General Relationship DiscussionAlthough anyone can post anywhere on Talk About Marriage, this section is for people interested in general relationship and marriage advice.
I'm sorry you've had a terrible experience with marriage. Really, I am.
But the fact of the matter is most spouses don't cheat. If you choose treat your significant others as cheaters who just haven't been caught yet, that's your prerogative. I think that's corrosive to a relationship, but that's just me.
Still, do a favor and please don't condescend to those of us who don't believe spying is part of a normal, healthy marriage.
And, frankly, all the spying in the world isn't going to stop a person determined to cheat. It may catch them sooner, but that's after the fact. Rather than focus on spying, focus on creating a marital environment that's less susceptible to infidelity. Posted via Mobile Device
Not even putting your words into my mouth as you attempt to do here makes your argument work. And you are still magnificently naïve and as I say long may it last.
I'm sorry you've had a terrible experience with marriage. Really, I am.
But the fact of the matter is most spouses don't cheat.
If you choose treat your significant others as cheaters who just haven't been caught yet, that's your prerogative. I think that's corrosive to a relationship, but that's just me.
Still, do a favor and please don't condescend to those of us who don't believe spying is part of a normal, healthy marriage.
And, frankly, all the spying in the world isn't going to stop a person determined to cheat. It may catch them sooner, but that's after the fact. Rather than focus on spying, focus on creating a marital environment that's less susceptible to infidelity. Posted via Mobile Device
Are you saying that people that focus on creating a marital environment that's less susceptible to infidelity don't get cheated on?
You said less susceptible. So what about the person that is doing this, but there are a number of red flags that make that same wonderful spouse think that their partner is cheating? What should they do, to confirm or deny what they think is going on?
1. Source?
2. Infidelity stats tend to be inherently unreliable because they rely on self-reporting and/or are compiled by people with 'skin in the game,' so to speak, i.e. those peddling books on how to prevent/recover from infidelity.
3. I can cite you figures from respected, independent researchers at the U. of Chicago and UC-Irvine that place the figure between 11 and 18 percent. Or a U. of Chicago study released this summer that puts the figure at 22 percent for men and 14 percent for women. (Sorry, can't link off my mobile, but you can find them if you look).
For those who've been cheated on and/or have visited this site, it must seem like everyone's cheating. Certainly there's a 'misery loves company' element to that. But the real, verifiable research out there says the great majority of spouses are faithful. Posted via Mobile Device
From my experience on the TAM forum I have not seen anyone suggest a key logger or other form of spying to someone in a happy healthy relationship, they have ONLY been suggested as a way of obtaining proof of infidelity because of actual red flags. Now for example if H and I get into an argument over doing the dishes an I post it on this site to vent/ask for opinions I'm about 110% sure they are not going to tell me to install key loggers and spy on my husband because it's a red flag that he is possibly cheating. If however my H starts being protective of his phone, closing out windows and deleting browser history, boots me off his Facebook, and not answering calls/texts(when it was never a problem before) then yes because these are major red flags they would suggest a key logger and other type of things so that I can verify if there is an affair which in a majority of these cases their is an affair in the works either an EA or a PA.
When my H had his EA the communication was only face to face every other day and he would talk to her as often as he possibly could. I confronted him with my suspicions and was immidiately told I was "overreacting" and that he only spoke to her when he absolutely had to. I couldn't say otherwise because I had NO PROOF had I been able to obtain proof then this could have been nipped before they went out on their second "date" now mind you he even went as far as introducing me to the woman! The only reason I found out was because I got eyewitness accounts that he couldn't dispute. Posted via Mobile Device
Are you saying that people that focus on creating a marital environment that's less susceptible to infidelity don't get cheated on?
Doesn't the phrase 'less susceptible' answer that question for you?
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You said less susceptible. So what about the person that is doing this, but there are a number of red flags that make that same wonderful spouse think that their partner is cheating? What should they do, to confirm or deny what they think is going on?
If you spend some time reading the thread, you'll see that I've said many times investigating red flags is fine. I'm arguing against the notion that spying on one's spouse as a matter of routine is normal and expected (such as the posters who proclaim a spouse has no right or expectation of privacy). Posted via Mobile Device
Doesn't the phrase 'less susceptible' answer that question for you?
If you spend some time reading the thread, you'll see that I've said many times investigating red flags is fine. I'm arguing against the notion that spying on one's spouse as a matter of routine is normal and expected (such as the posters who proclaim a spouse has no right or expectation of privacy). Posted via Mobile Device
I never once said that and most of us in the CWI don't say that either, you're setting up a strawman
it's almost as if you wish to say that the betrayed could have done something to make their spouse not cheat on them
Maybe, maybe not. I'm sure there are many instances in which a betrayed spouse could have done nothing to prevent the cheating. Some people no doubt are married to self-centered jerks.
I suspect there are many more instances in which the cheating was a symptom of marital discord, not the cause. Most cheaters don't wake up one morning and say 'I'm going to go f--- someone else today just because.' It's a process that gets them to that point, and that process is far less likely to occur in a marriage in which both spouses needs are met.
