Men, please listen (and not just hear) when we speak - Page 5 - Talk About Marriage
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post #61 of 68 (permalink) Old 01-06-2016, 10:11 PM
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Re: Men, please listen (and not just hear) when we speak

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Originally Posted by barbieDoll View Post
So, after reading shy_guy's very insightful post about what he (and for similar men) would like from women, I think it's also fair for us to do the same.

I titled the post to be similar to shy_guy's. It made me laugh when someone posted that all she thought her husband heard was "blah blah blah Musinex blah blah blah liquid" because I often think all men hear is the voice from Charlie Brown.

Anyhoo... here's my best stab at something similar.

==============================================

1. Please listen and not just hear us when we speak.

There are differences to the two: hearing us is basically hearing background noise. "Pick up deodorant". Listening is when you actually got the details of what we were saying. "Pick up the same deodorant I use". This is where I also fall into the trap of ASSUMING he knows or HOPING he'd be smart enough to check out what deodorant I use or know to go to where I keep it to find out. I learned that I have to specifically say what brand, what scent and sometimes what it looks like. I had to get over the fact that he doesn't care to waste time to figure all that stuff out when it was easier for me to tell him.

Men FAIL
: Hearing only "Pick up deodorant"
Women FAIL: Be specific. STOP assuming he knows.

2. Reciprocate.

Myth: Women/Wives love to clean the house, do laundry, cook dinner... yada yada.
Truth: We (or majority of us) do it because we like a clean house, clean clothes and food.. not because we enjoy it. We (or marjority of us) would also prefer to come home, sit in front of the TV and have things magically done for us.

We nag/b!tch because we have a reason to. If we feel like we are doing more work than you are, that'll begin the nagging/b!tching. I would prefer that while I'm cooking dinner, H is putting in a load of laundry or putting away dishes. Then we can eat together, cleanup and wash the dishes together and then have our down time TOGETHER. It really irritates me that as soon as I get home, I'm busting my butt to prepare dinner, wash/put away the dishes from that morning, have supper ready for H then have him retire himself to the den after dinner so he can relax only to leave me in the kitchen to clean up and wash more dishes. You think I'm going to be happy after that? NOPE.

Share the chores, share the nag free quiet happiness together.

I'm working on this by the way...it's not a free ticket!

3. Just because we're married, it doesn't mean I'm dead.

I know this is an issue for many people and we're no different. Each couple differs in in this department though. Personally, I would love it if my H complimented me more. I get the odd "you're cute" every few months. That's the extent. This wouldn't be an issue if there were physical things he did to show me that he's still attracted. I'm not asking for a compliment about everything, every day but it would be so nice to be complimented on odd days or when I put an extra effort.

Of course I can't put anything to do with sexuality in this post because being on here long enough has taught me that both men and women can be sexually deprived. So nothing in this department.

4. Talking about your issues/feelings is NOT a sign of weakness.

Ok, we get it. If you "talk about your feelings" other guys might think you're lame or a pansy. But what you fail to realize is that you would save yourself and your wife or S.O. so much wasted energy and time by just spitting it out. By not telling us what's going on, we automatically ASSUME and that's when we get creative with our thoughts. On the flip side, we women should also STOP saying the word "fine" or "It's fine". This does nothing but piss off men. Communicate, communicate, communicate!!

Men FAIL: Talking about my feelings is lame. It'll go away.
Women FAIL: FINE.

=========================================

This can go on and on and is not an exhaustive list but a good start I would think.

I also have to put a disclaimer that every situation is different. I am NOT painting everyone with the same brush but merely stating some things that are ON AVERAGE, a pretty good representation of situations.

And remember; Men, you fight with fists and are physical about it. We, on the other hand, do not... we fight a great game of mental warfare . LOL!

Like it, love it, hate it... it's my view/opinion.

ENJOY!!
I have rethought it a little more.

This is great advice for couples where you have a great wife and a rubbish husband. When it is the other way round, you have a woman who assumes she is great at communication, knows what the man means regardless of what he actually says and feels she is so great at communication that she does not have to try hard when listening.

Some women just ***** and nag, just as some men are ungrateful and lazy. "We nag/b!tch because we have a reason to" is not always true.

