WillK

Okay. I have to jump right in on this one, and I've read a post that seemed helpful - and I've gathered a user going by Entropy is a resident expert and I'd be very appreciative of his feedback.

My wife has reason to be seperating me, she's younger than me and has some growing up to do, and I've been guilty of behaviour problems that are common with marriage.

One of those problems is that we've become emotionally distant.

Let me make clear, that for reasons I won't get into, my wife insists she would never have a sexual affair because it would have consequences for our children who are age 5 & 6. I believe her and trust her completely.

But one of our son's friends has a dad with whom my wife has formed a friendship. I believe my wife did so to try to fill the emotional needs I should have been satisfying.

I've confronted my wife about whether she is having an emotional affair, and she says she is not.. I partially believe her, even though I feel as though she's getting emotional needs satisfied by him that she should get from me.

As a measure of what's going on, he frequently texts her. My wife doesn't text back very much, sometimes not at all.

I've gathered that he is separated from his wife.

More likely, I think, is that he is having an emotional affair type attachment to my wife, my wife may have the strength to resist the attachment (she says, and I believe, that he's not the type of person that appeals to my wife...)

I acknowledge it's okay for my wife to have a friend, an appropriate relationship shouldn't take any kind of secrecy to carry on and I would feel that if I can talk to this dude, then that's a sign there's nothing being hidden by my wife. For that matter, I probably should make more friends so I can talk with other people rather than overburden my wife by being the only one I can turn to.

Here's my question:
Would there be anything inappropriate about me talking with the dad of our son's friend? He's out waiting at school to pick up his son every day, and my wife is volunteering today - I'll be
picking up the kids after school.

Responses greatly appreciated!

iheartlife

Can you explain what this means? Are you separated, or has she asked for a separation?

WillK

She's getting a nearby apartment, and she's said she'll have the kids Sunday through Weds. and take them to school Thursday morning, I pick up the kids Thursday after school and keep them until Sunday morning.

She's spoke about this as something she needs to do to grow as a person - you see, she does have issues with dependency and she is capable of independence, but chooses not to be independent and enables that by blaming others for her state of dependency. Moving out will be good for this issue because she can't blame anyone and she'll be forced to learn that she has the capacity to be responsible for her own actions.

Also, our house is a very long story, suffice to say it needs to be gutted and while she's living in the apartment, I'll make major headway on remodelling in our house and after the 6 month lease the house will be a much better place - the house's issues are a huge source of anxiety for her.

Mind you, her schedule isn't going to leave her much free time. She's taking on Saturday work to pay for the apartment rent, already working Thursday and Friday, she goes to the gym, she'll have to do groceries cleaning and laundry in the time the kids are away, and she often volunteers and/or has marathon events that take up the whole day Saturday. (She works for her mom's business, so doing work is something she gets a lot of flexibility with, so I'm sure if she has a full day event Saturday she'll get 48 hours of work in somewhere in the Thursday-Friday time.)


I don't think it really is a detail that's significantly germain to the question - aside from the fact that I am trying to communicate that I'm confident the separation isn't the guaranteed end of our marriage. I know I have work to do and I am hopeful that I can do it with a good chance of saving our marriage.

This is just a matter of my wanting to ensure this friend is not going to be someone that comes between us.

So I'm thinking at the end of the school day, I'l just talk with this guy and start off just asking if we can talk, and maybe I'll try asking about his marriage and discussing that - and at an appropriate point, simply tell him that I want very much to save my own marriage, and I appreciate that he's been a friend to my wife, but I'm concerned that the friendship might be interfering with our healing process.

What I'd appreciate is some feedback if I'm going about this right or if there's anything I should do differently?

NextTimeAround

***I've confronted my wife about whether she is having an emotional affair, and she says she is not..***

What actions on her part have you noticed that make you suspect she is having an EA?

TBT

I don't get the dependency issues fully.As husband and wife shouldn't you be able to rely and depend on each other? Maybe I'm just missing something here.

__________________
"Truth is like the sun,you can shut it out for a time,but it ain't going away"-Elvis

WillK

Okay, for one thing I have to preface this by describing my problems. I've been very frustrated that she wants to move out, and I had a bit of a breakthrough Saturday evening after she went to sleep. Prior to this breakthrough, I would react to her in a manner that was defensive and reactive. After the breakthrough, I listen to her, acknowledge her, express my understanding and refrain from defensiveness and reaction that only serve to inflame the situation.

This one simple breakthrough has been wonderful at starting a dramatic turnaround of a deteriorating relationship.

So with that said, I've suspected an EA because of the deteriorating relationship, because she has been texting this guy frequently, because she's been slightly deceptive - mind you, she knows I look at texts, she doesn't object, and she doesn't say anything much back. But he has a nickname for her "freckles" (she's a redhead) that has been uncomfortable.

There's more to the story from our past before we had kids I won't get in to. Suffice to say we've been in counseling before and I've always been a LH.

strugglinghusband

You should ask Entropy, you may be able to PM him?
(I would ask 1st)

WillK

Okay I'll give an example. I've been between jobs for 4 weeks, I started a new job yesterday. One day a couple weeks back, while I'd finished my interviewing and was aware I'd be getting a job offer, in the days waiting for the new job to start I used the time to get some work on the house done - in particular, a large project involving digging out, mixing and pouring concrete in our house's crawlspace.

I was mixing and pouring concrete on this day, and I had rented a mixer so I wanted to get everything done by a certain time, I would need to return the mixer first thing in the morning to avoid additional rental charges. I needed to finish before a father-daughter event at school that evening. I was a little behind.

My wife wanted to order pizza. She got mad at me that I hadn't stopped working to order the pizza.

Without me around, she wouldn't have depended on me to do something she could have done herself.

