Womens March - Page 2 - Talk About Marriage
The Ladies' Lounge Sharing and support.

User Tag List

 248Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread
post #16 of 197 (permalink) Old 02-01-2017, 05:18 PM Thread Starter
Forum Supporter
 
MarriedDude's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: ORYGUN
Posts: 1,850
Re: Womens March

Quote:
Originally Posted by Itwasjustafantasy View Post
Not in DC, but in a city in the East Coast. All I experinced was a sense of fellowship and togetherness.
And hardly anything offends me. Any particular reason you asked me this question?
Just Curious, heard it was kinda disorganized, but otherwise they had a nice time. Apparently, there was a lady handing out a metric ton of free cookies...thats cool. They brought me back a *****Hat..which is interesting...they also brought back a protest sign...the one with the flag burka thing...we collect them and hang them in the job trailers.


Holes burn deep in your chest,
Raked by machine gun fire.
Screaming soul sent out to die,
Living mandatory suicide.
MarriedDude is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #17 of 197 (permalink) Old 02-01-2017, 05:20 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Posts: 1,007
Re: Womens March

This is the one I was referring to:

Linda Sarsour, the executive director of the Arab American Association of New York.

She co-chaired the event. Anyone know she's into Sharia Law and tried to convince others of how fair Sharia Law is?
becareful2 is offline  
post #18 of 197 (permalink) Old 02-01-2017, 05:26 PM
Member
 
Fozzy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 4,681
Re: Womens March

Taking bets on how many people end up banned from this thread.

Darling it's better down where it's wetter, take it from me! --- Sebastian
Fozzy is offline  
 
post #19 of 197 (permalink) Old 02-01-2017, 05:47 PM
Member
 
FeministInPink's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 5,029
Re: Womens March

Quote:
Originally Posted by becareful2 View Post
It thought the messages were numerous and very disorganized, and when narrowed down to the crux of the matter, I think that entire march was mainly a pro-abortion march.
There's a BIG difference between being pro-abortion and being pro-choice. The choice to have an abortion is never taken lightly, and is emotionally very difficult. To categorize or re-name pro-choice as being "pro-abortion" is really a disservice.

The pro-choice movement is about providing access to safe, legal medical services/procedures. Prior to the passing of Roe V. Wade, 5,000 women died annually from illegal abortions. (Estimates of total illegal abortions prior to Roe v. Wade range from 200,000 to over a million per year; the range is crazy wide because many illegal procedures are unreported, because they were --duh-- illegal.) That number has dropped to 0.6 deaths in 100,000 procedures since Roe v. Wade was passed. Source.

Pro-choice is also about education and access to birth control; the pro-choice movement wants people to be educated about birth control and safer sex so that men and women can choose if and when to start a family. Studies have shown that adequate sex education and access to birth control reduces 1) teen pregnancy and 2) the overall abortion rate.

Pro-choice people don't want to kill babies. That claim is nothing more than pro-life rhetoric and propaganda, designed to vilify and dehumanize people who are pro-choice.

~Happily un-married since December 9, 2013~
FeministInPink is online now  
post #20 of 197 (permalink) Old 02-01-2017, 05:52 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Posts: 1,007
becareful2 is offline  
post #21 of 197 (permalink) Old 02-01-2017, 05:57 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Posts: 1,007
Re: Womens March

Quote:
Originally Posted by FeministInPink View Post
There's a BIG difference between being pro-abortion and being pro-choice. The choice to have an abortion is never taken lightly, and is emotionally very difficult. To categorize or re-name pro-choice as being "pro-abortion" is really a disservice.

The pro-choice movement is about providing access to safe, legal medical services/procedures. Prior to the passing of Roe V. Wade, 5,000 women died annually from illegal abortions. (Estimates of total illegal abortions prior to Roe v. Wade range from 200,000 to over a million per year; the range is crazy wide because many illegal procedures are unreported, because they were --duh-- illegal.) That number has dropped to 0.6 deaths in 100,000 procedures since Roe v. Wade was passed. Source.

Pro-choice is also about education and access to birth control; the pro-choice movement wants people to be educated about birth control and safer sex so that men and women can choose if and when to start a family. Studies have shown that adequate sex education and access to birth control reduces 1) teen pregnancy and 2) the overall abortion rate.

