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Made a decision in my mind...........WAW in four years if nothing changes

7K views 70 replies 24 participants last post by  john117 
#1 ·
I can't get past this sadness of rejection and knowing that he just doesn't feel "like that" about me anymore after 23 years together. Nothing I can do or not do will make him feel "like that." There is nobody else for either one of us, nobody has a medical problem, I am the same weight and shape I was when we first met, AND I have talked to him about this on numerous occasions. His response? If he isn't good enough for me then I need to find somebody else that is. SOOO.................it looks like I have no choice. The youngest will be 18 in four years and I guess it's time to start thinking about my exit plan.

My questions:

1. Is there ANYTHING else I can do?? ANYTHING?
2. Should I tell him I my future plans or just ride it out?
3. HOW do I manage to make it through the next 4 years feeling so hurt and rejected??
4. What does one do to prepare for an exit plan? Can anybody every REALLY be 'ready'???
5. I will be 52 when this plan takes place. Am I "too old" to be doing this??

Just makes me sad, but I cannot handle the sadness inside that his 'not feeling that way' about me creates. I feel so broken. How in the world can I live like this for FOUR more years?

Sunshine
 
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#4 ·
I think I am going to have to wait the full four years - purpose is waiting 'til the youngest is out of the house. He will make me feel tremendously guilty if I do it while kids are still at home. I know, as I almost did it a year ago. It was horrible. Kids were CRYING, he told them it was all MY doing. I caved after all of the trauma and decided to just stick with it a while. I DO think he would make my life miserable if I told him sooner vs. when I am really ready to do it. Are you suggesting NOT waiting 4 years to do it, Blondi, or just not waiting to get some therapy and going through the 180 (which I am going to have to look up again and review). HOW can I make this work for 4 years without my sadness and frustration showing through and eating me up inside?
 
#27 ·
I almost did it a year ago. It was horrible. Kids were CRYING, he told them it was all MY doing. I caved after all of the trauma and decided to just stick with it a while.
Wow. Sounds like it was rough. You tried to fix a horrible situation. Good for you. But it got hard, I see. Who wants to deal with that? Better to be miserable and ride it out. Good decision to cave.

Four years? You'll still be here in 10.
 
#5 ·
Can't tell him NOW or I am afraid he will make my life while I am here a living hell :(((( I agree, it isn't promising. Forgot to add that I was going to counseling the first time I tried to do this a year ago and convinced him to go. He went ONE TIME and said he wasn't comfortable "sharing feelings" and refused to go back. He flat out told me that if I wasn't happy with him that there was nothing else he could do :((( This makes me SO sad. NOthing more I would love than his attention, affection, and loving me "in that way"...................I am just heart-broken inside. 23 years.
 
#6 ·
Go now. Staying for the kid is only going to teach the kid that a miserable marriage is normal, because you are only going to get more and more miserable in the next four years. Your child won't learn what a proper, loving, partnership should look like.

Don't condemn your children to a marriage as bad as yours. That's all staying four more years will accomplish.

Take a few months, separate your finances, find a job, apartment hunt, do your legal research, develop a spine, do whatever you need to do to prepare.
 
#7 ·
No offense, but it sound like your husband is a complete loser. He is the one who isn't committed to the marriage, so he should be the one to leave, not you. But if you are unable to kick him out (if he would become violent), I would take the kids and stay anywhere else you can.

Start the 180, and let him feel the effects of his decision.
 
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#14 ·
He has never been violent, so not worried about that. My worse fear is that I will tell him what I am planning to do, and he won't care or won't try to stop me. Which means I will then have to follow through. I really DO want to make this work, just NOTHING is getting his attention. I can't say I'm going to leave unless I am prepared to do it......................and it's taking a risk right now because I'm not sure he would care or try to stop me :((( Ohhhh how I wish he would - so bad. I don't want out - I just want it to be better.
 
#9 ·
Is there more to this story? Is his side different? Did you both drift apart when your kids were young, and did the sex stop?

He could be a loser or he could have deep seated resentments that make him want to punish you - and withholding affection seems to be accomplishing that.

I'm not blaming you but want you to think from his perspective and see if there is something he is blaming you for.
 
