I am so miserable.
 Talk About Marriage
  The Marriage Advice and Relationship Help Forums
  right
Forums - For Therapists - Link to Us - Advertise  

    A Public Forum Provided by The Family & Marriage Counseling Directory
Register FAQ Community Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

General Relationship Discussion Although anyone can post anywhere on Talk About Marriage, this section is for people interested in general relationship and marriage advice.

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 11-25-2008, 12:38 PM   #1 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: toronto
Posts: 9
Unhappy I am so miserable.

Hello all. I'm new here. I've been reading for a while, but finally got the guts to post.

I am so miserable in my marriage now. Married for 14 yrs with two small kids (both now in school all day). And this is why...

Over the years my wife has turned into a slob. I'm sorry to say that, but it's true. I work 9-10 hours a day and come home that looks like a bomb hit it. She works a total of 3 hours a day.

I feed the kids in the morning and get them dressed for school and take them, then when I get home from work, I start dinner.

She says because she doesn't know what to cook anymore (like there's only so many ways you can cook mac & cheese and chicken strips.

She has put on 98 lbs. since our marriage where I have lost 35. I shower every morning where I'm lucky if she showers once a week (and that is after I remind her how long its been.) She no longer wears any make up or does her hair, and has no problem in going out like that. To say I'm no longer physically attracted to her is an understatement.

She is addicted to tv and the soaps. She has read one book in our 14 yrs. of marriage.

It coming to the point where she doesn't do anything unless I tell her to. It like having three kids. And I hate it, and starting to hate her.

There is just so much for me to say, that I don't know how to say it all.

The big problem is that she doesn't see anything wrong with her appearance. She thinks she looks good!!! And I am ashamed. Going out with greasy hair in public is just rude.

I have been the best husband I can be. Provided a nice home, nice clothes, lots of elegant jewellery and fur coats, nice cars, lingerie, the works. I spend lots of time with the kids playing and doing homework, taking them out for bike rides, and games. And she is for ever complimenting me on how good I am with the kids, and how handsome I am, that it really bothers me, and I've asked her to stop. I have done my best, but I can't go on any more.

I have clearly let her know how I feel and nothing works. And I find myself getting abusive verbally just out of shear frustration ("have you climbed on the scale lately? You look like you just woke up from the grave. Can you at least wash your face?" and stuff like that.) There was a time when I cared about her ego and tried to be supportive while suggesting ways to improve her image, but now I don't care anymore. I know she loves me, but I can't deal with her slobbiness anymore.

Please understand that I'm not looking for her to be a Barbie, but to keep herself clean and presentable, with proper fitting clothes, to teach the kids proper grooming habits, and to keep a somewhat tidy house. Is that too much to ask? Every spare minute I have is spent cooking, cleaning and doing the laundry.

HELP HELP HELP!!!!! PLEASE!!!
cdn-joe is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 11-25-2008, 01:06 PM   #2 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 2
Default Re: I am so miserable.

Hi. Congratulations on being married 14 years, that's a great thing.

While, I don't know you and I'm only reading your side of the story, I can understand where your coming from. However, I'm sure your wife does many other things that you didn't mention in your post. Can you find any good things about her? I understand that you feel that you are doing the cooking, cleaning, helping with kids, making the money & everything else. Like I said however, she is adding something to your family & marriage. I would focus ALL of your time & energy to the positive.

A few questions.
1. Why did you fall in love with your wife?
2. Can you name 3 things that you still love about her?
3. Why do you provide the materialistic things for her?
4. Why do you think putting her down will help the issue?

I think you need to start looking at the bigger picture. If your wife isn't active, why don't you buy two bikes for you and her and take the kids bike riding together? Have you thought about purchasing a gym membership and the both of you going? Make it a date. The key isn't to make her feel bad about herself. Tthat will only keep her down the road you don't want her to go down.
Niceguy78 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-25-2008, 02:16 PM   #3 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: toronto
Posts: 9
Default Re: I am so miserable.