Pro-choice people don't want to kill babies. That claim is nothing more than pro-life rhetoric and propaganda, designed to vilify and dehumanize people who are pro-choice.
Fifty-six million abortions since Roe v Wade would beg to differ with your assessment. Pregnant women who go into Planned Parenthood to seek adoption placement services are steered towards abortion. There are actual recordings of this.
becareful2 is offline  
post #22 of 197 (permalink) Old 02-01-2017, 06:19 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2016
Posts: 2,401
Re: Womens March

I saw the womens march as a way of saying that women are a powerful political force and should be considered in all politics. I think this is a fine message, half the population is female and they have historically not had half the political power.

Beyond that there are many issues that affect women and of course not all women will agree on all of these issues. Abortion is one of the most divisive issues because the two sides is starting from different postulates: is a fetus a person? That cannot be measured, and depending on your answer you end up on one side or the other of the abortion debate.

Abortion is either murder, or a woman's obvious right to control her own body.
uhtred is offline  
post #23 of 197 (permalink) Old 02-01-2017, 06:23 PM
Member
 
FeministInPink's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 5,029
Re: Womens March

Quote:
Originally Posted by becareful2 View Post
Fifty-six million abortions since Roe v Wade would beg to differ with your assessment. Pregnant women who go into Planned Parenthood to seek adoption placement services are steered towards abortion. There are actual recordings of this.
That number isn't quite right. You're off by about 5 million. According to the CDC, approximately 50 million abortions have been performed since the passing of Roe v. Wade, and that number has been steadily declining since 1990. The current number is somewhere around 660,000 per year, as of 2013 (only slightly more than in 1973, in which the number was 610,000). Source. The same or less raw number than before Roe v. Wade, despite the fact that there are 105 million MORE PEOPLE in the US in 2013 than there were in 1973, the year Roe v. Wade was passed. Source. So if you look at the percentages, there is actually less abortion now, proportionally.

Additionally, you can see from this CDC chart that teen pregnancy has dropped drastically over the last 20 yrs: https://www.cdc.gov/teenpregnancy/about/

Please provide legitimate (not fake news sites or right-wing propaganda sites) sources for your claims, please. I'll be more likely to take your claims seriously and with less skepticism if you do.

ETA: And Planned Parenthood is a separate issue. Please keep red herrings out of the debate. We're not talking about Planned Parenthood.

~Happily un-married since December 9, 2013~
FeministInPink is online now  
post #24 of 197 (permalink) Old 02-01-2017, 06:44 PM
Member
 
FeministInPink's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 5,029
Re: Womens March

Quote:
Originally Posted by uhtred View Post
I saw the womens march as a way of saying that women are a powerful political force and should be considered in all politics. I think this is a fine message, half the population is female and they have historically not had half the political power.

Beyond that there are many issues that affect women and of course not all women will agree on all of these issues. Abortion is one of the most divisive issues because the two sides is starting from different postulates: is a fetus a person? That cannot be measured, and depending on your answer you end up on one side or the other of the abortion debate.

Abortion is either murder, or a woman's obvious right to control her own body.
My dad always said this about the pro-choice/pro-life debate (I am paraphrasing, obviously)

Many people miss the actual point of this issue. The point isn't whether abortion is morally right or wrong. The point isn't "When does life begin?" No, the point is this: "Do I have the right to impose my belief system on someone else? Does the government have the right to impose one group's belief system on an entire country?" Because the question of whether something is right or wrong is not a question of fact, it is a question of personal belief. And when it comes to belief, nothing can be proven or disproven--it is simply opinion. And opinion is a personal choice; no one can tell you what opinion to have, nor can it be legislated by the government.

And he didn't answer the question for me--he wanted me to come up with the answer for myself. And the answer I have reached is this: No, I do not have the right to impose my beliefs on another person, and neither does anyone else.

~Happily un-married since December 9, 2013~
FeministInPink is online now  
post #25 of 197 (permalink) Old 02-01-2017, 07:08 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2016
Posts: 2,401
Re: Womens March

I wish it was that simple but it isn't.

If a fetus is a child, then abortion is wrong in the same way that murder is wrong, and as a society we have decided that we DO have the right to prohibit murder. We have decided that murder is not a matter of choice, that there are things that are simply wrong no matter what someone believes.

Personally I do not think a fetus is a child. I think it is part of a woman's body and she has every right to do with it as she wishes. I am a strong supporter of abortion rights.

I just recognize that people who oppose abortion for everyone can be making a rational and moral choice based on their belief that a fetus is a child - just as my position is rational and moral based on my belief that a fetus is not a child.


We may see this sort of problem increasing as the lines between "human" and "not human" get blurred - whether by genetically engineered chimeras, re-created neanderthals, or AIs.

We seem to have finally gotten to the point where we agree that all humans are... well human, regardless of race. It wasn't so long ago that many people disagreed.





