tigger01

I am just curious as to the personal opinions/experiences regarding trial separations.

My husband and I (both Catholic, no children) are going through the most difficult time we have ever gone through in our 17 years of marriage. We both agree that we are not ready to navigate towards divorce, but a lot of issues (lack of intimacy/pornography - my husband/EA - me) have severely weakened our marriage, and my love, especially, is not what it used to be.

There is a big part of me that feels (and my husband agrees) that some time apart would be a good thing, and that it could actually help our marriage.

The truth is, long before I reconnected with this person from my past and got involved in an EA, our marriage just "existed." The intimacy, despite my asking for (intimacy) and questioning why (he had no interest), dwindled down to nothing. This reconnection with this OM was done in a very innocent way; however, I think it lit a spark that had been missing for so long. I have been honest in saying to my husband that this OM is someone I wouldn't leave him for, but this seven-month EA has left me very, very confused. I have pretty much discontinued all communication with this OM, but I just do not know what I want anymore. Do I want to save my marriage, or do I want to move on?

My husband, despite all that he knows about this OM and the many things difficult things that I have had to express to him (the fact that I don't love him like I used to, etc.), is willing to do what he can to save our marriage. I, however, feel like I checked out a while ago, but I'm not ready to make such a final decision as divorce. My concern, also, remains the porn, because we have been down this same road multiple times throughout (and even before) our marriage. "Saving the marriage" means that he has gotten rid of the porn, but this HAS happened before; only to resurface again …. and that I can guarantee!

I just feel as if our being apart will allow both of us the time to really think about things. I'm not going to lie in that I DO still think about this OM, and maybe that's something I need to evaluate, too. As far as getting involved with him while apart from my husband? I DO KNOW that that would be a tremendous mistake, and would only make matters ten times worse! He (OM) does live 100+ miles away, so for that I am thankful.

Please provide some insight. As always, I thank you ALL in advance! Your input is so greatly appreciated, because this is a very foreign chapter in my life and it’s rather scary to feel this restless and confused. I know it should be very cut and dry …. I’m married; therefore, figure it out and make it work, but right or wrong, a person can’t be told HOW to feel when they’re clearly NOT feeling it. Any advice/personal stories would be appreciated!

Thank you, again!

TRy

The numbers show that separations almost always leads to divorce. Once separated, it takes extra effort just to even see each other. Usually one or the other will be viewed as making less of an effort and after a while both stop trying.

You need to fish or cut bait. Either stay together and try to work it out, or divorce. separation is just another way of saying slow and painful divorce.

Riverside MFT

From my professional experience, I don't think separating is a good idea. There is a difference between taking a break from dealing with some of your problems and running away from them altogether.

I think that if you separated from your husband, and still had feelings for the OM, you would naturally start gravitating towards the OM instead of towards your husband.

I recognize that love and passion in the marriage is dead. This does not mean that your marriage is dead. I referenced some research in an article I discussed on my blog at Before You Divorce, Part III: Marriage Improvement and Financial Considerations | Improve My Marriage

__________________
Brian, Marriage Counselor
My Counseling Webpage (for California Residents)
Improve My Marriage Blog

Riverside MFT

Those couples I see in counseling who are trying to work on their marriage while still staying together have a significantly higher percentage of actually making their marriage work.

__________________
Brian, Marriage Counselor
My Counseling Webpage (for California Residents)
Improve My Marriage Blog

accept

One would really need more information. Why no children for instance. You dont write apart from the porn what is wrong. Your H is willing to do what he can. Does that include intimacy. You both really have to make a list of what you want in a marriage which for some reason doesnt include children. Only then can you 'go' away and decide if the 'other' can really fulfill it.

Halien

Tigger,

Lots of people on this site, including me, would have very strong opinions on this subject based only on the EA. People might say that for this reason, seperation will only draw you closer to the OM. I disagree with seperation for different reasons, but my reasons align with a couple of posters above.

There is another point that I really would like to bring up, though. You are a very good person, with high regard for doing the right thing. Is it possible that guilt over the idea of divorce is playing a much bigger role that you admit here? Take a step back and look at this from the POV of someone who only knows the basics of your situation. You lived in a cold marriage, but with a man who was basically good at heart. But this porn problem and his own issues enabled him to pull away. Really, your needs have been shelved for a very long time. Who wouldn't want a shot at finding the kind of beautiful marriage that seems so insurmountable with him?

Is it possible that your beliefs, and your guilt, are the only glue keeping you with him? If so, seperation will only provide the needed assurance that you can survive without him. That you've never really gotten much from him in the first place, at least for a long time.

