Vacation separately - sign we are in trouble? - Page 11 - Talk About Marriage
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post #151 of 258 (permalink) Old 04-14-2017, 04:58 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Miss Independent View Post
Oh I must have missed it huh? Care to show where he answered 4/5?
You are correct. OP did not mention if the NOLA trip was to be couple only or with the kids. We assume just the two of them but it is never stated. That is a key question because IMO Nola with kids is infinitely different that Nola with just husband or Nola with a BFF.

Same for the turning down the Vegas trip. OP didn't indicate if wife had input or requested he turn down the trip to save it. That is a very key question.

German,

I doubt you will come back, but you have major issues with the marriage, separate from any potential cheating in NO. IMO you both don't see yourselves as a pair, but rather two individuals living together. Why don't you have combined money? It should not be a matter of you having money for the trip but she does not. That is NOT a marriage.

It's a cliche but the person who values the marriage less holds all the power. That seems to be your wife. She is going on the trip and you are posting here. See the difference.

The advice to take a revenge trip escalates the problem and solves nothing.

This is a great place to discuss the major issues. I hope you come back.
So the NOLA trip we discussed originally was only going to be the two of us.

I turned down Vegas with a friend bc I knew it would bother her. It was one of the places she hadn't ever been at that point and wanted to go badly. I couldn't ever do that knowing it would upset her. If it was for work or even a bachelor party with good friends that's a different story. But it was similar to this trip. Just for no reason other than to go and the choice of any other destination.

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post #152 of 258 (permalink) Old 04-14-2017, 05:21 AM
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Re: Vacation separately - sign we are in trouble?

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So the NOLA trip we discussed originally was only going to be the two of us.

I turned down Vegas with a friend bc I knew it would bother her. It was one of the places she hadn't ever been at that point and wanted to go badly. I couldn't ever do that knowing it would upset her. If it was for work or even a bachelor party with good friends that's a different story. But it was similar to this trip. Just for no reason other than to go and the choice of any other destination.
She knows it upsets you and doesn't give a ****. So her "controlling" ex was probably a dude like you who didn't like certain behavior.

Sorry man, I don't see her changing or your relationship working, at least not the way you want it to work.
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post #153 of 258 (permalink) Old 04-14-2017, 05:23 AM
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Re: Vacation separately - sign we are in trouble?

I would give her the "Your'e coming back to divorce papers" line, and I would mean it. That will show you how much or how little she respects you.
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post #154 of 258 (permalink) Old 04-14-2017, 05:39 AM Thread Starter
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Sorry everyone. Was driving 11 hours for vacation with my kids. And to be honest I needed a break from all of the bad thoughts. Just eating away at me even more. Wasn't expecting all of these responses and it makes it harder.

Well she is on the plane now. Headed to NO. Getting there nice and early on a Friday. This past week has been rough. Feeling from distant bc of all the fighting. She still doesn't get that it hurt me. And she barely even apologized for it. Justified much of it. First saying it was bc she was resentful of things in the marriage (money primarily and some with the kids) and then switched over to she had no choice bc her friend decided that's where she wanted to go and then the latest switch to I was leaving her alone for a week and she didn't want to be alone.

The truth of it is that I asked many times about all of us going to her parents with the kids. I thought it would be a great vacation with the kids. And I get my kids every other year for break so I only get them 2 or 3 more times at best before they are in college. But she told me she couldn't take time and didn't have money each time. So I didn't want my kids to have to spend their break sitting in my office all day so I took them to their grandmas that they only get to see maybe once or twice a year. My mom. So then she booked her vacation bc she didn't want to be alone this weekend bc I left her alone. Turns out she was able to take 2 days off so she can have a four day weekend of it in NO. Then she asks her boss and got a third day off the day before so she can pack and get ready. I would've loved to have done a 4 or 5 day vacation anywhere with the family. We don't get to do them often.

