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post #31 of 164 (permalink) Old 02-27-2017, 11:32 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Flowers sent to an Italian girl

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Originally Posted by Cooper View Post
Not sure if anyone else mentioned this but just to toss this out there. You need to be very careful when you cross a boundary into a persons professional life. Getting flowers at work from an anonymous source could very have offended her or put her in an uncomfortable position. That even goes to emails and such, many work places monitor their employees office emails.

Honestly the more you have written the more I think she has just been doing some friendly networking, nothing you have said makes me think she is interested romantically.
Yes those are risks and valid thoughts too. She did directly tell me she had started a role with this particular company. It was still a gamble if she would even get them - and yes how she would react to them.


Last edited by zeezack; 02-27-2017 at 11:40 AM.
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post #32 of 164 (permalink) Old 02-27-2017, 11:57 AM
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Re: Flowers sent to an Italian girl

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@zeezack -- If a woman is interested but she isn't available for the time you invite her out, she will almost always suggest an alternate time/activity. Considering that you suggested pancakes for pancake day or for another time (leaving it open), and she said she won't be around on pancake day and didn't offer an alternate date, I would say that she is friend-zoning you.

Considering that you say she is "very entrepreneurial, smart and ambitious"... I'm guessing that she's looking for a guy who is more assertive and confident than you have been with her.
Yes, to the above.

She may have a "string" of admirers. You are a "part" of her personal Mosaic Portrait. The paste-on type.

The Mosaic that she has in her well decorated bedroom. If you stand far back, say, at the opposite wall and look at the Mosaic, it is a man's face. An attractive man's face.

Moving closer, you see that it is made up of many faces of men. Yours' is one of those faces. She does enjoy your attention. That is the extent of her attentive needs. She does not want your 'manhood' standing at "attention" in front of her. The thought of "that" happening at your end of a computer screen or smart phone.....yes, big ego boost for her.

Oh, she may be married or engaged. A form of mild sexting. Your words, her hand.....sort of relationship.

Whatever. Either let this non-relationship go..... or let her do the work. Let her make the effort. If she does, be encouraging but be elusive and mysterious. Spin a yarn with silk thread. Put a big flourish on the end of this knitted helixed rope. A French curl, a spun French tickler for her to ponder.

This....This is the nub of the stick that pokes me in the eye when the light of day energizes my optic nerve....SunCMars.... The Allegory of the Cave--> On this, I did a '180' and stepped out.

The Lion in Winter. Invictus..By Will, Shall... Saved from harm by my friends.
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post #33 of 164 (permalink) Old 02-27-2017, 01:01 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Flowers sent to an Italian girl

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Yes, to the above.

She may have a "string" of admirers. You are a "part" of her personal Mosaic Portrait. The paste-on type.

The Mosaic that she has in her well decorated bedroom. If you stand far back, say, at the opposite wall and look at the Mosaic, it is a man's face. An attractive man's face.

Moving closer, you see that it is made up of many faces of men. Yours' is one of those faces. She does enjoy your attention. That is the extent of her attentive needs. She does not want your 'manhood' standing at "attention" in front of her. The thought of "that" happening at your end of a computer screen or smart phone.....yes, big ego boost for her.

Oh, she may be married or engaged. A form of mild sexting. Your words, her hand.....sort of relationship.

Whatever. Either let this non-relationship go..... or let her do the work. Let her make the effort. If she does, be encouraging but be elusive and mysterious. Spin a yarn with silk thread. Put a big flourish on the end of this knitted helixed rope. A French curl, a spun French tickler for her to ponder.


"She may have a "string" of admirers."
^ sure I can believe that. But then - I can not control this or nor should I make it my concern - as me and her - have our own connection (link)

I'm an educated guy - youthful looking, non-smoker, muscular build - working on being more athletic, good earning capacity. So I can only dance to my own tune. I will try and approach her different - and will give her space/time - then trying to bother her about a meet.

