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post #61 of 153 (permalink) Old 01-30-2017, 03:52 PM
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Re: Ladies, What is a "good lover" ?

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I agree, you are so right. I see porn as a very dangerous thing that causes such damage in marriages and relationships and in individuals lives. Porn use is now mentioned in 60% of all divorces. I would hate it if my husband thought that porn was in anyway Ok or a good place to learn. For a man to be thinking about the other women he has seen while he has sex with his wife is so wrong. For me its a big no no. How can he not compare her with the other women who are after all just acting?

We are all different and what some women want some would hate. Someone mentioned they liked 'mild choking'. I cant think of anything worse, and many more things that have been mentioned here I would hate and have no interest in. As someone said, its what your wife thinks that matters not what other women have said they want.
Wow, this is so contrary to my views and experiences. It still surprises me how diverse we all are. I can't imagine sex with my partner without the domination (eg. choking, spanking, hair pulling etc) that is the norm for us. I suppose in the very same way you can't possibly imagine your sex life with it. Very intriguing. I suppose there must also be men who prefer the less dominating approach also. That really makes me feel lucky to have found a partner who not only has a similar drive but similar sexual interests.

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post #62 of 153 (permalink) Old 01-30-2017, 03:53 PM
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Re: Ladies, What is a "good lover" ?

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Honestly before coming on TAM, I had zero awareness of the turn-off towards porn by some women. My sisters all watched porn, in fact my interest in it started when the oldest shared that she had used it to teach herself to cum. Much later, after many frustrating failed attempts, I too was able to cum with it playing in the background. Similarly, close girlfriends also make reference to porn and we compare/share some of our favourite scenes.

So in my experience I really haven't come across women who find porn destructive. I agree that men who get addicted to it introduce a very unhealthy dynamic to a relationship. I would really be curious what percentage of women have had the experience of it destroying their sex life, what percentage of men/women find it generally unappealing, what percentage of men find themselves getting addicted to it and what percentage of women find it useful like myself.
I know loads of women who don't look at porn and many men too. Its so damaging to the one who uses it and to so many marriages. I know 2 marriages myself that ended due to porn use, and in 60% of divorces now porn used is cited as the reason for it.
Addiction to porn is a massive problem, I have heard of many women whose husbands wont have sex with them any more, due to their addiction, and others who cant even get an erection any more unless they look at porn.
Its also having such a damaging effect on our children now as well, skewing their minds as to what a loving, caring, functional, unselfish relationship should be. Its making them see girls as objects for their own lusts instead of valuable people to be respected and cared about. Many of them are also into violent porn, and their young developing minds are being terribly damaged.
I fear for their future. Who knows what they may do to women.

Also many women in porn films were sexually abused as children, many don't even like sex let alone love it. Poor women who think so little of themselves that they have resorted to doing that for a living. The only winners(for now anyway) are those who make it and create it.

For those who look at porn, would you like your 18 year old daughter to be in porn films?To be lusted over by so many older men? They are all someones child.

Last edited by Diana7; 01-30-2017 at 03:58 PM.
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post #63 of 153 (permalink) Old 01-30-2017, 04:04 PM
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Re: Ladies, What is a "good lover" ?

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Wow, this is so contrary to my views and experiences. It still surprises me how diverse we all are. I can't imagine sex with my partner without the domination (eg. choking, spanking, hair pulling etc) that is the norm for us. I suppose in the very same way you can't possibly imagine your sex life with it. Very intriguing. I suppose there must also be men who prefer the less dominating approach also. That really makes me feel lucky to have found a partner who not only has a similar drive but similar sexual interests.
It makes me glad to have a husband who would never use violence on me or try and choke me! For me its all about expressing sexual love, there are so many things you can do and enjoy without violence. Someone hurting me isn't expressing love. Some have even died after doing that!
Have you ever asked why you need to be hurt or hurt another to get enjoyment?
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post #64 of 153 (permalink) Old 01-30-2017, 04:20 PM
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Re: Ladies, What is a "good lover" ?

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It makes me glad to have a husband who would never use violence on me or try and choke me! For me its all about expressing sexual love, there are so many things you can do and enjoy without violence. Someone hurting me isn't expressing love. Some have even died after doing that!
Have you ever asked why you need to be hurt or hurt another to get enjoyment?
You're talking about asphyxiation play, which is different than what keke is talking about it. BDSM play, when practiced correctly, is perfectly safe.