I'll be honest that this weekend is going to be beyond hard on me. Bc I wanted to go with her and experience it together. Not to mention I know what being the wingman means. I mentioned it to her but she insisted that no one is going to talk to the heavy friend. But she is gorgeous and I know guys. And I know drunk guys and drunk women. She keeps repeating that nothing will happen. She will not cheat. So I'm doing my best to take her at her word right now.

The hard part is I'm the romantic one. And I wish she was more like I am with that. And more about doing things as a couple. I stupidly just kept hoping she was getting on a plane to come here and surprise me and love yada yada. Lol. But she sent me a text of her plane ticket to NO so I know that's not happening. No movie ending to this weekend I guess. Lol. I get it. A weekend with me and my kids certainly isn't anywhere near as exciting.

She has sent me a ton of 'I love you's' in the last 12 hours or so leading up and as she was boarding.

I did tell her I wanted to go to therapy together the other day. So now I'm just hoping she makes it a priority. Bc this whole thing has bothered me so much that it really made me question what she thinks of our relationship and how she feels about me. I may not always be the best at communicating but when I do screw up it's bc I'm busy and forgot. I would never do anything to hurt her. She says she didn't do it to intentionally hurt me. But she had to know it would hurt me or she wouldn't have avoided telling me for so long.

And no I didn't get any itinerary. It was like pulling teeth to get flight info. Still no idea about her flight back. And certainly no hotel information. I know what most are going to say. Just go easy on me please bc this is hard enough.

I really only posted originally bc I was curious if other marriages all discussed things like going on trips. And if you would've talked about it with your spouse before going. I know my previous marriage we would've talked about it. Even though I can't ever see either of us taking separate vacations like this. But my current wife insists that's what normal couples do with girls weekends and she shouldn't have to get permission.

Thanks for listening to me vent.
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post #155 of 258 (permalink) Old 04-14-2017, 06:46 AM
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Not to mention I know what being the wingman means. I mentioned it to her but she insisted that no one is going to talk to the heavy friend. But she is gorgeous and I know guys.
From "Urban Dictionary". I'd say "show it to her", but I'm guessing she wrote the passage.

"Now that the hot friend sees that the ugly girl has finally found a man, she is now free to start scouting".



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Originally Posted by germanchip1 View Post
And no I didn't get any itinerary. It was like pulling teeth to get flight info. Still no idea about her flight back. And certainly no hotel information.

I finally get it. Men who marry party girls are cuckolds. This statement is incredible. Girls, what kind of a man do you marry that you would even think it's a POSSIBILITY to get away with this, let alone be on a flight after having successfully pulled it off. She married a man who would let it happen. It's amazing really.

How long have you been together? I don't remember specifically, but married 6 months, dated for a while, I get the feeling. Does she go out a lot with her girlfriends? Stay out late? Ever hear the words "we were to drunk to drive so we just got a hotel downtown"?

I'm guessing I'm close. I don't remember you ever saying "and this is SO out of character for her". And she's on her way to the party girl Olympics. She's been training her whole adult life for this. If it were me I'd be telling mom that I need to take a trip. It's an emergency. Please watch the kids.

Good luck dude.

PS: Full Disclosure: I've got issues. Take the above with a grain of salt.
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post #156 of 258 (permalink) Old 04-14-2017, 06:55 AM
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Re: Vacation separately - sign we are in trouble?

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Originally Posted by germanchip1 View Post
Sorry everyone. Was driving 11 hours for vacation with my kids. And to be honest I needed a break from all of the bad thoughts. Just eating away at me even more. Wasn't expecting all of these responses and it makes it harder.

Well she is on the plane now. Headed to NO. Getting there nice and early on a Friday. This past week has been rough. Feeling from distant bc of all the fighting. She still doesn't get that it hurt me. And she barely even apologized for it. Justified much of it. First saying it was bc she was resentful of things in the marriage (money primarily and some with the kids) and then switched over to she had no choice bc her friend decided that's where she wanted to go and then the latest switch to I was leaving her alone for a week and she didn't want to be alone.

