Just remember, autonomy with a cheater is NOT the same thing as giving them free reign to do whatever they want. They LOST that right when they cheated.
If you can't deal with that one simple truth, then she will continue to cheat on you over and over and over...because she'll have lost all respect for you.
does she want to leave me? no. but does she have ALL the power right now? ABSOLUTELY. i spent some time with a very dear friend this weekend who sort of gave me the same advice of niceguy. he said... leave her alone for awhile. make her want to talk to you. honestly, i know she's not cheating on me. but clearly she does want some autonomy. so i'm going to give that to her. but deejo... i will start thinking about my own boundries and what i need from the relationship too. if at the end of the day, her needs and mine don't mesh... well then i guess we'll have our answer.
The honest truth is that she very well may want to leave you, so you have to take this very seriously.
She does not, however, have all the power. You can choose how you react to things. You can choose to not ask her questions about everything she does. You can choose to see a lawyer. You can choose to change where you deposit your paycheck. You can choose to be patient or you can choose to force the issue now by giving her ultimatums.
When I was in your shoes my main thought was that I wanted to SAVE MY MARRIAGE. Now - I want to BE HAPPY. I "hope" I am able to do both, but I'm now open to the possibility that happiness can exist without her in my life.
This isn't a sprint. Try to relax. And KEEP YOUR EYES OPEN. Another "benefit" of backing off is that she'll relax. If she IS doing something she shouldn't, you'll start to figure it out.
GREAT points niceguy... i've realized tonight that her wanting to leave is a possibility. i also realize that if she has already made up her mind, she may want ME to make that decision so then it's MY fault and she can somehow use that against me. i also had a friend tell me whatever i do, DON'T move out because she can claim that i abandoned her.
this weekend she's going away by herself. she's already told me that she plans to shop and see some family. do i think there's something sinister in the works? i don't know. but i can't worry about that right now. i've spent TOO long trying to control this situation. i'm tired, and sick to my stomach over the whole thing. and i'm not going to let her walk all over me. i'll give her a little space... but i'm not going to sit around waiting until SHE decides what SHE wants. i realize it's about what "I" want too.
One thing to be careful of, is to not engage in a power-struggle over your wants vs. her wants. In this instance, you can control YOU and you can change YOU--and you can control the things you contribute and to whom and when. For example, if you earn the money and own the car and pay the bills, you can also decide where the money is deposited for the safety of the "family" obligations, where the car goes to be sure it is for the "family" and not for the affair, and which bills are paid so that no cell phone you pay for is used for the affair...and no internet you pay for is used to cheat on you. Make sense?
If she chooses to cheat--she is absolutely free to do so, but on her own dime. She can cheat in the house she rents--in the bed she has bought...not in your bed. She can be unfaithful using her own money, not your check which goes to pay for the family obligations and caring for the children. She can see her lover in the car he buys for her. She can choose adultery on the phone she buys or use the internet she pays for--YOUR phone and YOUR internet pays for the children to have a game or for you to have contact with family and relatives...good stuff.
Don't turn this into a tug of war. Nope just more like this: "I realize I can't control you or stop you. You're free. But I'm also free to make choices based on my boundaries and what I want for my family and my children."
you've spoken to the other man's wife via email before. Find out if he's going away this weekend! That should give you some idea of his intentions.
As much as I've encouraged you to back off, this sounds like a really good idea. If she's being honest and isn't in touch with him, she likely won't hear that you were asking. If she's being dishonest and he is going away too, you really shouldn't care much what she thinks. Just be prepared for the "I can't help it - its just a coincidence" argument. And by be prepared I mean don't take the bait. Tell her you don't believe her and walk away from the conversation - don't try to pull the truth out of her.
I was caught and to win back my wife took a long time and we were very close to calling it quits. Before she could truly forgive (but not forget, women NEVER FORGET), I had to be an open book, no secrets and everything in the open. There was no more my space at that point.
