The ABANDONMENT ruined me. I had issues that I THOUGHT I had dealt with. NOT from divorce of my parents, but from being ABANDONED and thrown away like trash by not 1, but BOTH dads.
THAT effed me up. Not the divorce.
I have had therapy for the abandonment issues because they almost ruined my marriage. The effects of being abandon puts you in constant survival mode...never letting your guard down...always waiting for your mate to leave or let you go. That's how i lived my first 2 years of marriage. Always expecting him to leave. And then he did. And I realized my worst fear...and I survived.
and even though he moved out because of my behaviour caused by my issues, he helped me work through them.
I have (and still struggle with, unfortunately) the abandonment issues, too. For me, it was partially the divorce itself...not helped by the way in which it was handled. I FELT abandoned even if neither of my parents intended to make me feel that way. But it was also the subsequent roller coaster of my childhood that was only triggered by the divorce that caused the abandonment issues. My mom's serial boyfriends, being left with a couple of unsavory babysitters - one of whom was an abusive 14-year-old girl - while she went out to enjoy her newfound independence. There was also a huge socioeconomic difference between my old life with both mom and dad and my new life living mostly with my mom. It was this event cascade that started with the divorce and permanently changed the course of my life.
I felt abandoned by my dad when my stepmom came into the picture almost right away while I was still trying to adjust to the divorce. I missed him and the security of my parents being together, but at least I still got to live in my family home and do those little father-daughter rituals with him every other weekend (being read stories at bedtime, watching Dukes of Hazzard over a shared bowl of cheese grits lol)...until she came along months later and changed anything left in my life that was familiar and comforting to me. It didn't help that she was my maternal aunt.
Yea, i can see that. Children internalize things so much differently than adults. I had to basically comfort my inner child and let her know she was no longer needed to protect me...because when she ran my emotions and life, it was fight or flight.
My mom never dated again. I don't understand why, but she had 3 horrible marriages, so i get it. That being said, she was VERY stable for me and raised me and put her life aside. now she's livin it up...traveling, being gramma, has friends. it's good.
My stepdad didn't date until I was a late teen. I didn't care that he got married again, it was the fact that he just let me go. We barely spoke for 10 years after that, and now he's dead.
Are you getting help for those issues? Abandonment issues run deep and until you get to the root and realize you don't need that old way of coping, you'll forever repeat the pattern...I have a string of people I 'effed over' before they could eff me over. Not cool.
Then there's people like my husband whose parents SHOULD have divorced...but didn't. Instead they stay together and it's unbearable for the children, forever tainting the idea of marriage...which is what Hubs has worked through.
No matter what though, people grow up with some baggage. Best we can do is love our children, support them, answer their questions and remind them it's not their fault.
Yea, i can see that. Children internalize things so much differently than adults. I had to basically comfort my inner child and let her know she was no longer needed to protect me...because when she ran my emotions and life, it was fight or flight.
My mom never dated again. I don't understand why, but she had 3 horrible marriages, so i get it. That being said, she was VERY stable for me and raised me and put her life aside. now she's livin it up...traveling, being gramma, has friends. it's good.
My stepdad didn't date until I was a late teen. I didn't care that he got married again, it was the fact that he just let me go. We barely spoke for 10 years after that, and now he's dead.
Are you getting help for those issues? Abandonment issues run deep and until you get to the root and realize you don't need that old way of coping, you'll forever repeat the pattern...I have a string of people I 'effed over' before they could eff me over. Not cool.
Then there's people like my husband whose parents SHOULD have divorced...but didn't. Instead they stay together and it's unbearable for the children, forever tainting the idea of marriage...which is what Hubs has worked through.
No matter what though, people grow up with some baggage. Best we can do is love our children, support them, answer their questions and remind them it's not their fault.
Fight or flight... that's exactly how it is. I haven't had as much help for it as I need. I recognized the issues years ago, but it's like I was just hoping being aware of them would somehow be enough to stop repeating that pattern you talked about. It's not. I mean, it has helped significantly in that I at least see the pattern and am often able to stop it halfway through repeating it or, if I'm lucky (and if the people who love me are lucky), even right as it starts...but there are still so many times when I don't see it until after the damage is done. Or I kinda sorta recognize it in the middle of the behavior, but the emotions are too far gone by then and too hard to control.
