Unwillngly separated wife took kids need adv - Talk About Marriage
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post #1 of 34 (permalink) Old 03-16-2017, 06:02 PM Thread Starter
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Unwillngly separated wife took kids need adv

I apologize for the length of this post but I want to put as many details here because I really need help.

Have been married 9 yrs. W and I are both alcoholics, I am many years sober. We met 12y ago at a sober camping trip, dated, moved in and married. We agreed that it would be a sober relationship. I come from an abusive alcoholic home and I do not like drunk/drugged people in fact I have a visceral aversion to it. All was groovy for the first 3-4 years...

We moved to a different area due to my job and have 2 kids who are 5 and 8. Around 2010 my wife started drinking, and lying about it. I asked her to go back to AA which she did. She would put 5 or 6 months together and then I would catch her drunk again and she would deny. This happened several times. I also began going back to meetings @ her behest as she felt it could help me understand her better. She got heavily involved in AA, but still continued the sporadic drinking, and lying until confronted with hard evidence. I came to find out from a guy in her group that she had taken a 2-year coin, when she didn't even have 6 months to rub together. In addition, she had developed what i considered an inappropriate friendship ( I call it an EA, she denies) with another cat from her group. All of this took place around the same time, 3 years ago or so. I had threatened to leave a few times, once when I caught her driving drunk w/kids.

I told her I would not leave her b/c of drinking, but I cannot put up with the lying. I had a dark night of the soul about 2 years ago and I went into what I can only describe a jealous insanity, searched the entire house for evidence of infidelity as well as her computer and would try to see her phone often. I even read her AA 4th step inventory a big no-no but I was out of my mind. I did not find evidence of cheating but found many pills squirreled away in an old purse. I confronted her with all of this and of course she turned it around on me, how I violated her trust and safe space, I was controlling etc. I demanded NC with the AA guy which she said was unreasonable, so I backed off and let her talk to him which she immediately did (I monitored the cell phone bills) to the point that I said enough, no more contact with him. I also confronted him, and he said that he thought of her as a sister and had not romantic feelings for her. I talked to many other people who know both of them and they all said no way he would not do that and they never suspected anything btw them. I agreed to stop spying which I kept my word on for almost 1 year.

We were going to our (3rd) MC and I thought things were getting better. In July I congratulated her on a year of sobriety. I recently looked back at our texts from the summer and there was a lot of positivity, she saying she thinks we are in a good place, etc. We were set to go on vacation in August and I noticed her acting squirrely so I looked at her texts and there was one to this guy from the program "B" and she was asking him for Xanax (she had stopped taking it at my rq.) I didn't say anything so as to not ruin the vacation. The night before vacation I came upstairs 1230AM and she was gone, not outside smoking just simply gone. I text where u @ and she says down the street at "B"'s house he had a fight with his old lady and needs somebody to talk to. I says come home right now which she did. I told her that I saw the text about the Xanax and she denied it. She did admit to using cocaine for about a week in April, which was widely known among her AA friends but not to me. I asked why did you never tell me, I came and gave you flower and big congrats last month on a year clean/sober and you were lying AGAIN. We had a big fight and I was up until 3AM couldnt sleep.

Wake up 9:30 and she and the kids, and a lot of their stuff, is gone. call her, WTF? Says we are going on vacation. I says didn't you forget something? She said you told me the marriage was over so I go w/o you. I don't remember saying that but it is possible. Told her I didn't mean it. She says she needs a break from me, wants me to move out for 30d. I say no way. She said ok then I am moving to my parents. She never returned home from the vacation.

Here it is 7 months later and I cannot get straight answers from her. I have asked her to come home many times. She is not ready. We have done family events/Christmas together which is nice but I sense a kind of distance/coldness in her. She keeps saying how much she loves me but can't live together right now. Says things like she has spent so much time being a wife/mom that she lost herself; she has done so much for others that she has to take care of herself and find herself, find who she really is (isn't this what your 20s were for??)

