back, H looks at me like i'm the devil. I have had to be a statue in this whole situation. Perfectly still, not saying anything, not the slightest look or tone or anything, no matter how much FIL is a d*ck.

At this stage, H had been unemployed for 7 months, i was dying in my job that has turned into hell but getting through it until i hit my maternity leave, and we are going backwards financially with renovations and being on one income trying to cover mortgage payments etc. Fortunately, H now has full time work so that is helping, but i am still feeling really resentful that the FIL just comes and just mooches off us for everything. I will get to that a bit later...

THE PERVING

Oh yeah... well i wrote about this previously. It seems to have helped alot since i started dressing with lots of coats and baggy stuff around him. He is a perve, like he will look at (or mentally study) girls in the street, and not subtly either. Just looking looking looking looking, not just the ones with nothing on, but the ones with even wearing something loose but you can see maybe their body shape or get an idea of their boob size. Basically anything that's not a giant paper bag.

I noticed him staring at my breasts over family dinner a couple of times. They weren't hanging out or anything, i was fairly modest but casual, i dunno... it made me so uncomfortable, and p*ssed me off. A few times he has been really pervy with me just in general.

I never ended up telling H but my feeling is that he has noticed. He seems to have been more "modesty aware" when he's around, like i will get dressed and he will hand me a big loose cardigan saying "do you want to wear this too?" It could be in my head but my feeling is he has noticed. My feeling is that he doesn't want to talk about it, hear me talk about it, deal with it, we are just trying to get through this sh*t time and he is trying to come to terms with his dad dying without having to support me too.

WHILE WE WERE AWAY...

So as expected, he has no money. Ever. For anything. To the point that he finds ways to get H to sub him for cigarettes, petrol, and a supply of food just before we went away for 10 days to Fiji (and FIL stayed at our place alone).

I told H that i wasn't comfortable with FIL staying here while we were overseas. 1, because he is terminally ill and i am concerned that with no one around, something terrible could happen and no one would be there to help, and 2, because the brother would be going to the Phillipines that week and he would want to stay at ours and I felt the FIL would let him and i didn't want a junkie in my house for a whole stack of reasons.

So what does H do? Invites him to stay here while we're away.

I was so peeved at H at putting me in this position, like there was no discussion even with FIL about the concerns.

So that night me and H argued, then H was acting like a big baby in front of FIL, and so i had to be the adult and say "look, I understand H invited you to stay, however i have some concerns, and i want to talk about those before i feel comfortable with that".

The discussion went ok. It was all in H's head that this would be some catastrophe. Only issue is, FIL is a compulsive liar. But i was assured he would have all his medications with him, he takes them religiously at the correct times, that he would stay in touch with a few others daily, and go straight to the hospital if anything was wrong. He also gave us his word that he would not let the brother stay here.

I felt put at ease but still somewhat uncomfortable. But we went away for our holiday,

We got back and he picked us up in H's car. It was on 3/4 tank when we left, now it was under 1/2. The loose change that was in the consol was missing. He gave H a cheque he found in our car, it was some kind of reimbursement cheque to H for $32 from the post office. I thought it was weird that FIL just happened to find that in our car, i think it was in our glove.

When we got home, there was also a letter on the lounge, it had our replacement credit cards. Neither of us remember opening it, but FIL said it was opened by us, he found it like that. He could have been right, maybe we were wrong, i don't know. But i thought that was weird too. There is a big pile of papers we have on a shelf and i'm pretty sure it would have been in that if it was old. If it was received in the mail while we were away then it would not have been us that opened it.

We had stripped our bed before we left and had a pile of freshly cleaned sheets sitting on it. When we got home, FIL had made our bed with the old sheets, and one of the new sheets was hanging up over a door to keep the heat in one of our rooms. I don't know where the other was. He made our bed for us. With everything else, it made me suspicious, that maybe the brother did stay here, either that or FIL felt like sleeping in our bed. Alone? Who's to say. None of my business, except when it's in my bed. No way of knowing i guess.

FINANCIAL BOUNDARIES

Me and H went over this a few times, sometimes in the form of arguing. H didn't want to charge him rent (and i wasn't keen on that either originally) but i felt we were being taken advantage of and I was angry at H for his lack of boundaries with his dad around $, how he couldn't say "no" to his dad and he would just let his dad mooch off us for different things.

In the end, H agreed that we could charge him $50 a week for food for the time that he stayed with us. H brought it up, and as is the case any time $ has come up in discussions with FIL, the FIL will be passive aggressive and kind of guilt trippy and just make it awkward for us. H told him we want $50 a week for food. FIL was like "well i don't eat that much, but if that's what you want..." etc but H was assertive and i was happy with his effort.

SINCE THEN...