It's probably not something that makes a lot of sense, you might have to just take my word for it. She's younger by 7 years than me and she's a youngest of 3 daughters, and she's never lived on her own - plus she's probably been babied a lot by her mom (and I'm probably guilty as well since we've been together). It's a little understandable, at 13 she was in a major car accident in which, besides her own injuries, her best friend was killed.

Toffer

Will,

Wake up and get your head out of you azz quickly! Do some reading in the Coping With Infidelity forum.

While you may be right that your wife isn't having an affair currently, she's waving a TON of red flags that she may be having one or is thinking about one

she's younger than me and has some growing up to do - Red Flag

he frequently texts her. My wife doesn't text back very much, sometimes not at all (that you know of. Is she possibly deleting texts?) - Red Flag

I've gathered that he is separated from his wife - HUGE Red Flag

I think, is that he is having an emotional affair type attachment to my wife. Another big Red Flag. There's an expression that cheaters allways "affair down" that means they usually trade down from their spouse in regards to looks, financial status and personality

She's getting a nearby apartment - Red Flag - She's getting almost free reign (yes, I saw the part about the kids) to explore her feelings for the other man (OM) and keep you on stand-by if it doesn;t work out. Plus you'll have the house all fixed up for her IF she comes back to you!

She is without the kids 4 days of the week - Red Flag - What's to prevent sleepovers on these days? How many hours does she normally work on Thu/Fri/Sat?/Sun?

I don't think it really is a detail that's significantly germain to the question - Red Flag - You're burying your head in the sand my friend and ignoring a very real possibility that your wife is cheating on you. You need to rule this out!

Do you have access to the cell phone account? If so, starting reviewing past invoices to see if there are alot of texts/phone calls to numbers you don't know. Does she keep her phone with her at all times? Is it password protected?

Does she have a PC that she will have with her in her apartment? If so, get a keylogger on it NOW before she moves! Also plant a voice activated recorder in her car under the seat with heavy duty velcro.

Again, while I may be WAY OFF base here, what could it hurt for you to check into this? It would at least put your mind at ease and tell you whether or not you truly have a shot a fixing your marriage.

TBT

The OM is recently separated and now your wife is separating from you.You're not comfortable with the level of emotion and frequency of texts between them and he even has a pet nickname for her.All that alone would make me want to verify what's really going on between them.Texting alone isn't the only way they have to communicate as being the father of your son's schoolmate,he is part and parcel of your immediate community.Talking to him may set your mind at ease,but if his intentions are to pursue your wife I don't think he would ever admit to it to you.jmo

__________________
"Truth is like the sun,you can shut it out for a time,but it ain't going away"-Elvis

Shaggy

Hell yes you should be worried. She's getting her own place, she is going have weekend nights free and open. She and he are already texting and sharing. Perfect storm situation.

Her moving to be independent sounds really fishy really. She's a mom and wife, those are lifetime commitments. How is living in her own place and free on Fri/sat nights going to grow her? You know his it will grow here, she's going to be free to party and meet guys socially.

What are the rules for this separation? What are the terms for ending it someday?

Honestly I think you are being payed here and it's not going to end well.
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WillK

Let me be clear - it is not that I haven't considered all of that. I have. I just want the discussion focussed on my specific question. Whether I speak with OM is my question because it is an area where I am uncertain about how to deal with the situation. Everything else, I am not asking about because I don't have uncertainty about dealing with it.

To answer a few questions - I review our cell phone online frequently to see if she's active with texting, I know and recognize OM's phone number, my wife has her phone with her during the day but leaves it out at night, she doesn't lock it. She leaves her texts on the phone. I compare her texts to the phone records, there are not texts that get deleted before I see them.

tacoma

Don`t talk to the OM.

Start checking your wifes communications.

If she`s already got a new place though I don`t see what difference it makes as it sounds like she`s done anyway.

tacoma

Ok then,

No do not speak to the Om because you have pretty good reason to think he`s doing "something" with your wife.
What motivation does he have to even be sincere about anything with you?
What motivation might he have to lie?

How would you know?

Anything you hear from the OM is just a possible emotional grenade.
It won`t help you at all.

iheartlife

WillK, this is a very bad situation. Very bad.

The biggest red flag--deceptiveness. The minute it's detected, THAT VERY MINUTE, you should consider this a five alarm fire. It is the gateway through which all affairs occur. It is the moment in which she is learning, before your very eyes, to lie to herself and to you.

This whole 'dependency' thing--that is called a rationalization.

She uses it as an excuse--to LIE to you and to herself--that she "needs" to "learn" how not to be dependent on you.

YOU use it too--because golly, she needs to learn how to order a pizza.

Please go back and read your description of the pizza example (and don't go telling us that it wasn't a very good example!). You were busy at work. She gets mad you didn't order a pizza--when she could easily order the pizza. In YOUR twisted logic, living on her own is going to....teach her to order a pizza when you're busy at work?

Let's say she is young and inexperienced and used to others doing her bidding (which means that she's accustomed, perhaps, to being indulged, since many a 13 year old orders their own pizza). Exactly how could she not learn this lesson while married to you and living in your house? You just showed us how. You cannot wait on her hand and foot (any more than I suspect you already do). Ergo, she needs to step up and become an adult--but all it takes is for you to stop doing things for her. While still married, and under the same roof. Independence learned.

---------------

I also need to comment on something else you said, which is you want your specific question answered. The forum can certainly help you answer specific questions. But because the people here (such as myself) have direct experience with affairs, including (like myself) emotional affairs in particular, posters tend to take different pieces of the issue and expand on them. These might initially seem to you not to be important or relevant. Please step back and take another look at what seems like extraneous advice. It is part of a larger picture that is going to help you with the larger problems in your marriage.