greenpearl

I don't know what other people think about this.

But my husband always tells me that men like the feeling that they are being needed, especially by their wives. Men like the feeling that they can protect others.

My husband knows that I can support myself financially, but he knows very well that I need him emotionally, he knows that I am vulnerable. He knows that he provides me a lot of joy and happiness in my life. He knows I can't live without him. That makes him feel important in my life.

I know he can live without me since he has always been a loner, but he tells me all the time that I complete his life, I make him a happy man in this world.

When a husband and a wife both know that they are important in each other's life, they are bonded!

Like you and your husband. MEM and his wife, BBW and his wife.

We are all bonded!

Conrad

This is really an excellent question.

I now mask needy feelings because of the poor results I got when they were on display.

I felt bad about me and I've learned her "internal" response was contempt.

Then again, everyone is different.

And, what it likely involves is how good you are at taking care of yourself. And, of course, this doesn't mean masturbation. It can be part of it, of course, but it's way deeper than that.

If we can isolate the parts of our personality where "neediness" emanates, we can administer to ourselves. At that point, we're so unbelieveably attractive to the opposite sex - because we're self-sufficient, competent, and appear to be self-made.

Our partners wish to share in that, so the virtuous cycle starts to turn.

I hope this is clear.

Wolf is right that if a woman starts to feel like your mother, you're on the wrong track. Mothers take care of needy kids.

We play the role of children at our peril.

MEM11363

SA,
I have really made the effort to make sure I am consistent. I don't like that she still believes there is this "very nice guy" the day after sex and not so nice guy when there isn't.

I guess it all comes down to this. At what point does your partner accept that you have changed/improved? I think 5 years is plenty long.

BBW,
What a perfect response. I blew it - since that was the ultimate answer "in the moment". Hmmm.

I think instead of hammering her - I am just going to start teasing her when she asks me to do something. I constructed a small set of conversational lego this afternoon that sort of goes like this:

She asks me for something - note she almost never asks anything unreasonable so I almost never respond with anything other than "sure babe - with a smile". Unless of course I am "playing" with her.

So she asks something and depending on what it is she is going to get one of these responses:
1. "of course - I mean you did put out last night"
2. "I don't know, it has been 3 days now - ask me again the "morning after the next time we connect" "
3. "Hmmm - it has been 4 days now - so all requests must be submitted in writing"

Atholk

But she's essentially correct in her observation isn't she?

You guys have just been sick and when you're sick, tired and cranky everything looks worse than it is. I believe she was actually trying to say how much she liked what you were doing for her, you just took it the wrong way.

Breathe!

__________________
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MEM11363

Atholl,
She definitely was grateful.

And - you are right she is technically correct - I AM a little warmer/more affectionate the day after sex. That said, my normal behavior when "life" disrupts sex is very good. A disruption to our sex life does not produce irritable, sullen unhelpful behavior. As for the affection stuff - if she wants more she can initiate more on non-sex days. I don't turn hugs into requests to fuvk and she knows that.

She doesn't say "you treat me like gold - when we have a lot of sex". She says "you treat me like gold". Which is something she says a few times a year and has for quite some time.

I am over my cold. My wits have returned and I bantered with her tonight while I diplomatically declined her offer to connect. She is still coughing up a storm and if I were feeling that way romance would be the last thing on my mind.....

AFEH

From my point of view men do have a vulnerable emotional side to them. We can feel hurt and hurt very deeply. I came to know that when I was depressed a few years back and got to the point I was feeling suicidal. I told my wife twice in the period of a week that I felt suicidal and she ignored me. That is I declared my vulnerability and I was ignored. I think my wife had seen me change from a very independent person to a very needy person and she couldn’t cope with it. From that moment on I told myself I’d never again let my wife see me vulnerable or go to her for emotional support. I didn’t really know what I was doing as I think vulnerability and emotional support at those times so very important in a marriage.

Years later 6 months after we’d separated I tried connecting with my wife to see if we could bring our decades together to some kind of nice closure, we’d parted in a very bad way. At that time she told me just how emotionally she’d been affected by our separation. For six months she couldn’t sleep, missed me in the bed, sent home from work, couldn’t hold a job down. I had absolutely no clue that my wife felt that deeply about me and our marriage, no clue at all. My wife kept all her vulnerability, passion and thoughts and emotions inside of her during our time together, so I just didn’t know.