These issues recently cropped up again in my relationship... my partner and I reconciled a few months ago after a long separation and we're really trying hard to create a better relationship. I'm trying to work on me, but most of it is self help at this point as my insurance doesn't cover any type of therapy. Self help is farrr from ideal for this type of problem, so my progress is not as much as I'd like. The good thing is that my partner, like your husband, is also understanding. We are looking for ways to decrease our monthly expenses in order to afford therapy soon. Please keep your fingers crossed for me that we can manage it somehow!
I grew up living with my mom and never knowing my dad until I helped get them back together at 21. Even though I didn't get a chance to know him before, I know it screwed my up! I never got a chance to grow emotionally lose to another father figure or any of the men and women my mother dated. And as a result I turned into a mamma's boy wimp and hated my dad. It doesn't matter which parents have custody the children that live with them will adopt their views and take their side.
My STBXW also grew up with family problems with an emotional abusive and adulterous father, and a depressed distant mother. No suprise there when found out how codependent she was and that cheating ways run in the family. She also was closer to her mother except every time her dad left to screw over the poor family, she blamed herself for not being the daughter he wanted. It was really sad hearing how she was his favorite until he cheated and emotionally checked out but still hung around. I mean sleeping on the sofa and drinking his @$$ off everynight, and ignoring the women of the house.
I have done a great deal of therapy since I was a child and recent MC. But nothing prepared me for my childish parents trying to call me so they could drag me into their fight. Don't let a therapist who gets paid to make you feel better step over your red flags and fill your head with crap. It is true that the healthier your relationship with your ex is, the better your children will cope with this. However, that's just not going to happen in every case. You both need time to cool off and being forced into socially awkward situations with your ex will only cause problems. If you have to set up an arrangement where you don't have to see or speak to your ex for visitation rights until you are ready. Give it a year or two to calm down and see that you are better of without the dependency close relationships encourage and how you don't need him to be happy, but you don't have to avoid him to be at peace of mind. You don't have to fear being dependent again, but it will help you far more in the future to establish interdepentent tendencies and not enable people to cross cetain boundaries again and again. To put it another way, you punish the bad and reward the good.... and never chase anyone who makes it clear they don't want you.
What really helped me was to learn about relationships through books and experiences. You see the first relationships we form in life with our mothers and fathers, twins, or emotionally closer care-takers sets the bar for our other relationships later on. As I see it Freud was partially right in that you seek the emotional support similar to what you had when growing up, not that you want to sleep with your opposit sex parent. And you adopt the coping techniques to soothe yourself and carry those with you into adulthood. So if you learned that being emotionally distant when your parents where fighting helped you avoid feeling stressed, you'll use distancing to potect yourself in conflicts with marriage to avoid feeling responsble or guilty. Like wise codependent good girls and guys will try to avoid conflict or settle differences ASAP and risk others losing respect for them to keep things peaceful. Except the same feeling of contempt and guilt will arise and eventually the more extreme people will seek out unhealthy, emotionally dependant, addicted care-taker, and abusive relationships. But all of these re learne traits that can b unlearned over time.
See if any of this sounds familiar for you or your partner for at leat 80% of the time. There's nothing wrong with being needy towards each other at times but constant codependency hurts you more in the end. The Intuitive Self - Author - Bill Taggart
What really helped me was to learn about relationships through books and experiences. You see the first relationships we form in life with our mothers and fathers, twins, or emotionally closer care-takers sets the bar for our other relationships later on. As I see it Freud was partially right in that you seek the emotional support similar to what you had when growing up, not that you want to sleep with your opposit sex parent. And you adopt the coping techniques to soothe yourself and carry those with you into adulthood.
I agree with this, and this is why parents need to stay on the look-out for childrens' mental health after divorce. Kids only have so much coping capacity, and what they can handle varies by child. You always hear how "adaptable" they are. Sure, they'll adapt...but often it's by developing negative coping mechanisms after their usual, healthier ones are exhausted.
My behavior changed after my parent's divorce. They also separated my big brother and me...Dad took him, Mom took me (Thank God you don't see parents divvying up kids like furniture much anymore these days!). He was 7 years older and like most big brothers, sort of played a protector role for me. My two (and only) best friends at school both happened to move away as my parents were separating. I felt totally alone. I was already naturally shy, but grew more introverted than ever. I started eating to fill an emotional void and went from a skinny little thing at age 5 to the chubby girl at school for a few years. I started flipping out - I'm talking clawing, biting, screaming, kicking flipping out - whenever my parents tried to discipline me (this may have been related to the "discipline" from the babysitter and not the divorce itself though). I started having attachment issues with my mother, crying and making her late to work every day because I didn't want to get out of the car to go to school.
It was like nobody noticed. Or, rather, they noticed when the behavior got bad enough, but only to label me "bad" (funny, I had always been good before, if a little feisty) for the behavior, not recognizing any of the root causes or getting me any help. My parents were too distracted with their new lives.
OP, you are not that way. You've already recognized the trouble your son had 6 months ago when there was talk of separation. Just keep a close eye on him, make sure he adjusts (it will take time) and that his coping skills are not overwhelmed. Keep his life as stable as you can make it despite whatever your wife does. And yes, try to be civil to your ex when having to deal with her regarding your child, especially in front of him. Even if you have to bite your tongue 'til it's bloody. Even if you have to hold it all in and then vent it all to us later when your child is asleep. This doesn't mean letting her cross personal boundaries (which you definitely will need to stay sane), but you can be distantly friendly and not overtly angry in your interactions.
OP, you are not that way. You've already recognized the trouble your son had 6 months ago when there was talk of separation. Just keep a close eye on him, make sure he adjusts (it will take time) and that his coping skills are not overwhelmed. Keep his life as stable as you can make it despite whatever your wife does. And yes, try to be civil to your ex when having to deal with her regarding your child, especially in front of him. Even if you have to bite your tongue 'til it's bloody. Even if you have to hold it all in and then vent it all to us later when your child is asleep. This doesn't mean letting her cross personal boundaries (which you definitely will need to stay sane), but you can be distantly friendly and not overtly angry in your interactions.
I call this "passing the marshmallow test"
And if you can remember to be kind over being honest, you'll live a much happier life than you would bruding over and fighting with your ex. Save your freakouts for the treadmill and fill your emotional need with people and not.... junk food, bad and meaningless relationships, hoarding, pets, drugs, chocolate,or alcohol.
You're not alone there 3LC, I was obese my entire life until I lost 75lbs at 19 before I joined the Navy. There I still used food a my coping tool and ballooned up nicely. Now that I'm on mood stailizers and utilize intermittent fasting I don't gain weight like I used to. I'm still chunky, but after almost a year of serious lifting and diet.... aside from occasional junk food once in a while (dorrito's supreme tacos, pizza, donuts) I'm more muscular and 52 lbs lighter.
Yep, that's another thing, only set to get worse as they grow - playing one against the other. Even when the parents are completely amicable, this is bound to happen. New partners etc...will only exacerbate it. While some divorces are necessary, I think these whole "I'm sooo unhappy" cases (when you've got the world, basically) are just complete baloney; a pathetic blight on a society who's really got it far too easy and watches far too much Entertainment Tonight.
I think this is true for my situation. Of course, I realize I contributed to the overall failure of the marriage. But, now, I realize it. I am determined to change and better myself. My wife doesn't have faith that my changes would last. She's too afraid. And, she doesn't love me enough to stick it out and try.
Meanwhile, she loves her independence, which at this time, involves going out with her married girlfriends to concerts, movies, dinners, and exercise classes. Wow. I lost out to that. As long as I'm away, her misery no longer exists.
TBH, I don't know what she's looking for. I think she's in a fog that's been perpetuated by her friends, entertainment tonight, and an unfulfilling marriage. Instead of working on herself and the marriage and commiting to me, she is content at being alone.
And being this way, despite our 2 young children. Just more burden for her to carry.
If she does meet someone down the road, most likely it will be a divorcee with children, we will then deal with new sets of issues. She will be leaving one (our marriage and children) and opening up another (new man, his children, mixed families).