With your wife changing the PC on her phone and asking for me time is a huge red flag. Everytime when I was cheating and the wife asked, the 1st thing to come out of my mouth was, "I just need some alone time to think things through." Which meant that bought me a couple of weeks or at the most a month to screw around some more and search my feelings while literally screwing the OW from heaven to hell and back.
Once things fell apart, wife confronted the OW, it was only then that I was finally faced with the facts that I was caught and went crawling back to the wife and begged for forgiveness. But the only way she would take me back was for me to hide nothing at all and she had access to everything, NO QUESTIONS ASKED.
15 years later, she still brings it up once in a blue moon when we have an argument. The other spouse NEVER forgets, but the cheaters who truly turn around will always remember this fact and live with it also.
CHEATERS WILL LIE TO THE DEATH THAT NOTHING HAPPENED UNLESS CAUGHT RED HANDED. I lied right to the end that there was no PA until the wife and OW met to trade notes.
We've been happily married these past 15 years and have 3 beautiful daughters. The road here wasn't easy and I'm still paying for it 15 years later. But I couldn't love my wife more and have devoted myself soley to her and my kids and receive the same back from her, I hope
Given her history there is zero benefit from speaking to her. HOWEVER it is completely legit to install a GPS device on her car and see where she is going. If after 30 days you see nothing suspicious, remove the GPS and get on with your life.
I absolutely think she has given you reasonable cause. If my wife refused to break off communication with a guy who clearly wanted an affair - well I would make her choose - him or me. But it is ok if you don't want to do that. I DO think you need proof - real - solid proof - before you bring this up with her again otherwise you are just making bad feelings for nothing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ozarksguy
GREAT points niceguy... i've realized tonight that her wanting to leave is a possibility. i also realize that if she has already made up her mind, she may want ME to make that decision so then it's MY fault and she can somehow use that against me. i also had a friend tell me whatever i do, DON'T move out because she can claim that i abandoned her.
this weekend she's going away by herself. she's already told me that she plans to shop and see some family. do i think there's something sinister in the works? i don't know. but i can't worry about that right now. i've spent TOO long trying to control this situation. i'm tired, and sick to my stomach over the whole thing. and i'm not going to let her walk all over me. i'll give her a little space... but i'm not going to sit around waiting until SHE decides what SHE wants. i realize it's about what "I" want too.
so my wife goes to a work meeting, then happy hour with friends last night. she comes home very tipsy at 11:30. when changing her clothes, i noticed that she was wearing different underwear than the ones she left in during the morning. apparently she went home in the afternoon to see our son, and changed. she changed into a sexy white thong... hmmm....
also, she paid her bar bill at 9:00... and claims she just sat around with friends until 11:00 then drove home. i'm going to check out that story tonight with the waitres... to see what time she really left and who she was there with...
i confronted her about the panty change (the rest of her wardrobe stayed the same) and she blew up at me. this might be too much info... but she said she had to change in the afternoon because it was "that time of the month". sadly, i checked the morning panties and there was nothing to suggest she needed to change because of "that time of the month". so clearly, she put on a thong for another reason. and ladies chime in here... do you honestly wear thongs during "that time of the month"...
after our morning confrontation, my wife has asked me to move out. i'm NOT moving out, period. i've told her as calmly as possible that if she wants "space" she's free to leave our home. now she's threatening to leave and take the kids too. i've told her that it's my home and the kids home, and that we are not going anywhere but if she feels the need to leave, i'll support her.
honestly, i'm pretty sure we're headed for a divorce. i think she's cheating with somebody, but is too chicken **** to be honest with me and just tell me her true feelings. it's much easier to blame me for all our problems... and get mad when i question her. obviously she knows i'm on to her... and the panty change clearly indicates something is up...
btw, I sure hope you have put a stop on all your bank accounts, because you are one step away from having all your savings cleaned out. And you need to call your family, her family, and everyone else you know that she has threatened to take the children away from you. If SHE makes the call first, she will tell everyone you're abusive and she's afraid for their safety. And then you get SQUAT.
Re: wife denies... i don't buy 
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