"She does enjoy your attention. That is the extent of her attentive needs. She does not want your 'manhood' standing at "attention" in front of her. The thought of "that" happening at your end of a computer screen or smart phone.....yes, big ego boost for her. "
^ sure this is all possible - I am now assessing her - and watching my interactions with her more carefully. Trying to see if she will contact first.

"she may be married or engaged."
^ No I don't think this is true.

"or let her do the work. Let her make the effort. If she does, be encouraging but be elusive and mysterious."
^ that is how I will try this.
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post #34 of 164 (permalink) Old 02-27-2017, 01:05 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Flowers sent to an Italian girl

Its like this - out of all her admirer's - I was the only one to take the risk/chance or gall to send her flowers. I did that with good intentions. I made myself vulnerable by revealing this to her. But it made an impact, good or bad - we'll see. Or mabye we won't see - and then we know her true colours/intent.
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post #35 of 164 (permalink) Old 02-27-2017, 01:06 PM
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Re: Flowers sent to an Italian girl

ref: "The Three Faces of Eve" was a popular movie produced in 1957.

I am the "The Three Faces of Steve"

I am going to present the face that @EleGirl and @turnera begrudgeingly "like"............. Like, secretly.

I will offer another logical and rational take on the modelesque Italian Girl who is the same field as you. The lady that you communicate with.

Women in business-

Women in business are at a distinct disadvantage. Men can have friends in the same line of work. They can be friendly with these guys. They can NETWORK with these "guys".

The friendly banter, the occasional email. The meet ups for coffee or beer, or golf, when in the same city is deemed OK. There are no strings attached to this camaraderie. Provided, no party is gay.

When women get friendly and upbeat, they are immediately viewed as being interested in romance.

Before I retired, I dealt with many, many dozens of women sales reps. They wanted a sale. Not romance. Not to be hit on.

Well, 95% of them. The other 5%? They wore short skirts, tight clothes, lots of perfume, open cleavage....you get the picture. Some would have done a lot of things to get a sale.

I suspect your Italian Colleague wanted a friend in you. She MAY HAVE wanted someone to NETWORK with. She wanted a friend. Who does not need more friends?

Men find it hard to separate the women from the body. They just DO!

Me, I would keep her as a friend. Friends are like gold. Hard to obtain.

True, and golden friends never lose their luster. Luster......... Lust Her. Stop the lust....be professional and be friendly. Things will fall into their proper place and their proper perspective.

This....This is the nub of the stick that pokes me in the eye when the light of day energizes my optic nerve....SunCMars.... The Allegory of the Cave--> On this, I did a '180' and stepped out.

The Lion in Winter. Invictus..By Will, Shall... Saved from harm by my friends.
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post #36 of 164 (permalink) Old 02-27-2017, 01:12 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Flowers sent to an Italian girl

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Originally Posted by SunCMars View Post
ref: "The Three Faces of Eve" was a popular movie produced in 1957.

I am the "The Three Faces of Steve"

I am going to present the face that @EleGirl and @turnera begrudgeingly "like"............. Like, secretly.

I will offer another logical and rational take on the modelesque Italian Girl who is the same field as you. The lady that you communicate with.

Women in business-

Women in business are at a distinct disadvantage. Men can have friends in the same line of work. They can be friendly with these guys. They can NETWORK with these "guys".

The friendly banter, the occasional email. The meet ups for coffee or beer, or golf, when in the same city is deemed OK. There are no strings attached to this camaraderie. Provided, no party is gay.

When women get friendly and upbeat, they are immediately viewed as being interested in romance.

Before I retired, I dealt with many, many dozens of women sales reps. They wanted a sale. Not romance. Not to be hit on.

Well, 95% of them. The other 5%? They wore short skirts, tight clothes, lots of perfume, open cleavage....you get the picture. Some would have done a lot of things to get a sale.

I suspect your Italian Colleague wanted a friend in you. She MAY HAVE wanted someone to NETWORK with. She wanted a friend. Who does not need more friends?

Men find it hard to separate the women from the body. They just DO!

Me, I would keep her as a friend. Friends are like gold. Hard to obtain.