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post #65 of 153 (permalink) Old 01-30-2017, 04:22 PM
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Re: Ladies, What is a "good lover" ?

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It makes me glad to have a husband who would never use violence on me or try and choke me! For me its all about expressing sexual love, there are so many things you can do and enjoy without violence. Someone hurting me isn't expressing love. Some have even died after doing that!
Have you ever asked why you need to be hurt or hurt another to get enjoyment?
I know this wasn't asked of me but I'll chime in. It's more of a role playing situation for me. Not a fan of choking (that's too far for me) but ive often wondered why i like it so rough and domineering? I had an idyllic childhood, no abuse, physical or sexual to speak of. Maybe its because i have a job where i always take charge and i just want someone else to steer the ship? Im a very decisive, take charge person in all aspects of my life, its nice for someone to tell me what to do for a change. I get SO TIRED of being charles in charge. And, it really turns me on. It is what it is.
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post #66 of 153 (permalink) Old 01-30-2017, 04:54 PM
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Re: Ladies, What is a "good lover" ?

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I know there is no way to know or find out, but I do not think your attitude reflects the "majority of men" on this issue.
There is actually. If you speak to real people and not base your picture entirely on certain TAM cases. You can also google studies on porn and how the rates of rape and sexual violence have gone down dramatically in the western countries since porn became widely and easily accessible since the 80'. Why do you consider anecdotal 'evidence' from selected TAM posts superior to studies taken from the general population?

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For the record, I've never been with a man who disrespected me in any way, including via porn use. What I have done though is listen to and read messages from hundreds of both men and women who HAVE been very hurt by their partner's porn use. Yes, including many men. Yes, some of them really would be ok with BBC but freak out if their woman watches girl on girl. Yes, some of them also freak out when they find out their wives are reading erotica. And then it goes on from there....chatting, sexting, webcam, all the way up to meeting strangers in real life in some cases (and I'm talking about women doing all of these, not men). Yes, men do have plenty to worry about, just as women do, and yes they are incredibly jealous when the reality of what I'm saying happens to them. TAM is not the only source of my knowledge base (as I know it isn't yours, either). Fine to agree to disagree, but I still do not think you should speak as if the majority of men think the way you do.
Ok so you haven't actually experienced 'neglect via a porn addict partner' yourself so your opinion is based on a 'precise' sample of 0. (I am sorry but TAM posts here and there blaming porn don't count because you have no idea what the actual underlying problem might be). Whereas you feel justified to tell me (as a man) how I should be feeling or what my motivations are whenever I watch porn? (since you appear to speak for this silent majority of men who have been hurting all these women). It is difficult to even begin to argue with the logic.

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Originally Posted by Faithful Wife View Post
I'm quite aware that the majority of women don't feel the way I do (I'm not talking about the porn part, I mean just in general) and so instead of speaking for them, the ones who feel differently than I do, I instead speak what I've heard them say and try to convey their feelings and try to empathize even if it isn't how I feel. What you are doing is insisting that the men who really are doing things that harm their marriages and their wives are the outliers or are rare somehow, based on the fact the "you" don't feel that way and you think you speak for the average man. You don't.
So instead of speaking for all these 'other women' why not just speak for yourself? Which is what I have primarily been doing (speaking for myself and for my relationship). I know how I feel about porn. I know how my wife feels about porn and exactly what role it plays in our relationship. I feel justified stating my opinion on this matter since it at the very least includes our experience. What I do find offensive is when someone tells me how we should feel about it, based on other people's stories and accept it as universal truth.

Last edited by inmyprime; 01-30-2017 at 06:01 PM.
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post #67 of 153 (permalink) Old 01-30-2017, 05:06 PM
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Re: Ladies, What is a "good lover" ?

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Originally Posted by inmyprime View Post
There is actually. If you speak to real people and not base your picture entirely on certain TAM cases. You can also google studies on porn and how the rates of rape and sexual violence have gone down dramatically in the western countries since porn became widely and easily accessible since the 80'. Why do you consider anecdotal 'evidence' from selected TAM posts superior to studies taken from the general population?
I already said in another post that I DON'T base my opinion on what is at TAM, and also said I know you don't either.

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post #68 of 153 (permalink) Old 01-30-2017, 05:11 PM
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Re: Ladies, What is a "good lover" ?