At the time I told my wife that just yesterday I was in the supermarket having a coffee waiting for some friends to finish their shopping and tears just came out of my eyes when I thought of her. She responded that she’d have loved to see that vulnerable side of me while we were together. I found that quite amazing because at the few times I did show my vulnerable side I was treated quite contemptuously, as though I was less than “a man” or something.

I think men will show their vulnerable side to their wives, but they must be certain they are in safe hands otherwise they wont take the risk of opening themselves up.

It is indeed sometimes a very strange world.

Bob

greenpearl

Bob,

Your post is very touching.

Men in the world are taught to hide their emotions, which is not very healthy. Like I often say, when men were kids, they were mom's babies too. They need love, they need support, they need to seek harbor, just in a different way.

Loving wives are their harbor.

When my husband is sick, he is just like a baby. I know at that time I should give him the kind of love he longs from his mother. At that time, I have to treat him like a baby, I have to hold him in my arms!

Conrad

Bob,

Perhaps "moderation" in all things is the way to proceed.

Too much of anything generally exhausts a relationship.

My wife and I have been having great late night discussions this week, as she's been searching her soul for answers.

Last night? It just wasn't there.

She went to bed early. I stayed up and watched football with my daughter. She woke pumped up about her insights during quiet time.

Another 2-3am job would have likely exhausted us both.

You get the idea.

r2d210

Isn't this type of response making sex a condition of good behavior? I will do it becuase you are good, or I'm good, therefore you need to have sex with me? I thought you weren't supposed to make sex a condition based on behavior?

Example....my wife is on her "montly". It has been a while for us connecting. Based on my actions this weekend, I really noticed a change! She was all over me! She told me she missed me! So, when we went to bed last night and she offered a "HAND JOB". I told her I would love that....and I missed her, and she asked...."so you miss it, not so much me?" I felt immeditately in a corner and so I told her her....yes I missed "it". Normally, I would have politely declined, thinking it was a "hand out" (no pun intended!), however my thinking was, I have needs, but I'm not going to appear needy. So by her offering, and instead of me brushing it off as I'm good, ok, I'll wait, etc., I accepted. I was dissapointed in her behavior. She had no excitement, life or even enthusiasim. It was totally going through the motions....which upset me afterwords. She instantly got up, washed her hands, crawled back in bed and put her back to me. So, I went to sleep. Nothing said this morning about it.

Update....several times over the weekend, she held her tounge. She was the most respectful I have seen in a long time. It's almost like she is reading this....? I decided after running in the snow and mud that I am going to get a "winter" membership at the gym. I have always wanted to take a spinning class and I will go before work. This will put me out the door by 5:45a.m. three days a week. I know I need to "tell" her and not "ask". I also know an argument will insue....but I'm willing to take it on. I read the first 5 chapters of "no more mr nice guy" this weekend. I have a much better understanding of why I'm the way I am. The book fits me exactly. I was abandened as a child (parents divorced when I was 8 and I was the oldest). I thought it was all my fault. I have sought her approval since day one. I have done everything wrong...and I can see why she has no interest in me sexually and a strong lack of respect. This is going to take some time, but I am very encouraged by the changes I have already seen! The comments and discussion is great!

Trenton

To your wife's question about the hand job. My husband's response would have been "Both." with a smirk.

r2d210

Trenton, I wish I would have said that. My guess is...and I'm thick here, she didn't like the answer, hence the "lack of enthusiasm". I just knew 1) I couldn't change her reaction, and 2) my need was met. I know I have to be strong in everything I do. My boundaries need to be firm. I'm very happy how TAM has changed my way of looking at this all. In the past, I definetely believed that if I was good, and I could manipulate enough, she would put out. Looking at it from the outside,.....the problem was me all along!

SimplyAmorous

Thank you for sharing with such honesty. All of us would eventually turn away if met with these responses, how could we not. Or it would kill us inside. I understand.


I agree with this. As in all things -even our deepest emotions, we should strive for a healthy balance. If it will only lead to us feeling bad about ourselves afterwards, best to curb it for that day. But to never go there with our spouses , I think this is not healthy either. In AFEH's situation (learning after the fact) - What could have been if he had showed this just a little more often, what could it have been if she had responded differently?

Sometimes we live & learn too late.




SO TRUE. Unfortunetly I think all of us women have done this at one time or another. Myself included. My husband rarely showed his "need"- and of coarse, just like you all, in response to how I carelessly handled him in the past.

