General Relationship DiscussionAlthough anyone can post anywhere on Talk About Marriage, this section is for people interested in general relationship and marriage advice.
My boyfriend and I have agreed to get married in January. We're keeping it a secret from family until the day of. We want to sign a prenup before being married. I'd like to do one on my own because there's a whole bunch of things that makes this complicated.
1. I live out of the country with my boyfriend.
2. We plan to get married in a state where we will not reside
3. Then we will file for a spouse visa for him and move back to the USA
So I have a few questions.
1. Which form should I fill out? The form for the state we will be married in, or the form for the state where we will primarily reside?
2. Would a prenup drawn up by a out-of-country lawyer even count in the USA?
3. Do we have to have lawyers review it? And would it even matter since they would be lawyers from a different country?
4. Would it be better for us to just get a postnup instead? I've read they're not held up as well in court.
Thanks so much for reading! I'm doing a lot of research but it's hard for me to find the answers to my sort of weird questions. I have a feeling asking a lawyer here would be no good anyways since they aren't familiar with USA law.
You are asking for legal advice, you'd do better with an online consultation with a US law firm familiar with immigration issues.
Why are you keeping your engagement a secret? If you are marrying strictly to provide him with a visa, you better get your stories straight or you could face some pretty harsh penalties for visa fraud.
You are asking for legal advice, you'd do better with an online consultation with a US law firm familiar with immigration issues.
Why are you keeping your engagement a secret? If you are marrying strictly to provide him with a visa, you better get your stories straight or you could face some pretty harsh penalties for visa fraud.
Of course everyone will assume this is for a visa. We have been living together for over a year and have been in a relationship for 3. We share finances, have mail, have traveled together, etc etc. I'm not here for advice about my visa, I know how to handle that and have plenty of evidence. Please don't jump to such quick judgement.
We're keeping our marriage a secret because we don't want anyone to feel left out because they weren't there. It will be a simple courthouse thing and once we move to the USA we plan to have a big ceremony and reception. But hardly anyone would be able to make it so in order to keep both families from going crazy for not being present, we're keeping it a secret.
I suppose if no one knows anything about prenups here I'll try to find out more information on my own. I just thought this would be a good resource to start with.
Enforcability varies alot from state to state. They're kind of like releases or waivers of liability; there's no such thing as iron-clad prenups because alot depends on the inclination of the courts to enforce one depending on the facts of the case and the desire to avoid an inequitable result.
You're going to have to see a lawyer for this one, but I'd say ideally you get pre-nups valid in both jurisdictions. For one thing, that will speak to the intent of the parties to make damn sure that they want this to be binding, and will likely help out with enforcability down the road if need be.
Thanks for the info! The problem is we'll only be in the USA for a week and that's probably not enough time to get a prenup written up.
I've been reading about postnups too. I think they would be a better fit because we just won't be in the USA long enough to get all this done before we get married. But I hear they're not as good as prenups. Does anyone have info about those?
And I won't apologize for defending my relationship. You have no idea how many times I've had that question asked and it really sucks. I don't like when people think we're getting married for a visa. I also don't think I replied in a volatile way, just stating facts. But anyways, I'm not here to defend my relationship, just get info.
The Prenup would have to be valid in the state or country where you are divorcing.
I'm surprised you would get defensive at a perfectly reasonable question considering
a) Marriage to you is a vehicle for citizenship for your guy
b) you want a prenup
c) you are not telling anyone about your wedding
All of those things point reasonably to a fake marriage... So the question deserves to be asked... And you should expect that question.
The Prenup would have to be valid in the state or country where you are divorcing.
I'm surprised you would get defensive at a perfectly reasonable question considering
a) Marriage to you is a vehicle for citizenship for your guy
b) you want a prenup
c) you are not telling anyone about your wedding
All of those things point reasonably to a fake marriage... So the question deserves to be asked... And you should expect that question.
Thanks for the info.
There's a stigma attached to prenups. We don't plan on using it. It's *just in case*. We're not marrying expecting to break up. We're marrying because we love each other.
And I'm sure none of you have any idea what actually goes into getting an immigrant visa. It takes about a year, involves mounds of paperwork and around $1000. He would NOT gain citizenship through a marriage, just a residency. Citizenship is a whole other deal. Big difference.
I just don't like how my relationship is being attacked so easily. People seem to jump to "green card spouse" as soon as a visa is mentioned. When I looked through older threads for prenup info I found a very similar attack on another member. I know fraud does exist, and it's a shame it does. It gives the rest of us real relationships a hard time. It's frustrating. But I don't really expect everyone to understand it. Especially those who have absolutely no experience with immigration.