When my wife and I were really struggling in reconciliation, after I had initially asked for a divorce, she began talking about a seperation. I told her honestly that our only hope of marriage was in being together, and actively growing closer. I had two decades of evidence to support that I was emotionally alone in the marriage, in some ways.

Just my thoughts. Understand the real motives for considering seperation, and compare them to what is REALLY keeping you married. If guilt and religious convictions are at the root of this, your desire to stay with him will not grow while you are apart, in my opinion.

I really hope you find peace in this difficult time.

tigger01

I have been posting now since mid-October. You, Halien, have continued to provide great advice/insight, and for that, I truly thank you!

It has been made clear to me (above posts, other sources, my counselor) that a trial separation, inevitably, leads to divorce. It’s been categorized as a “gradual move” towards divorce; time that allows a couple to “adjust” to the adjustment of divorce. I still, though, wanted other points of view, because I honestly felt that maybe a trial separation would allow me to really miss my husband; to realize that what I had (my marriage/my husband), I couldn’t live without; to realize that what I thought I wanted (to be on my own), was not what I wanted after all.

This confusion and inability to understand what I really want consumes me day in and day out. This is the reason why, on November 30, I was let go from a job that I held for nearly 17 years. I am a person with a strong work ethic, someone who always performed to best of my ability, did near-impeccable work, but was clearly unable to meet those expectations any longer due to the mess that I created in my personal life. My husband, however, saw this as a good thing, because he knew the stresses of my job, but also knew that I would never quit on my own. So here I sit, nearly six weeks later, with the same issue/unhappiness at hand; that being my personal life. And here I sit, afraid to make a change in my personal life, for, perhaps, the same reason …. I’m not a quitter. Maybe, deep down, I want my husband to “set me free,” as did my employer. I just don’t know.

As was mentioned by Halien, I have been in a cold marriage, but with a man who is good at heart. It’s the “good at heart” part that really makes it hard to move on, because he is, deep down, a wonderful, wonderful person! I know, too, that it IS POSSIBLE for a cold marriage to make an entire 360, but the truth is, I feel as if I checked out a long time ago. The feelings just aren’t there anymore. I think that my “pretending” everything was normal/healthy/happy within my marriage was altered when this OM entered the picture. An EA, however, was not something I could continue. In all honesty, it made me more miserable than it did happy. I’m not going to lie, however, and say that I don’t still think about him. I think about him a lot! I, however, do know that he’s not the one for me. If I were to divorce, would I date him? Probably so; if the timing were right, but again, I honestly don’t think I would ever end up with him, long-term.

So, knowing what I know …. if my husband and I make the decision to divorce, I would be on my own, without a job and leaving the marriage for “nobody” in particular. In a way, though, that doesn’t scare me. That, however, is what scares me …. the fact that it DOESN’T scare me!!

Halien asked about my beliefs. After doing some research, it is clearly stated by the Catholic Church that pornography is legitimate grounds for divorce. If this were a one-time thing, I would be more apt to question my motives, but the fact that pornography was an issue way back to when we were dating tells me that this clearly is a problem. I never agreed with it then, and I don’t agree with it now. He, however, continues to feel that it is normal; that all guys view it. Maybe so, but that doesn’t mean I have to agree with it, and when intimacy has been withheld from the marriage, that is NOT normal. I struggle, though, with the fact that God brought us together. Or didn't he? If I had mentioned the pornography to my parents way back then, or if I had mentioned the fact that he didn't want children to my parents way back then, would they have provided some personal insight? Would they have questioned my desire to marry him? This, too, is something I struggle with.

Well, that’s all for now. Thank you (everyone) for reading. Sadly, if this isn’t confusion, I don’t know what is!

Halien

I'm so sorry about the job loss on top of everything! When I went through a midlife crisis, I was asking so many of the same questions about my marriage. Of course, I was distracted. I had accomplished some things in the past that almost assured a great career. When VPs use these examples of my cost savings in their daily talking points, it helps the career. But my boss let me know in an off the record way that my distraction couldn't go on forever ... hint .. hint.

I don't want to derail your thread, but my feelings are very similar to yours. In my case, though, my wife feels like I was a really good husband for two decades, but she is extremely bitter about the last two years. Tries to deal with it, but it comes out sometimes.

Regarding your husband's coldness, there is a thought that I wanted to mention:
As a man who overcame past sexual abuse, which I believe you suspected as a part in what is going on with your husband, I think it is critical for you to try to be really clear on your DAILY expectations going forward, and tell him that you would try to re-channel the hope you once had. I wonder if he commits to a concrete plan, if this will give you just a little more hope, and maybe clarity?