The truth of it is that I asked many times about all of us going to her parents with the kids. I thought it would be a great vacation with the kids. And I get my kids every other year for break so I only get them 2 or 3 more times at best before they are in college. But she told me she couldn't take time and didn't have money each time. So I didn't want my kids to have to spend their break sitting in my office all day so I took them to their grandmas that they only get to see maybe once or twice a year. My mom. So then she booked her vacation bc she didn't want to be alone this weekend bc I left her alone. Turns out she was able to take 2 days off so she can have a four day weekend of it in NO. Then she asks her boss and got a third day off the day before so she can pack and get ready. I would've loved to have done a 4 or 5 day vacation anywhere with the family. We don't get to do them often.

I'll be honest that this weekend is going to be beyond hard on me. Bc I wanted to go with her and experience it together. Not to mention I know what being the wingman means. I mentioned it to her but she insisted that no one is going to talk to the heavy friend. But she is gorgeous and I know guys. And I know drunk guys and drunk women. She keeps repeating that nothing will happen. She will not cheat. So I'm doing my best to take her at her word right now.

The hard part is I'm the romantic one. And I wish she was more like I am with that. And more about doing things as a couple. I stupidly just kept hoping she was getting on a plane to come here and surprise me and love yada yada. Lol. But she sent me a text of her plane ticket to NO so I know that's not happening. No movie ending to this weekend I guess. Lol. I get it. A weekend with me and my kids certainly isn't anywhere near as exciting.

She has sent me a ton of 'I love you's' in the last 12 hours or so leading up and as she was boarding.

I did tell her I wanted to go to therapy together the other day. So now I'm just hoping she makes it a priority. Bc this whole thing has bothered me so much that it really made me question what she thinks of our relationship and how she feels about me. I may not always be the best at communicating but when I do screw up it's bc I'm busy and forgot. I would never do anything to hurt her. She says she didn't do it to intentionally hurt me. But she had to know it would hurt me or she wouldn't have avoided telling me for so long.

And no I didn't get any itinerary. It was like pulling teeth to get flight info. Still no idea about her flight back. And certainly no hotel information. I know what most are going to say. Just go easy on me please bc this is hard enough.

I really only posted originally bc I was curious if other marriages all discussed things like going on trips. And if you would've talked about it with your spouse before going. I know my previous marriage we would've talked about it. Even though I can't ever see either of us taking separate vacations like this. But my current wife insists that's what normal couples do with girls weekends and she shouldn't have to get permission.

Thanks for listening to me vent.
No PI, no itinerary, she's being secretive, she showers you with "I love yous" when her actions speak otherwise and the best thing you can come up with is counseling ?

Counseling with who ? For all you know, you could be counseling over communication issues when you have a wife who may be up to bad things in NO.

What is your exposure for loss if you decide to end the marriage ?

She has brought her brokenness and put it on your shoulders.

The fact that you turned down LV for her but she goes to NO without you is not very forgivable IMO
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post #157 of 258 (permalink) Old 04-14-2017, 08:31 AM
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Re: Vacation separately - sign we are in trouble?

She knows that you wanted to go to NO with her. It's on your bucket list.
She knows that she's hurting you by going.
The time that she negotiated away from work was for her. Her family wasn't a consideration.
She refuses to let you know her itinerary, even what hotel she's staying in.
She diverts and makes excuses as to her motives.
She doesn't "need permission" from you is her only argument because there is no good excuse for what she's doing.
Dozens of the words "I love you" but her actions speak otherwise.
"Normal" women go on "Girl's night out" and weekends with their friends, but not at the expense of their family's emotional well-being.

There are so many other things... but you get what I'm saying.