Thanks for your reply. My words don't come lightly, honestly. This has been an ongoing struggle for many, many years. I have tried to focus on the positive for years now, only to my sadness.

I "fell" in love with her because I was young (18) and tried to rescue her from an abusive and very domineering mother.
No, I can't name three things. Originally I bought her the nicer things to help her make her feel better about herself and to look nice (the women in my family always loved jewellery and as a kid I used to love watching my mom get gussied up for a night on the town). But after spending $$$ on diamonds and furs, I learned that she doesn't care about that stuff at all and just ended up in the drawer. I buy her clothes because she wears her sister's hand-me downs (yes, at age 43) or wear the clothes her mother buys her (and end up looking like a 75 y/o woman). She won't even go and buy her own clothes. Just doesn't care about fashion at all.

And I don't think putting her down will help the issue. Not by a long shot. On the contrary, I have been nothing but supportive and caring over the years, careful not to damage her self esteem, only to discover that she never had any to start with (again abusive mother). I married her thinking I could rescue her and "fix" her, not into what I wanted her to be, but into the best SHE could be. I've encouraged her to go back to school, find a job she likes, find a hair salon she likes, anything. But she just doesn't have the drive. For anything. Even down to cooking a meal for her family, she does just the bare minimum just to get by. She lacks passion for anything and everything. I did discover this a few years into our dating and tried to call it off, but she made such a scene that I retracted.

I have bought the dual gym memberships, the bikes, everything you suggested, but to no avail at all and I found myself doing these things alone.

But please don't be so quick to judge me. I just have to admit to myself that it's my fault. I gambled on a broken person thinking that I could repair her, but I can't.
cdn-joe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-25-2008, 02:41 PM   #4 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 1
Default Re: I am so miserable.

Perhaps your wife is depressed and not even realize it .... she may need counseling to help her work through her past issues (abusive mother).
married2mybff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-25-2008, 02:57 PM   #5 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 2
Default Re: I am so miserable.

No problem, I'm not going to judge you.

Your wife may have depression issues. For whatever reason, she is going through this and maybe you did know before you got married but your married now.

Have you thought about marriage counseling? Maybe there is a deeper issue that you don't even know about. Don't give up, you got married for a reason. Ups & downs, good/bad, work through it. Maybe ask her out to dinner this weekend. Get a babysitter, suprise her with flowers and take her out. Talk to her. Don't criticize, don't blame, don't use the words like "I, me, you". Say "We, Us, our marriage". when talking to her, ask her to go to counseling with you. Tell her how you feel but don't blame her. If she doesn't want to go, go alone (it will hurt to do this but do it).

My only other feeling about your situation maybe that she is so use to you doing everything maybe she feels like she is worthless in the marriage. It sounds crazy but, she may have an identity crisis in your marriage. Maybe plan a schedule? Mon,Wed,Fri you make dinner, Tues, Thurs,Sat she makes dinner. Sunday night you do carry out. Set up a cleaning schedule. Alternate schedules for cleaning.
Niceguy78 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-25-2008, 03:41 PM   #6 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: toronto
Posts: 9
Default Re: I am so miserable.

Quote:
Originally Posted by married2mybff View Post
Perhaps your wife is depressed and not even realize it .... she may need counseling to help her work through her past issues (abusive mother).
Yes, I have mentioned it, but she won't consider councelling. The one time I brought it up, she got hysterical (no exageration) at the thought and cried for days saying she is such a failure. I know she needs councelling to overcome mother issues, but I'm afraid that it will only make things worse. I've even discussed depression with our family doctor, and she did an "incognito" acessment, and found nothing out of the ordinary. Also checked her thyroid too.

We go out for "dates" on a regular basis, but discuss just trivial things. And I have been doing my fair share of housework long enough. If I put in 9 hours a day at work, shouldn't she? Fair is fair, no? Why do I have to tell what she must do? Can't she look around her own home and see what needs to be done?