#11 ·
Yes, I do realize you are only hearing one side of the story. There probably was some sort of "drifting apart" when the kids were younger, though he has always been the LD partner and me "MD" (medium). When the kids were little, neither one of us approached the other or had the interest or energy - so it was a two-way street. Before kids, it was 50/50. Now that they are older, it is me most of the time. We have not been to bed together at the same time since my youngest was a baby (child is now 14). He would rather sit with the computer playing games or tinkering with his cars. It hurts me to my core that some nights I just wake up awake, lying there, hearing him in there playing a game or knowing he is outside, and isn't interested enough to come to bed even once a week. There is just no attraction on his part - or it is the impression he gives. Makes me feel so unwanted and unloved. He is otherwise a great dad and a great provider, and really a decent person.
 
#10 · (Edited)
Sunshine....good name!

As strangers, we are always at a disadvantage. We have only one side of the story. And Paul Harvey is not here to give us "The rest of the story".

There are some responders on this blog...TAM that are good detectives and can spot a bad tooth. They will start tugging and twisting until the root of the problem is exposed.

I will take what you have posted to be Gospel. Your husband has no legs to stand on, in this matter. You are rather perfect, or better put...close to it. And you may be!

I must believe this to continue.

The fact that you are asking strangers if there are other options other than separating and later divorcing tells me that you are looking, either:

a) for justification to leave him
b) for a solution and a path to meaningful reconciliation. Living out your last days with him.

What do you want?.... I know....you will tell me that you would like to patch things up and continue in the marriage. That is the moral and proper response. I get that. You are a good wife, mother, companion and human being. You are in pain.

You do not want to be perceived as a failure or selfish or inflexible. Who does?

I ask again...What DO YOU WANT...shed the sensibilities, please.

As an old man I will give you my take:

1) Is there anything that I can do?

There are two people in a marriage. One person cannot be the glue and the other the solvent. The marriage will not adhere, stay together. Your husband needs to be part of the solution. It does not sound like he is interested. That is bad....and that is key.

2) Lay it all on the line. Tell him that you are ready to walk away from the marriage.....soon. Yes, tell him that this will happen soon, even if you have the four year mark in your long range plan. He must be informed. This will bump him off-center...as it should.

He needs a wake-up call. The Clarion Call to Arms/to Charge: Da-Da-DOT-da-da-DOT-tah-tah-Dah!

If he is interested in fixing this marriage...or not...then his response will open the correct door for you. He is the key...not you. Again, assuming that you want to fix this.

If he wants to repair the marriage then both of you need to lay out your expectations of each other. What must he do? What does he want from you?

After hearing his needs and his side of the story, can you emotionally and rationally work with them? Is it something that you want to do? Or is it more of the same....whitewashing the dirty walls rather than sanding them and re-painting them with good long lasting enamel.

If the answer is yes, then Great...do it!

If not, then plan your exit. He was told.

Now tell the rest of your family, even your older children. Do not go into the dirty details. Just tell them that you and your husband have grown apart and you are going to divorce...at some time in the future.

3) Why wait four years? Get those Sterling Silver plates that you got as wedding plates...all in a row. Put detailed planning notes on each, all sequenced as to When, What, Who and Where.

Be realistic and flexible. Plan to be separated in six months. If it takes a year, sobeit. The joy will be when you are free and on your own...not the journey to that place. The journey is going to be gut-wrenching and painful. Accept that.

Divorces happen. Fifty percent of marriages end. For a good reason or reasons. Sometime people change in their marriages, for good or bad. This is life....a short life.

4) How does one be prepared?

You need basic things to survive. Shelter, Food, Water, Air, an Income to support the former items. Get a job, if you do not have one. Can you move in with relatives or friends in the interim until you get you feet on the ground?

The first things to plan on are these: Income, shelter...an apartment or house. Those are the biggies. You have children. You probably do not want to move too far from them.

Open a credit card in your name for emergencies. Your husband may close all your joint accounts and leave you high and dry...penniless. Come up with some cash. Find a job close-by your new abode...to save on gasoline. You may need to pinch pennies for awhile.

Does this sound like something that you can handle? Are you prepared to uproot your whole life? This is what is in store for you, unless you have a good income or ample monies to draw-on {most people} do not.

During this separation to divorce, be as amicable as possible. Do not say or do things that will rain crap on this process.

During your separation do not get involved with another man. This will poke the bear and bring the Hostility Hoards to your new doorstep. It will also give your Soon-to-be-ex-Husband STBXH ammunition to knock you off your pedestal. You have made it this far being honorable. You can wait a little longer.