My husband wouldn't think of going to a place on our bucket list without me.
My husband wouldn't think of hurting me by going to a party town without me (if I wanted to go) despite my concerns.
My husband wouldn't negotiate precious time away from work, only to exclude me from it.
My husband always lets me know where he's going, where he's staying, and what he's doing, even on business trips, and loves to send me pictures of himself and the places he's seeing, so that I can experience a little of it myself since I have my own work to do.
My husband doesn't make excuses. If he believes that he's being fair, he stands firm. He doesn't believe in being unfair, so thus, he doesn't have to make excuses. Sometimes he sacrifices what he wants for what I want, but he makes sure that I understand that it's voluntary, not an obligation. I do the same for him.
My husband doesn't need my permission to do anything, but he wants me to approve. We sometimes have to negotiate.
When my husband says "I love you", he isn't stabbing me in the back while he's saying it.
My husband puts me first. I put him first.
My husband won't put up with my crap either, and everyone has a little crap in them. He's firm and fair, and he expects that from me.

You, on the other hand, are letting your wife set a precedent. She's going on this trip, and to hell with you. You're expected to deal with it now, and she'll smooth things over when she gets back. When that works, then the next time she has an itch that you can't scratch, she'll do it again.

Is she going there with no boundaries, meaning, if a stud wants to plow her, she's going to get plowed? It certainly seems like it. What happens in NO stays in NO, right? Will that happen? Maybe. If it doesn't happen, will you think to yourself "Whew! I'm glad we dodged that bullet!". How will you know if she's been faithful? Actually, I suppose the question is "How will you know if she's been even MORE UNfaithful", because she's already pushed the definition of faithful almost to the breaking point. There's no "freshness indicator" on her lady parts, and you don't know where she'll be, because she won't tell you. I guess you'll just always wonder about that, won't you, because you can't prove that she DIDN'T do anything.

The trust issue is not because she's going out of town with a friend. My husband goes out of town often, and I'm not concerned about his behavior. It's because she's being insistent, secretive, and selfish to the extreme that makes her untrustworthy.

If your wife is truly faithful, and yet incapable of understanding what she's doing to your relationship, she certainly doesn't understand one of the basic rules of marriage: Avoid the appearance of wrong-doing.

If my husband behaved as your wife is, he wouldn't hear a peep out of me while he was gone. Absolutely NO CONTACT. He'd come home to HIS house, not OUR house, after his potential sexcation, because I wouldn't be there anymore. There'd be a note on his pillow, "You did your thing. I'm doing mine".

Only you can decide, since you didn't put your foot down before she left, if you're willing to put up with the misery of this precedent. If you do, the next time she pulls the stunt, and she will, it will be much harder for you to deal with, unless you've lopped your testicles off and given them to her in a gift box by then.

Sorry if you want gentle. You don't need gentle. There's too much gentle. Everyone gets a trophy, right? You need to stand up for yourself and your children. You need a woman like me to tell you that you're not cutting it, so a woman like your wife doesn't own you. Gentle? How about HARD. How about ASSERTIVE. How about STRONG but FAIR. That's what you need to be, so you'll get the woman that you deserve.

Sometimes, the only answer to her mistake, and your mistake in choosing her, is a hearty "GTFO. I won't be treated this way", but then, you have to mean it.
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post #158 of 258 (permalink) Old 04-14-2017, 08:45 AM
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Re: Vacation separately - sign we are in trouble?

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post #159 of 258 (permalink) Old 04-14-2017, 08:50 AM
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Re: Vacation separately - sign we are in trouble?

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She has sent me a ton of 'I love you's' in the last 12 hours or so leading up and as she was boarding.

I did tell her I wanted to go to therapy together the other day. So now I'm just hoping she makes it a priority. Bc this whole thing has bothered me so much that it really made me question what she thinks of our relationship and how she feels about me. I may not always be the best at communicating but when I do screw up it's bc I'm busy and forgot. I would never do anything to hurt her. She says she didn't do it to intentionally hurt me. But she had to know it would hurt me or she wouldn't have avoided telling me for so long.
That's because she wasn't thinking about you.