Last month she invited me to come spend the weekend (in-laws in FL for winter). I go up there after work Friday and she is passed out, loaded to the gills, kids say oh mommy taking a nap. She got up for dinner, wound up having sex which I actually feel guilty about, and the next day I confronted her. She lied about it again until I told her I had found the booze. (it was hard liquor this time, she was normally a wino). She admitted it and I said you have to decide what you want. She basically said that she drank due to the stress of me coming and that she thinks that if she can't stay sober with me around then the relationship is not healthy, and we should call it quits. I agreed. I left that night with a heavy heart. I went home and packed up some of her stuff, mostly her family pictures etc and bagged it up as we were to meet at my mother's the next day for her birthday party.

She shows up at the party and I hand her the bag of stuff, and she asks why you giving me this? I says I cant look at this stuff anymore and you should have it. She says what are you talking about I need time. Me: we just agreed yesterday the marriage is over... She: I didn't mean it, I need time to think about things. I said ok (I don't want divorce).

She has been going to IC and we are scheduled to go together to the same therapist on the 28th where she is apparently planning to give me a list of conditions/requirements in order to get back together. She told me one of these is that I must accept that she is an alcoholic and will have relapses. I'm not sure if I can accept this, and I think she is setting herself (and me) up for the next drink.

I fluctuate between giving in on my positiion re: the drinking in order to save the family, or just calling it quits. My daughter told me last weekend she would rather live with me than mommy. I want my kids to have mommy and daddy together but I don't know if it is possible.

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post #2 of 34 (permalink) Old 03-16-2017, 06:32 PM
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Cool Re: Unwillngly separated wife took kids need adv

Time to get your legal representative/attorney involved!

He can find a remedy to get your kids back!

"To love another person is to see the face of God!" - Jean Valjean from Les Miserables

My Story! http://talkaboutmarriage.com/going-t...andonment.html
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post #3 of 34 (permalink) Old 03-16-2017, 06:36 PM
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Re: Unwillngly separated wife took kids need adv

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronald Lane View Post
I apologize for the length of this post but I want to put as many details here because I really need help.

Have been married 9 yrs. W and I are both alcoholics, I am many years sober. We met 12y ago at a sober camping trip, dated, moved in and married. We agreed that it would be a sober relationship. I come from an abusive alcoholic home and I do not like drunk/drugged people in fact I have a visceral aversion to it. All was groovy for the first 3-4 years...

We moved to a different area due to my job and have 2 kids who are 5 and 8. Around 2010 my wife started drinking, and lying about it. I asked her to go back to AA which she did. She would put 5 or 6 months together and then I would catch her drunk again and she would deny. This happened several times. I also began going back to meetings @ her behest as she felt it could help me understand her better. She got heavily involved in AA, but still continued the sporadic drinking, and lying until confronted with hard evidence. I came to find out from a guy in her group that she had taken a 2-year coin, when she didn't even have 6 months to rub together. In addition, she had developed what i considered an inappropriate friendship ( I call it an EA, she denies) with another cat from her group. All of this took place around the same time, 3 years ago or so. I had threatened to leave a few times, once when I caught her driving drunk w/kids.

I told her I would not leave her b/c of drinking, but I cannot put up with the lying. I had a dark night of the soul about 2 years ago and I went into what I can only describe a jealous insanity, searched the entire house for evidence of infidelity as well as her computer and would try to see her phone often. I even read her AA 4th step inventory a big no-no but I was out of my mind. I did not find evidence of cheating but found many pills squirreled away in an old purse. I confronted her with all of this and of course she turned it around on me, how I violated her trust and safe space, I was controlling etc. I demanded NC with the AA guy which she said was unreasonable, so I backed off and let her talk to him which she immediately did (I monitored the cell phone bills) to the point that I said enough, no more contact with him. I also confronted him, and he said that he thought of her as a sister and had not romantic feelings for her. I talked to many other people who know both of them and they all said no way he would not do that and they never suspected anything btw them. I agreed to stop spying which I kept my word on for almost 1 year.

Just because you found out doesn't mean it stopped. You trusted a cheater?

We were going to our (3rd) MC and I thought things were getting better. In July I congratulated her on a year of sobriety. I recently looked back at our texts from the summer and there was a lot of positivity, she saying she thinks we are in a good place, etc. We were set to go on vacation in August and I noticed her acting squirrely so I looked at her texts and there was one to this guy from the program "B" and she was asking him for Xanax (she had stopped taking it at my rq.) I didn't say anything so as to not ruin the vacation. The night before vacation I came upstairs 1230AM and she was gone, not outside smoking just simply gone. I text where u @ and she says down the street at "B"'s house he had a fight with his old lady and needs somebody to talk to. I says come home right now which she did. I told her that I saw the text about the Xanax and she denied it. She did admit to using cocaine for about a week in April, which was widely known among her AA friends but not to me. I asked why did you never tell me, I came and gave you flower and big congrats last month on a year clean/sober and you were lying AGAIN. We had a big fight and I was up until 3AM couldnt sleep.

If you check back I'll bet other man is in the picture and always was. It never ended. Review your phone records.

Wake up 9:30 and she and the kids, and a lot of their stuff, is gone. call her, WTF? Says we are going on vacation. I says didn't you forget something? She said you told me the marriage was over so I go w/o you. I don't remember saying that but it is possible. Told her I didn't mean it. She says she needs a break from me, wants me to move out for 30d. I say no way. She said ok then I am moving to my parents. She never returned home from the vacation.

Here it is 7 months later and I cannot get straight answers from her. I have asked her to come home many times. She is not ready. We have done family events/Christmas together which is nice but I sense a kind of distance/coldness in her. She keeps saying how much she loves me but can't live together right now. Says things like she has spent so much time being a wife/mom that she lost herself; she has done so much for others that she has to take care of herself and find herself, find who she really is (isn't this what your 20s were for??)

Typical "cheater script".

Last month she invited me to come spend the weekend (in-laws in FL for winter). I go up there after work Friday and she is passed out, loaded to the gills, kids say oh mommy taking a nap. She got up for dinner, wound up having sex which I actually feel guilty about, and the next day I confronted her. She lied about it again until I told her I had found the booze. (it was hard liquor this time, she was normally a wino). She admitted it and I said you have to decide what you want. She basically said that she drank due to the stress of me coming and that she thinks that if she can't stay sober with me around then the relationship is not healthy, and we should call it quits. I agreed. I left that night with a heavy heart. I went home and packed up some of her stuff, mostly her family pictures etc and bagged it up as we were to meet at my mother's the next day for her birthday party.

She shows up at the party and I hand her the bag of stuff, and she asks why you giving me this? I says I cant look at this stuff anymore and you should have it. She says what are you talking about I need time. Me: we just agreed yesterday the marriage is over... She: I didn't mean it, I need time to think about things. I said ok (I don't want divorce).

She has been going to IC and we are scheduled to go together to the same therapist on the 28th where she is apparently planning to give me a list of conditions/requirements in order to get back together. She told me one of these is that I must accept that she is an alcoholic and will have relapses. I'm not sure if I can accept this, and I think she is setting herself (and me) up for the next drink.

Just a lot of bull**** and excuses to do as she pleases.

I fluctuate between giving in on my positiion re: the drinking in order to save the family, or just calling it quits.

Giving in WILL destroy you and your family. You know better.

My daughter told me last weekend she would rather live with me than mommy. I want my kids to have mommy and daddy together but I don't know if it is possible.

If she continues to drink around you you'll fall off the wagon too. You are married to a drunk and cheater. If you can't keep your boundaries she'll ruin your life too. She'll cake eat until stop letting her.
You can't fix her or make her do anything but she has no right to take your kids from you.

File for divorce. She'll either fix herself and come along or she won't. You can stop it or slow it down if she changes her way.

Doing what you're doing which has been nothing won't get you much. As you've seen.

