Conrad

Who's yo daddy?

__________________
"Forgive or Re-Live"

-AFEH

AFEH

Jonny, deleting txts is a really bad sign, a big red flag. It means she is keeping secrets from you. It sounds like the start of an EA.

There are applications you can put on mobile phones whereby you can see everything your wife does on hers.

If I was you I would do it and consider it due diligence on my marriage. Don't be taken for a fool buddy. Look in on the Coping with Infidelity forum if you need some more pointers.

No amount of "manning up" will get you what you want if her heart is with another man.

You may well find that your "changes in behaviour" have already been txt to OM.


Bob

Conrad

jonny,

The Wolf is very direct on this point.

You need not worry about passing "every test".

You already see the dynamic changing. She finds you much more interesting than the whiny-assed baby she's been living with.

Stay the course - have fun with it.

__________________
"Forgive or Re-Live"

-AFEH

jonny

Thanks Bob - AS always - good info / good insight.

Don't worry - I'm on top of it - been on top of it since the start.

I've told her that I worry about it. I've told her that if i notice she's getting dependant on the relationship, addicted to it, that it should rasie some red flags in her own mind. I've told her not to lie, not to delete texts.

"When our son if 5 years old, you know what I'm going to tell him - if he has to hide it from me, lie about it, he knows it's wrong. Same goes for you and this situation / relationship"

etc.

The thing that's changing in me. Yes CONRAD - I said change. The thing thats changing - is my attitude towards Me. Also to my relationship. I'm a nice guy - I'll give her lots of chances to do the right thing. If in the end she doesn't - I will now have no problem being the 'bad guy' and saying it stops now or we stop now.

I'm not going to go through the rest of my life being treated unfairly.

Golden rule - as one of you guys posted regarding boundaries. I'll treat her with respect. I deserve the same back.

I'll OWN that I'm more tolerable than most - That might change, but for now I own that - but Instead of just going on being tolerable and walked over - I will make an enough is enough statement when needed.

It's like a job. If I'm not doing a good job - I don't want to have my boss come in - say I'm fired without a chance to shape the **** up. I want him to talk to me like an adult - give me a chance - then fire me if I disrespect his wishes - OR - don't agree with them.

I'm still working on the details of my NUTS - or boundaries. I'm still working on what's acceptable / tolerable or not. AND - still working on how many times will I accept screw ups. Screw ups / accidents are different that outward defiance.

BLAH BLAH BLAH.

Sorry.

I feel like I'm rambling.

I'm not sorry actually.

I'm thankful for finding this forum - I have no idea how I got here. NO idea how I found a no-more mr.nice guy post. NO idea how I stumbled onto a fitness test post and thought - WOW. THIS WHOLE THING is MY LIFE.

You're right CONRAD. She is finding me more appealing - I can sense it - even if it's in waves right now. She's resisting like crazy - so it is a little dramatic right now - but it's a process.

Instead of being that pansy assed victim - I OWN that everything that's happened to me is my fault. Either by enabling, accepting, rolling over, cowering, or forgetting who I am.

There's a kids birthday on Sunday - I usually go - chase the kids around while my wife and the other girls socialize. I'm expected to. I'm told to watch the kids. Told to make sure they're behaving.

I'm going to paintball this time - I'm not going to wear armor - I'm going to get welts, and I'm going to wear them like a man. ( I will wear a can though. haha. Have to protect my favorite thing.)

God it's going to hurt like hell.

I might cry.

Manly tears.

haha.

Conrad

jonny,

One last thing.

The dance is owned by "both of you".

She pushed - you panicked.

So, the idea that "you failed" or "it's your fault" isn't true.

Couples get into these things together.

Yes, one has to lead the way out. That often falls on the male. But, there are many examples here of that working in the other direction.

You can only choose YOUR response. Not hers.

Unlike Bob, I'd say the hell with her phone. Who cares? Looks needy to even ask about it.

What IS unacceptable (to me) is to have her doing it in your face.

__________________
"Forgive or Re-Live"

-AFEH

jonny

Oh - I should tell about a text convo with my wife today.

She is attacking my manhood a lot lately - In a joking manner. Trying to get under my skin.

Last night - son gets a magnifying glass - what's this. Wife says " That's what mommy uses to find daddys penis" He laughes - holds it up to his eye - runs at me. " See daddys penis!? " I laugh - because it is funny. The old me would take offense. She knows this.

I do a little - she's , afterall, attacking my manhood. but I don't let it show.

After he goes to bed. I tell her - you probably shouldn't say things like that Crystal.

"Why? You insecure"

"ha. not at all. Wait till he picks up the magnifying glass at pre school and starts repeating your words though."

She also attacked it on facebook. About me losing weight - lots of responses - didn't know you had weight to lose!" etc. She said " he hid it in his pants." I came back with a comment about my member. " Thanks honey - you know I don't go bragging - but thanks for telling everyone about the weight I'm hiding in my pants" I was thinking it would end there. but back came

"Nothing to be proud of my dear."

Anyway. It's happening often - so I'm coming back at her with retorts.

We shall see what goes on next. She's pissed, yet intrigued by this new me at the same time.

Really hot and cold about it.

Confused it seems.