My husband is very sensitive, He has ALWAYS been bothered that I didn’t seem to have much of a sex drive, he took this very very personal & internal (but in saying this, I never did this Mercy Sex thing, when he got me going, I was HOT & very very into him- I just didn’t think about it but once a week). He NEVER faught with me about it, just accepted I was like a Nun. WE laugh about this today -how can we not, I do not know that woman of yesterday!!

I can recall only once him asking me for a hand job. ONCE in 19 yrs of marriage!! I did it gladly. I SHOULD have been clued in then to how he "needed" more sex but I was oblivious - somewhere off in the clouds, I don't know. I can't understand it myself. When we started REALLY communicating about sex (we never did this before at all - what a pathetic mistake to make in marriage) , I learned of his silent suffering . Him seeing ME all of a sudden IN NEED allowed him to OPEN up to me. I am sure seeing the tables turn was some amusing for him.

I guess the worst thing I ever did, according to him >>> about 6 yrs ago, he tried to tell me He wanted to "hold me more at night "-never mentioning sex - I took this as wanting to hold me "while I slept" (I can be very dense at times) and I am very fidgity, moving around alot, even a leg on top of me would prevent me from sleeping. I just didn't get it. In his mind the holding meant it would lead to love making. In my mind, he wanted to hold me while I slept. He even remembers me complaining I cant sleep like that, but he didn’t try to make it more clear, more about Love making/ closeness/ bonding, or that he hurt. ..... Then I did the stupidest thing imaginable , he over heard me talking to one of my friends on the phone about this, and this CRUSHED him (this was HIS burning). Pretty much the only time he EVER opened up to me about wanting more sex and I didn’t get it, I took It very very casually.

When he shared this with me 2 yrs ago, I was shocked ! He hid it sooo well. Looking back, after this stupid thing I dismissed, there was a definete decline in his coming to me for sex. He was not someone who would beg. And I still didn't wake up until a few years later.

Shame shame on us women sometimes. I have more than made up for all of this now. It is no wonder he loves MY Neediness. He felt all these years I did not need him at all ! But I did, I never wanted anyone else, I even was grouchy myself back then, I probably needed more SEX too, sometimes we don't know what we truly need for happiness. I was working back then, life was more stressful, but none of these excuses are good enough. In our case, the communication was lacking from his end, and I was terribly lacking in understanding of what men NEED from their wives, I assumed since I only needed it once a week, he must feel the same.

Thank you all for sharing. It helps me better understand the mindset of my husband -back then.

MarriedWifeInLove

Why does your wife feel the need to talk down to you and treat you like a child?

I have not read the entire post (sorry, too long and I'm at work), do you have a good marriage? Why is she so rude and condensending to you?

That sounds like the main root of the problems. She believes she can treat/talk to you in this manner and there are no consequences.

I'm sure some strong feedback from you (or some really hard consequences) might change her tune.

AFEH

r2d210, something I came to recognise with my wife was how much control of my emotions I’d given to her. I had kind of an awakening and just saw it. It was like she had a remote control in her hands and could push different buttons and get different responses from me. I didn’t have a clue before. I came to realise that my wife knew exactly what she was doing, it wasn’t something that happened by accident.

“"So you miss it, not so much me?" I’m of the mind to think that was so designed to get a reaction from you, the reaction she got. She could have just enjoyed what she was doing and enjoyed your response. But she didn’t. She’ll know you a lot better than you will ever think. She wanted you to feel the way you did.

In long term marriages we haven’t a clue really just how deeply our emotions and intellect are entwined with our partners. We just haven’t got a clue because it is “a way of life”. If we are not careful we truly do become institutionalised and lose who we are.

As you keep on with your healthy boundaries and differentiate yourself more and more as an individual you will come to recognise this as time goes by. You will begin to see yourself and your wife much clearer than ever before.

Bob

greenpearl

R2,

I am happy for you!

In order for everything to turn to the good circle, when your wife is being nice to you, please take it nicely, please don't read too much into it. Mercy sex, willing sex, whatever, as long as it is sex, and she offered, you should take it happily. I don't understand the concept of mercy sex, I just know, when I want sex, I want sex. When she wants to have sex, just fxxx her hard, fxxx her like crazy, and she will remember that, next time, she's be more initiative. Don't forget that, she wants sex too. MAN, I can't write too much about sex, I have been in a high sex drive for a long time, to a point it is distracting me.

As a couple, we can't be proud, we can't be meek, how to find the balance, it needs our wisdom!