Last edited by Marc878; 03-16-2017 at 06:43 PM.
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post #4 of 34 (permalink) Old 03-16-2017, 06:39 PM
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Re: Unwillngly separated wife took kids need adv

Welcome to the forum, sorrry for the reasons you found yourself here.

I have zero experience with substance abuse, so I can't comment on that portion, but others will be along to help you soon. There is also a board that deals with addictions, and you may find some help on there also.

As much as I always want families to stay together if possible, both marriage mates have to want to be in the marriage. Due to addiction and other factors, it sounds like your wife doesn't really want to, or perhaps is incapable of doing so.

You really have to think about your children's safety. If she has been known to drive drunk with them in a car, and be passed out on drugs and/or booze while she is supposed to be parenting, you have problems with hair on them! Imagine if one or all of your children were hurt or killed during one of her binges. You would never get over that.

IMO you need to immediately file for divorce, and get full custody. I hope your situation improves and your family can remain as undamaged as possible.

Ciao,

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post #5 of 34 (permalink) Old 03-16-2017, 06:56 PM
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Re: Unwillngly separated wife took kids need adv

When your wife left, she took your children with her. You could have stopped her from taking your children. She does not sound like someone who should have primary custody of the children.

Right now you have 100% legal right to go get your children and bring them back to the family home. Go see a lawyer and get it set up so that you get your children and then file in your state for your to have primary custody. That way she cannot make unilateral decisions to just run off and take the children out of their family home.

I know you are having problems with your wife. But she's a adult making bad choices. Your focus really needs to be no your children first. The rely on you to keep them safe. They cannot make their own choices.

You can prove her drug use by asking the court to order her to take a drug test. And that the court not allow her unsupervised visitation until she does pass drugs tests.
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post #6 of 34 (permalink) Old 03-16-2017, 06:58 PM
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Re: Unwillngly separated wife took kids need adv

You cannot change or fix her. She has to do that herself. You know that from AA, right?

The best thing you can do for her is to not enable her further by sticking around while she "decides what she wants". What she is doing is NOT okay. She is seriously risking the lives of your children! She should absolutely NOT have custody. The first time you found her driving them around while she was drunk should have been the LAST time she was ever left alone with then, unless you were sure she was sober long-term. And she definitely wasn't!

Just wow. This is such a scary and sad situation.

You need to say, This stops here. This is NOT what I signed up for. You are risking the lives of our children and I will not allow it.

You need to tell her you are leaving the marriage, and then proceed to do it. Perhaps that will be rock-bottom enough for her to wake up. Perhaps it won't. But it's your only chance, and it's what you absolutely HAVE to do to protect your kids.

Don't let people become a priority in your life when you're just an option in theirs.
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post #7 of 34 (permalink) Old 03-17-2017, 09:42 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Unwillngly separated wife took kids need adv

Thank you all for the responses, they are hard truths that I have perhaps been hiding from, well today I am going to call a divorce/mediation lawyer, I have had it and I will explain why.

I had asked my wife to come with the kids for the weekend so we could spend family time together. She said she is not ready for that and needs "another week". Wednesday she told me her sponsor asked her to go on a retreat this weekend. I said what kind of retreat, where, etc? She doesnt have details yet. Thursday she said she has decided to go on retreat, and her sponsor is driving her, she will pick W up tomorrow at 3, can I come get the kids. I says thats great, what kind of retreat, and where is it? W: I didn't ask the details it's a Chopra spiritual retreat, somewhere in North (State).

Now I am suspicious, so I look at the last 90 days of phone bills, something I had promised not to do, and that I actually held to promise for almost 1 year. I find many, many texts btw her and an ex-boyfriend of hers, a guy I know, who was at our wedding, and who she has maintained a friendship with, which I had not problem with when we were together and he was 80 miles away. Nice guy, single, musician, motorcycle, etc, living the dream. Well these texts were many (500+/month) and at late hours, including some 2-3 AM. This is not good, and now I dont believe that she is planning to go on any spiritual retreat.