One other take I got from an eldrly neighbour who was married for 60 yrs. is that she is just too comfortable in life and relationship. That made sense to me, but he died before he could tell me how to fix it.
cdn-joe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-25-2008, 04:11 PM   #7 (permalink)
Moderator
 
Amplexor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Temporary Resident of Earth Lord Only Knows Where Next
Posts: 5,512
Default Re: I am so miserable.

She exhibits this behavior because you enable her. She suffers from poor self esteem so she justifies her poor feelings buy insuring she does fail by not taking care of herself. Self fulfilling prophecy!!! If she needs such guidance then tell her the tasks at home need to be divided more evenly. Don’t make this a request. It is a statement of fact. Sit down and draw up a check list and show her you expect her to hold up her half. Play a little hard ball here. On the softer side have you thought about getting her a day spa treatment. A day to be pampered and some professional help in the hair and make up. If you can get her to do that and really express how great she looks when she comes back that might give her a booster. Maybe put more effort into her appearance and hygiene. Good luck.
__________________
Amp

Confidence Love Patience Faith Are the tools to help heal a marriage.

"Some of the greatest lessons life has taught me came from my darkest days in it" -Amp
Amplexor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-25-2008, 04:45 PM   #8 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: toronto
Posts: 9
Default Re: I am so miserable.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Amplexor View Post
She exhibits this behavior because you enable her. She suffers from poor self esteem so she justifies her poor feelings buy insuring she does fail by not taking care of herself. Self fulfilling prophecy!!! If she needs such guidance then tell her the tasks at home need to be divided more evenly. Don’t make this a request. It is a statement of fact. Sit down and draw up a check list and show her you expect her to hold up her half. Play a little hard ball here. On the softer side have you thought about getting her a day spa treatment. A day to be pampered and some professional help in the hair and make up. If you can get her to do that and really express how great she looks when she comes back that might give her a booster. Maybe put more effort into her appearance and hygiene. Good luck.
Guess what? A few years ago I DID get her a day at the spa, a very exclusive spa (that I got hoodwinked into buying from a co-worker). $475 and my wife let it expire. I hit the roof. And all she could say was Sorry, she forgot.

Now I'm normally not a hard ball type of guy, especially with women, but I try with her. I have told her that I'm tired. I need help. I'm embarrassed of the house. I have divided up the stuff. I make lists for her to do, and everything gets done to the bare minimum. Wash the floors? -they're swept. Clean off the counters?-everything is tossed into drawers willy nilly. Vacuum the carpets?- she does, but doesn't pick up the big stuff first and ends up breaking the vacuum (4 in the last 7-8 years.) Clean the bathroom?-only the counter top. I scrub the shower, floor and toilets. The only time she does something is when I tell her to, or when I get p!ssed off and start doing them myself. Then I can't get her out of my way. And it usually ends up in a big screaming match late at night. She will stuff the garbage till it overflows, but won't wrap it up and take it out till I come home and ask if she is on strike.

But that's my point. I don't like having to tell her to do stuff. It makes me feel like a bossy jerk. But that's the only way things get done, and I'm tired of it. And my daughters are starting to pick up this stubborn habit.

Now I know I'm not perfect, but we both have been told (both together and apart) by a number of women (and believe it or not, one guy!) that if I come back on the market, I would be snapped up instantly!! That made me laugh, but sad too in that she thinks it's a joke and that I won't go anywhere.
cdn-joe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-25-2008, 08:05 PM   #9 (permalink)
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 56
Default Re: I am so miserable.

My dad has a wife like this. She is around the same age as your wife. It is a little different with them because my dad caved in and gotten a housekeeper and a nanny for the 5 year old, even though the woman stays home all day. This has not helped all the problems, but it has helped my dad not want to off himself. He met her 15 years ago at work. Back then, she worked 40 hours a week and was thin. She quit her job because he made enough money to support them. Well, she became a recluse and had no ambition whatsoever. She gained a lot of weight and developed "health problems" that "prevented" her from doing much. I think she also suffers from depression.