5) I am 52. Is this too old?

Too old for what? Please explain.

Older women have gotten divorces for centuries. You are not unique.

Too old to find another man...another marriageable man? Oh yeah, it will be hard to find another Good Man. You may get lucky. You did not with your present husband. The men that are out there are single for a reason. Some tragic reasons, such as death of a spouse. Or some really good man may have had a terrible wife and he too got divorced. You must sift through all the pedigrees to find a good one.

Finding a friend with benefits FWB's, not hard. A sexual partner...very easy.

I believe that this is not what you want. That may change. I doubt it.

You have not lived alone in years. This will be a big change.

Get ready...or get back into the same old stressful life that is yours NOW.
 
#12 ·
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I truly prefer option B..................staying with him. I do love him. But I don't feel desired or loved in 'that' way. It used to be there early on, so I know he is capable of it. I honestly don't know what I have done to make him resent me if that is what is going on.

Why wait? I absolutely will not leave until all kids are out of the house even if that means four years. Unless I have a meltdown and just can't take it any more one day. I just don't feel right about uprooting them and feeling guilty for the rest of my life. Plus I need $$$ to prepare. I have been self-employed for 20 years and don't bring in a consistent salary. What if the time I choose to make a break is one of my 'down' years??

Too old? Well, I had planned on not working my entire life - as did he - and its looking like me doing that will set us BOTH back for having to go back to very stressful jobs that we both hated. I hate "starting over" at the age of 52 and knowing I then would probably be working until I was 80 years old to get back financially to a good place. No, I don't think I would ever want to marry again. I would not rule out a good relationship, where I felt loved and wanted, but never marriage. I think people change after being married for a while and just quit trying. NOT INTERESTED in going down that road again. However, I may be too old to have something between a FWB and a marriage - which is probably what would work for my comfort level.
 
#15 ·
How depressing. When was the last time you two had sex?

I'd divorce him now. Or at the least, have an affair to get your needs met. Who cares at this point? You don't have a marriage.

I was in a 100% sexless marriage for almost the last 5 years of our 8 years being married. 5 months being separated and having great sex with my g/f, life is great again. Having a hot sex life is not overrated!

I have two young kids. I had to put myself first. Definitely didn't want them to see their mom and dad in a miserable marriage and not loving each other.
 
#23 ·
I'd divorce him now. Or at the least, have an affair to get your needs met. Who cares at this point? You don't have a marriage.
^^This. With a slight modification.

I'd tell him you plan to get something on the side, and if he's not good with that then you'll divorce him. Be prepared to follow through. If you follow through you might see a change in his behavior but that will be fear based and temporary- unless he really intends to make changes and that means at the very least, a commitment to marital counseling.

I wouldn't wait 4 years, I'd do this tomorrow.

Don't wait 4 years until your youngest is 18, there's no magic number, no particular age where divorce affects children more or less. The key is to keep it low conflict at least in front of the children.
 
#16 ·
Have you actually talked about sex and attraction? Have you directly asked for sex? Have you asked if he finds you sexually attracted?

Do you find him sexually attractive?

I find that the most direct and honest questions are the hardest to ask. Instead, people break up rather than have the hard talks.

Do you dress provocatively for him at all? Show some cleavage? Tight jeans or yoga pants or leggings? I realize this might not be your style in your age group, but if you dress conservatively or "like a mom" maybe you should shake it up and lure him back sexually. I've pushed my wife to do this - she's a very conservative dresser - now even my DD14 pushes her to wear better fitting (tighter) clothes. I think she's sexy and amazing and I want her to feel what I see anyway.

If you really want to try to make it work, then I think you owe it to yourself to take the time and be honest - and keep talking about sex and intimacy.

Can you join him in his activities? Okay games next to him - get a laptop and sit next to him, find out what games he plays and okay too? Go to the garage with a drink and sit and watch and talk?

I'm asking if you can develop an interest in his interests. If you read His Needs Her Needs, you find that men like it when a woman shares his interests - which is probably why a lot of women go to sporting events and sports bars and clearly have no idea what's going on in the games


I realize all these ideas are awkward... but divorce and starting over are pretty tough too.
 