Quote:
Originally Posted by FeministInPink View Post
My dad always said this about the pro-choice/pro-life debate (I am paraphrasing, obviously)

Many people miss the actual point of this issue. The point isn't whether abortion is morally right or wrong. The point isn't "When does life begin?" No, the point is this: "Do I have the right to impose my belief system on someone else? Does the government have the right to impose one group's belief system on an entire country?" Because the question of whether something is right or wrong is not a question of fact, it is a question of personal belief. And when it comes to belief, nothing can be proven or disproven--it is simply opinion. And opinion is a personal choice; no one can tell you what opinion to have, nor can it be legislated by the government.

And he didn't answer the question for me--he wanted me to come up with the answer for myself. And the answer I have reached is this: No, I do not have the right to impose my beliefs on another person, and neither does anyone else.


uhtred is offline  
post #26 of 197 (permalink) Old 02-01-2017, 07:14 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 103
Re: Womens March

Oh lordy...of course abortion is such a controversial topic. Pro choice means I get to make my choice and so do you. Pro life is just pro-birth and pro-fetus..nothing else. Pro-choice people generally believe that all life is precious, not just that of a fetus. Pro lifers often expect women to give birth to every fertilized egg and once that fetus is born, well good luck with that. Women who use public assistance are looked down upon once they had their precious babies encouraged by the very people who insist they must bring such children to this world. And it is often the same people who are against sex education!
I have explained in a different thread how my husband and I have decided against having any more children. Period. No doubts. Hopefully this President of ours won't put people like us in the position of having to bring what would be a completely unwanted child to this world. And no, I do not care to add more children to the foster care system. I work in the social work field, I know what it is like to grow up unwanted, unloved, waiting to age out of the system..horrendous. No birth control is perfect thus having reproductive rights protected is imperative.
Finally, the best sign I saw at the march was the one that said "The only wall we need to build is the one between church and state." Mr. Trump and (most) of his followers need to understand that this is a democracy not a theocracy...laws should not be made based on one single religion (Christianity) or any at all. If one loves religion so much perhaps it is time to move to another country ruled by religious laws.
Itwasjustafantasy is offline  
post #27 of 197 (permalink) Old 02-01-2017, 08:20 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Posts: 1,007
Re: Womens March

Quote:
Originally Posted by FeministInPink View Post
That number isn't quite right. You're off by about 5 million. According to the CDC, approximately 50 million abortions have been performed since the passing of Roe v. Wade, and that number has been steadily declining since 1990. The current number is somewhere around 660,000 per year, as of 2013 (only slightly more than in 1973, in which the number was 610,000). Source. The same or less raw number than before Roe v. Wade, despite the fact that there are 105 million MORE PEOPLE in the US in 2013 than there were in 1973, the year Roe v. Wade was passed. Source. So if you look at the percentages, there is actually less abortion now, proportionally.

Additionally, you can see from this CDC chart that teen pregnancy has dropped drastically over the last 20 yrs: https://www.cdc.gov/teenpregnancy/about/

Please provide legitimate (not fake news sites or right-wing propaganda sites) sources for your claims, please. I'll be more likely to take your claims seriously and with less skepticism if you do.

ETA: And Planned Parenthood is a separate issue. Please keep red herrings out of the debate. We're not talking about Planned Parenthood.
The 56 million figure I got came from Life News, a pro-life site, but you will dismiss that as right wing propaganda, so I'll go to where you are.

That 50 million figure you cited from the CDC is 1000% percent wrong, plus the link you posted to wikipedia actually shows 51,888,303, not 50 million. How do I know it's wrong? It is widely known and acknowledged that the CDC abortion stats have omitted key states like California, which also happens to be the most populous, since 1998. They also have stopped counting abortions from New Hampshire since that same year. In addition, several states have not been counted for certain years. The CDC - from the wikipedia link you cited - reduced it's reporting areas from 52 to 47 in 1998.

There are really only two sources for abortion stats: the CDC and the Guttmacher Institute. GI was a former research arm of the Planned Parenthood Federation of America. Both are incomplete since the CDC omits certain states and have reduced the number of reporting areas, while the Guttmacher Institute doesn't do an annual survey, plus they said only 58% of those they survey provides them with stats. There is no law that mandates any abortion providers to report their numbers.

Let's play with some numbers that I've lifted from the Guttmacher Institute site. source.

•Approximately 926,200 abortions occurred in the United States in 2014.
• In 2014, some 157,350 abortions were provided in California.
• In 2014, some 2,540 abortions were provided in New Hampshire. source

Notice that I'm only low-balling it, and not using the high numbers from years like 1990 when it was 1.6 million.