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Originally Posted by Keke24 View Post
Wow, this is so contrary to my views and experiences. It still surprises me how diverse we all are. I can't imagine sex with my partner without the domination (eg. choking, spanking, hair pulling etc) that is the norm for us. I suppose in the very same way you can't possibly imagine your sex life with it. Very intriguing. I suppose there must also be men who prefer the less dominating approach also. That really makes me feel lucky to have found a partner who not only has a similar drive but similar sexual interests.
The general theme is the same though: domineering, confident male partner, who pushes the boundaries as far as is comfortable for the woman. You are possibly a couple of levels higher than most when it comes to expression. Although I also pushed my wife a little in this direction and was gobsmacked when it turned out that she enjoys that kind of sex more than I could have imagined.
(Not always: there is a mixture, but I would say her orgasms are the stronger the more she lets go of boundaries. Sex is a form of escapism from conventional norms of everyday life. It only works when there is 100% trust. Speaking only on behalf of ourselves :-)
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post #69 of 153 (permalink) Old 01-30-2017, 05:34 PM
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Re: Ladies, What is a "good lover" ?

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The reason your post touched a nerve with me is because you spoke for "men" and said that "men" aren't lusting for the women's bodies in porn and that they always love their wife's body more. You are way off base here and are only speaking for yourself, and when you do that but project it upon "men", then women who have husbands who are much different than you rightly feel you don't know what you're talking about (WRT their own life and husband). It is a disservice for you or any man to try to play down a woman's feelings when her husband is FAR different than you are.
I think I understand where you are coming from. If this was true however (if I projected what I feel on all other men), I would write after every post where a wife complains that her husband prefers porn over sex with her "not to worry, he still likes you more and will come around". I would never dream of doing that. I don't live in lala land and acknowledge that in some instances, excessive porn usage can lead to problems. But those are exceptional cases when it comes to the general population. If porn was really that much superior for the majority of men (in the real world) they would stop having sex with their wives en masse. That is just not the case. Even on TAM, many men who admit they watch porn do so because the wife deny them sex. Anyway, I would find it all easier to understand if your extrapolations came from personal experience. I really don't understand what is the point of extrapolating from other people's experiences, of which one usually only knows one side of the story anyway.
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post #70 of 153 (permalink) Old 01-30-2017, 05:34 PM
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Re: Ladies, What is a "good lover" ?

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Originally Posted by inmyprime View Post
There is actually. If you speak to real people and not base your picture entirely on certain TAM cases. You can also google studies on porn and how the rates of rape and sexual violence have gone down dramatically in the western countries since porn became widely and easily accessible since the 80'. Why do you consider anecdotal 'evidence' from selected TAM posts superior to studies taken from the general population?



Ok so you haven't actually experienced 'neglect via a porn addict partner' yourself so your opinion is based on a 'precise' sample of 0. (I am sorry but TAM posts here and there blaming porn don't count because you have no idea what the actual underlying problem might be). Whereas you feel justified to tell me (as a man) how I should be feeling or what my motivations are whenever I watch porn? (since you appear to speak for this silent majority of men who have been hurting all these women). It is difficult to even begin to argue with the logic.



So instead of speaking for all these 'other women' why not just speak for yourself? Which is what I have primarily been doing (speaking for myself and for my relationship). I know how I feel about porn. I know how my wife feels about porn and exactly what role it plays in our relationship. I feel justified stating my opinion on this matter since it at the very least includes our experience. You cannot say the same. What I do find offensive is when someone tells me how we should feel about it, based on other people's stories and accept it as universal truth.
I think your off a degree or two myself.

I think you might be suffering from porn brain.

Interesting reach. More porn=less sexual assault and rape. Hmmm....

BTW. FW has a lot of years of research under her belt and TAM is only a fraction of her experience.

Maybe slow it down a little and actually take a look at who you are talking to before making any more incorrect statements?

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post #71 of 153 (permalink) Old 01-30-2017, 05:40 PM
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Re: Ladies, What is a "good lover" ?

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I already said in another post that I DON'T base my opinion on what is at TAM, and also said I know you don't either.
Are you quite certain it really matters what you say in this particular conversation?
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post #72 of 153 (permalink) Old 01-30-2017, 05:40 PM
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Re: Ladies, What is a "good lover" ?

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I think your off a degree or two myself.