#18 ·
No - marriage is a partnership and both sides have a responsibility to always work on it. A lack of sex can turn a marriage into a roommates situation - yes that can kill the emotions. Getting fat can be a valid issue if an attractive spouse is one of your needs - nothing wrong with being honest about your needs and supporting your spouse by meeting theirs (I gained 100 lbs in marriage so I'm not just talking and looking down on fat people).

OP's H has dropped the ball and she wants him to pick it up - we're here to offer ideas to help her get what she needs or get out.

Sorry this thread triggered you chilly! Not everyone bails when it gets rough - but few get what they need without working for it and communicating.
 
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#24 ·
At 14 your son is old enough to understand his parent's unhappiness and that a civilized divorce could improve everyone's lives. That by itself shouldn't be a barrier.
Yes definitely.

Are you self-supporting? If not, get a job asap. That alone may give you a new perspective on your marriage.
NO!

Not if you're considering divorce. For reasons that are beyond the scope of this thread, just don't do it. Stay unemployed until the court has made an alimony award.
 
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#20 · (Edited)
OP, when I look at your past threads, it appears nothing has changed at all in the past year or more. Why continue trying? Your husband has not done anything to change the situation. And he has figured out that you are not going to do anything about it. Do you really want to do something or do you want to just vent?

Your kids have to be aware of the distance between your husband and you. How is your marriage as an example to them? Is this what you want for them to be the norm for a marriage? Your husband hasn't gone to bed at the same time as you for 13+ years. He doesn't walk along side you or hold your hand or show any signs of affection. Why would you want to wait to divorce him? So your children can learn from their parents what marriage is? Divorce is not suddenly easier for a kid just because they up have left for college. I think it could actually be harder at that age. At this younger age, they have a better means of adjusting before having to leave home and face all the many adjustments of the first time living away.

Why not start an in house separation now? It sounds like your husband does that anyway (him going to bed hours after you). Just make it official, try working out terms of splitting assets amicably, and see if you can be roommates for the required separation period. You might be surprised how relieved the kids are to have the underlying tension in the house over with.
 
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#26 ·
He could fight the agreement in court if something material about his situation changes, but everything of mine is bequeathed to our son in a trust that my ex is an executor of should something happen to us, so highly unlikely and expensive for him.
You are confusing assets with support. Your assets may be protected in a trust but if your situation changes and the "no alimony" clause can be challenged then you could very well end up paying him support. But we're getting off topic here.

I suspect your advice is coloured by your own difficult divorce -- your words from your other thread. Not everyone has an ugly divorce so we'll just have to agree to disagree.
Wrong. I have given advice to men going through a similar situation. If her husband posted here I'd advise him to encourage his wife to get a job before divorcing her.

There's no doubt I'm bitter and tainted by my own divorce but I'm not THAT biased. In fact if I WAS posting based on my own divorce I would not be advising the wife to stay unemployed which is exactly what my exwife did.

All depends on who is asking for advice.
 
#31 ·
I highly doubt any such change will be permanent.

I've read that lots of times, from the perspective of the husband who is in shock and awe upon being served with divorce papers.

He wants more than anything to be given the opportunity that he will change, or that in fact he HAS changed, in the short 2 weeks since he got served and his wife stopped talking to him.

If she then relents, and withdraws the divorce filing, how long do you really think it will take for him to be right back to the way he was before?

It's no different than people using the 180 to get a response out of their partner.
 
#30 ·
LMS, you were the thread I came for wondering "Just a given after 20+ years it's more of a "companion" type of love?"

Since that thread, in reflection and ownership, I know there were so many things I placed in the way that my wife had every reason to walk away, perhaps not similar in deed as yours, but similar in hurt. What is most hurtful is why he will not assess and correct himself to be the husband he promised to be.

The poster above me is right, he either has no idea because his stoic world is all he knows or for reasons known only to him, he simply does not care.

Panic does not create sustainment... he may stress your leaving until he catches his familiar balance, then come back most ugly trying to retaliate for him thinking you forced hime to show his belly... or he may break down his walls and find a humility, push aside those emotional barriers and see his love for you again waiting to be nurtured, and close the gap for the affirmation of love you need and deserve.

This is going to require a leap of faith for you... the majority in yourself. You can't "make" him do anything.

Nothing.

Hope for the best, prepare for the worst.