So last night W txt: will you pick up the kids? Me: Yes, and I would also like to meet your sponsor, if you don't mind.

W: Someday you will

I: Tomorrow no good?

W: Idk? I'll see what her plans are. It's not like I have never asked to meet your sponsor. It's called trust!

I: Oh I thought you said her plans were to pick you up at 3? Sry if I misunderstood.

W: (12 minutes later) I don't think you misunderstood but this is what proves you don't trust me. You may never and for that I take sole responsibility. I have never asked to meet with your sponsor because I have always trusted you.
[many lines of blah blah you never trusted me, all I have done is support you etc] Thank you for your support but I'll bow out of the retreat. It was a special opportunity.

I: Why?

W: Because I'm not willing to be treated like this anymore.

I: Why are you cancelling retreat?

W: Not willing to deal with this. Maybe next weekend.

W: This is exactly the problem!

This morning W: Happy St. Patric's day! The kids and I have stuff do to this weekend so I'll just stay with them. Have a good weekend.

I: k

W: [cute pics of kids with their green outfits] have a good day

I: ty for pics

So, clearly, she had some kind of plans for the weekend other than spirituality. If it was just drinking I don't think there would be reason to cook up a story about going away on retreat. There has been too much lying and deception, and at this point I don't even care if she cheated, or at least I don't care to try to find out because I can't take any more. I was going to try 180 but I think it has moved beyond that. I am calling the mediation/div attorney right now. She had already told me I could buy out her share of the house , we'll see if she sticks to that. I want to try the mediation route to save $ and to keep it friendly as possible. I still love her. I will let you know what happens. Thanks so much for your thoughts. This is killing me.
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post #8 of 34 (permalink) Old 03-17-2017, 09:53 AM
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Re: Unwillngly separated wife took kids need adv

You're a doormat. Why do you feel bad to check on your wife's phone bill? I honestly don't get why you care, you should have filed divorce papers months ago. Do you not think you can do better than a lying drunk that does cocaine and other drugs? How did you let her have the kids? I don't know how you sleep at night. You should be going to war, blowing up her little world. Do you support her financially?

Get a bulldog attorney that will make her life miserable. You'll need $5k for the retainer and be able to pay the invoices each month.

Keep posting here, we'll keep you going on the right track. Divorce is not the end of the world. It's a new beginning, a re-do. Start now. Time will fly and in a year, you'll be in a much better place.
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post #9 of 34 (permalink) Old 03-17-2017, 10:27 AM
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Re: Unwillngly separated wife took kids need adv

OP The only way to deal with a woman like your wife is to file for divorce... also I know you love her but she's not a good woman she's a very broken woman and OP you seem like you are a good guy... there's a woman out there that is gonna love you for who you are. you deserve that kind of love... this woman is definitely dealing with some mental issues. Not even AA is capable of finding a solution for her problems. She incapable of being honest with her self. Most likely she needs to seen by psychiatrist that could prescribe psychiatric medication... there's a good chance she'll be diagnosed as BPD (borderline personality disorder) from what I understand there's really no treatment. The best thing for you is to file for divorce ASAP. Also you need to be strong for your kids because they are going to need you.

Spartans lay down your weapons.! "Persian come and get them"

Last edited by Sparta; 03-19-2017 at 05:54 AM.
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post #10 of 34 (permalink) Old 03-17-2017, 10:29 AM
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Re: Unwillngly separated wife took kids need adv

Ronald it sounds like you have to stop this cat and mouse game, its been going on to long and yes you don't trust her because she has given you every reason not to trust her...at this point your Marriage is a joke, and she is playing you...file and keep records of everything, at this point your responsible for those kids well being, not for her, she is not willing to move forward with this marriage, and she keep blame shifting you. and by the way expose expose expose....and get every little detail you can because she will fight you tooth and nail once she gets served.