True, and golden friends never lose their luster. Luster......... Lust Her. Stop the lust....be professional and be friendly. Things will fall into their proper place and their proper perspective.
"Stop the lust....be professional and be friendly. "
^ I sent her flowers - and at best its very platonic. I think she is a great person - and would be interested in meeting her - if only as a friend. I do see there being more potential though - but then I would like to meet her face to face and find that out really for myself.
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post #37 of 164 (permalink) Old 02-27-2017, 01:30 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Flowers sent to an Italian girl

The difficulty I have - is getting beyond the current form of communication methods. I don't even feel it wise to express my thoughts and feelings to her on that. At the moment - what I feel, think is currently a very virtual image of her in my mind. So I am trying to give myself time to assess my own thoughts and keep things grounded to reality. I'm a very thoughtful person - I wouldn't send a girl flowers unless I had some serious intentions - of being serious.
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post #38 of 164 (permalink) Old 02-27-2017, 01:37 PM
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Re: Flowers sent to an Italian girl

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Originally Posted by zeezack View Post
The difficulty I have - is getting beyond the current form of communication methods. I don't even feel it wise to express my thoughts and feelings to her on that. At the moment - what I feel, think is currently a very virtual image of her in my mind. So I am trying to give myself time to assess my own thoughts and keep things grounded to reality. I'm a very thoughtful person - I wouldn't send a girl flowers unless I had some serious intentions - of being serious.
I would stop all contact. If she has any interest in you romantically she will let you know.
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post #39 of 164 (permalink) Old 02-27-2017, 01:44 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Flowers sent to an Italian girl

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I would stop all contact. If she has any interest in you romantically she will let you know.
Sure. Well I've stuck my head out now anyway and dropped the hints. I am trying to assess now - see if she is interested in having a guy meet her mother and sister, or if she is more interested in instagram. I am hoping there is an inbetween.

Last edited by zeezack; 02-27-2017 at 01:49 PM.
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post #40 of 164 (permalink) Old 02-27-2017, 01:54 PM
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Re: Flowers sent to an Italian girl

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Originally Posted by SunCMars View Post
Women in business-

Women in business are at a distinct disadvantage. Men can have friends in the same line of work. They can be friendly with these guys. They can NETWORK with these "guys".

The friendly banter, the occasional email. The meet ups for coffee or beer, or golf, when in the same city is deemed OK. There are no strings attached to this camaraderie. Provided, no party is gay.

When women get friendly and upbeat, they are immediately viewed as being interested in romance.

This is so true. Especially in sales, it's difficult to be friendly and approachable without a man thinking you are interested in something more.

If she needs a strong, confident man, you have done nothing to present yourself in that manner. If you want to meet with her, ask her if she wants to meet with you face to face. You cannot proceed if you have no idea what she wants.

Messaging a person for a year and never meeting her when she lives close to you is not strong or confident. It doesn't show an interest in deepening the relationship.

If you believe she is out of your league, she is. There is no point in taking things further if you don't feel you can offer what she needs. Wanting her isn't enough. You have to believe that you are desirable as well.


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post #41 of 164 (permalink) Old 02-27-2017, 02:06 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Flowers sent to an Italian girl

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This is so true. Especially in sales, it's difficult to be friendly and approachable without a man thinking you are interested in something more.

If she needs a strong, confident man, you have done nothing to present yourself in that manner. If you want to meet with her, ask her if she wants to meet with you face to face. You cannot proceed if you have no idea what she wants.

Messaging a person for a year and never meeting her when she lives close to you is not strong or confident. It doesn't show an interest in deepening the relationship.

If you believe she is out of your league, she is. There is no point in taking things further if you don't feel you can offer what she needs. Wanting her isn't enough. You have to believe that you are desirable as well.
- She is not in sales.

"If she needs a strong, confident man, you have done nothing to present yourself in that manner. If you want to meet with her, ask her if she wants to meet with you face to face. You cannot proceed if you have no idea what she wants."
^ well I have suggested it, once.

"Messaging a person for a year and never meeting her when she lives close to you is not strong or confident. It doesn't show an interest in deepening the relationship."
^ I am just saying she contacted me first a year ago - and we have been in touch since. But my feelings for her have grown stronger since the end of last year/start of this year. Like I said - neither of us really pushed for a meet.