Except for one thing... Iamaga wasn't attacking you, nor your relationship. She asked a legitimate question, as others have stated. The way you posed your question left it open to interpretation. She was asking to be sure you weren't asking for advice for an illegal situation. I am familiar with immigration laws and what it costs to gain citizenship. A good friend of mine went thru this about 3 or 4 years ago.
Anyway, you could have avoided being offended by Iamaga's question by simply stating something like "due to the costs of travel, we are not telling our family until after the fact, to avoid hard feelings."... and that would suffice in speaking to anyone, really. But the reality is that you really should pose this question to a lawyer.
Thanks for the info! The problem is we'll only be in the USA for a week and that's probably not enough time to get a prenup written up.
You can get a prenup written up without being in the country. Find a lawyer, have them draft it, and then send it to you. Once it is what the two of you need, then you can execute it. Your actual presence is not necessary to get it drawn up.
Alright, I'm not going to say anything else in regards to the green card or the comments made. Just getting off track.
I guess I'm seeing that it's best to speak to a lawyer. Does anyone know if lawyers give free consultations over the phone? I guess I could google around a bit. Like I said, we'll only be in the USA for one week and I don't think that's enough time to get together a full prenup.
Also, since we'll be marrying in a different state from where we plan to live, we should use a lawyer where we plan to live, right? It's just a lot of factors!
You can get a prenup written up without being in the country. Find a lawyer, have them draft it, and then send it to you. Once it is what the two of you need, then you can execute it. Your actual presence is not necessary to get it drawn up.
A friend recommended I use the website legal zoom. I looked and they quoted a prenup for $700. Does that seem about right? It seems so high to me. If that's what we have to pay it's fine, but it'd be nice if it was less. I honestly wasn't expecting anything over $300, but then again I've never done this before
There's a stigma attached to prenups. We don't plan on using it. It's *just in case*. We're not marrying expecting to break up. We're marrying because we love each other.
And I'm sure none of you have any idea what actually goes into getting an immigrant visa. It takes about a year, involves mounds of paperwork and around $1000. He would NOT gain citizenship through a marriage, just a residency. Citizenship is a whole other deal. Big difference.
I just don't like how my relationship is being attacked so easily. People seem to jump to "green card spouse" as soon as a visa is mentioned. When I looked through older threads for prenup info I found a very similar attack on another member. I know fraud does exist, and it's a shame it does. It gives the rest of us real relationships a hard time. It's frustrating. But I don't really expect everyone to understand it. Especially those who have absolutely no experience with immigration.
You do seem defensive about the immigration aspect. No one was attacking your relationship. Sheesh, we're just a bunch of strangers on the internet. We don't "know" you. If you can't handle simple questions from strangers on the internet, how are you planning to handle it when you talk to people in your family?
I actually know quite a bit of info about immigrant visas actually.
While he wouldn't gain citizenship automatically through marriage it's only a hop skip and jump to citizenship once he gets his permanent residency. I had a friend who married a man from another country. As soon as he gained his "Green Card" he divorced her. He got his citizenship too. I'm NOT saying that's what is happening to you. I'm pointing out that getting citizenship is pretty easy once you have the permanent residency and you're not a conditional permanent resident. At that point, he'd have to commit some heinous crime or leave the country for a really extended period of time to not gain citizenship.
Quote:
Originally Posted by swimmingaggie
A friend recommended I use the website legal zoom. I looked and they quoted a prenup for $700. Does that seem about right? It seems so high to me. If that's what we have to pay it's fine, but it'd be nice if it was less. I honestly wasn't expecting anything over $300, but then again I've never done this before
That's not expensive. I know some attorneys who charge $200-$300 an hour!
One last thing...to avoid problems down the road make sure both sides had the opportunity for independent legal representation. If he can say he didn't know what he was signing; it was under duress; he didn't have sufficient time to review it; he had language difficulties but no interpreter was provided for him or some other factor the courts use to declare prenups invalid, you'll be out of luck when it comes to enforcing it (of course you don't want to get to the point where the prenup is enforced).
3Likes
Prenup info 
We have been living together for over a year and have been in a relationship for 3. We share finances, have mail, have traveled together, etc etc. I'm not here for advice about my visa, I know how to handle that and have plenty of evidence. Please don't jump to such quick judgement.