I'm telling you all of this because I see how my dad has enabled this woman to go down this path. She manipulates him by making him feel sorry for her and giving him a little bit of hope that she might change and that it is all "health related". He keeps holding out hope that it is only temporary, but it is not. Pretty nice to have someone do everything for you! So why would she change?

Consider that your actions may be enabling her actions (or inactions. She sees that no matter what she does, you will still be there. Maybe a dose of reality ( the fact that you might not always be there) will be a wake up call for her to snap out of her mindset. I think counseling might also help her see your side from a third party perspective. She may also be depressed.

Another possibility (probably more likely) is that she is fed up with trying to be someone she is not, and has just given up on it all together. She may have tried for a while, but it seemed it was not enough for you. Consider that you may be trying to compare her to the women in your own family,the ones who loved getting all dolled-up. That is not fair to her. If she has never been that type of woman, how can you expect her to change?

Are there other qualities about her that you admire, or did at one point? It is best to highlight the good things than the bad. Once you do these things, you may be surprised. She might just get her ambition back. Right now she is feeling pretty worthless, no doubt partly due to your constant belittling. That 's enough to make any woman depressed.

Last edited by sunnygirl; 11-25-2008 at 08:10 PM.
sunnygirl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-25-2008, 10:25 PM   #10 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 2
Default Re: I am so miserable.

you must talk to her. She's lucky to have you, you sound like a great husband.
gemini6 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-26-2008, 06:37 AM   #11 (permalink)
Forum Supporter
 
MarkTwain's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Yorkshire, UK
Posts: 3,424
Default Re: I am so miserable.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Amplexor View Post
She exhibits this behavior because you enable her.
I agree with what Amp is saying, but...

Is there anything you have been doing or not doing that may have made her worse. How affectionate have you been to her over the years? How much physical intimacy has passed between you? She shows every sign of being a little love starved.
MarkTwain is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-27-2008, 12:15 PM   #12 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: toronto
Posts: 9
Unhappy Re: I am so miserable.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Amplexor View Post
She exhibits this behavior because you enable her. She suffers from poor self esteem so she justifies her poor feelings buy insuring she does fail by not taking care of herself. Self fulfilling prophecy!!! If she needs such guidance then tell her the tasks at home need to be divided more evenly. Don’t make this a request. It is a statement of fact. Sit down and draw up a check list and show her you expect her to hold up her half. Play a little hard ball here. On the softer side have you thought about getting her a day spa treatment. A day to be pampered and some professional help in the hair and make up. If you can get her to do that and really express how great she looks when she comes back that might give her a booster. Maybe put more effort into her appearance and hygiene. Good luck.
Hi and thanks for your honesty. I can see now how I may be enabling her to act this way, but how do I stop this? I've tried everything, always keeping her fragile ego in mind.

Originally (almost 20 years ago now) I started by focusing on the good and ignoring the bad. Then it became 50/50. Now All I do is focus on the bad, and we fight, she cries and I feel like an idiot.

But it wasn't always like this. There was a time when she actually took some care of her appearance. She was never a fashion model, and that was one of the main things I loved about her, her natural beauty. But marriage came, then children came and she got worse and worse. The only thing I can think of that may have caused this change in her behaviour is that over the years I have advanced in my career and she has not. But that is not my doing. She had the same mentality in all her jobs too (do just the bare minimum just to get by) and therefore went through many jobs. When we had our first child I suspected postpartum depression and I even quit my job and became a stay at home Dad for two years, hoping that her going back to work would snap her out of it. No such luck. I think it actually made things worse because 1) she got fired (again) and 2) I showed her that it can be done. I cooked, I cleaned, I potty trained, went to mums-n-tots, the whole shebang. And I did it!!! I think this made her feel worse. But that wasn't my intention. These are all things that must be done around the house and I did it.