And talking about issues and feelings will often be seen as a sign of weakness. When a man has trouble in his life, it might make a woman insecure that his attention is diverted by that dying relative etc.

Your post is a great tribute to the great women that are out there. It over-reaches beyond that.

And as a man whose favourite sports to partake in are rugby and boxing, I am sorry to say that men typically stick to mental warfare rather than fists and are often rubbish at both styles.

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post #62 of 68 (permalink) Old 01-16-2016, 07:40 PM
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Re: Men, please listen (and not just hear) when we speak

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Originally Posted by barbieDoll View Post
1. Please listen and not just hear us when we speak.


Men FAIL
: Hearing only "Pick up deodorant"
Women FAIL: Be specific. STOP assuming he knows.

2. Reciprocate.
I find it rude that my wife puts so much on me in her requests leaving me to figure it out rather than just giving me clear instructions as to what she wants. Like not paying attention to what kind of deodorant she uses, even as it changes over years, is somehow a message that I am not paying attention to her.

Another manifestation of this her assumption that I reference the world in the same context and detail that she does. I mean she will go on for 3 min trying to get me acknowledge that I know exactly what house she is talking about 5 blocks from our home. When I keep indicating I have no idea what house she is taking about she keeps giving more and more detail "with those rocks in the yard and these flowers and that car and et...." and she gets frustrated when I have no clue like it is some failing on my part. When the truth is I can't describe the house three doors because frankly I don't put any energy in memorizing things that are not important to me. Let alone some house half a mile away.

"what was that" (after hearing a quiet noise) This literally happens several times a week. I never hear the noise but she always assumes I know what she is talking about or I did hear it and while having no idea what caused it, I don't find it out of the ordinary.



Quote:
Originally Posted by barbieDoll View Post
Myth: Women/Wives love to clean the house, do laundry, cook dinner... yada yada.
Truth: We (or majority of us) do it because we like a clean house, clean clothes and food.. not because we enjoy it. We (or marjority of us) would also prefer to come home, sit in front of the TV and have things magically done for us.

Share the chores, share the nag free quiet happiness together.
I generally agree with this and I do help with a lot of the basic clean up. Though you can get laundry done and home house cleaning done through services for $600 to $800 a month. If she where to go to work for even $2000/ month take home...well you do the math.


Quote:
Originally Posted by barbieDoll View Post
3. Just because we're married, it doesn't mean I'm dead.

I know this is an issue for many people and we're no different. Each couple differs in in this department though. Personally, I would love it if my H complimented me more. I get the odd "you're cute" every few months. That's the extent. This wouldn't be an issue if there were physical things he did to show me that he's still attracted. I'm not asking for a compliment about everything, every day but it would be so nice to be complimented on odd days or when I put an extra effort.

I really tried this for years but it become a competition where she would do her best to prove my words where cheesey and did not mean anything. If it did mean anything to her, it was important to her to show that she could not be moved emotionally by words and she remains this way today.



Quote:
Originally Posted by barbieDoll View Post

4. Talking about your issues/feelings is NOT a sign of weakness.

Ok, we get it. If you "talk about your feelings" other guys might think you're lame or a pansy. But what you fail to realize is that you would save yourself and your wife or S.O. so much wasted energy and time by just spitting it out. By not telling us what's going on, we automatically ASSUME and that's when we get creative with our thoughts. On the flip side, we women should also STOP saying the word "fine" or "It's fine". This does nothing but piss off men. Communicate, communicate, communicate!!

Men FAIL: Talking about my feelings is lame. It'll go away.
Women FAIL: FINE.
Tried that also. she refuses to talk about anything relationship. Emotions, sex, feelings--whatever. Shows contempt for me the few times I was emotional about some of my own issues.

This is not some pity party post for me, and the problems in my marriage aside, its a fact that not all women really want what you describe as a relationship. For good or bad.