I too will take you at your word with all you have shared, if you cannot live on this path of emotional isolation, you owe it to yourself to take another.

You owe it to your children to show them that they have the ability to choose a path of helpfulness, not hopelessness.

If you wait so many more years, those 4 years need to be on the path of your emotional stability first and foremost. Find the counseling you need, find the loving interests and activities you need, find the good and positive friends you need, find the sunshine you need... I would advise to stay away from the things that break you down and leave you disappointed in the mirror with poor friend choices, activities that hurt your self and soul (finding another physical partner while still married will find your path leading to a cliff quite quickly), embrace mindfulness to allow you to stay focused and not lead to these distractions that will compliment the pain you are already suffering.

Prepare yourself for a life of love so if the worst does come, you are prepared to offer love again from the right path.

Again, hope for the best, prepare for the worst.

You will not be here in this mind when it happens.
 
#35 ·
And you seemingly use the term "relents" as a synonym for "caving". She's done that and it doesn't work.

No, she takes him back after some SERIOUS effort on his part. The magic part happens instantly. When he realizes he's fuc#ed. Then the work starts.

Changing him and making him want to change are two different things. The former is easy. THEN the work starts. And MAY fail, of course. But it all starts with the fact that he WANTS to change. That's mandatory.

That's all I'm saying.
 
#36 ·
Why is everyone telling her to work on changing HIM ? Vary rarely does forced change stick. The guy has evolved into what he is, but so has the OP, for all we know the guy prays everyday to come home from work and find her gone.

OP if you want it done than finish it now, you are doing no one any favors by sticking around for another four years. All you are doing is creating a miserable atmosphere for all involved, including yourself. If you have your eye on the calendar for 2020 you are already 100% divested in your marriage, the next four years will be a miserable waste of time. I have no idea what your history is, I haven't read your other threads, but in my opinion you have so much anger and resentment toward your husband I don't see how you would ever get past it and become happily married.
 
#39 ·
OK, my thoughts are all over the place but here is what I am thinking now in response to some of everyone's questions. And thank you all for reading. I have read each and every one of the replies.

Why four years? Because I just can't bear to have my kids in two different homes. They don't see a bad relationship. We don't have loud, awful fights. We just don't do a lot together. How can they see that as a bad relationship? i don't think they even pick up on that. It's just a mom and a dad living together without a lot of drama. I can see if we had a ton of fights, there was abuse, etc., but it's not..............it's just a mom and dad living together, low-drama, low-conflict, just not a lot of love which they don't know about.

Why did I cave? I'm scared i can't make it on my own. We struggled in our early years and finally am in a place where I don't have to worry about every dime. My income varies greatly because I am self-employed. I will never make as much as he does, though, as my field will never pay that. I love the work that I do and am not sure how happy I would be going back and doing it for someone else and all that goes with that if I couldn't make enough one year to sustain myself. Not to mention health insurance would eat me alive if I had to pay for it myself (right now it is through him).

These are the two things that immediately came to mind reading through posts. I hope this adds more to the picture of what I am going through.
 
#40 ·
You are modeling to them what a marriage is supposed to look like. They are seeing a low conflict, low love environment, and especially in the formative teen years, will recognize that as being "normal".

Is the split custody really the concern? If so, is that about them, or about you?

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk
 
#41 ·
A few things I'm thinking. First, you don't "get" someone to change. You can share with your H that the current way things are going are not acceptable. He either agrees or not. He might decide that the marriage is worth the effort to modify his behavior, or he might not. But any change has to come from him.

Second, please don't live like this for four years. A 14 year old is more than capable of handling a parent's potential divorce. Lead by example to show your kids what a healthy relationship should be and why it is work to maintain. Everyone has a right to be happy, and that means you, your kids and your spouse. Go to MC, go to therapy, do the 180. But good gosh don't sit in silence for four years.
 
#42 ·
LMS, do you know and understand with total truthfulness why he feels as he does towards you with his lack of emotional attachment?

Looking back through many threads, your lack of faith in self seems to find some commonality, your desire for recognition is your heaviest chain and fear taking over when control of the things within your grasp are ignored. If you come to terms with him first, you will remove your first unknown. Clarity is empowering.

Having fear and recognizing that attachment is only healthy when you are willing to place yourself in a place to remove them, moving forward without removing that which takes away your confidence is like leaving the raft without the island in sight.
 
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