I caught FIL going through our pile of papers on the shelf. He got startled when I saw him, said he was looking for a receipt for the bathroom guy or something. It made me really uneasy, but i was also super p*ssed off by then. When he spoke for himself, i just said "ah right" (sarcastically but knowingly) and just left it at that.

He was then going to get paid on the Wednesday day last week, but it must have hit his account on the Tuesday night because he suddenly became very preoccupied with his phone (on which he had no credit).

When H was out of the room, I looked at FIL for a while, then said "did you get credit on your phone?" and he looked at me for about 10 seconds, then said "i was just switching it off".

Then as i was getting ready for bed, i notice FIL dismantled his phone, like separated the phone from the battery and then from the SIM card. Just really weird. He was always holding onto it and very protective over it, but now he just had it casually on the ironing board with the phone part.

Then the next morning, i woke up at maybe 5:30am. FIL had slept in the lounge room to be near the heater. The light was on and the heater was going, and i could hear some noise, it sounded like a computer was on but it kind of sounded like a pokie. So i got up really quietly, then opened the door a bit suddenly and he was standing in the loungeroom, he turned his back to me and looked like he was holding something in front of him. The computer wasn't on, he was holding his phone i'm pretty sure. I walked past him to go to the bathroom and he looked like he was concealing his phone. I said "you're up early" and he was like "well, yeah, i had enough sleep. When you've had enough you've had enough". And i said "ah right" like i did the time i saw him going through our papers. I went to the bathroom, and came back.

I'm 99% sure he was gambling.

I don't care in any other situation because he's a grown man and he can do what he wants. The only reason it p*sses me off so bad now is that i am in a financial relationship with a man i do not want to be in a financial relationship with.

INTERNET HISTORY AND USE OF OUR CAR

FIL has been using our car on the weekdays i noticed. I have had a few days off lately, and on the days, when he has gone out, he has taken H's car keys.

Net history...well, he clears it, but we had a Net Nanny installed after he first used it because we were pretty sure he looked up porn or something and my H is in long term recovery for sex addiction and we don't want that sh*t on our computer.

Well, I found out, Net Nanny has a reporting function. Turns out he's been trying to look up adult services in the area. No doubt that's where some of his pension is going, he runs out of his fortnightly payment within a few days then cries poor.

Again, none of my business, other than the "financial relationship" aspect again. But on another level, i wondered if he had an escort over when we were away. If that's why he made our bed. Maybe he really was being thoughtful, but that would not be characteristic of him to do something that wasn't going to benefit himself strategically in some way. Then i wondered if he sniffs my undies or thinks about me... yuck yuck yuck. Mind running away now. It seems outlandish but what can you take for granted with someone who is a compulsive liar? I dunno... so many scenarios going through my head.

HOSPITAL

On Weds night, we took FIL to hospital, he had been deteriorating badly within a 24 hour period. He was stubborn about it but H insisted. He was there for a few days, became better. He is now officially classed as palliative and that is now presenting another challenge to us. Will he stay between our places until one day he dies, either in front of our eyes or all alone in the house for us to come home and find? This is a really traumatic thing to see one's parent go through. I had an aunt whos husband died at home and she had to get out of that house and move away because she couldn't be there anymore. Will that happen to us if he dies here?

Also found out that all the medications he's supposed to be taking, he is taking hap-hazardly, that 3 of his prescriptions ran out a while ago and he didn't renew them, and that one he was supposed to get was really important but he didn't go to the doctor when he was supposed to. So now there's the factor that his unmanageability has put him at risk of dying. Again, his choice, but who is gonna find him on the floor when they get home from work?

AM I BEING SELFISH?

So here i am, whinging about this annoying dying man, who i have struggled to find love in my heart for. I am doing my best but it's not easy. I feel like my boundaries have been trampled on and i am trying to be as soft as i can. I have vented to H at different times, but maybe that's not fair, he is coming to terms with his dying father, that's hard enough as it is without me putting pressure on him.

A pet peeve of mine is people's BS and being in situations where i have to keep my mouth shut and just nod along, as if i agree or believe them.

But then... pet peeve vs dying man... hmm....

I have really struggled recently to not judge him. I feel awful that i don't have alot of love for him in my heart. This man is my husband's father and my H's heart is broken. The only thing that seems to help is praying for the man. Last night i prayed for half an hour. That's all i feel i can do right now...

I am also not telling my H any more stressful stuff. I haven't told him about FIL going through our papers, gambling his last pay, or trying to look up brothels on our home computer.

PALLIATIVE CARE

I have made some calls about the different options available. I am still getting info, but i feel like this is part of my contribution, i feel i am able to talk about this less emotionally and look at the likely scenarios and options. I am not trying to make or influence decisions for his family but i hope me making a few enquiries helps get info together for their own consideration.

But inside, i really am worried about FIL staying here while we are both at work and something terrible happens, or if FIL is very unwell and H is there to see him die... that would be really traumatic for H and a memory that will never leave our house.