The " I love yous ", a distraction. Camoflage.

And, it's not about getting permission. It's about married people, partners, discussing their plans with the people they supposedly love. And respect.

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post #160 of 258 (permalink) Old 04-14-2017, 08:53 AM
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Re: Vacation separately - sign we are in trouble?

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Originally Posted by Dr. Stupid View Post
She knows that you wanted to go to NO with her. It's on your bucket list.
She knows that she's hurting you by going.
The time that she negotiated away from work was for her. Her family wasn't a consideration.
She refuses to let you know her itinerary, even what hotel she's staying in.
She diverts and makes excuses as to her motives.
She doesn't "need permission" from you is her only argument because there is no good excuse for what she's doing.
Dozens of the words "I love you" but her actions speak otherwise.
"Normal" women go on "Girl's night out" and weekends with their friends, but not at the expense of their family's emotional well-being.

There are so many other things... but you get what I'm saying.

My husband wouldn't think of going to a place on our bucket list without me.
My husband wouldn't think of hurting me by going to a party town without me (if I wanted to go) despite my concerns.
My husband wouldn't negotiate precious time away from work, only to exclude me from it.
My husband always lets me know where he's going, where he's staying, and what he's doing, even on business trips, and loves to send me pictures of himself and the places he's seeing, so that I can experience a little of it myself since I have my own work to do.
My husband doesn't make excuses. If he believes that he's being fair, he stands firm. He doesn't believe in being unfair, so thus, he doesn't have to make excuses. Sometimes he sacrifices what he wants for what I want, but he makes sure that I understand that it's voluntary, not an obligation. I do the same for him.
My husband doesn't need my permission to do anything, but he wants me to approve. We sometimes have to negotiate.
When my husband says "I love you", he isn't stabbing me in the back while he's saying it.
My husband puts me first. I put him first.
My husband won't put up with my crap either, and everyone has a little crap in them. He's firm and fair, and he expects that from me.

You, on the other hand, are letting your wife set a precedent. She's going on this trip, and to hell with you. You're expected to deal with it now, and she'll smooth things over when she gets back. When that works, then the next time she has an itch that you can't scratch, she'll do it again.

Is she going there with no boundaries, meaning, if a stud wants to plow her, she's going to get plowed? It certainly seems like it. What happens in NO stays in NO, right? Will that happen? Maybe. If it doesn't happen, will you think to yourself "Whew! I'm glad we dodged that bullet!". How will you know if she's been faithful? Actually, I suppose the question is "How will you know if she's been even MORE UNfaithful", because she's already pushed the definition of faithful almost to the breaking point. There's no "freshness indicator" on her lady parts, and you don't know where she'll be, because she won't tell you. I guess you'll just always wonder about that, won't you, because you can't prove that she DIDN'T do anything.

The trust issue is not because she's going out of town with a friend. My husband goes out of town often, and I'm not concerned about his behavior. It's because she's being insistent, secretive, and selfish to the extreme that makes her untrustworthy.

If your wife is truly faithful, and yet incapable of understanding what she's doing to your relationship, she certainly doesn't understand one of the basic rules of marriage: Avoid the appearance of wrong-doing.

If my husband behaved as your wife is, he wouldn't hear a peep out of me while he was gone. Absolutely NO CONTACT. He'd come home to HIS house, not OUR house, after his potential sexcation, because I wouldn't be there anymore. There'd be a note on his pillow, "You did your thing. I'm doing mine".

Only you can decide, since you didn't put your foot down before she left, if you're willing to put up with the misery of this precedent. If you do, the next time she pulls the stunt, and she will, it will be much harder for you to deal with, unless you've lopped your testicles off and given them to her in a gift box by then.