SE

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Last edited by ScrambledEggs; 01-16-2016 at 08:02 PM.
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post #63 of 68 (permalink) Old 01-16-2016, 07:42 PM
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Re: Men, please listen (and not just hear) when we speak

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Originally Posted by tamuser View Post
two things come to mind:

1) my wife loves to talk *at length* about her job/school/whatever - often, there's nothing for me to do but say "mmm-hmmm" and nod, or the occasional "you did fine" or "don't worry about that". I'm happy to do this, but after a really long time, it gets old and it feels like she's being really self centered. Problem is, I *don't* like to talk about my work - I'd rather leave it at the office, and so I can't do a clean reciprocation (or even get a word in edgewise, to tell the truth). I understand that she has a need for this "conversation", so I do my best to fill it. It can sure seem excessive, though, and I haven't found a great way to shut it off when I've had enough without causing problems.

2) She doesn't really want to hear about my feelings. She does if they're good and they re-enforce the stability she likes to feel, but if I feel depressed or other negative emotions, it appears to freak her out and make her very anxious. She ends those conversations as soon as she can. It may be related to the fact that I'm the primary breadwinner and if I were to spiral out of control and lose my job or something, our lives would take a big hit.
Worse you could talk about your work problems and challenges and then like me, get blamed "for bring your work home", "only talking about work", "always complaining"," being negative", or me favorite "complaining about things that she can't do anything about/nothing to do with her".
I have listened and analysed the complaints she gives, after listen are actually two fold :
(1) I'm talking, so she can't be talking about her thoughts
(2) They're things that aren't about her.

Analysis has indicated that a man being involved in "discussion" must avoid (1) and (2) to be at the correct communication level of participation.
A woman frequently appear to feel, however that her stating these things is communication with others. Often this "communication" is not instruction nor does it involve direction; so it is important to be ready to decode the poor communcation standard that results from an untrained and undisciplined speaker when they do try and intimate their directives and relationship concerns.
(again, as another poster has indicated, as businesses people, salespeople, and upper level management, you're expected to have actual training in such skills as they are an important part of dealing with others without those skills)
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post #64 of 68 (permalink) Old 01-16-2016, 08:02 PM
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Re: Men, please listen (and not just hear) when we speak

I deleted my previous post as it was too personal buuuuuut...

I think making this gender specific is the wrong way to go.

I do believe there are differences between the genders but communication breakdowns are equally both genders fault.

I also find the "men" example in this more of a "selfish" person example. That can fall to men or women.

Erase the genders in this one, and you have a good conversation starter about conversation breakdowns. The ones we have been having for years. The one where we give too much and the other too little. The one where we never knew we were communicating poorly.
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post #65 of 68 (permalink) Old 01-16-2016, 08:30 PM
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Re: Men, please listen (and not just hear) when we speak

Men like to try fix things, whereas women want to know you are listening when they talk, but they are not necessarily awaiting a answer from you.
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post #66 of 68 (permalink) Old 01-16-2016, 08:55 PM
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Re: Men, please listen (and not just hear) when we speak

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Erase the genders in this one, and you have a good conversation starter about conversation breakdowns. The ones we have been having for years. The one where we give too much and the other too little. The one where we never knew we were communicating poorly.

sadly one group of considers itself natural communicators, especially when they talk so much (and say so little).
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post #67 of 68 (permalink) Old 01-16-2016, 10:21 PM
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Re: Men, please listen (and not just hear) when we speak

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Originally Posted by spotthedeaddog View Post
sadly one group of considers itself natural communicators, especially when they talk so much (and say so little).
I think it is a matter of a previous quote

Quote:
Men like to try fix things, whereas women want to know you are listening when they talk, but they are not necessarily awaiting a answer from you.
There are different directions to the communication. Women may be trying to force men to their directive through verbal force. Men may be dodging that verbal force and trying to force women to think "more logical" when the logic they are applying is missing the emotional logic women are looking for.

Then there are some men and women who are emotionally immature and selfish. They may display that in traditionally masculine or feminine ways or simply be *******s about it.
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post #68 of 68 (permalink) Old 01-16-2016, 10:51 PM
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Re: Men, please listen (and not just hear) when we speak

It's a lot easier when both sides admit neither of you are perfect... and recognize your SO isn't you.

We think differently, it's not personal.

"Mark Gungor - The Nothing Box - Part 1" on YouTube

The short version, Watch "Mark Gungor - The Nothing Box - Part 1"

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Last edited by anchorwatch; 01-17-2016 at 05:48 PM.
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