My son was only 1 year old when his dad and I separated and then divorced. He doesn't even remember us together, but he still has been greatly affected by it. He's 15 now, and we actually just had a candid conversation about this topic a few weeks ago. I forget how it even came up, but he was very honest about how being a child of divorce has affected him in a negative way.
To contrast, I was 5 when my parents separated. I do remember them together. They fought often near the end. One of my earliest memories is being held by my mom and them arguing and me putting one hand on each of their chests and trying to push them away from each other... not because they were getting physical, but because I just wanted it to stop.
However, I also have many good memories of my life when my parents were together. I remember feeling a sense of security then (taken totally for granted at the time) that I never felt after their divorce. My mom is the one who introduced the reasoning of, "Trust me, you will be better off and happier with us divorced than if we were still together and fighting all the time," to me. I bought it the way a child that age will buy anything a parent tells them. I even regurgitated it to others who expressed sympathy over my parents being divorced throughout my childhood and teenage years.
But guess what? It wasn't true. It was so, so not true. I never even came to terms with how it affected me until adulthood. I honestly believe now that divorce carries a negative impact that will be felt by children in one way or another throughout the rest of their lives. I think that negative impact can be mitigated by many factors, especially the way the parents handle the divorce and how they co-parent after. I'm sure a lot of it also depends on the child's innate personality. But there's a negative impact, regardless. Whether that outweighs the negative impact on the child from staying in a high-conflict marriage, I don't know. I know sometimes it comes down to choosing the lesser of two evils, but IMO, divorce is pretty damn evil for kids, so it would have to be an incredibly bad marriage.
I can vouch for the negative impact of divorce that lasts into adulthood. Happened to me.
My wife is an only child whose parents are still married after 40 some years.
I tried to explain all of this to her several times. But, she is completely sold into the "I need to be happy alone or with someone else rather than to be married to you". Even though we had the upper middle class life, even though there have been no blatant issues (arguing, abuse, affairs, etc.).
She is sold on the premise that as long as the 2 of us are on good terms, our children will be fine. Any argument against that will be labeled as selfish, stubborn, etc.
I can't argue past that line of defense. Our MC couldn't bring her past that line of defense.
This is all about her and her not feeling the love thing.
I can vouch for the negative impact of divorce that lasts into adulthood. Happened to me.
My wife is an only child whose parents are still married after 40 some years.
I tried to explain all of this to her several times. But, she is completely sold into the "I need to be happy alone or with someone else rather than to be married to you". Even though we had the upper middle class life, even though there have been no blatant issues (arguing, abuse, affairs, etc.).
She is sold on the premise that as long as the 2 of us are on good terms, our children will be fine. Any argument against that will be labeled as selfish, stubborn, etc.
I can't argue past that line of defense. Our MC couldn't bring her past that line of defense.
This is all about her and her not feeling the love thing.
I can totally empathize. My divorce was not my choice, either. My husband wanted to go out and be young and party more instead of being married. He actually gave that as the reason, so they're not my words. However, our marriage was never a good idea and nowhere near as stable as yours. We were both extremely young. I made a bad choice in marrying him, but because of my own experiences with divorced parents, I think I would have stayed indefinitely because I never wanted that for my child. But since I think it would have ended anyway eventually, I'm grateful now that it happened early on before we wasted too much time and before our son got older. It still affected him (and continues to), but I don't think it's as bad as it would have been.
I am always on the side of the children in a divorce. Whoever's decision it is, it's certainly not theirs. I get very angry when I see the parents putting the child in the middle, or - and this can be equally bad - simply ignoring the effects on the child like they don't exist out of selfishness or ambivalence. Kids need stability. This is why I love the new "nesting" trend in co-parenting, where the parents are the ones to switch homes and the kids get to stay in the family home. After all, they didn't ask for this...why should they be paying so much for it?
I`ve never known a kid who wasn`t traumatized and messed up to some extent by their parents divorce well into adulthood.
Granted that`s only 6 kids known close as family but all of them are/were messed up by the experience.
I`m not saying staying for the kids is right, I`m just saying truth should be outed on this subject.