Now, he's going to struggle, but regular feedback has to be a critical part of your agreement, if this makes sense. For example, if there is a week or so where he grows distant, and your needs for intimacy aren't being met, he has to be willing to listen to you, and at a bare minimum, express his desire to overcome it. Also at a bare minimum, he would have to want to reach out for close intimacy daily, even if it didn't lead to sex. What could have been happening to him is that his world feels so threatening, that he puts you outside that wall he has created. None of this has anything to do with you, if this is what is happening, but more of his own hypersensitivity to the thought of being somehow sexually flawed. I used to really dislike having people touch me. Its hard to believe that I became very clingy quickly, wanting to always have my hands on my wife (who happened to not be threatened by it). I think that expectation of daily closeness could help him. Otherwise, he gets trapped in avoidance.

In the past, Catherine answered one of your threads. Maybe she hasn't noticed this one, but I'd suggest PM'ing her. She's often given great advice to people who are going through struggles like yours, and has been known to let me know if she thinks I can help on others.

Catherine602

Hi Tigger
I am so glad you found the streath to break with the OM. Under the circumstances, it must have been very difficult. Now you are going to have to dig deep to make more changes.

I am so sorry about your job, this occurrence seems to be begging you to act.

I see things a little differntly. I see this current turmoil in your lives as being more about your husband than you. You have been standing in the way of your husbands opportunity for growth for 17 years.

Good boundaries, would have prevented this, but it is never to late. You got married, and in so doing, you have a reasonable expectations for a husband who is sincere in his commitment. He has not been sincere he left you early on and you allowed him to abandon his vow.

In essence, you have spent 17 years protecting him from public exposure of his addiction but you cannot protect him from the erosion of his inner being.

Your husband is addicted to watching other people have sex, an addiction that numbs him to the suffering of his wife, limits his life and probably fills him with shame and self-loathing.

He brought you down to a low level existence, despair and depression so he that he could engage in his addiction.

I cannot tell you what to do but I can ask you to consider looking at this from a completely different view. You fear hurting your husband because he is a good man. But that goodness has not touched you nor is it helping him.

He needs to want to get out of a very dark place and that will only happen when he is exposed fully to the consequences of his choices. He will is unlikely to reach a point that he will reach out while he hides in the comfort and falseness of a sham marriage.

Have faith - let him feel the reality of his existence, you are not abandoning him. Letting him go with love is not abandonment, but showing your faith that God will help him when he is ready to ask for help. Yes, he will suffer but in that suffering, he will have the opportunity to claim his birthright.

This seems like the worse time in your life but it may be an opportunity for your husband to reach out in faith, something he has not had to do. It is also forcing you to see the beauty of life and encouraging you to get out and live.

God has plan for you and your husband but you are both standing in each others way.

I don't think you need to decide what to do using a Catholic filter - go directly to Him and lay your troubles directly at his feet and then have faith and follow him.
__________________________________________________

John 5:4 "For whatever is born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world--our faith."

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"Hey some guys need a book to find the G-spot. It was intuitive for me. Some take the road less travelled." Enthropy 3000

This is me

17 years and just about over for us.

I am living proof that a trial seperation is a bad idea. She walked away 9 weeks ago and I am on the verge of telling her I am done. This has been a very rough couple of months and at this point I see no point in continuing.

You can not work on it while apart. Either work on the marriage while together, or end it. A trial seperation is just a path to divorce in my eyes.

tigger01

This is exactly what is happening right now. He is humiliated that I am now sharing this with my counselor and especially humiliated that my parents now know what "issues" we have had in our marriage. I, however, felt that I needed to be entirely honest with my parents. Yes, I became involved in an EA, but I truly believe that there were reasons why this reconnection escalated to the level that it did. However, telling my parents about my husband was the hardest thing for me to do. They are both devout Catholics, and as I shared this difficult information with them, I felt it necessary to keep reminding them that their son-in-law is still the wonderful, caring person that they know him to be.

That is what I am struggling with right now. He claims he doesn't want to lose me, but yet, he sees nothing wrong with viewing pornography. He doesn't feel that this is the reason our intimacy has dwindled down to nothing. I, however, truly believe that there is a direct correlation, and I, sadly, do not see this "interest" and/or "addiction" going away anytime soon. He needs to want to make that change, and I just don't see it happening. I, therefore, truly wonder if I can continue on in this type of marriage.


That's what scares me, though. What is God's will for this marriage? If a decision to divorce is made, is that the right decision? I'm just not confident enough in knowing yet what's the right decision.