ADVICE PLEASE!

This is where i need some advice.

My current position is that I am not telling H stuff that is going to just stress him out or make him more grieved about his dad. I think he is really wanting to have some good memories of his dad despite his failings and i feel it would be selfish to just fill his head with the stuff i have been noticing.

I have also backed off with the money conversations because whenever we have them, it just makes me the devil for even talking about it.

I do feel like there needs to be some more boundaries with FIL. I am wondering if it would be best to address them when it's just me and FIL there. I won't be nasty about it, but i will let him know that we do have a net nanny installed, that it does tell me the blocked sites, that i do notice he uses H's car, that I haven't told H any of this and don't intend to, but i ask that he uses his own phone and $ to look that stuff up and that he uses his own car to go to those places.

I don't know if that's a bit bold on my part, or disrespectful to an old dying man. I am not wanting to shame him here, but i want him to know that i know, and that he is a grown man and can do what he likes but that he can't use our petrol, bandwidth, computer, car etc to do this with, and that if he blows his pay, we are not going to be paying his way.

Then part of me really wants to ask if he took my wedding ring because i will never know. But even if i asked he would never tell me anyway. That's probably a selfish part... it's gone either way, whether i ever find out or not.

There are so many questions in my mind. Some of them just pure speculation or imagination, because i don't know this man or what he's really up to when i'm not there. Some of them probably have some truth to them.

So... yeah. This is my f*cked up situation. I am so angry but feel guilty and just feel like i can't have boundaries in my own house and life when there is a "bigger fish to fry".

If you got this far, thx for reading. I guess i needed to get all this out.

PS: The bro in law is now back from the Phillipines. He has gone into detox, and looking at rehab options. I am hoping (praying!) that this is his "rock bottom" (i hate that term) but i hope he really gets into recovery from this point
 
See less See more
#2 ·
It's good that you got all that out of your system. It really helps.

You seem like a genuinely good person, but perhaps a bit too obsessive. I realize it is a difficult situation, but I'm not sure your own conscious and cultural background (south Asian if I'm right) gives you much of a choice. Parents are to be cared for late in their life. That's what's wired into you and your husband even if it goes completely against the logic that the individualistic western culture keeps pushing you towards.

I believe you've done a wonderful thing to not inflict additional stress on your husband. Why not do the same for yourself by detaching from your father-in-law's lifestyle? Why not take life easy until he dies (or forever!)?

From what I read, the man is not really abusing you or wreaking havoc in your life. He's just being a silly old man who is going to die in the next few years. There is no 'fixing' him.

Spying on his internet or phone activity is really uncalled for. He's not a child. He can look at porn, sleep with prostitutes and gamble away his own money as much as he wants to. He has the right to do some living in his last few days on this earth. As long as he's not putting a noticeable dent in your finances, I'm not sure why you should be so upset?

I understand you don't love the man. That's okay. But your husband loves him and has every right to want to take care of his dying father. You would do the same for your father if you had to (I hope).

Again, you're a good person, but resentful and stressed. This is not your husband's fault. He's merely going by his instincts and hasn't done much wrong.

Take life a lot easier. Look at your father-in-law as a human who deserves love and respect even if he possesses some 'not so nice' traits. As long as he's not being abusive, let him live the last days of his life peacefully.

I wish you luck.
 
#6 ·
1. Yep, I probably am obsessive in some ways. This whole thing has been a real "bee in my bonnet" and I am trying to let it go even as it happens again and again...

2. South Asian? You're cold on that one mate :) we are Aussie. But Asian or not, yep, I would say we do have an instinct to look after our parents. I think what complicates this is the enmeshment of finances and personal space with a man who is taking everything he can get and more to fuel his addictions. His addiction is therefore subsidized (and at a cost) to us.

3. Yep, doing my best to not put more stress on H with this stuff. I do feel to keep it that way for now. The for the encouragement :)

4. Detaching is not so easy when the $ I earn is putting more in his pocket to gamble or visit prostitutes with. We are having a baby in September, and H is a low income earner. We are already jn debt. Yet FIL tries to bum $ any opportunity he gets. It's also difficult sharing personal space with a man who looks at me like I'm dinner. But again, am finding ways to dress with very loose clothes or big coats around him. It's not that I want to fix him. I just don't want to be part of his dynamic or support his choices with my own money that we need to put towards buying baby things, mortgage, our own future.

5. I guess you are right when you say he is not really abusing me. I don't feel safe with him in my house, he perves at me, he goes through our stuff, uses our computer in a way that could compromise my own husbands sobriety (pop up ads with sexual services are appearing much more frequently since FIL's use of our computer). But this is just me ranting again... Sorry I am so rantybright now. When I wrote last night, a lot of this is stuff I haven't been able to talk about with other people as it's pretty sensitive. Well you have a point in that I am not in physical danger, and this is what I can take on board.