Sorry if you want gentle. You don't need gentle. There's too much gentle. Everyone gets a trophy, right? You need to stand up for yourself and your children. You need a woman like me to tell you that you're not cutting it, so a woman like your wife doesn't own you. Gentle? How about HARD. How about ASSERTIVE. How about STRONG but FAIR. That's what you need to be, so you'll get the woman that you deserve.

Sometimes, the only answer to her mistake, and your mistake in choosing her, is a hearty "GTFO. I won't be treated this way", but then, you have to mean it.
Wow!

Good Post.

A few ouches.

And baby...you ain't *stupid!
.................................................. .................................................. ..........................
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This....This is the nub of the stick that pokes me in the eye when the light of day energizes my optic nerve....SunCMars.... The Allegory of the Cave--> On this, I did a '180' and stepped out.

The Lion in Winter. Invictus..By Will, Shall... Saved from harm by my friends.
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post #161 of 258 (permalink) Old 04-14-2017, 08:57 AM
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Re: Vacation separately - sign we are in trouble?

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Sorry everyone. Was driving 11 hours for vacation with my kids. And to be honest I needed a break from all of the bad thoughts. Just eating away at me even more. Wasn't expecting all of these responses and it makes it harder.

Well she is on the plane now. Headed to NO. Getting there nice and early on a Friday. This past week has been rough. Feeling from distant bc of all the fighting. She still doesn't get that it hurt me. And she barely even apologized for it. Justified much of it. First saying it was bc she was resentful of things in the marriage (money primarily and some with the kids) and then switched over to she had no choice bc her friend decided that's where she wanted to go and then the latest switch to I was leaving her alone for a week and she didn't want to be alone.

The truth of it is that I asked many times about all of us going to her parents with the kids. I thought it would be a great vacation with the kids. And I get my kids every other year for break so I only get them 2 or 3 more times at best before they are in college. But she told me she couldn't take time and didn't have money each time. So I didn't want my kids to have to spend their break sitting in my office all day so I took them to their grandmas that they only get to see maybe once or twice a year. My mom. So then she booked her vacation bc she didn't want to be alone this weekend bc I left her alone. Turns out she was able to take 2 days off so she can have a four day weekend of it in NO. Then she asks her boss and got a third day off the day before so she can pack and get ready. I would've loved to have done a 4 or 5 day vacation anywhere with the family. We don't get to do them often.

I'll be honest that this weekend is going to be beyond hard on me. Bc I wanted to go with her and experience it together. Not to mention I know what being the wingman means. I mentioned it to her but she insisted that no one is going to talk to the heavy friend. But she is gorgeous and I know guys. And I know drunk guys and drunk women. She keeps repeating that nothing will happen. She will not cheat. So I'm doing my best to take her at her word right now.

The hard part is I'm the romantic one. And I wish she was more like I am with that. And more about doing things as a couple. I stupidly just kept hoping she was getting on a plane to come here and surprise me and love yada yada. Lol. But she sent me a text of her plane ticket to NO so I know that's not happening. No movie ending to this weekend I guess. Lol. I get it. A weekend with me and my kids certainly isn't anywhere near as exciting.

She has sent me a ton of 'I love you's' in the last 12 hours or so leading up and as she was boarding.

I did tell her I wanted to go to therapy together the other day. So now I'm just hoping she makes it a priority. Bc this whole thing has bothered me so much that it really made me question what she thinks of our relationship and how she feels about me. I may not always be the best at communicating but when I do screw up it's bc I'm busy and forgot. I would never do anything to hurt her. She says she didn't do it to intentionally hurt me. But she had to know it would hurt me or she wouldn't have avoided telling me for so long.

And no I didn't get any itinerary. It was like pulling teeth to get flight info. Still no idea about her flight back. And certainly no hotel information. I know what most are going to say. Just go easy on me please bc this is hard enough.

I really only posted originally bc I was curious if other marriages all discussed things like going on trips. And if you would've talked about it with your spouse before going. I know my previous marriage we would've talked about it. Even though I can't ever see either of us taking separate vacations like this. But my current wife insists that's what normal couples do with girls weekends and she shouldn't have to get permission.