I think you might be suffering from porn brain.

Interesting reach. More porn=less sexual assault and rape. Hmmm....
I don't watch much porn (unless it's home made).

Perhaps google next time yourself before insulting me: http://aic.gov.au/media_library/publ...kutchinsky.pdf (read the conclusion)

and

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog...sexual-assault

PS: I'd like to get the thread back on topic.

Last edited by inmyprime; 01-30-2017 at 05:47 PM.
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post #73 of 153 (permalink) Old 01-30-2017, 05:48 PM
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True, I wouldn't classify it as violence although I would say there is a pain aspect that is very real and immensely pleasurable. I don't think it's much different for a woman to want to be pounded, to be attracted to big d*cks, to want to be grabbed and tossed around into positions.

There is something incredibly sexy about being dominated by a man, to have it done to me by the man I love is a very erotic experience. There are levels of domination and the higher you go, the greater the return in pleasure and there's understandably there's also greater the risk. Risk of being labeled as a ****, someone who wants to be used, the risk of being taken advantage of, etc, you can think of other stuff.

I love that I can be honest with my partner about the kind of sex I want. To have him enjoy it in the same way feels so good. It makes me embrace my vulnerability and give in to him even more during sex. No one is really getting hurt. Quite the contrary, we have a very satisfying sex life. We argue like normal couples and we love each other all over like normal couples.
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Originally Posted by Diana7 View Post
It makes me glad to have a husband who would never use violence on me or try and choke me! For me its all about expressing sexual love, there are so many things you can do and enjoy without violence. Someone hurting me isn't expressing love. Some have even died after doing that!
Have you ever asked why you need to be hurt or hurt another to get enjoyment?
You're talking about asphyxiation play, which is different than what keke is talking about it. BDSM play, when practiced ocorrectly, is perfectly safe.
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post #74 of 153 (permalink) Old 01-30-2017, 05:50 PM
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Re: Ladies, What is a "good lover" ?

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Originally Posted by inmyprime View Post
I don't watch much porn (unless it's home made).

Perhaps google next time yourself before insulting me: http://aic.gov.au/media_library/publ...kutchinsky.pdf (read the conclusion)

and

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog...sexual-assault
Oh I've got close to 20 years of experience where the rubber meets the road and human drama is unveiled.

I do a fair bit of research that requires more than clicking on a tab.

The smily face after my porn brain statement means to take it lightly, like a joke, you know when someone ribs you with a grin.
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post #75 of 153 (permalink) Old 01-30-2017, 06:00 PM
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Re: Ladies, What is a "good lover" ?

There is such a huge range in what people enjoy and you are very lucky to be with someone who shares your interests. In addition to the often discussed mismatches in drive, there are mismatches in level of, and types of kinkiness. I think there is a tendency for some people to think that their sexual interest are widely shared.

Even in what might seem to others like an already narrow set of people who like BDSM like activities, there is huge variation -whether it is pretend or real pain, domination, etc.

There are people who think being spanked during sex is fun and sexy and others who would consider it abuse.

BTW, and to be clear: This is all about *consensual* play where both parties are actually enjoying themselves and have taken proper precautions. This is completely different from abuse - even though it might look similar to an outside observer at a quick glance.

This is one of the reasons I think it is so important for a couple to at least discuss, if not engage in intimacy before they commit to a long term relationship.

This circles back to this discussion - a "good lover" can be very different to different people. There are likely some common attributes (like caring about their partners enjoyment) but a large range of differences.











Quote:
Originally Posted by Keke24 View Post
True, I wouldn't classify it as violence although I would say there is a pain aspect that is very real and immensely pleasurable. I don't think it's much different for a woman to want to be pounded, to be attracted to big d*cks, to want to be grabbed and tossed around into positions.

There is something incredibly sexy about being dominated by a man, to have it done to me by the man I love is a very erotic experience. There are levels of domination and the higher you go, the greater the return in pleasure and there's understandably there's also greater the risk. Risk of being labeled as a ****, someone who wants to be used, the risk of being taken advantage of, etc, you can think of other stuff.

I love that I can be honest with my partner about the kind of sex I want. To have him enjoy it in the same way feels so good. It makes me embrace my vulnerability and give in to him even more during sex. No one is really getting hurt. Quite the contrary, we have a very satisfying sex life. We argue like normal couples and we love each other all over like normal couples.
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