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post #11 of 34 (permalink) Old 03-17-2017, 12:23 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Unwillngly separated wife took kids need adv

Called W told her things didn't add up and it is now her last chance to come clean with everything. Says she was going on retreat, I have no right to ask to meet her sponsor and she did not want to give that to me because I should just trust her. Didn't say I looked at phone bill but asked about relationship with the dude. She says the guy is just her dear friend of 20 years nothing is going on. Final answer? Yes. Ok I'm done, I cannot live like this anymore. Will you go to mediator?

She agreed to go to mediator. Then texts back and says let me look into mediators. I says I already have one, we go together or I file on my own, your choice. I Said I am trying to make it as friendly and inexpensive as possible for us and the kids, I do not want to waste 1000s of $. No response yet. I will make the appointment next week, we will see if she attends. At this point I think I have just enough money to buy her out, pay off most of the house, and still be able to afford to live in it with the child support etc. Cant afford 20k + for legal bills, she has over 100k inheritance $ that she "wisely" kept separate from me. Custody of the kids is a long shot, in this state the mother basically has to be caught/arrested multiple times DWI etc for the father to get custody. I have no evidence, no proofs of anything as far as her drinking/drugs. I am hoping that the mediation goes smoothly. She has never been a greedy/materialistic person. Thank you again for support and insight.
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post #12 of 34 (permalink) Old 03-17-2017, 12:29 PM
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Re: Unwillngly separated wife took kids need adv

If she fails to give you a fair divorce, then you have your attorney request a court ordered random drug test. One failed drug test, you'll have 100% custody.

Worst case scenario, you'll get 50/50 custody. Don't settle for less.

Hit the gym 5x a week. Lift weights. Eat and drink healthy. Start casual dating when you feel like it, it will boost your self confidence and distract you from the divorce process. Don't get serious and make sure you let them know. Plenty of girls out there looking to get laid and nothing more. It's like being in high school/college all over again, but better.
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post #13 of 34 (permalink) Old 03-17-2017, 12:57 PM
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Re: Unwillngly separated wife took kids need adv

Obviously she is and always has been unstable. Taking her back would mean that you would have to devote lots of time taking more BS from her, wondering whether she's other affairs and bailing her out of trouble. Not the best role model for the kids. I would divorce her and bring all the evidence about her alcoholism to the court, particularly the time when she was driving drunk with the kids in the car and go for full custody. She's danger to both you and your kids.

"I've paid double for every transgression I've ever made and that motel and that boat are little to ask for"
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post #14 of 34 (permalink) Old 03-17-2017, 01:31 PM
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Re: Unwillngly separated wife took kids need adv

OP you need to think more about what you can use as evidence of her alcoholism and drug abuse. Your children do not need to be around this terrible behavior. You don't want to take the risk of them adopting her addictive tendencies and mimicking her use of alcohol/drugs as a coping mechanism.

And you already said your daughter indicated she would rather be with you. Protect them man! She's only going to get worse as the divorce progresses. They're not going to enjoy having to go over to her house and they might resent you for not fighting harder to limit their court-ordered time with her.
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post #15 of 34 (permalink) Old 03-17-2017, 02:02 PM
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Re: Unwillngly separated wife took kids need adv

I think you seems to be missing the big picture in all of this. It's not about when your wife will come home, or if she cheated with an ex boyfriend or a random man she met at AA or about the texts she has been sending to an exboyfriend all hours of the night.

What this is all about is that your children are in the primary custody of an alcoholic, who has admitted to doing cocaine and has or is on xanax.

When are you going to start worrying about the damage being done to your children, and stop worrying about a cheating, alcoholic, drug using woman who has left you and moved out. Take custody of your kids again, and write this woman off. I fear she may need a large wake up call to bring her back on the path she should be on. Maybe the wake up call of losing her husband and her children will work but until she cleans her act up, you need to put your children's safety first.

I hope this all works out for you, I grew up with an alcoholic and let me tell you the damage it has inflicted on me has created problems for me in my teenage years and adult years. I'm sure you have had similar problem given your upbringing with alcoholic parents. Don't repeat this cycle, break it for your kids sake.
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