Thanks for listening to me vent.
Your wife does want a husband,but only part time and you will fill that role when she wants to play the role of loving wife.
When she wants to play the role of single girl you are not required and she has shown you not only in her words but also her actions.
The best bit of advice I ever got on tam was to judge someone by their actions,not their words.She has shown you and told you exactly where you fit in and standing on the outside looking in,your life stinks.Go and see a lawyer when you get back and if it is your house,change the locks.This woman has shown you who she is.Believe her.
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post #162 of 258 (permalink) Old 04-14-2017, 09:11 AM
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Re: Vacation separately - sign we are in trouble?

It seems to me that the two of you are not overly compatible. If your thoughts on these trips is so far from hers, and she doesn't appear to even care, then your marriage will only get worse. I am a huge advocate of saving marriages but you really only have three options.

1) Continue letting her walk all over you like a doormat.

2) Divorce, move on, and find someone more compatible.

3) Take her lead and stop caring what she does. Go on your own vacations and don't plan things with her. She no longer should be the center of your thinking.

Personally, after only a few months of marriage, I would choose #2. Chalk it up to a poor decision and move on.

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post #163 of 258 (permalink) Old 04-14-2017, 09:17 AM
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Re: Vacation separately - sign we are in trouble?

Ref: post 154.

Ref: sitcom, "Car 54" where are you?
Hello Dear, how are you! Where are you?

The whole 4 days will worry you, eat at you.
Unlike a few big worrywarts on TAM, I do not think she will cheat on you.
No kissing or hand-holding, or worse.

Getting hit on, yes.
Getting or allowing men to buy them drinks, yes.

Talking and flirting...yes. She will initially make an effort to behave, to resist. Then the alcohol will kick in. Her defenses will lower. Lower a tad more. Hell, she already has opened the gate.Her girlfriend is single. She [GF] is going to be the "wild card", the wild one. What is your wife going to do when her BFF allows other men to get close and to talk and shmooze. They are going to buying drinks for her and her girlfriend. How can she chase them off, when this happens?

The girlfriend may get bedded. That leaves your wife to either sit by herself or go to her room by herself...or to continue sitting with the bevy of male players.

I do not think she will have any ONS's. I could be wrong.

She should not put you through this.

She said she will not cheat! Wow! This means that she knows your fears and walks off the plank anyway.

Some hope: The frequent calls saying: "I love you".

She does love you. She does love you...but she loves herself more. She is self-destructive.

This....This is the nub of the stick that pokes me in the eye when the light of day energizes my optic nerve....SunCMars.... The Allegory of the Cave--> On this, I did a '180' and stepped out.

The Lion in Winter. Invictus..By Will, Shall... Saved from harm by my friends.
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post #164 of 258 (permalink) Old 04-14-2017, 09:21 AM
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Re: Vacation separately - sign we are in trouble?

She sounds like she just doesn't know how to be married. You need to let her know that this kind of independent behavior in marriage isn't going to work for you.

She did this because she justified it in her mind and thought you'd suck it up.

Let her know that's not the case. I'd make this a big issue and MC a non-negotiable. She isn't behaving like a married woman.
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post #165 of 258 (permalink) Old 04-14-2017, 09:42 AM
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Re: Vacation separately - sign we are in trouble?

Do you take care of her financially? What security do you give her? Definitely sounds like she's resenting you.

I hear you about trust. My fiance is the hottest thing in the world (duh!) and I know other guys are checking her out whenever she's out and about. If she went to Vegas or NO with another single girl, I'd have an uneasy feeling in my stomach, especially with your circumstances. A married couple shouldn't be putting themselves in that type of situation, way too risky for temptation. I've been to Vegas by myself for work and I've been tempted to see if I still got it to boost my ego. It's so easy in Vegas or other party towns to have a ONS if you put a little effort into it, seen it happen with other guys many times.
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