If I am enabling her, please give me more examples of how else I may be doing this, and also ways on how I can fix it. Please? I don't want this to end. I have two little girls that mean the world to me, but I also can't go on like this. It is eating away at my soul and making me very sad.

Last edited by cdn-joe; 11-27-2008 at 12:42 PM.
cdn-joe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-30-2008, 02:44 AM   #13 (permalink)
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 56
Default Re: I am so miserable.

I really think you two need counseling, ASAP. You both have learned behavior over time that is not conducive to a prosperous
marriage. Judging from the desperation in your post I can tell that you want it to work out. I think that deep down you do still love this woman, but this love has been buried under years of dysfunction. If she refuse, go without her.

Marriage takes lots of work and communication, as you know! Right now,it sounds like HONEST communication is really lacking on both parts. You acknowledge that you say horrible things to her, yet it sounds like you are not willing to change this, unless she starts changing first. This will be an endless cycle, if you are not willing to be the first to stop it. It is not fair to this woman, the mother of your children, to treat her with disrespect like you are. It is ugly behavior that I am sure you are not proud of, right? You say she thinks she looks good. I doubt that is true. She may be just trying to protect herself from your harsh criticisms because they are too painful.

I do feel the pain in your writing. I know it is difficult right now for you and I truly am sorry. I think you have a shot at fixing this, but it will take a lot of work with a counselor (even if just to get you started-if money is an issue). You will need to be prepared to take an honest look at yourself to see how you have contributed to this. There may be things that will be hard to hear, but they need to be said. Maybe you will learn to find the inner beauty that your wife has within herself. In turn, maybe she will see it, too, and change her behavior.

P.S... speaking of expectations...do you think that perhaps your idea of cleanliness are too high? It could be that you need to relax a little bit about cleanliness with two kids in the house. Have you thought about designating certain areas of the house as off-limits for mess? Our living room is barely used, so when one of us wants time in a clean, stress-free room, we go there. Also, about her cooking...were you ever complimentary about her cooking, even though you may not have liked it? I know that that means a lot to me when my husband says nice things, even though it was not perfect. Maybe it's a woman thing, but that goes a long way. Eventually I got better at cooking because I wasn't afraid to piss my husband off if it wasn't perfection.

Just my two cents...Sorry if i am way off in my assessment, but that is how I see it based on what you have written so far.

Last edited by sunnygirl; 11-30-2008 at 02:52 AM.
sunnygirl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-30-2008, 06:29 AM   #14 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Ask Eve's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 16
Default Re: I am so miserable.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sunnygirl View Post
Marriage takes lots of work and communication, as you know! Right now,it sounds like HONEST communication is really lacking on both parts.
There are a lot of issues here on your wife's part. At the moment she has absolutely no sense of self worth! For one she's been so used to being dominated and verbally abused as a child that she's never really had to think for herself, her mother did that for her. She's went from one job to another getting by and no more and if she's been sacked then she's told herself it's because she's no good anyway, mom has always told her that. She's never HAD the chance to fend for herself, you came along and took over and looked after her. Can you see where I'm coming from?

She mopes around the house watching TV and doing the minimal of tasks. She's put on piles of weight too through lack of exercise. It's as if she's on self destruct just WAITING for you to tell her she's hopeless, no good and that you're leaving her. The truth is... she doesn't know HOW to...

Counselling would certainly be an advantage here but she's very against that (too intimidating for her) so don't force her, leave that for now. She needs to see that she IS worthy! She IS needed and that she IS a wonderful person.