I'll bet you anything in the world. If you told my wife that me manning up, doing what I'm doing would change how she feels towards me - She would say - no way. She would side with the other women on this site that talk against it.

I'll say it's working.

and fast.

I'm not even close to 'out of the woods' yet - but I'll keep posting. The support is important to me. And hearing success stories / reading others experiences was and is important to me as well.

Thanks.

Conrad

>>Last night - son gets a magnifying glass - what's this. Wife says " That's what mommy uses to find daddys penis" He laughes <<

"Only after I used it to find Mommy's integrity"

__________________
"Forgive or Re-Live"

-AFEH

AFEH

Well we disagree with the phone but time will tell one way or the other. As far as I’m concerned it’s an EA now. She spends all day at work with the guy and then lot’s of txting after work about stuff that’s not even work related. EA.

Conrad

Bob,

I totally agree it's an EA.

But, she knows how he feels about the texting.

Continuing to 'go there" just gets her to dig in and lets her know she's getting to him.

__________________
"Forgive or Re-Live"

-AFEH

mtg2

Posted via Mobile Device

AFEH

Ok. Personally I can’t see that anything Jonny does, changes he makes etc. is going to work while the EA is going on.

If the unspoken plan with yourself and the other guys here is for Jonny to make himself “attractive” enough for his wife to stop the EA, stop taking the whatsit out of him and for Jonny to be the one she has her primary emotional connection with then fair enough.

Still don’t think it’s going to work though. Everyday she communicates with OM the relationship gets deeper and deeper and therefore harder to break. A cent gets a dollar that OM already knows about the changes Jonny has made and they’re laughing about it.

moonangel

you really should keep it between the two of you and not fb. it's so sad how this just keeps getting worse...but...

it's okay to argue and be angry but not when one starts attacking your physical looks...how very sad.

mtg2

Oops. New to this and my iPad so not sure what I just sent above.

In any case jonny, I just wanted to say that I've been following this thread and am really impressed. Just reading, you can feel the growth and changes you've made. I wish you could knock some sense into my husband. It takes a good man to recognize his faults and mistakes. And a bigger one to own them and make changes.

Change is good. Seems to me that you're becoming more than the man that she may have originally fell in love with. A better one - for you, your son and her. I'm inspired to stay the course. I too have no idea how I ended up on this forum but wonder if your story and others and the great advice given consistently will be what pulls me through.

So thanks. I hope your wife starts owning her piece in all this. She is loosing out.
Posted via Mobile Device

lime

You can demand anything from a woman if you do it in the right way



NiceGuy, that's a good point; I still wouldn't say "do it yourself," however, because that can easily be interpreted as skipping out on your manly duties--especially by a woman who is already p*ssed off and looking for faults. I think in those situations it's even more important to use humor, or to tell her you'll do it on your terms.

MEM11363

Jonny,
Your post below is incredible. You are way stronger than you likely ever realized. I call my earlier bet that you are smart, and raise it to you are very smart.

It is perfectly ok to cry. In fact I believe there is some very powerful physiology underlying crying - it helps you expel grief from your body.

Gentle suggestion. If at all possible do not cry in front of your wife. If she is anything like my W - many other women I know they are wired to react badly to male tears.

The reality is that 80 percent of the reason my W loves me is based on the emotions I DO express. The last 20 percent of her love is based on those that I mute or completely mask.

The 80 percent she sees are:
- love
- happiness
- optimism
- determination
- sympathy/empathy for her

The 20 percent I mute, conceal or convey on a well timed "delay loop" are:
- fear
- anger
- sadness (with kids problems - and we have some - when she is sad, and I share that sadness, I express it - so this is an exception - and yes I am also empathetic - see above - but I do show sadness in this case)
- frustration
- resentment

That does not mean I don't react when I feel I am being ill treated. I absolutely react. But typically I am calm and FIRM when I react and if I cannot think of something clever or funny I use phrases along the lines of:
"Would you be ok if I did that to you"?
"Do you really mean that"?
"What did you just say to me"? (I typically use this when she is clearly, overtly and deliberately provoking me. So in a sense she is "requesting" this response. No kidding for us - this is a type of foreplay. And this phrase is almost always delivered while walking towards her with unbroken eye contact until I am inside her personal space*)
"Silence - not a word - while I slowly and deliberately orient my body facing directly at her and simply stare quietly at her with a neutral expression"

This is just my experience so YMMV but in the past when I have tried to "talk about my feelings" this is what happens. She says something I believe to be unjustified/unfair/etc.

I say "that hurts my feelings and makes me mad"

She says: "You are being overly sensitive" OR
She gets MORE aggressive OR
She explains WHY whatever she did shouldn't bother me

At that point I DO lose my temper. And then I DO over react. And ultimately I end up apologizing. So I can safely say I almost never talk about my feelings "IN THE MOMENT". I stick to a neutral emotional affect, a firm delivery style and words that express my boundaries.


* For context: I have never, would never hit my W, physically intimidate her, etc. This behavior has a specific meaning for "us" which loosely translates into: "If this is foreplay, follow the script. If not, go put on your "Arctic wear" because I am about to drop the emotional temperature in the house to absolute zero"