"If you believe she is out of your league, she is."
^ she is very pretty - but she is also human - and has the same fears as anyone else.

"There is no point in taking things further if you don't feel you can offer what she needs. Wanting her isn't enough. You have to believe that you are desirable as well."
^ I feel I could step up and be more desirable - I've had issues - but I feel I can support her, but more importantly encourage her to flourish.

I can be a confident guy - I can take command and have had to make some very difficult decisions in my past, but even now I feel my justification was correct. I work in a very pressurised environment most of the time.
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post #42 of 164 (permalink) Old 02-28-2017, 04:52 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Flowers sent to an Italian girl

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Be direct. Tell her you find her fascinating and would love a chance to meet face to face, ask her if she would like to grab dinner or drinks one evening. So now you are being ambiguous, if she answers "yes, that sounds great", then you try to pin down a day and time by asking her what fits her schedule best, if she says "sure maybe sometime when I'm not so busy", that means she probably isn't interested.

A pancake date? You may think that is fun and quirky and for some women it would work, but if she's as high class as you think that was probably an unappealing invite to her.

In the end all you can lose is an internet buddy if she says no.
My friend say something like this - that I should ask her out - for something like a cocktail bar. I am contemplating it though - feeling it may be prudent. I am just giving her some space/time to reflect for now - see if she wants to talk - initiate first contact. I am trying to assess if she indeed was busy today - it is possible - I think she went to some high-rise block in Canary Wharf yesterday night.

Trying to keep a level head - focusing on my work - doing an emergency contract.
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post #43 of 164 (permalink) Old 02-28-2017, 05:16 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Flowers sent to an Italian girl

I think she had a traumatic breakup 2 years back. She had invested in this relationship - "made him better. Gave him career and changed his mindset" and he left her for another. He wanted to come back after awhile and she said no. That she didn't love him anymore.
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post #44 of 164 (permalink) Old 02-28-2017, 06:41 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Flowers sent to an Italian girl

I have been interested from the start in her helping me with a particular set of web projects - maybe I could focus and prepare this - and then try and approach her again with asking her out - maybe ask her to join me at one of these cat cafes she spoke about earlier.

This way at least I can set the tone and at least try and meet for the first time in a more casual place first. Try and at least talk to each other in person - with an initial and primary topic of interest to talk about. If she wants to discuss other things we can.

Maybe the pancakes thing was too quirky and topical - and I think she is dieting too. One friend said about food being a bad first date - as people may feel less comfortable eating in front of others at the start.

I am keen to meet this girl - even if I tailor it as a more platonic thing - especially if she is not ready generally for a relationship. I could always offer her both settings - cat cafe or cocktail bar?
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post #45 of 164 (permalink) Old 03-01-2017, 05:18 AM
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Re: Flowers sent to an Italian girl

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I have been interested from the start in her helping me with a particular set of web projects - maybe I could focus and prepare this - and then try and approach her again with asking her out - maybe ask her to join me at one of these cat cafes she spoke about earlier.

This way at least I can set the tone and at least try and meet for the first time in a more casual place first. Try and at least talk to each other in person - with an initial and primary topic of interest to talk about. If she wants to discuss other things we can.

Maybe the pancakes thing was too quirky and topical - and I think she is dieting too. One friend said about food being a bad first date - as people may feel less comfortable eating in front of others at the start.

I am keen to meet this girl - even if I tailor it as a more platonic thing - especially if she is not ready generally for a relationship. I could always offer her both settings - cat cafe or cocktail bar?
Did Cupid shoot you in the head with an arrow? Now you're going to manipulate both of your professional lives just so you can get close to her and work your way into a date? I won't say you're the first person to use this approach but honestly from the sum of all your post I do not think she is interested in you. You're starting to sound desperate and conniving, neither of which are attractive traits.

If this woman is as beautiful as you say she is use to men sniffing around her like puppies, she can see what you're up to before you make a move.
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