What I would suggest is to take things one step at a time. Don't expect her to turn everything around in one day as this is expecting the impossible. Instead use reverse psychology. Say to her for example that the bathroom could do with a good clean and would she do it today? Ask her to be really thorough with it and you'll be doing an "inspection" when you get home. Laugh about it though and keep it light and not too serious. Kiss her when you leave for work and remind her again about the bathroom. When you come in at night go check to see if she's done it. If she has praise her to the hilt! "Wow, you've been busy today, the bathroom looks amazing." It's only one room but she's achieved something so praise her for it. It will make her feel good and she'll WANT to do something else for more praise. Sit with her at night and tell her how proud you are that she made such a good job of the bathroom. Make a lot out of it. Deep down she's just like a little child herself and she NEEDS constant praise when she does something right and like a child she'll WANT to please you again! Continue like this with other little tasks (just one thing at a time) and go overboard with the praise when she does it. This will build up her self esteem and in time she'll start to do things without you having to ask.

Make sure too that when you go shopping you buy in nutritious and healthy food. Remember, we are what we eat! Buying snacky foods will cause her to feel lethargic, she'll have no energy and feel listless all the time. If she's used to putting a lot of fatty or sugary snacks in the basket then YOU do the shopping and buy in wholesome food. She can't eat what's not there.

Remember too, even although she's only working around the house, this is still exercise for her and she'll start to feel good. She'll feel good that she's cleaned the bathroom thoroughly, she'll feel good that you NOTICED and told her and she'll start to think what else she can do to get that praise again. Take time out at night when the kids are in bed and again let her know how you were so proud of her and the work she did on the bathroom. Do the same again with another room in the house and again, lots of praise if she does it.

In time you'll find that you won't need to tell her about her appearance, she'll WANT to tidy herself up and look good, not only for you but for herself as her sense of self worth will have started to rise. She's been down on herself for so many years and the verbal abuse and control from her mother is very deeply ingrained but with your love and help this CAN be turned around. You just need to be patient and a little bit clever!

~Eve~

Last edited by Ask Eve; 11-30-2008 at 06:35 AM.
Ask Eve is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2008, 12:17 PM   #15 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: toronto
Posts: 9
Default Re: I am so miserable.

Thanks Sunnygirl for the advice. You just made me feel 10x worse.

Eve, thanks for seeing it from an unbiased point of view. I do completely agree with your positive reinforcement practices and I have used them in the past to limited success. But as you know lives have a way of evolving over time. We now have two little kids (one with a possible learning disability) and an elderly parent (stroke victim) to look after who also lives with us.

And I am so tired. I never thought that at 39 i'd be so tired of it all. I give praise and discipline staff at work and I do it at home. I just want to shut it off. I need a break and I have really no family to turn to. Everyone else is so wound up in their lives, that I get no help with my mother. My wife doesn't do homework with the kids until I suggest it when I get home. Or dinner. Or laundry. I'm tired of having to tell her what needs to be done.

It seems that no one thinks about MY well being. Two years ago I developed Pneumonia and no one looked after me. I was rolling around on the floor and halucinating at home for almost a week before anyone thought of taking me to emergency. Since I am a diabetic, my blood sugar was through the roof (57 mmol/L) and I was rushed into intensive care for another week. Thats when I really got scared. I got no one else to count on. It all falls on me to take charge. My dad died when I was 10, and I was told that I had to take charge of the family then, and I've been doing it ever since. And I am so tired. Mentally, physically, emotionally. I got no one to look after me. I got so many people around me, yet I've never been so alone in my life.

Last edited by cdn-joe; 12-05-2008 at 12:45 PM. Reason: grammar.
cdn-joe is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
How miserable are you really? CallaLily General Relationship Discussion 17 04-21-2011 12:17 PM
Miserable and need help JLynnMann The Ladies' Lounge 6 04-16-2011 11:38 PM
I am miserable Lady in TX The Ladies' Lounge 12 04-06-2011 02:32 AM
Miserable FarmGirl34 Sex in Marriage 1 09-29-2010 08:47 AM
I'm Miserable p22pqq2 General Relationship Discussion 17 08-12-2009 08:20 PM

Member Area

Find a Therapist:


Sponsor Ads


Sponsor Ads




Get The Family & Marriage Counseling Directory Help Guide via Email:
Name:
Email:




All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:25 PM.



Copyright 2007 - 2013 © Talk About Marriage