Is this somehow a controversial stance? I thought it was fairly common sense.
This is in no way intended to justify cheating. There are many, many other appropriate ways to address marital unhappiness - up to and including divorce. Cheating is never OK, in my book.
But while it may be easier and less painful (and less introspective) for the BS to just label the cheater as an evil-doer, chances are it's not that simple.
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I'm all for a good convo on setting boundaries and discussing them
but do understand that good chunk of people in the CWI forum had what they considered to be good marriages before they were cheated on.
Sure, they may say that. I'd guess most even believe it. But that doesn't make it so. Just because one side or the other doesn't communicate their unhappiness - or does and it's ignored or misunderstood - doesn't mean the unhappiness wasn't there. What's sometimes labeled as 'rewritten history' may in fact be previously undisclosed or unseen or ignored issues. And I've seen my share of BS here who'll admit they were less than ideal partners.
Again, that's not said to justify, but to illustrate that infidelity doesn't always occur in a vacuum or out of the blue. It may just seem that way for couples who are poor at communicating. Posted via Mobile Device
Cyber cheating, I've come acrossed a Post on here about a women who's husband has been found cheating on her online, acording to her he was caught on facebook in a realtionship with various women, dirty pictures and so on. So she decided to take it apone herself and instal a "Key Loger." a Key loger records EVERYTHING you type onto your pc, its a Massive invasion of ones privacy, whille it seems harmless to the person who is trying to find out if their spouse is cheating to the other person any information on their pc is recorded to the other person this is basically HACKING and Illegal. In my personal experince being one who has had a key loger on my pc you never get over the invasion, nor do you feel you can totally trust you partner and WHAT if your partner didn't do anything?? The TRUST is gone (between one or both of you) Some beleive if you chat with the oppsit sex its "emotinal cheatng", I personally beleive that you have to be PHYSICALLY with a person to be cheating along i think that somtimes you can get emotinally attached to a person online if you allow yourself. I think if the story had been diffrent (a women was caught cheating and the man had put the Key loger on her pc things would have been very diffrent, the man would be charged and either fined or inprinsoned and charged with some sort of crime and women all over this site would call him all sorts of names and not be sticking up for him like the women are for this women who has caught her husband not PHYSICALLY cheating but "cyber cheating." and hacking into his pc.. Would like to hear from others on your thoughts, if you have been a victem of a key logger, or hacking, etc I am NOT for cheating or anything i just think that two wrongs do NOT make a right!
Doesn't the phrase 'less susceptible' answer that question for you?
If you spend some time reading the thread, you'll see that I've said many times investigating red flags is fine. I'm arguing against the notion that spying on one's spouse as a matter of routine is normal and expected (such as the posters who proclaim a spouse has no right or expectation of privacy). Posted via Mobile Device
Privacy in your terms means secrets. There should be no secrets in a marriage, no closed chapters in our books. If you do have secrets then you will eventually lose your partner’s trust because you are going to deceive and lie in order to maintain your secrets.
I never once said that and most of us in the CWI don't say that either, you're setting up a strawman
So you're suggesting there aren't posts in this thread stating (paraphrasing) that a spouse has no right or expectation of privacy?
I suggest you re-read the thread.
Did you say it? I don't know. But given that the post to which you responded wasn't in reply to you nor did it mention, I'm not sure why you choose to believe I was writing about you. Posted via Mobile Device
OKAY BUT see it from my eyes, you married to someone who is very selfish doesnt allow you any friends, you cannot talk to family, you are not allowed to even look people without verbal bashing from your husband, he is EXSTREAMLY jealous and when you talk to him about issues he goes into a mood and does whatever he can to make you feel like crap....then the internet comes around and now you have a sorce of way of communitcating with someone who isn't going to judge you (or obviouly many have) you don't have to fear for you life at that point then SUDDENLY your jealous husband finds a way to read everything you right (all totally innocent) but your husband is the type that twist and turn s words and totally insecure anyways he installs this stupid logger finds out you have been chatting with men and women and goes phycotic on his wife....or she goes phycotic on her husband and kills him (Put yourself in the eyes of a wife is has no other company but the computer she ISNT cheating just normal everyday chatting) but to the eyes of her jealous spouse he takes it as cheating even if shes chatting to a girl!
Ya know, not all issues are so black and white. People who use a key logger to control their spouses are wackos. The problem is not the key logger, it is the abusive, controlling husband. Big diff.
But most people who do a little digging on their spouse have done so because they have REASON to believe that their spouse is cheating. And a cheating spouse, when confronted, does not admit guilt 99% of the time.
If you aren't doing anything wrong, it shouldn't matter what your spouse sees. If you can't be transparent with your spouse, you have something to hide. And chatting with strange men on the 'net is inappropriate. And to think that only physical cheating is "cheating" is naive and just out of touch with how most married people think in a healthy relationship.
You also might want to do spellcheck on some of your posts. Just FYI.
Stop trying to justify your emotional affair. It won't solve the problem you have of being in an abusive marriage. Deal with that part head on. Having an EA online will not make your situation any better.
Re: Spying on your spouse, not such a good idea! 