Kids NEVER take their parents splitting without some serious long lasting emotional turmoil
I`ll add a caveat to this eariel post of mine.
The experiences I`ve been involved with concerning children of divorce were all personal and familial.
However, as That_Girl has said they also involved fatherly abandonment.
She is undoubtedly right that this is a more serious harm than the actual divorce itself and may be coloring my view due to personal involvement.
I think this is true for my situation. Of course, I realize I contributed to the overall failure of the marriage. But, now, I realize it. I am determined to change and better myself. My wife doesn't have faith that my changes would last. She's too afraid. And, she doesn't love me enough to stick it out and try.
Exactly the same here. We had hours of chats about our mutual failings. Nowadays however, I'm not inclined to changing/bettering myself (for her, anyway). I always accepted who she was; not the other way round it seems. So I'm totally done playing that "Beating myself up" game - whichever way you skin it, she's the quitter, not me.
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Originally Posted by Jayb
Meanwhile, she loves her independence, which at this time, involves going out with her married girlfriends to concerts, movies, dinners, and exercise classes. Wow. I lost out to that. As long as I'm away, her misery no longer exists.
TBH, I don't know what she's looking for. I think she's in a fog that's been perpetuated by her friends, entertainment tonight, and an unfulfilling marriage. Instead of working on herself and the marriage and commiting to me, she is content at being alone.
And being this way, despite our 2 young children. Just more burden for her to carry.
Again, same thing here. To combat this, I took a leaf straight out of her book...because when I put my mind to it, I can party like the best of 'em....and I have done, over the last 6 weeks or so and its been a blast. But....for me, it always comes back round to our daughter. Little things she says and does, like the one I mentioned earlier - while my stbx refuses to let herself see it, I know our little girl wants us together as a family. Not this pseudo family we've become. I've only been acting like I have because of my attempts to get a grip of the situation that was forced upon me - I'd never have carried on the way I have been doing lately if she hadn't put the hammer down on the marriage.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jayb
If she does meet someone down the road, most likely it will be a divorcee with children, we will then deal with new sets of issues. She will be leaving one (our marriage and children) and opening up another (new man, his children, mixed families).
Its pretty much inevitable this will happen sooner or later. Not just her, you also, and its most likely going to be as you describe (divorcee with kids etc). And all of this angst, for what? Just seems really selfish to me, and while kids will adapt, I'm not so sure the adaptations they will undertake are for the better.
Exactly the same here. We had hours of chats about our mutual failings. Nowadays however, I'm not inclined to changing/bettering myself (for her, anyway). I always accepted who she was; not the other way round it seems. So I'm totally done playing that "Beating myself up" game - whichever way you skin it, she's the quitter, not me.
Again, same thing here. To combat this, I took a leaf straight out of her book...because when I put my mind to it, I can party like the best of 'em....and I have done, over the last 6 weeks or so and its been a blast. But....for me, it always comes back round to our daughter. Little things she says and does, like the one I mentioned earlier - while my stbx refuses to let herself see it, I know our little girl wants us together as a family. Not this pseudo family we've become. I've only been acting like I have because of my attempts to get a grip of the situation that was forced upon me - I'd never have carried on the way I have been doing lately if she hadn't put the hammer down on the marriage.
Its pretty much inevitable this will happen sooner or later. Not just her, you also, and its most likely going to be as you describe (divorcee with kids etc). And all of this angst, for what? Just seems really selfish to me, and while kids will adapt, I'm not so sure the adaptations they will undertake are for the better.
In my situation, I filed for D last fall. I did it in a period when I drank every day and lived in bitterness, anger, sadness, day in and day out. I figured she would file later, just when I thought things were smooth. I wanted to hurt her like I hurt.
In early January, I stopped all of that. Begged for another chance.
But, alas to no avail. We agreed to put a hold on the D proceedings for 90 days. That period will end here in a week or 2, and my wife still wants to finalize this.
I care for my children and detest my failings in our marriage. I want it known that I did all I could to save us. This is on her.
That being said, the result and aftermath are the same.
But, my heart breaks and will, for as long as we're apart.
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Re: Therapist says kids will be ok from divorce 