6. Re internet spying, I thought I should clarify. I don't spy in his phone and even if I wanted to (which I don't) I couldn't. It's his device that he owns and he pays for that service himself. Re my computer that I own with internet service tgatbi pay for, with a Net Nanny that blocks stuff that no don't want on my computer, well he uses it at his own risk. It was supposed to send him a subtle message when we installed it but I guess he never got it, and now there are reports as part of the Net Nanny service that I only discovered yesterday. It gave me enough of an idea. This is part of why I am thinking of talking to him. I could let him know that I know, request that he no longer uses our computer or car to do this with, and assure him i will not tell H but that he needs to respect our things. In would not be telling him what to do with his own things or money, just saying he cannot use our things or money to do this with.
 
#3 ·
The ring is gone. I think you're going to have to let that go.

You have a toxic man living under your roof. A dying, adult, toxic train wreck of a man.

I suggest you put the renos on hold, get him palliative care and out of your house, and wait it out.

Just because he's dying doesn't mean he gets to take this time away from you and make you not safe in your own house.
 
#4 ·
Yeah, I hear ya about the ring. Even if I did get into it with him it would just be drama and he would lie in any case if he was guilty.

Renos... the last major thing is being finished off now which is the main bathroom. It is finally usable so that is a relief, but there are some defects we are waiting to get sorted out. The remaining renos are small jobs. I was hoping we would have everything finished before we have a baby in September, but as long as the place is functional for now...

Re palliative care options, I am broaching the subject very carefully with H. We are still getting information and recommendations. I have genuine fears about in home care but I think that's what H and his sister will try to accommodate ultimately...
 
#8 ·
You are the one pregnant and the only one working and bringing home money. And people are telling you not to stress your lazy ass H?

Put your money into a separate account to which H has no access. If he wants to give FIL money let him get his lazy ass a job.

If you have any relatives nearby, go stay with them and let H, SIL and FIL work this out. They obviously have no concern for you or your baby.

IamSomebody
 
#9 ·
I should have probably clarified. My H was unemployed for 7 month . He had a contract job that ran out in October, which is when we bought the house and we had some major work to do to it. So it was understood that he would focus on coordinating thisfor a while. Then early this year he started applying for jobs again, but the market was tough so it took a while to get anywhere. He got a job which he started 4 weeks ago, so far so good. But for a while I felt like I was carring the financial responsibilities, and with his dad in the picture, it was just too much. I earn more than H by about 25K so when I take time off for the baby we will be living on a lot less for a while. We can't afford to give FIL $ he should have put aside. It would be different if his level of financial need were genuine, but this is what he chooses for himself...
 
#12 ·
The problem is that she is in a no-win scenario because of his impending death.

If she forces him to boot him out, she risks his resentment forever. Because his dad is going to die, you know?

If she doesn't, she has a toxic person who might be stealing in her home, and a baby on the way. And they can't afford it. So he can't be there.

There's no way out.

I think your husband is way, way in the wrong here. It's his job to keep his family stuff sorted and you and the baby take priority by a long shot, and he's not doing that.

What I recommend is this. Be the bad guy. Don't make your husband be the bad guy. Let your husband know you're going to do this, and then do this:

"FIL, I appreciate what you're going through. You have no place to go. You're going to die.

I need you to appreciate what I'm going through. I'm pregnant, about to have a baby, and I have a dying man with a history of addiction and poor choices in my house. I can't have that.

On top of that, you're putting your son in a really ****ty position where he has to choose to either support his dying father that can't provide for himself or his wife and unborn child.

We can't afford to have you stay here. And we can't afford to have you not stay here. You need to come up with some options for yourself. We're prepared to do X and Y for you. And you have Z weeks to get this sorted.

I want to support you. We will visit and support you however we can. But what can't happen is for you to stay here past Z weeks from now."
 
#14 ·
I am working right now and didn't get through the whole thread, so I apologize if this has been already mentioned.

You are in a position of control, financially.

I would leverage that control to change your situation, at least make it tolerable.

What this looks like.
• separate finances from your husband
• write down a list of unacceptable behaviours, exclude annoyances, these are deal breakers only.
• with each behaviour, write down a consequence, try to relate the consequence to the behaviour.
• set limits on, time spent at your home, budget for food, and non essentials.

Do not enable or allow your husband to enable disrespectful behaviours. As long as you are the financial breadwinner, you decide what you will tolerate.

Their is no reason FIL can't spend his last days in comfort, he needs to learn gratitude and respect, he needs to know and respect your boundaries, what you are comfortable with.

This isn't impossible, most families eventually deal with 'next of kin dog days,' it doesn't have to be such a burden.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
You have insufficient privileges to reply here.
Top