From 1998 to 2016 is 16 years, so for California, it's (157,350 x 16 = 2,517,600). For New Hampshire, it's (2,778 x 16 = 44,457).
Add CA & NH's missing years to the 51,888,303 and we get (2,778 + 2,517,600 + 51,883,303 = 54,403,681. That total is about 1.6 million shy of 56 million. The Guttmacher Institute estimates that there is a 3% undercount, so that gets it over 56 million.

CDC did not count stats from states like Oklahoma, Alaska, West Virginia, Maryland, and Louisiana (OK in 1998, AK from 1998 to 2002, WV in 2003 and 2004, LA in 2005, MD from 2007 to 2012). I don't think it's a stretch to get to 56 million if those states are accounted for. It's definitely not 50 million. Mine is a layman's simplistic extrapolation, since it's not possible to get the exact figure regardless of whether the CDC stats or the GI stats are used, but if combined, it does paint a clearer picture.

I'm not disputing that there's a decline in abortions, but I'm not certain what is the reason behind that. It could be better health education or it could be a shift in how women view abortion. The CDC stats seem to say that the number of STDs have increased (source) and people are having more sex now than ever with the wide spread use of services like Tinder, AM, Match, Cupid, etc. School age kids are also having sex and sexting. There are what's known as Super STDs that are resistant to most known vaccines. It could also be due to people having less children. Every year, there's a pro-abortion march and a pro-life march. I've seen signs that read "Thank you, Mom, I am grateful", so to a certain extent, I think women's views on abortion have slowly changed from pro-abortion to pro-life.

Planned Parenthood had a major presence in this women's march, so I think it's relevant to talk about them, and definitely not a red herring.
becareful2 is offline  
post #28 of 197 (permalink) Old 02-01-2017, 08:21 PM
Forum Supporter
 
TX-SC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Texas
Posts: 1,573
Re: Womens March

I highly recommend you guys consider moving this debate to the politics forum.

Sent from my LG-US996 using Tapatalk

"You are talking about the nonsensical ravings of a lunatic mind!" Victor Von Frankenstein
TX-SC is online now  
post #29 of 197 (permalink) Old 02-01-2017, 08:43 PM
Member
 
FeministInPink's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 5,029
Re: Womens March

@becareful2 Thank you for your thoughtful, detailed response, and I will accept your estimate of 56 million.

And FYI, I reached the 50 million number because I subtracted the 3 yrs prior to Roe V Wade.

~Happily un-married since December 9, 2013~
FeministInPink is online now  
post #30 of 197 (permalink) Old 02-01-2017, 08:57 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Posts: 11
Re: Womens March

I am sick and tired of everyone protesting about EVERYTHING. It is absolutely absurd. The protests stem from that segment of the population that despise Trump, it's been that way since he announced his candidacy in the summer of 2015. Combine distaste for him with his winning the election and the disappointment from seeing him in this position of authority, and many can't stomach it. He's the President. He won the election, get used to it. Maybe someone will actually do something in the White House, rather than sit on their f***ing a** for 8 years. If you went to a protest, get a job, get a life. This politically correct, "misogynisitic", "racist", liberal crap is just unbearable. Go to work, pay taxes, take care of and protect your family, be kind to others, try to get along with others, etc. Can anyone take anyone seriously who wears a vagina costume?? And who the heck protests extreme vetting, which protects us? I don't see anyone protesting locking their doors at night. This is what those who root for Hillary, those who hate Trump, the ones protesting,those who cried during the election still don't get--this s*** is getting old, and it needs to stop.
HD48 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on Talk About Marriage, you must first register. Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

Important! Your username will be visible to the public next to anything you post and could show up in search engines like Google. If you are concerned about anonymity, PLEASE choose a username that will not be recognizable to anyone you know.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in









Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



Thread Tools Search this Thread
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Women's Infidelity Books KJ_Simmons The Men's Clubhouse 4 12-27-2016 04:02 PM
Need women's advice - fiance broke off engagement without warning ctb09 The Ladies' Lounge 30 09-22-2016 05:38 AM
Aren't there already transgendered people in women's bathrooms? SecondTime'Round Politics and Religion 1014 06-14-2016 01:38 PM
March Madness is Finally Here! arbitrator The Social Spot 17 03-27-2016 09:56 PM
Women's Turn Ons? Opinions Wanted Lovemywife83 Sex in Marriage 45 03-02-2016 09:44 PM

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome